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Old 9th June 2013, 18:06   #91
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Default re: A story of 3 workhorses: 2 Santro's and a Manza, Edit: Santro sold, Manza at 100k+

Got my wife's black santro serviced today @91.5k km's. Pretty routine service w/o any major issues. Details as below.

Engine oil Total 7000 10W40 3L@300/L = 900
Elofic oil filter = 80
NGK spark plugs 4x80 = 320
Syndicate wiper blades 20" and 16" = 220
A hose clip and 2 rear light bulbs = 40
A trusted FNG mechanic labor = 350

Total = 1,910

In addition to changing above parts, throttle body was opened and cleaned. Both belts were checked and found okay. There was a minor coolant seepage (not leakage) in the engine bay where the radiator hose connects to the thermostat eblow. We opened the hose and the elbow to clean them for carbon deposits. Both the parts were otherwise okay so replacing the OE self tightening hose clip with a screw type hose clip did the job. Did not do alignement, balancing or brake cleaning as there did not seem to be any need.

Last oil change on this car was in April 12 at 85k km's and I usually ensure to change oil every 12 months irrespective of less km's. I just forgot about this and overshoot the oil change by 2 months (car did 6.5 km's only though in last 14 months).

Pretty reliable city commuter and good to go for another 12 months now .

Thank you for reading.
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Old 2nd July 2013, 11:10   #92
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Default Re: Manza at 90k km's

Manza completed 90k km's today, in precisely 41 months of ownership. No issues with the car as of now. Last service was at 80k km's at TASS. I'll be servicing the car at 93k km's at my FNG and at same (13k km) interval thereafter.
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Old 2nd September 2013, 13:52   #93
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Default Re: Manza at 94k km's

I got manza serviced yesterday with ODO at 93,725km. 13,800 km's since last service. There were no major issues to be fixed, usual service.

Fiat has opened a new dealership / service centre at Patiala and I happen to know someone there. So a couple of weeks earlier I picked up all required Fiat OE products from the dealership:

Engine oil (Petronas Selenia WR 5W40) 3L x 650 = 1,950
Gear oil (Petronas Tutela CarTechnyx 75W85) 2L x 500 = 1000
Power Steering oil (Tutela Car GI/E, ATF DEX III) 1L x 490 = 490
Coolant 2L x 200 = 400
Sofima (UFI) Oil Filter = 250
Air Filter = 340
6L Distilled water = 60
Labor = 400
Wheel Alignment = 150
Total = 5,040

Front brakes were cleaned. Gear oil and PS oil were replaced for the first time.

Coolant was last changed at 80k km service at TASS. However, it got totally contaminated within 8-9 months and 14k km's. The color had turned brown from usual green (like rust is mixed in water). I suspect TASS filled hard/ tap water with coolant last time leading to this issue. Mechanic suggested to totally drain the radiator, run with clean (distilled) water only for 2-3 days and then refill with coolant. So as of now car is filled with on 6 litres of distilled water. Will drain this in a day or two and then fill with coolant water mix.

Next service will be around 107k km's. Total maintenance expenses at 94k km's are as below:

Maintenance upto 50k km's - rs.30,000 (details in post #51)
55k km Oil + Filter change - rs.2,600 (At TASS, Selenia WR 5W40)
60k km paid service, fuel filter + air filter change - rs.3,900 (At TASS)
67.5k km Battery, brake pads, wiper blades, alignment etc - rs.5,500
70k km paid service, Oil + oil and air filter change - rs.3,750 (At TASS, Selenia WR 5W40)
80k km paid service, Oil + oil +fuel + air filter + coolant and brake fluid change - rs.8,000 (At TASS)
80k km tire change Apollo Acelere 185/60/15 - rs.9,200
81k km suspension work - rs.2,500
85k km AC servicing - rs.1,100
94k km Servicing - rs.5,000

That's about rs.72k for 94k km's including services and tires. The mileage on the car has reduced a bit from earlier. Now a days I get 15kmpl in city and 20 on highways (both with 100% AC). It's still good mileage but used to be higher by 2 kmpl earlier. It may improve after the service.

