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Old 10th October 2009, 12:52   #211
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@ happywheels Great pics and Delivery Experience essay buddy! Really happy for you ..isn't it great when a dream is realized!?

Really liked all the pics and especially the Red Carpet!

I hope you have a great ownership experience and dont face the kind of problems other Forum members like TSK have encountered!

All the best!
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Old 12th October 2009, 09:18   #212
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...isn't it great when a dream is realized!?
...
All the best!
Thanks a ton, Manuuj!

It certainly is a great feeling when it gets realized. And, touch wood, so far so good.
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Old 12th October 2009, 16:49   #213
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Got my second service, for 5000kms, done last Saturday at Concord Motors, Mysore Road.

I had spend the whole day there at the service center. My advice to anyone who plans to do this, and that on a Saturday, please DON'T!!!

Anyway, back the to the experience. Booking done two days back, so expected them to be ready for the vehicle.

Drive in at 9.20am, and a very courteous welcome by the security. Good job there, since he was wishing each and every one who is driving in. Find the parking all filled and finally ended up parking in the Demo car slot.

Got assigned a SA at 9.40 . Since he was neither of the two known Safari SA's, I ask him if he also works on Safari's. He says Indica. So, again wait for Safari SA. 10 minutes and I get assigned to an SA, Narasimha. He is a newbie being trained on for the Safari.

We both go thru the manual and he noted the oil change & filter change required. Tightening all around and brakes checking. One strange thing that we noted was the mention to do a fuel filter change!!! Both of us were confused; I told him to skip it.

Vehicle taken to bay and then the wait begins. Till 10.40 nothing happens. Find two guys taking a good break with the a/c switched on. It seems they were testing the vehicle!!! Fine!

They move out. Another person comes and does a complete test of all the lights and switches. He moves out.

At around 11.30, the vehicle is finally moved to a bay which has the lift. The mechanic assigned was Asif Pasha, an experienced person. I am happy about that.

The Bhadhal person comes and pours in the treatment fluid and stamps the MRP 760 Rs charge! Good.

Next, wheels removed, brakes checked. Engine oil changed. Rear differential oil changed. All nuts on the arm and suspension tightened. Hand brake tightened.

Greasing also done. Air filter cleaned (darn! 6 screws to remove an air filter!!! What were they thinking!).

Vehicle all done and final TD with Reddy, a senior Safari SA, is done. All OK.

Vehicle in line for washing at 2.30pm.

Huge line of vehicles and I expect at least 2 hrs, minimum, for it to clear.

After an hour, I notice that vehicles are still in the same position. Walk up to the washing area and find all the boys, except one poor soul doing the water spraying, soap washing and drying!!! The rest of the 15 or so people are chatting away to glory. Expected it to be a break, but it seems to be a mini-flash-work-halt by them for payment related issue.

So, decide that I will do washing outside than do an indefinite wait here. Tell Reddy to get my vehicle off the queue since they seems to having an issue. Looks like none of the SA's knew about this.

Long story short, they did a quick wash of the vehicle, not the kind anyone would like, but with the dirt which was there, even the quick wash was a blessing. No vacuuming done. Reddy asked me to come down later, when I have time for a free wash and cleaning. (Thanks, Reddy!).

Bill generated at 5.15pm and paid. Rs. 3495/- (will put the break up later today evening).

How does the vehicle feel - good as before.

Now a question to all 2.2 guys - on the 5000kms I drove, at 3 instances I noticed that there was a sudden drop in power. This was when I was moving from 2nd to 3rd and around 1500RPM. This just comes for a second and then goes off. The feeling is similar to what will happen when you are driving without fuel. And do note that I got this only thrice so far.

Had anyone else got this kind of issue? We checked the ECU for any error code, none! It seems there is a Jan 2.2 which is there at Concord with the same issue, but at a larger degree forcing him to send it to the service center.

Apart from that, no circus, no service light, no rocking effect - smooth sail so far. Hope it stays that way.
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Old 12th October 2009, 17:11   #214
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He he he, typical Concorde Service, but good that you spent time with a newbie SA, you both learnt together... So, there is no perceptible difference before and after the service???
So, what is the inference here?
Service not required or not properly done??
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Old 12th October 2009, 17:17   #215
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Mmmm.... maybe the oils were good enough to last for some more time? And the air filter was not all that bad in shape???

