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Old 12th May 2011, 10:57   #151
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Default re: Life with a Fiat Punto *UPDATE* Car sold

anshuman, perfectly agree with you. I had to change the GT3 on my Punto since I damaged them during a Bangalore - Tiruvannamalai trip last year on the craters between krishnagiri and Tiruvannamalai.

I replaced the running 4 tires with Yokohama C-drives and they have been doing good for the last 7K kms. Compared to GT3, the Yokohama C drives have less nose, smoother drive. I did not see any difference with respect to steering weight or mileage compared to GT3.
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Old 14th May 2011, 06:26   #152
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Default re: Life with a Fiat Punto *UPDATE* Car sold

Anshuman, the clutch on our Punto is very hard and shifting gears has now become a major headache!!! Is this clutch cylinder related?
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Old 14th May 2011, 12:07   #153
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Default re: Life with a Fiat Punto *UPDATE* Car sold

Quote:
Originally Posted by krreddy View Post
Anshuman, the clutch on our Punto is very hard and shifting gears has now become a major headache!!! Is this clutch cylinder related?
It can be related to Clutch Servo Cylinder assembly. If you did not get the plastic assembly replaced get it checked now.

The clutch in my Punto had become heavier over time, it was not over assisted like when the car was delivered. I did not drive the car after the replacement so i cannot tell you how heavy is it now?

Edit: The clutch after master cylinder assembly replacement is much lighter.

Last edited by .anshuman : 23rd June 2011 at 23:57. Reason: See post
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Old 24th June 2011, 00:32   #154
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Default Punto / Swift / i20

Hi Anshuman,

I have gone through this thread and also this one:
http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/test-d...update-22.html (Exchanged Swift with Grande Punto EDIT: 15000 kms update)

I would say that both of these two threads contain a very detailed feedback. I have gone through other threads also like GTO's report on Punto. Members and guests coming to the forum in search of Punto reviews, will get a lot of help from these two threads. But, few of them, will still remain confused, just like I am confused at the moment.

My Swift VDi is ready to be delivered within 1-2 weeks time but now I am confused if I should go for Swift VDi, i20 or Punto Emotion?

Why Punto?
1. All new Swift was supposed to be launched by August but it seems it will be delayed because of the strike at Manesar plant. Can not keep holding the Swift booking for the next 6 months. Also I don't want to buy a model which will be old within next 6 months.
2. MOST IMPORTANT: Punto looks are far better as compared even with the all new swift.
3. Ride quality, safety and comfort are better in Punto than the swift.

Why Swift VDi?
1. It's a Maruti Suzuki network and after Sales Service will be a peace of mind.
2. Tatas have recently said that they will have to rework on their alliance with FIAT. Don't know if it can result in ZERO after sales service.
3. Turning radius is better in Swift. Easy to drive in cities.

Why i20?
1. Second largest network in India.
2. Reliable, ride quality, safety and comfort at par with Punto.

There will be common problems like poor plastics, poor fit and finish etc. in both (Punto and Swift) the cars. But I would like to know, after two years, are you still happy with your Punto? Would you still recommend Punto over the Swift VDi and i20?

You have faced problems in all the three workshops of TATA in Gurgaon. I am not sure if HIM Motors at Patparganj, Delhi better than the Gurgaon workshops? If I buy the Punto than this is the workshop where it will be serviced. I know the workshop manager here and may be he can help me by giving me the better support.

PS: I will be retaining the car for the next 5 years atleast. The deal will be done on cash down payment basis.

help me in deciding the car.

Cheers!
Irish

Last edited by Irish : 24th June 2011 at 00:34.
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Old 24th June 2011, 13:01   #155
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Default Re: Punto / Swift / i20

Quote:
Originally Posted by Irish View Post
Hi Anshuman,

I have gone through this thread and also this one:
http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/test-d...update-22.html (Exchanged Swift with Grande Punto EDIT: 15000 kms update)

I would say that both of these two threads contain a very detailed feedback. I have gone through other threads also like GTO's report on Punto. Members and guests coming to the forum in search of Punto reviews, will get a lot of help from these two threads. But, few of them, will still remain confused, just like I am confused at the moment.
Thanks Irish, I am glad you found these threads helpful.

