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Old 28th April 2011, 21:20   #106
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Default Re: Linea 1.4 (E+) - 1 year ownership review

^Quite an experience, waiting for the next part.

There should be some way to escalate this to higher managment
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Old 28th April 2011, 21:34   #107
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Default Re: Linea 1.4 (E+) - 1 year ownership review

I came across 1-2 instances of this CSC breaking down and the owner was stranded because of no RSA. Thank god that I shot a mail to FIAT 2 weeks back and got my CSC changed to a metal one yesterday in warranty

Eager to hear how things went for you. Hope ended well
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Old 29th April 2011, 13:10   #108
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Default Re: Linea 1.4 (E+) - 1 year ownership review

^^ Well things have not really ended so to speak. I had gotten the CSC replaced in Jan 2009. In a little over a year, its gone bust again.

@ bottle - I will be shooting a mail or two before EOD today. If you can help with any contacts, that would be great.
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Old 2nd May 2011, 17:20   #109
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Default Re: Linea 1.4 (E+) - 1 year ownership review

Phew! Thats a horrifying experience. I only hope that you have not done any more damage to the clutch assembly by driving it in this state. Luckily I haven't had any trouble with the CSC so far and yes I first got it replaced in my Punto in Nov/Dec 2009 and then again recently at the FIAT First check-up camp. Your car's owner manual lists 24-hr helpline numbers for all dealers and ASC's across India and I have known people who had to call at a very odd hour and they got help. You should surely take this up with FIAT. Hope it all ended to your satisfaction.
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Old 4th May 2011, 15:10   #110
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Angry Re: Linea 1.4 (E+) - 1 year ownership review

Quote:
Originally Posted by Urban_Nomad View Post
Stranded ........ and no help in sight


Continued.....

I reached home drenched in sweat (had turned off the AC as I feared overheating because of drving the car for 20 odd kms on 1st / 2nd gear). To say I was hopping mad would be an understatement.

I kept thinking about my weekend trip to Amritsar with my wife, mom, dad and sis. I kept thinking how this issue (of the clutch cylinder) occured just after 30 odd kms of driving post the trip. What if I was stranded on the highway? If they could not provide any help / assistance just 20 odd kms away, at a reasonable hour during the day, how could I expect anything 100(s) of kms away; maybe somewhat late-ish night?

With a dizzy head and a zillion un-answered questions, I called up the GM at Rama Motors again. Dissapointment galore. My queries were met with responses like "its a machine. Anything can happen to a machine anytime" or "see reliability is not something I can talk about. I dont give the reliability. Its is Fiat. We are just a dealership. What can we do"? I was not happy with anything he was saying. My questions like "do you not represent Fiat" or "reliability of a major mechanical component vital for the product (car) to achieve its most basic purpose (transport from A to B) does not have any significance?" OR "Brakes too are mechanical components. Would a failure without warning be deemed normal (given that all service schedules have been adhered to or rather exceeded, no harsh terrains / abuse)" ....... was met with a silence at the other end. What was most sickening was the non-apologetic, non empathatic attitude of a very senior person representing a fairly well known car manufacturer. Standard motone resposne (verbatim) - "Yaar, ab bataao kya kar sakte hain".

I was not in my happy place. I told the GM that a tete a tete was required. He agreed.

At the service center:

The service center is roughly 7 - 8 odd kms away from where I stay. I aksed the GM if there was any assistance he could provide me with getting my car towed. Simple answer - "No". So, drove in 1st gear again till the workshop at 10 - 20 kmph. More than half this route is choc a bloc with traffic almost any time of the day ... any day. And this day was no different. It was a hot Saturday afternoon. The AC remained shut fearing overheating issues. Got the look from many a folks on the road and also dealt with a couple of extra hot headed individuals.

Finally, I reached the workshop. It was around 1:30 pm. I had called the GM and confirmed the late appoinment with him owing to some urgent business I had to take care of in the morning. The guard stopped me at the gate and asked me why I was there. I was in a Fiat, outside a Fiat authorised service center, what could I have possibly been there for? I had half a mind to respond with "your mama" (to be said only in a Jamaican accent), but I simply said "car service".

The entrance to the premises was very narrow with many a cars covering almost half the driveway. This meant a 3 point turn (to some extent thanks to Linea's turning radius). Impossible in my case (clutch no work you see). Called the GM and asked him to send a couple of guys outside to help me push the car inside. Response - "this is our lunch break. Someone will be there in some time". "How much time" I asked. 15 - 20 minutes. "But the car is at your gate. No car can enter or exit your premises" I almost pleaded. Got the standard monotone response. Not that I was not ticked off before, but this took it to another level. The guard probably noticed it and did not ask me to move the car even once.