And the newbie SA moved out when the experienced person came in.
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Old 12th October 2009, 17:26   #216
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Default ECU Cover and Flash

While i was in VST motors last month,Works Manager got a mail from TATA.
Some of the Safari was sold without ECU Cover and a set of chassis numbers of safari to be checked for ECU and flash it.
Some tech. guy had come from head quaters and he was giving training to flash ECU.

Safari Owners,
Please check with your dealer for the same.
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Old 12th October 2009, 17:27   #217
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Quote:
Originally Posted by suman View Post
One squeak in a vehicle that has done only 5k kms - shoddy TML quality
Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyWheels View Post
True! And that too the squeak is not there all the time! Can't they get anything right?
You Tata guys!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyWheels View Post
One strange thing that we noted was the mention to do a fuel filter change!!! Both of us were confused; I told him to skip it.

Apart from that, no circus, no service light, no rocking effect - smooth sail so far. Hope it stays that way.
With regard to not changing the fuel filter, will it not affect warranty? I mean required work not done at the required time types. Its great to know that everything is going on fine. Let it remain so.
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Old 12th October 2009, 17:28   #218
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And the newbie SA moved out when the experienced person came in.
Darn....!!!! You ruined the bright future of a deserving candidate....How will he learn now??!!!!
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Old 12th October 2009, 17:33   #219
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Originally Posted by HappyWheels View Post

Now a question to all 2.2 guys - on the 5000kms I drove, at 3 instances I noticed that there was a sudden drop in power. This was when I was moving from 2nd to 3rd and around 1500RPM. This just comes for a second and then goes off. The feeling is similar to what will happen when you are driving without fuel.
Exactly. I feel it sometimes, very erratic though. Most of the time on cold engine, morning start. I think the first instance, IIRC was around 4k kms. No service light, no error codes etc. For last 1000kms or so after retro upgrade and system-D, I feel this has reduced. Not alarming and since it is not interfering w/ driving haven't pursued the matter. I think this has been reported on many 2.2s in Safari technical thread by Dadu.

-BJ
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Old 12th October 2009, 17:35   #220
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyWheels View Post

Now a question to all 2.2 guys - on the 5000kms I drove, at 3 instances I noticed that there was a sudden drop in power. This was when I was moving from 2nd to 3rd and around 1500RPM. This just comes for a second and then goes off. The feeling is similar to what will happen when you are driving without fuel. And do note that I got this only thrice so far.

Had anyone else got this kind of issue? We checked the ECU for any error code, none! It seems there is a Jan 2.2 which is there at Concord with the same issue, but at a larger degree forcing him to send it to the service center.

Apart from that, no circus, no service light, no rocking effect - smooth sail so far. Hope it stays that way.
Should be Dadu's VTT this is a common issue on many including mine , Check the Safari 2.2 VT thread.
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Old 12th October 2009, 17:56   #221
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyWheels View Post
One strange thing that we noted was the mention to do a fuel filter change!!! Both of us were confused; I told him to skip it.

Yes its a misprint

Rear differential oil changed
Huh... This wasnt even touched in my case . Not sure but does the manual mention it ?

The Bhadhal person comes and pours in the treatment fluid and stamps the MRP 760 Rs charge! Good.
Was this necessary ?

Now a question to all 2.2 guys - on the 5000kms I drove, at 3 instances I noticed that there was a sudden drop in power. This was when I was moving from 2nd to 3rd and around 1500RPM. This just comes for a second and then goes off. The feeling is similar to what will happen when you are driving without fuel. And do note that I got this only thrice so far.

I can vouch for it

Had anyone else got this kind of issue? We checked the ECU for any error code, none! It seems there is a Jan 2.2 which is there at Concord with the same issue, but at a larger degree forcing him to send it to the service center.

Yes I do face this issue .. Moving away from SHELL Diesel helped a lot. I donot know why but..

Apart from that, no circus, no service light, no rocking effect - smooth sail so far. Hope it stays that way.
I am glad you are enjoying your ride..

PS: Please keep a record of the power drop in 1500rpm.. I too face the same and would like to collect the same and present it to TML as a coordinated effort.