Quote:
My Swift VDi is ready to be delivered within 1-2 weeks time but now I am confused if I should go for Swift VDi, i20 or Punto Emotion?
Quote:
Why Punto?
1. All new Swift was supposed to be launched by August but it seems it will be delayed because of the strike at Manesar plant. Can not keep holding the Swift booking for the next 6 months. Also I don't want to buy a model which will be old within next 6 months.
2. MOST IMPORTANT: Punto looks are far better as compared even with the all new swift.
3. Ride quality, safety and comfort are better in Punto than the swift.
When you know the new Swift is coming very soon, going in for the current Swift does not make much sense. To confuse you further, even the Fiat Punto facelift is rumoured coming by Diwali.

Looks are subjective and i agree Punto is probably the best looking hatchback on sale in our country today.

Ride quality in Punto is even better than most 10 lakh rupee hatchbacks. Low speed ride is a bit stiff but after moderate speeds the ride composure and ability to soak up poor roads is brilliant.

For safety i guess the new Swift also has been certified with 5 star Euro NCAP rating and the versions we get here do not come with all the safety equipment like knee airbags, curtain airbags, ESP etc, I'd trust both the cars equally well.

Punto is very comfortable car thanks to the composed ride BUT the ergonomics are POOR, even after living with the car for more than 2 years i am yet get used to weird driving position and i am yet to find the perfect driving position unlike the Swift where even without the adjustable steering the driving position is much more comfortable. The steering is only usable at lowest position, the adjustable steering feature in Punto remains effective just in paper specs to impress new car buyers. Another concern i have with Ergonomics is the pedals, they are weirdly positioned too high up and along with the steering that is positioned too close to the chest, to add to my woes my other car- Elantra had the best ergonomics around, even my current Laura has great ergonomics to spoil me further. For ergonomics i'd rate i20>Swift>Punto.

Boomy engine and low gearing make it annoying when cruising at speed on highways. 90Hp has much better NVH insulation. Overall Performance is Mediocre, disappointing for flat out driving, good for riding the torque wave.

Another concern is poor service support and terrible supply of parts. You may have to wait for parts for months. God forbid if the car gets into an accident, you may have to wait for months.

List of parts i've had to wait-
  • Key replacement under warranty- Months
  • AC Filter- I could not find one so got it replaced in next service.
  • Steering lock- Did not arrive after months of waiting, finally a Tata mechanic fixed it.

Quote:
Why Swift VDi?
1. It's a Maruti Suzuki network and after Sales Service will be a peace of mind.
2. Tatas have recently said that they will have to rework on their alliance with FIAT. Don't know if it can result in ZERO after sales service.
3. Turning radius is better in Swift. Easy to drive in cities.
  • Compared to Tata-Fiat network, Maruti's service support is leagues ahead.
  • Point#2 replied above.
  • Yes Turning radius is better than Punto, no more 3 point U turns. You may find find this surprising- My Laura can get to a certain spot in one go when the Punto has to make a 3 point turn.
  • Current Swift cannot match the vault like build of the Punto. In my Swift rattling started within the first 15 days of ownership.
  • Thanks to the better sorted gear ratios, the Swift is much more peppier to drive than the Punto, it's even faster than the 90hp version.



Quote:
Why i20?
1. Second largest network in India.
2. Reliable, ride quality, safety and comfort at par with Punto.
  • The i20's Handling, Steering and overall dynamics are not a match to either Swift or Punto. Good for commuting but not if you LIVE TO DRIVE.
  • i20 CRDi has the best Diesel Engine in the segment. It sure has lag below 2000 rpm(Further accentuated by tall gearing) but beyond it the power delivery stays till redline, very quiet, very refined and willing to revv. The Multijet engine too has turbo lag, more so in Swift but what annoys me is the narrow powerband, the torque arrives by 1800 rpm and tails off after 3200rpm(75hp).
  • Six speed gearbox with tall gearing, real pleasure on highways, pain in city(tall gearing).
  • Remember the AC is weak and rattles in steering assembly still do exist.

Quote:
There will be common problems like poor plastics, poor fit and finish etc. in both (Punto and Swift) the cars. But I would like to know, after two years, are you still happy with your Punto? Would you still recommend Punto over the Swift VDi and i20?
The Sad part is none of these cars are perfect- Punto has very strong core advantages but has equally annoying dark side. i20 is dull and uninvolving to drive but scores well on all other parts especially the excellent CRDi engine. Swift is an entertainer with the fun Handling and Peppy performance but out on bad roads it still rides like a small car, no matter how hard you try controlling the rattles, they will still exist plus there is no top end ZDi variant.