Now I did not want to spoil someone's lunch, but I could see quite a few cleaner type workers roaming about on the driveway. Asked a couple of folks myself for help but they said they could not. 20 minutes had passed and I had not even entered the gate. Finally, a couple of folks came. One of them sat on the driver's seat, put the car in 1st and was about to start the car. I lost it. "KYA KAR RAHA HAI" I screamed. He turned to me, almost with a look on his face. "Car jaayegi andar ek baar mein" I asked? He shook his head. "Then"? He got out and then we tried to push the car in. but the driveway was just too narrow. It would be an uphill task to manouvre the car inside. Even once we do, getting it in a position that it does not obstruct the path of other vehichles would be much easier said than done. We decided to push the car out and park along the service center boundry wall, outside. with no other option, I agreed.

The GM finally arrives. I shook hands with him and cut through the pleasentries. "Is there somewhere we can speak", I asked. I followed him to his cabin (its the tiniest cabin you would ever see a GM of anything sitting in). I spoke to him about the issue I faced, replacement of the very same part a little over a year ago, reliability issues etc. Without going into too much detail, I would just say that I was again acquainted with the same crappy monotone answers and zero empathy. However, there are certain points that I would really like to mention here. These pointers are clear indicators as to how a leader of an establishment perceives the term "service":

Q) The CSC of my car was replaced a little over a year ago and it has failed again. I am getting it replaced at my cost this time. What gaurantees do I have it does not fail in the next 2 days, 2 months, 2 years etc?
A) See, no gaurantees. Its a machine. It will fail. The reliability is offered by Fiat. How can I tell you about its reliability. We are governed by Fiat policies.

Q) When I called you the other day around 4 - ish pm, you told me that you would be unable to help and the car needs to be brought to your workshop the next day. Why?
A) (this is verbatim) Boss, we do not take any cars in the workshop after 11 am. Even today I got the car in at around 1:30 pm as a special gesture.

Q) (I pulled out the "Fiat 24*7 roadside assistance and workshops" booklet) This booklet here gives the numbers and addresses of workshops in different areas city wise. For Delhi, your workshop has been listed as a 24 X 7 assistance center. Why is there a contradiction in what you say and what has been written?
A) BOSS, aisa kuchh nahi hai. Humaari koi 24 ghante ki naukri nahi hai.

Q) But you just said that you are governed by Fiat policy. Do you follow policy basis your convenience?
A) BOSS, kuchh bhi likha ho, humaari koi 24 ghante ki naukri nahi hai. Buss.

Q) I never faced such issues with my 3 odd lac rupee, 90k kms, 9 odd years old Santro. No breakdowns and the service has been good. Why such problems with Fiat?
A) BOSSSS, lets not compare us to Hyundai. Ye hyundai, Maruti, Honda, Toyota badi (big) companies hain. Humaare pass acche log to rehte bhi nahi hain. They all want to work for these companies. Ab bataao, what can I do? From where will I get people who can service cars?

Q) I am not sure of what your staffing issues are and neither was I keen to know them. But thanks for letting me know. The companies that you just named though, handle much higher volumes and provide a much higher standard of service.
A) Dekho YAAR, ye sab jaane do. Aap ek 5 star hotel mein bhi chale jaao. 100 people ka booking karaao, lekin pohoch jaao 500. Aapko 5 star mein bhi service nahi milegi.

After hearing the last statement above, I did not know how to react. I was (am still in) in shock. This is the 'vision" of a GM. This is how he conducts himself. I asked for a glass of water (was not offered one) and was in turn asked to get it myself. I asked how long would the service advisor's lunch last so that I could provide the details of the task at hand. I was asked to wait in the customer lounge area. I was about ready to blow my top and told him, "You did not answer my question. And this (his cabin) is where I will wait. Is that understood"? "Baitho yaar", he mumbled. Whatever little patience I had left was now out the window. I gave him an earful on his unapologetic behaviour, absence of basic courtesy and manners in general. I was LOUD. He walked out.

I felt like I was in a school time scrap with someone, sans the fist fight of course. The whole thing felt silly. I felt silly. I just wanted to get my car fixed and in the process, just be treated with the most basic of manners, thats all. It was enough. He entered the cabin after a few minutes and I apologized to him for raising my voice. He apologized in return and expressed his helplessness yet again.