Thank you for reading.
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Old 29th December 2013, 23:16   #94
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Default Manza completed 100k km's

With a month short of 4 years, manza completed 100k km's yesterday morning as I was on the way to my FNG to get a few things sorted out. Got front and rear suspension, clutch and front brakes overhauled.

Suspension was not too bad but I was not happy with ride quality so decided to get all 4 dampers, suspension mounts, link rods and lower arm ball joints replaced. Lower arms and tie rod ends were found to be okay so not replaced. Also I was noticing clutch juddering for last 1-2 months while moving from stand still and from last week or so gear shifting was not smooth either. So decided to go for clutch replacement. I could have lived with stock suspension and clutch for another 10-15k km's but decided to change for enhanced driving comfort. Anyway useful life of these parts was close to over at 100k km's.

Off late there was significant amount of brake vibration at highway speeds indicating disk wrapping so front disks were turned and new pads are put in place.

Total cost of the above work came to rs.14,500. Part wise details are in attached excel. All parts were procured from http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/delhi-...new-delhi.html (Metro Spares & Ghai Motors (Savitri Nagar, New Delhi)) and work is done by my trusted FNG guy.

Change of suspension, clutch and brakes has sort of transformed the driving experience of the car. It's like car feels as good to drive as it was at 50k km's.

Manza has been extremely reliable and econmical throughout these 100k km's. I plan to retain the car with me for another year or so.

Total maintenance expenses at 100k km's are as below:

• Maintenance upto 50k km's - rs.30,000 (details in post #51)
• 55k km Oil + Filter change - rs.2,600 (At TASS, Selenia WR 5W40)
• 60k km paid service, fuel filter + air filter change - rs.3,900 (At TASS)
• 67.5k km Battery, brake pads, wiper blades, alignment etc - rs.5,500
• 70k km paid service, Oil + oil and air filter change - rs.3,750 (At TASS, Selenia WR 5W40)
• 80k km paid service, Oil + oil +fuel + air filter + coolant and brake fluid change - rs.8,000 (At TASS)
• 80k km tire change Apollo Acelere 185/60/15 - rs.9,200
• 81k km suspension work - rs.2,500
• 85k km AC servicing - rs.1,100
• 94k km Servicing - rs.5,000
• 100k km Clutch, suspension and brakes overhaul - rs.14,500

That's about rs.86k for 100k km's including services and tires. Next normal service will be around 107k km's.

Thank you for reading.
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Old 29th December 2013, 23:30   #95
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Default re: A story of 3 workhorses: 2 Santro's and a Manza, Edit: Santro sold, Manza at 100k+

Congrats Amit, for reaching this milestone. I am amazed to know of the service costs that you had incurred over the years. This is a real case of a value for money proposition. If you do not mind, can you PM me the number and details of the service centre you deal with on regular basis. This can be helpful to me for my cars as well.

One more question, how long will you keep these companions with you. I hope they still must be having lot of mettle to serve you for another few years.
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Old 29th December 2013, 23:32   #96
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Default re: A story of 3 workhorses: 2 Santro's and a Manza, Edit: Santro sold, Manza at 100k+

Amazing, thanks for keeping this informative thread alive and active!

Btw, CONGOS on having crossed the 100k milestone! A lot of noise around he forum about TATA cars not being reliable, this sets the record straight to quite an extent.

Also, very well kept cost chart there, I'm trying to keep things recorded with these Android apps called aCar & FuelLog to record of expenses on the car, do try out!

Enjoy!

Last edited by GrammarNazi : 29th December 2013 at 23:33.
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Old 30th December 2013, 11:08   #97
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Default re: A story of 3 workhorses: 2 Santro's and a Manza, Edit: Santro sold, Manza at 100k+

Quote:
Originally Posted by mints21 View Post
Congrats Amit, for reaching this milestone. I am amazed to know of the service costs that you had incurred over the years. This is a real case of a value for money proposition. If you do not mind, can you PM me the number and details of the service centre you deal with on regular basis. This can be helpful to me for my cars as well.

One more question, how long will you keep these companions with you. I hope they still must be having lot of mettle to serve you for another few years.
I go to a guy called Sunil who works out of Saket. His number is 9 eight 1 zero 2 zero 5 four 3 one. Really nice and knowledgeable chap. PM me your number if you need more inputs or help with directions etc.