Quote:
Originally Posted by amitk26 View Post
Should be Dadu's VTT this is a common issue on many including mine , Check the Safari 2.2 VT thread.
Amit this shoudnt be happening if at all..It surely is related to VTT and at a particular instance when this happens, the engine doesnt get enought air.. so..but to me it seems like a s/w glitch

Last edited by Eddy : 12th October 2009 at 18:14. Reason: Please avoid posting multiple back to back posts. Thanks
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Old 12th October 2009, 18:13   #222
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Amit this shoudnt be happening if at all..It surely is related to VTT and at a particular instance when this happens, the engine doesnt get enought air.. so..but to me it seems like a s/w glitch
Yes shouldn't happen but it happens commonly, The solution as of now is use of System-D for a tankful of normal diesel for city drive vehciles or a long high speed highway run.

This was investigated for quite long by TML and in Dadu's V.T.T older 70 mm EGR was replaced by 90 mm EGR ( that fixed krr issue) but newer Safari's already have 90mm EGR ( and no krr noise) so surely not due to EGR valve.

My own personal theory is that with normal diesel the V.T.T runs fine and to keep injectors etc clean System D can be used any thing else will raise your anxiety level by some or other issue.

My safari was doing fine all the while but I tried Shell and then Reliance Diesel in my 1000 KM trip few days back and got Idle RPM fluctuation issue immediately after return .

TML cleaned HP Fuel Lines , Injectors , Vehicle Speed sensor , Air filter and Hydraulic tappet ( HLA) Checked all the sensors and every thing you and Tanveer suggesed

Now after this mini service ( more then normal service in fact) engine noise is low and it is extra smooth but idle RPM fluctuation on cold engine is there. There is still half tank of reliance diesel so waiting for it to get over. I will be away for a month so can not send it back to Workshop.

But as I have understood this is not a serious issue as I am running up to 140 -145 Kmph occasionally and TSK completed 5000 KM leh trip so no going to waste my time on this till there is another reason.

OT : Turbo woosh sound has increased after ECU re flash.
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Old 12th October 2009, 18:25   #223
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Hey suresh nice to know your safari's clocking that many kms, I thought 5000 km service is free service, what is free in this case? I'm asking this as I have just left my vehicle too for service. I was told there is no oil change required, so no cost on consumables, now I have to wait and see till I get back my vehicle.

On a lighter note,
Your Safari ownership experience reminds me of an old Hindi movie dialogue,I'm trying to replace the character with your safari here:

Gaadi has some weird power drop
Baaki sab theek hai

The steering wheel is disintegrating
Baaki sab theek hai

Front passenger seat squeaks like a drowning mouse
Baaki sab theek hai

Headlights are pathetic
Baaki sab theek hai

I was assigned an untrained/wrongly trained SA
Baaki sab theek hai

They did not wash my car properly
Baaki sab theek hai

I was made to pay close to 3500/- bucks for a 'free' service
Baaki sab theek hai

Huh? They (Tata) will want more customers like you.

This is just for kicks, so please don't get into fight mode.
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Old 12th October 2009, 18:34   #224
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Originally Posted by Lukeskywalker View Post
Hey suresh nice to know your safari's clocking that many kms, I thought 5000 km service is free service, what is free in this case? I'm asking this as I have just left my vehicle too for service. I was told there is no oil change required, so no cost on consumables, now I have to wait and see till I get back my vehicle.
I think now Oil change interval is reduced to 5K till 15000KM ( earlier it was 15K) so some 7.5 Liters of Oil at 271 rs per liter +12.5% vat.
+ Oil filter at 161 Rs +12.55 vat. In addition he was sold Bardhal treatment for 760Rs + 12.5% vat = ~ 3500

Good that fuel filter was not changed it is 2000Rs approx and scheduled to be changed at 15K.

Labor and any parts are free any time you visit workshop and they are quite generous in that regard more then your liking at times
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Old 12th October 2009, 21:03   #225
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aks_karthik View Post
...Some of the Safari was sold without ECU Cover and a set of chassis numbers of safari to be checked for ECU and flash it...
Yes Karthik. This has been happening for close to couple of months now. In couple of places, it is now done by the TASS mechanics themselves, after the visit by the Pune based engineers.

Quote:
Originally Posted by unni.ak View Post
...With regard to not changing the fuel filter, will it not affect warranty? I mean required work not done at the required time types. Its great to know that everything is going on fine. Let it remain so.
Unni, This confusion is due to the change in the user manual when they brought in a 5k kms - 5.5k kms service interval. Previously it was 1k kms service, next was 15k kms service. Now they brought in 5.5k kms but what they did not do, or rather over-looked, was that the work to be done is different! So, as of now, people with "new" service booklet are doing most of the work that is actually required, or specified for 15k kms!