He looked at my "BU Bhandari" bag which holds service details / bills of every job carried out on my Linea. He then said "BU B has a different level of service altogether. They are a big name. We are quite small in comparison. The kind of service they can provide, we surely cannot".

I almost soiled myself. And if you have read this thread end to end, you know EXACTLY why I felt like that.

Too tired to write more. Will update the final outcome shortly. Take care.
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Old 4th May 2011, 18:06   #111
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Default Re: Linea 1.4 (E+) - 1 year ownership review

Man... that's a harrowing experience. No wonder people are ...t scared of buying a Fiat. I have reposed my faith in them but always have that niggling feeling in my mind. My Palio never let me down for the 5 years, 75 thou km which I drove it. I hope my luck rides with Linea. OT.. should have bought a Vento..
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Old 4th May 2011, 19:00   #112
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Default Re: Linea 1.4 (E+) - 1 year ownership review

Mate, thats really a bad experience. I had plans to buy a used linea, but - I have to re think now..
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Old 4th May 2011, 19:01   #113
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Default Re: Linea 1.4 (E+) - 1 year ownership review

Sad experience totally, seems to be more of an issue with this A.S.S really. Have you tried calling up the customer care hotline again or registering a complaint on the Fiat website ? I'm not sure if service@fiat.com is still active.

I think there is another Punto with the tyre wear issue here with some contacts posted that you can look for

Last edited by bottle : 4th May 2011 at 19:02.
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Old 5th May 2011, 02:58   #114
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Default Re: Linea 1.4 (E+) - 1 year ownership review

Why am I not surprised to hear that Rama Motors has screwed up again? I stay 10 minutes away from them; bought my Punto from them (one of the very first Punto's to hit the road in June'09), but go to Elegant Motors at Patparganj for even the most minor thing which is 20 kms away (45-50 minutes drive). Have been hearing they aren't going to stay in business for long.
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Old 5th May 2011, 12:11   #115
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Default Re: Linea 1.4 (E+) - 1 year ownership review

Quote:
Originally Posted by nkapoor777 View Post
Have been hearing they aren't going to stay in business for long.
With this attitude, I doubt they can survive. And the key word here is Attitude. I have seen a lot of discussion on this forum regarding TASS and one clear solution that almost everyone seems to agree upon is that Fiat should have seperate / independent A$$. I would disagree. Even with Tata, if just the staff's attitude towards the customer would be more positive, a lot would change. Maybe some training on customer service / ettiquette, if administered properly should help matters. The issues are not technical such as part availability or diagnose of the issue but rather the attitude of even the most senior people. I say this, if the gentleman (GM) had simply said something like "I understand that it must have been an unpleasent experience" or "apologies for the inconvenience caused" and attended me with the most basic civility, I would have been wayyyyyyy calmer (at least upon my arrival at the service center).

Will update the last bit of the experience shortly mate

Quote:
Originally Posted by bottle View Post
I think there is another Punto with the tyre wear issue here with some contacts posted that you can look for
Thanks for the heads up on the (Punto) thread. Will check it out shortly. In the past, I have mailed / called zillion people (top management) to have the most basic stuff sorted. I am just tired of it now. Life's too busy to spend day after day worrying about your vehichle. That said, I will take it up with Fiat this one time to see how they respond.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Superleggera View Post
Mate, thats really a bad experience. I had plans to buy a used linea, but - I have to re think now..
Do re-think and re-think hard. The car is nice and you will probably land a clean example at a very competitive price. But the A$$ ..... dont think I need to say much here.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Palio_2005 View Post
OT.. should have bought a Vento..
OT:

Last edited by Urban_Nomad : 5th May 2011 at 12:13.
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Old 5th May 2011, 12:30   #116
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Default Re: Linea 1.4 (E+) - 1 year ownership review

Sigh! We are looking for a premium hatch and the Punto was one of the top contenders. Won my heart to be honest, but am gonna put it few notches down the priority list, Figo and the Ritz coming upon it!

