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Old 21st February 2008, 19:24   #121
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I'm surprised, Swageo, about the steering problem you have. Civic's steering is probably one of the best I've handled. Its not artificial like the NHC or Wagon R. (I know I am comparing across segments but for people upgrading from lower segments those are the type of steering that they use)

Were you by any chance driving a NHC before? Because if you have you'll feel that the Civic steering is hard. Believe me above some sane speeds you will feel happy that you have a firm steering like the Civic. Its basically Point and shoot. :-)
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Old 21st February 2008, 20:23   #122
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Originally Posted by csentil View Post
I'm surprised, Swageo, about the steering problem you have. Civic's steering is probably one of the best I've handled. Its not artificial like the NHC or Wagon R. (I know I am comparing across segments but for people upgrading from lower segments those are the type of steering that they use)

Were you by any chance driving a NHC before? Because if you have you'll feel that the Civic steering is hard. Believe me above some sane speeds you will feel happy that you have a firm steering like the Civic. Its basically Point and shoot. :-)
Driving in city conditions with hard steering is a real pain. It is true that handling of Civic at 100+ kmph is good, but how often we go to that extend ? I am comparing Civic's steering to Accent's (my friend's car)
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Old 22nd February 2008, 12:18   #123
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Hi csentil,

> Its not artificial like the NHC or Wagon R. (I know I am comparing across
> segments

More than the segments, both the cars that you have mentioned sport Electric (Electronic) Power steering.
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Old 22nd February 2008, 14:13   #124
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Hi csentil,

> Its not artificial like the NHC or Wagon R. (I know I am comparing across
> segments

More than the segments, both the cars that you have mentioned sport Electric (Electronic) Power steering.
Does Civic got EPS ?. Manual says "power assisted" and I guess it means hydraulic

My Ikon's diesel steering was also very hard, and the explanation was same "It will work well at high speeds". I drove it for last 7 years, and it is a pain to drive it in city.
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Old 22nd February 2008, 19:59   #125
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Originally Posted by ST7677 View Post

I guess the engine has settled in after 10k km.
Anybody else observed similar things after crossing 10k?
I have progressed from a lowly 8 kmpl to 9.5 kmpl (all in city with about 50% AC on) after about 5.5k on the odo, what is strange is I am now gunning the car more than I used to when I was running it in , but FE has gone up !

Did a few highway runs in the last couple of months, on 2 tankful to tankful averaged about 13.5 - 14.0 kmpl, with AC on most of the time, but I must say that I was a good boy keeping it in between 80 -120, since I was ferrying family around.

I was quite apprehensive about the running costs when I bought this beast, but not anymore , currently busy showing of its voice modulation to my friends and all
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Old 22nd February 2008, 20:05   #126
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Originally Posted by swageo View Post
This is indeed a good news. I was disappointed with my civic's low end torque, and stiff gear/steering/clutch etc.

Did gear become smooth for you ?
All three are stiff ?
According to me the steering is very direct , you can shoot this car like a hatch (make sure to get some clearance though for the extra length)

I do get sometimes a sound like I am selecting the wrong gear when I downshift, that is primarily for the first gear , I got around it when I realised I was treating it like my other car, if you are below 10 km/h, it just slots in perfectly, no issues at all shifting up.
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Old 22nd February 2008, 21:47   #127
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Originally Posted by indivic View Post
All three are stiff ?
According to me the steering is very direct , you can shoot this car like a hatch (make sure to get some clearance though for the extra length)

I do get sometimes a sound like I am selecting the wrong gear when I downshift, that is primarily for the first gear , I got around it when I realised I was treating it like my other car, if you are below 10 km/h, it just slots in perfectly, no issues at all shifting up.
For me down shifting to 1st is always hard (even under 10 kmph). Often I have to keep pressing the lever to 1st position, and wait for it to get engaged.

Acceleration is not that great if you shift gear as follows. It does not shows its 1800 cc engine. Also at 3000+ rpm, engine gives a different kind of sound, as if it is producing a lot of power. But I don't feel that in the acceleration.