Wife's santro will be replaced between Apr - Jun 14. The way things stand today, it will be a Grand i10 for her. Manza is planned for replacement Apr - Jun 15. Haven't made up mind for the right replacement for this car. Not sure if it will be a diesel cross over or sedan.

Well as you know, plans are just that, plans.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GrammarNazi View Post
Amazing, thanks for keeping this informative thread alive and active!

Btw, CONGOS on having crossed the 100k milestone! A lot of noise around he forum about TATA cars not being reliable, this sets the record straight to quite an extent.

Also, very well kept cost chart there, I'm trying to keep things recorded with these Android apps called aCar & FuelLog to record of expenses on the car, do try out!

Enjoy!
Thanks. Yes I believe the newer gen Tatas are quite reliable. The older Tatas had quality issues leading to bad reputation. ASS is still an issue as they do not believe in fixing what's not broken. Once broken, it's too late I guess. I am happy as like to maintain my car myself with the help of good FNG mechanic and genuine parts are easily available.

For the app, I am an old school person! Don't have an android phone .

Last edited by amit1234singla : 30th December 2013 at 11:11. Reason: spelling correction
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Old 30th December 2013, 11:21   #98
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Default re: A story of 3 workhorses: 2 Santro's and a Manza, Edit: Santro sold, Manza at 100k+

Quote:
Originally Posted by amit1234singla View Post
With a month short of 4 years, manza completed 100k km's yesterday morning as I was on the way to my FNG to get a few things sorted out. Got front and rear suspension, clutch and front brakes overhauled.
Hearty congratulations Amit on reaching the 100K milestone. Since I have "been there & done that", I know how it feels. It is a feeling no less than someone scaling Mt. Everest. Kudos on that feat.

Quote:
That's about rs.86k for 100k km's including services and tires. Next normal service will be around 107k km's.
That is quite reasonable by today's standards, just Rs 0.86/km. Though it is not fair to compare with my 2004 Indica hatch, just wanted to share that my maintenance cost was Rs 0.74/km on reaching the 100K mark. Now after 137K kms, it is at Rs 0.80/km. If ever it crosses the Rs 1.00/km mark, I will sell it off immediately. However I doubt it will cross that mark , at least in the near future. Till then I will be happy driving it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GrammarNazi View Post
Btw, CONGOS on having crossed the 100k milestone! A lot of noise around he forum about TATA cars not being reliable, this sets the record straight to quite an extent.
People who are least bothered about regular/preventive maintenance of their cars, are the ones who cry fowl over Tata car's reliability. You can't compare a Tata with say a Toyota or a Honda & there are bound to be some niggling issues, but if you have a knack of overcoming such issues, then no other can be as VFM as a Tata. You see Amit has spent a good amount on preventive maintenance & I am sure he will be happy in the long run .
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Old 30th December 2013, 11:21   #99
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Default re: A story of 3 workhorses: 2 Santro's and a Manza, Edit: Santro sold, Manza at 100k+

Quote:
Originally Posted by amit1234singla View Post
I go to a guy called Sunil who works out of Saket. His number is 9 eight 1 zero 2 zero 5 four 3 one. Really nice and knowledgeable chap. PM me your number if you need more inputs or help with directions etc.

Wife's santro will be replaced between Apr - Jun 14. The way things stand today, it will be a Grand i10 for her. Manza is planned for replacement Apr - Jun 15. Haven't made up mind for the right replacement for this car. Not sure if it will be a diesel cross over or sedan.

Well as you know, plans are just that, plans.


Thanks. Yes I believe the newer gen Tatas are quite reliable. The older Tatas had quality issues leading to bad reputation. ASS is still an issue as they do not believe in fixing what's not broken. Once broken, it's too late I guess. I am happy as like to maintain my car myself with the help of good FNG mechanic and genuine parts are easily available.

For the app, I am an old school person! Don't have an android phone .
Thanks Amit for the information, It will be of immense use to me. Grand i10 will certainly make a better choice. I recently bought one and I am very happy with the car. An interesting thing that I have noticed is that the FE of this car is more than my Santro, i10 and i20.