Best of luck, Urban Nomad. Fiat service totally spoils everything, otherwise the Linea and the Punto are such potent cars.
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Old 5th May 2011, 12:37   #117
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Default Re: Linea 1.4 (E+) - 1 year ownership review

Quote:
Originally Posted by Urban_Nomad View Post
With this attitude, I doubt they can survive. And the key word here is Attitude. I say this, if the gentleman (GM) had simply said something like "I understand that it must have been an unpleasent experience" or "apologies for the inconvenience caused" and attended me with the most basic civility, I would have been wayyyyyyy calmer (at least upon my arrival at the service center).
100%. I bumped into this so-called GM some time ago when my car had a broken headlight and fender damage in a collision. I went to Rama Motors hoping against hope for the only reason that they offered cashless claim settlement with Bajaj Allianz which was the insurance company. I spent 30 minutes with him and got hopping mad at his "ATTITUDE". I walked off and went to Sanya motors and filed a claim, paid from my pocket and got reimbursement later. I haven't returned to Rama Motors since and don't intend to ever.
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Old 5th May 2011, 18:16   #118
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Default Re: Linea 1.4 (E+) - 1 year ownership review

Hot damn, straight from cloud nine onto the frying pan, man, that's how your story reads. From fragrant roses down into the bleeding thorns, eh? That conversation with the GM in unbelievable. 'Hamari koi 24 ghante ki naukri nahi hain?' If Fiat promises 24x7 roadside assistance and the assistance provider responds like this, maybe it's consumer court matter.

I recall the one and only time my rickety old Esteem wouldn't start on the road (Kamal Attaturk road, near Lodhi road) in 2007: the experience went like this: I call Maruti roadside assistance (which I never registered for), the girl on the phone asks for car no., make, colour, location, notes my no., tells me to wait 5 min, calls me back in 2, tells me a mechanic is on the way and will reach in 20 min, gives me the mechanic's no. too, he reaches in time in a van, finds that the aftermarket gas kit burner (which I never used) is causing a choke, I ask him to remove it altogether, he does so and starts the car, charges me 120/- and we're both on the way, all in 20 odd min. No smiles exchanged except at the end, mine with gratitude at the relief and his at the job quickly disposed. Summary: hot summer afternoon breakdown = painful, cursing myself silly for buying a used car = remorseful, from problem start to problem end = 1 hour, repair cost = 120 Rs., restoration of my faith in the car, my decision and Maruti service = priceless.

I was very serious on the Linea but this thread makes me nervous. What use is a beautiful wife whose family would treat you like dirt every time you meet them, hai na? Who wants a headache and pay for it too? Fiat customer care keeps calling if anyone turned for a requested TD every fortnight or so, I say no, they apologise and say they'll ask someone at Pandit auto to come over, I sigh, nobody ever comes. If this is how enthusiastically they sell it, I wonder how much enthusiastically they'd maintain it after the sale. Meanwhile, am off searching for other cars.

I do hope your problems are sorted out by now. Heck man, I was aghast reading those last two three posts of yours, even my way old granny of an Esteem (bought at 10 years of her age), never gave me so many problems in last four years plus.

Last edited by Delta Wing : 5th May 2011 at 18:32. Reason: typo
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Old 5th May 2011, 19:01   #119
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Default Re: Linea 1.4 (E+) - 1 year ownership review

@Urban_Nomad

Rama Motors at one point of time were Hyundai dealer based in Safdurjung Enclave in South Delhi, opposite to Bhikaji Cama Place. My cousin bought her Santro Xing XL from the same dealer in 2005. Guess this (pathetic customer servicing) was the reason they were kicked out by Hyundai, & could not reopen with any auto company for almost 3-4 years. & I doubt they will continue with Tata-Fiat for long or probably will be dealing in Tata cars only in future (worst case scenario, from customer viewpoint).

You could have tried Vivek instead, which is located opposite to Escorts (Apollo) Hospital (or rather Sarita Vihar) on the Mathura Road. It is adjacent to JLR showroom (another landmark FYIP). I bet this one is better & probably nearer if you take Kalindu Kunj route from Noida.

My only suggestion will be to avoid Rama in future, at any cost.
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Old 13th May 2011, 13:27   #120
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Default Re: Linea 1.4 (E+) - 1 year ownership review

Quote:
Originally Posted by Urban_Nomad View Post
Continued.....

Will update the final outcome shortly. Take care.

Continued.....

After this back and forth and back again, I finally got the service advisor to look at my car. One look at the clutch and he confirmed that the "clutch slave cylinder" needs replacement.