Previously they were over-doing it, now they are "under" doing it, with respect to mileage vs work required.


Quote:
Originally Posted by n.devdath View Post
Darn....!!!! You ruined the bright future of a deserving candidate....How will he learn now??!!!!
Oh, not to worry! I am sure he will have his fair share!

Quote:
Originally Posted by bj96 View Post
Exactly. I feel it sometimes, very erratic though. Most of the time on cold engine, morning start...
Quote:
Originally Posted by amitk26 View Post
Should be Dadu's VTT this is a common issue on many including mine , Check the Safari 2.2 VT thread.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rahulk76 View Post
...PS: Please keep a record of the power drop in 1500rpm.. I too face the same and would like to collect the same and present it to TML as a coordinated effort...
This sound like the EGR valve issue, but as noted by Amit, all new 2.2 are now sporting the rectified EGR valves. TML did the work with Dadu and silently fixed it for the new ones.

Do note that when the drop in power occurs, there is no extra smoke or anything else. The loss is there for a fraction of a second and then everything return back to normal.

So, in the great words of Mr.LukeSkyWalker, baaki sab theek hai.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rahulk76 View Post
I am glad you are enjoying your ride..
Thanks Rahul!


Quote:
Originally Posted by amitk26 View Post
...But as I have understood this is not a serious issue as I am running up to 140 -145 Kmph occasionally and TSK completed 5000 KM leh trip so no going to waste my time on this till there is another reason.

OT : Turbo woosh sound has increased after ECU re flash.
@Amit,
(Where do you still get Reliance diesel? Didn't know Reliance was back in business!)
The RPM fluctuation is what is plaguing TSK's vehicle for quite some time and TML is still scratching their head. I hope all are related to the same issue.

But, as for me, 5k kms and 3 times, so, this has not got me worried till now.

And about the turbo woosh: I gathered from others, who got their ECU flashed, was that the Woosh has been toned down to the power delivery being linear. So, are you sure the Woossh is a bigger Woooosssssh or a smaller Wosh?(!!!)



Quote:
Originally Posted by Lukeskywalker View Post
Hey suresh nice to know your safari's clocking that many kms, I thought 5000 km service is free service, what is free in this case? I'm asking this as I have just left my vehicle too for service. I was told there is no oil change required, so no cost on consumables, now I have to wait and see till I get back my vehicle...
Hari,

As I mentioned above, the confusion with TATA manual editors, who inserted the new 5k kms on the table and forgetting to move out or relook at the specified work at that mileage is causing this confusion. But, I was interested in changing the engine oil and hence asked them to go ahead. If no consumables, then you will get a bit fat zero for the bill amount.

PS: I infact asked them to change even the front differential oil, but the SA said that you are over-doing it and told me it is not required!


Quote:
Originally Posted by Lukeskywalker View Post
...This is just for kicks, so please don't get into fight mode.
Who would dare fight with you, Mr.Sky Walker!



Quote:
Originally Posted by amitk26 View Post
I think now Oil change interval is reduced to 5K till 15000KM ( earlier it was 15K) so some 7.5 Liters of Oil at 271 rs per liter +12.5% vat.
+ Oil filter at 161 Rs +12.55 vat. In addition he was sold Bardhal treatment for 760Rs + 12.5% vat = ~ 3500...
Spot on, Amit!

Here are my invoice details:

(Sl.no. / Part / Details / Qty / Rate / VAT / Amount)
1. / OILCASGTXD / Diesel engine oil CH4 15W40 Castrol GTS Diesel / 7.7 ltr / 231.11 / 222.45 / 1,779.55

2. / 254718130115 / Assembly Oil Filter / 1 / 161.78 / 20.22 / 161.78

3. / OIL85W140CASTR / Differential oil EP 85W140 Castrol / 2.2 / 191.11 / 52.56 / 420.44

4. / FREE2 / second Free Service

5. / 072020 / Air filter cleaning / FOC

6. / Vaunietch / Engine Flush Out D-One / / / / 760


Apart from this, I noticed one strange thing. There is a sticker under the hood, near to the central lock. There is a sticker with the VIN number and a description of the vehicle. It mentioned, "Safari GX Mineral Red 4x2"!!! Duh!!! Horn OK, Please!!!
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