0 - 10kmph = 1st
10 - 20 = 2nd
20 - 30 = 3rd
30 - 40 = 4th
40+ = 5th
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Old 22nd February 2008, 22:00   #128
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Quote:
Originally Posted by swageo View Post
Does Civic got EPS ?. Manual says "power assisted" and I guess it means hydraulic.
AFAIK, the Civic does not have EPS while the NHC does. The experts can throw more light on this one. Also, what could be the reason that the Civic is deprived of EPS while the NHC has it ?
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Old 23rd February 2008, 15:58   #129
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Hi swageo,

> Does Civic got EPS ?. Manual says "power assisted" and I guess it means
> hydraulic

No. The Civic has a hydraulic power steering. In that message the quoted portion had mentioned NHC and Wagon R. These cars have EPS.

Sorry for not conveying it properly.
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Old 23rd February 2008, 19:01   #130
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Its "speed sensitve electronic power steering" in City. This is what Honda India's web says.

Why did you omit this for civic ?. Was there any technical problem or as part of cost cut.
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Old 23rd February 2008, 22:53   #131
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It would have been crazy if the Civic had NHC's steering. The NHC is so artificial that you have no feel of driving a big car. Agreed in City conditions it makes for easy driving, but it gives me no sense of feel. I would not have gone for the Civic if it had that steering. One of the reasons why I didn't get the NHC either (lack of safety features being the other).

Low end is definitely missing in the Civic, especially if your Gear change ratios are at what you have mentioned.

The thrust/acceleration in the civic is more linear unlike the OHC Vtec. That it why you probably don't feel the lurch when you floor the accelerator. In the AT its a bit more pronounced as the auto tranny shifts to second or first to provide more thrust and it actually redlines too !!!
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Old 24th February 2008, 00:28   #132
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Originally Posted by swageo View Post
Also at 3000+ rpm, engine gives a different kind of sound, as if it is producing a lot of power. But I don't feel that in the acceleration.
Did anyone notice this ? My first service due next week and got a bag full of "so called issues".

Hows City's steering at high speed ?. I thought speed sensitivity would adjust the hardness
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Old 24th February 2008, 16:13   #133
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Hi,

> Hows City's steering at high speed ?. I thought speed sensitivity would adjust > the hardness

With my driving mostly in the 70kph region, it does harden a bit. But 'feel' is still missing as you don't get any idea as to what the front tyres are doing!
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Old 24th February 2008, 17:55   #134
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jesel
how are u guys getting this kind of FE. are u guys doing full tanks for fillings particular amount. lets say the civic has 50 liter tank ok then on one full tank u do around 500 kms ? ? ? or more ?
I reset my trip meter every time and tank up, about 39 ltrs of IOC regular fuel from the same petrol and then calculate when I refill when almost empty. Since I am consistently getting this mileage for about last 2k km of City drive, I am pretty confident of the measure.

Quote:
Originally Posted by swageo
This is indeed a good news. I was disappointed with my civic's low end torque, and stiff gear/steering/clutch etc.
Did gear become smooth for you ?
Gear, clutch and steering are absolutely smooth and delight in my car.
I love the short throw.
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Old 24th February 2008, 19:02   #135
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Swageo, Civic has a hydrolic Power assisted steering wheel, which is better than Electronic power assisted steering wheel (or hybrid EPS+HPS system)
Hydrolic steering wheel gives better control, is very accurate and found in more expensive cars.
You cannot compare it with EPS, just because you can turn it with one finger!


Quote:
Originally Posted by Swageo
Acceleration is not that great if you shift gear as follows. It does not shows its 1800 cc engine. Also at 3000+ rpm, engine gives a different kind of sound, as if it is producing a lot of power. But I don't feel that in the acceleration.

0 - 10kmph = 1st
10 - 20 = 2nd
20 - 30 = 3rd
30 - 40 = 4th
40+ = 5th
With these gear shifts you are screwing up your engine, your performance and your FE!!! Because you are always driving in the RPM range where your engine is inefficient, produces low power, and consumes more fuel.

You need shift up at about 2.5-2.8k RPM (with some exception for 1st gear).
If you want to feel the power of 2ltr engine you need to feel it between 3.5-6kRPM.
Till 3.5k RPM engine generally operates in economy zone.
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