Since the car was going to be at the workshop for a day, I decided to get some misc. things checked / done as well (service is a month or more away you see). Here's the list:
  • Replace CSC.
  • Interior "dry clean".
  • Check "Airbag failure" message that was popping up every now and then since the last one week or so.
  • The right front door had a faint rattle. So asked him to check that and all other doors too (preventive measure).
  • Asked him to try and rub our a faint (but ugly) scratch on the right rear fender (thank you Mahindra pick up driving doodh waala).
  • Fix the rear left quarter glass chrome strip (I had the chrome strip. It only had to be pasted).
He noted all the details and gave me an estimate of roughly Rs 3000. I asked him for the break up. He was charging me Rs 1250 for the interior cleaning, Rs 300 to diagnose "airbag failure" message (if anything needed fixing, that would be separate), fixing chrome strip Rs 200, Fender Rub would probably be another Rs 300, Oh! and they would NOT be washing the car as it is not a scheduled maintenance work I have come for. He did not have the cost of the CSC and assumed it would be around 2500 + labour.

(I know what you are thinking, it surely does not add up to 3500, but more. Well, read on.)

I threw a fit. I had suffered enough and did not want to pay for the nonsensical stuff he was throwing at me. After a loooooooooooottttttttt of haggling, got the cleaning down to Rs 1000, strip fix Rs 100, free wash (exterior) no charge for the 'Airbag diagnosis" and free rubbing of both fenders. All in all, I was able to knock back around 900 bucks.

I was promised delivery on Monday. Here's a snapshot of this entire experience (just the service part. Pre service has been covered in previous posts):

The Good (yes, I do have something to pen down here):
  • The part (slave cylinder) was readily available. No waiting, no nothing. And AFAIK, I do not think CSC is a "regular replacement / fast moving" spare part. Great.
  • It was very very cost effective. I made the stupidity of not opting for the extended warranty when I bought the car. All the money I was hoping to save when I unchecked the "extn warranty" box shall now go back to Fiat 10 fold, or so I thought. Now I dont know how much a clutch cylinder for other sedans in the same category cost, but I was billed Rs 1111 for the CSC. Not too shabby at all I say. Total bill (including cleaning) Rs 2800. Additional Rs 400 was charged against "brake oil" replacement. The SA told me that since its a hydraulic clutch, it is mandatory to replace the brake oil post CSC replacement. I was surprised (clutch - brake oil combo?) but let it be.
  • I had to collect the car from Rama on Monday evening. I could not get out of the office early and arrived at the dealership at 6:30 pm, near about closure time of the service center. My SA informed me that he leaves by 6 and 6:30 would be too late. Told him point blank that even a minute sooner would not be possible for me. He waited till I got there, showed me the car, directed me to the cash counter and then dashed out of there.
  • I was in and out of the service center (on monday ie) in about 5 minutes. The cashier worked quickly, the car was parked in a drive out position near the gate, my gate pass already submitted with the guard.Nicely done Mr SA.
The Bad (no service review of my Linea would be complete without this):
  • The next day (Tuesday morning) I noticed a pretty prominent scar / scratch on the rear left door. And given that the GM himself is such a polite man and a great listener (NOTTTTTT), I did not bother taking it up with him. For now, this scar has been added to my existing collection.
  • Car cleaning (exterior) - Yet again, I was not disappointed. I knew the car clean up would not be proper and Voila, even this time Fiat displayed its consistency. There were dusty handprints on the boot and rear doors of my car. I asked the SA to get it cleaned while I paid the bill. I came back and lets just say "they missed a SPOT".
  • The interiors were almost damp and covered with newspapers / "thank you ,visit again" brown paper. The interiors were cleaned with some sort of a chemical (or so I was told) and it had not dried up. I drove all the way home with a warm feeling in my pants, like I soiled myself. Thanks Fiat for bringing back my childhood memories.
  • Once the chemical did dry up (next morning), I did not see a remarkable difference in the interiors. Yes everything looked clean at a glance, but upon closer inspection, you kind of start looking at a spot or two that they probably missed. I think a "car shampoo" elsewhere would be a cheaper and better solution.
I end this post with ...... well ... kind of a heavy heart. I mean, the car itself is great. It checked all the boxes for me. It looks great, handles like a charm, overall is fun to drive (despite the engine ) gives respectable fuel efficiency, is loaded with gizmos and is not exactly heavy on the pocket in terms of ongoing maintenance. All in all, a very VFM deal. But at the very same time, it is being let down by a bunch of circus freaks who (collectively) refer to themselves as "the after sales service department". Every single visit to the service center leaves a bitter taste in my mouth EACH time. It does not matter if its Pune or Delhi, these jokers somehow manage to cling themselves to the name Fiat. I doubt how long such folks can stay in business. Get your act together Fiat. Whatever little you get to scrape off in terms of monthly car sales; would also cease to exist if this freak show continues.

Last edited by Urban_Nomad : 13th May 2011 at 13:29.
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