I will PM you my number and shall be in touch.
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Old 31st December 2013, 10:45   #100
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Default re: A story of 3 workhorses: 2 Santro's and a Manza, Edit: Santro sold, Manza at 100k+

Quote:
Originally Posted by AutoIndian View Post
Hearty congratulations Amit on reaching the 100K milestone. Since I have "been there & done that", I know how it feels. It is a feeling no less than someone scaling Mt. Everest. Kudos on that feat.
Thank you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AutoIndian View Post
That is quite reasonable by today's standards, just Rs 0.86/km.
Yes, it's pretty reasonable especially since suspension and clutch is changed purely as a preventive measure, these parts were not broken and could have gone for another 15-20k km easily.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AutoIndian View Post
in the long run .
And I thought at 100k km's I am already in long run!

Quote:
Originally Posted by mints21 View Post
Grand i10 will certainly make a better choice. I recently bought one and I am very happy with the car. An interesting thing that I have noticed is that the FE of this car is more than my Santro, i10 and i20.
Yeah, I think Grand i10 is a good replacement for my wife's car. Compact with premuim feel and good features (top end varient). We are yet to start test driving for santro replacement though. Let's see.

Hyundai service is expensive but it's mainly the add ons (engine flush, decarb etc) which are expensive and I never go for those. Pure service parts and labor is still manageable. Anyway after warranty it's bye bye to ASC's.

Re the mileage, her 96k km old santro gives 16-17kmpl in north winters and 14-15 in summers. She unlike many other (lady) drivers, does not ride clutch and upshits early w/o lugging the engine. I think Grand i10 should be similarly fuel efficient with her driving style.
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Old 21st January 2014, 11:22   #101
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Default re: A story of 3 workhorses: 2 Santro's and a Manza, Edit: Santro sold, Manza at 100k+

A quick update: We sold wife's black santro for rs.110k. It was an Aug 2006, Santro Xing XL BSIII, 95.5k km's, DL registered, first owner, black color car.

Mechanically car was perfect. Many small dents and scratches on the body. Tires good for another 10k km's. Insurance till Aug 14. Most used car dealers offered about rs.100-105k and we let it go for max offer (110k). Carwale and IBB valuation is lower than 110k.

Also booked Grand i10 Asta (O) 1.2 petrol manual in stardust (grey) color. Costing exact 6L on road, no discounts on this car as of now. They did not even agree to let go of Handling charge, going for self-insurance though.

We found Grand to be a very nice compact, premium, feature laden smooth hatch. Also checked out Toyota Liva, but that did not come close to heart as Grand did, expect for better space, reliability and better after sales support.

Car deliveries (grand in and santro out) expected on 2nd Feb.

Last edited by amit1234singla : 21st January 2014 at 11:24.
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Old 28th March 2014, 15:13   #102
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Default Re: A story of 3 workhorses: 2 Santro's and a Manza, Edit: Santro sold, Manza at 100k

A quick update on Manza: Car is at 104k km’s now. Last Saturday went to TASS, Concorde Motors for getting the clutch switch changed as it was not working properly. SA at Concorde was very helpful and politely asked if I had got the timing chain replaced to which I said no. He showed me a Tata circular dated 1st Jan 14 which mandated chain replacement at 60k km’s for Manza diesel and Vista D90 diesel. The circular was same as issued by Fiat to its dealers (available in another thread), just that every reference to Fiat was changed to Tata. He suggested me get the chain replaced and I agreed (after seeing the circular myself). Also got the fuel filter changed as it was last replaced at 80k km’s. Timing chain replacement costed a lot less than I expected (parts rs.3,300, labor rs.900). Workmanship was top notch and the guy who worked on the car was quite senior and relaxed. Did not cut corners to save time. Timing chain replacement is quite a mammoth work, requires engine mounting, oil sump and what not to be removed to access / remove timing chain cover. Also got the alignment checked as I was experiencing slight left pulling which is corrected now. Total cost for all work rs7,700. Break-up below:

Clutch switch – rs.306
Timing chain kit – rs.2,813 (includes chain, fixed and adjustable pad, chain stretcher)
Bond for oil sump – rs.458
Fuel Filter – rs.2,100
Total labor including alignment, taxes etc – rs.2,000

Car is even more refined than earlier now, though this wasn’t a concern earlier either. I choose to replace the chain as it had done 70% more than 'now' recommended interval and did not cost a lot to replace. Total maintenance expenses at 103.5k km's are as below:

• Maintenance upto 50k km's - rs.30,000 (details in post #51)
• Maintenance upto 50 to 100k km's - rs.56,000 (details in post #94)
• 104k km timing chain, fuel filter and misc work rs.7,700

That's about rs.94k for 104k km's including services and tires. Next due is a simple oil + filter change at 107k kms.

Thank you fo reading.

EDIT - in other news, my wife is in love with her new Grand i10. Even I love to drive that car. So smooth, silent and feature rich car that is. Suspension is also so unlike Hyundai !! Amazing mileage, we are getting about 16.5kmpl in city. We did only one highway trip to Punjab (600km) and it was 20.5kmpl. I am not making a mistake in typing here! This car is at 2k km's now with first free check-up service done.

Last edited by amit1234singla : 28th March 2014 at 15:18.
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Old 28th March 2014, 15:23   #103
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Default Re: A story of 3 workhorses: 2 Santro's and a Manza, Edit: Santro sold, Manza at 100k

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Originally Posted by amit1234singla View Post
He showed me a Tata circular dated 1st Jan 14 which mandated chain replacement at 60k km’s for Manza diesel and Vista D90 diesel.
Thank you for sharing the details Amit. Isn't the regular interval for changing the timing chain 100K kms? 60K km interval seems to be pretty short. Were there any issues observed with the timing chain, before the engine had run 100K kms, which made Fiat & in turn TML to reduce the change interval?

Also was this circular issued for a particular batch of vehicles or is it all across for the 90ps power version of the multijet/quadrajet?
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Old 28th March 2014, 15:46   #104
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Default Re: A story of 3 workhorses: 2 Santro's and a Manza, Edit: Santro sold, Manza at 100k

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Originally Posted by AutoIndian View Post
Thank you for sharing the details Amit. Isn't the regular interval for changing the timing chain 100K kms? 60K km interval seems to be pretty short. Were there any issues observed with the timing chain, before the engine had run 100K kms, which made Fiat & in turn TML to reduce the change interval?

Also was this circular issued for a particular batch of vehicles or is it all across for the 90ps power version of the multijet/quadrajet?
There is no mention of timing chain replacement in manual. Their earlier stand was that it lasts the lifetime of the engine which now is suddenly reduced to 60k km's. In my car, upon inspection after removal, old chain and all other parts seemed perfectly good. However, I know that there was a mild kat kat sound earlier which I could only hear between 1000 to 1200 RPM. That sound is gone now.

The circular is for all Manza's and Vista D90's. Please see the Fiat circular in thread below, Tata one was same.

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/techni...ing-chain.html (Fiat Linea 1.3L MJD - Timing Chain)
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Old 28th March 2014, 16:09   #105
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Default Re: A story of 3 workhorses: 2 Santro's and a Manza, Edit: Santro sold, Manza at 100k

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Originally Posted by amit1234singla View Post
There is no mention of timing chain replacement in manual. Their earlier stand was that it lasts the lifetime of the engine which now is suddenly reduced to 60k km's. In my car, upon inspection after removal, old chain and all other parts seemed perfectly good. However, I know that there was a mild kat kat sound earlier which I could only hear between 1000 to 1200 RPM. That sound is gone now.

The circular is for all Manza's and Vista D90's. Please see the Fiat circular in thread below, Tata one was same.

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/techni...ing-chain.html (Fiat Linea 1.3L MJD - Timing Chain)
This is a bit strange as the multi-jet timing chain has a self adjusting mechanism, which adjusts the chain whenever it gets elongated after prolonged use. I guess this is the case for all the common rail engines being produced nowadays. Anyways prevention is better than cure and so spending few thousands to ensure the engine does not cause any trouble is worth than getting stranded in the middle of the road.
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