Quote:
You have faced problems in all the three workshops of TATA in Gurgaon. I am not sure if HIM Motors at Patparganj, Delhi better than the Gurgaon workshops? If I buy the Punto than this is the workshop where it will be serviced. I know the workshop manager here and may be he can help me by giving me the better support.
Some service centers are better than others but overall they are no match for Maruti/Hyundai. Sourcing parts will be time consuming and painful process.

Quote:
PS: I will be retaining the car for the next 5 years atleast. The deal will be done on cash down payment basis.
Even i buy cars on Cash down, instead of opting for Finance.

I suggest you to wait for the new Swift before taking the final decision. However if you cannot wait you will have to choose from existing batch of compromise cars.

There are rumours of Polo 1.5 TDi 90+hp coming soon.
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Old 24th June 2011, 14:38   #156
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Default Re: Punto / Swift / i20

Quote:
Originally Posted by Irish View Post
Hi Anshuman,
I have gone through this thread and also this one:
http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/test-d...update-22.html (Exchanged Swift with Grande Punto EDIT: 15000 kms update)
I would say that both of these two threads contain a very detailed feedback. I have gone through other threads also like GTO's report on Punto. Members and guests coming to the forum in search of Punto reviews, will get a lot of help from these two threads. But, few of them, will still remain confused, just like I am confused at the moment.

My Swift VDi is ready to be delivered within 1-2 weeks time but now I am confused if I should go for Swift VDi, i20 or Punto Emotion?
Please also go through the threads detailing the unresolved steering rattles issues for the i20. One of them is here:
http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/indian...se-issues.html
It may contain a link to skanchan's video of the rattle.
When I checked these threads, these experiences helped me strike off one of my options

Of those that you have listed, I would go for the Punto.

Last edited by selfdrive : 24th June 2011 at 14:39.
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Old 24th June 2011, 22:09   #157
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Default re: Life with a Fiat Punto *UPDATE* Car sold

Thanks Anshuman and selfdrive.

You guys have confused me more. I can not wait for more than 15 days. So i20 may be out of list now as the waiting period for i20 is more than 1 month. Need to finalise the car now. Either Swift VDi or Punto.


Don't know if others also get confused.
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Old 26th June 2011, 23:15   #158
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Default re: Life with a Fiat Punto *UPDATE* Car sold

Hi Anshuman,

Can you please advise me if I should go for Emotion or Emotion Pack, if Punto MJD is finalised? Although I have gone through variuos threads on this forum like this one: http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/hatchb...ml#post1450274 (Punto MJD Emotion Regular v/s Emotion Pack)

I would also like more safety (Airbags) + style (Alloys) + Confort (B&M + Climate Control + Steering Mounted Controls) etc. But need your feedback over the same. I know that we are getting so many things within 60K, which is a good deal but is it advisable? Got so many confusions because Swift VDi is 5.88 Lacs (On road, Delhi). I know the Swift features and functions are far below (no offences to any swift owner here!), which are currently being offered in Punto. But still I've doubts.

One more factor - Will be doing cash down payment and the budget was 5.5 Lacs. Now I need 1.5 Lacs extra to enjoy the features (safety+comfort+style) of the Italian Beauty.

In Punto Emotion and Emotion Pack, there is a difference of approx 70K (Delhi - On Road) between these two models:
  • Emotion = 6.34 Lacs
  • Emotion Pack = 7.05 Lacs (he can do some more discount here)
Freebies Offered:
  • 1 Year Insurance
  • 2 + 2 = 4 Years Extended Warranty
  • 50 Months Road Side Assistance
Will be taking a quote from another dealer very soon. Any tips on getting more discounts here? Are the price quotes okay for the Punto? Please advise.


Cheers!
Irish
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Old 27th June 2011, 00:27   #159
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Default re: Life with a Fiat Punto *UPDATE* Car sold

I find the EP variant pretty good value for money over the Emotion version. If Emotion had Airbags i would have picked it over EP, that ways i could get Alloy Rims and Audio system of my taste. I do not care much about Climate Control, i anyways do not use it in Full Auto mode so a basic HVAC system with thermostat knob is equally fine with me.

75HP vs 90HP
The only noticable difference is beyond 3000rpm, if you intend to travel a lot on Highways at speed or you love revving the car consider the 90hp version. NVH is also slightly better in 90 hp.
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Old 27th June 2011, 13:23   #160
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Default re: Life with a Fiat Punto *UPDATE* Car sold

^^+1; while looking out for my car too, I was recommended to go in for the Emotion Pack 90 HP. While the 90 HP part is a bit subjective, I would definitely recommend the Emotion Pack due to the airbags if nothing else. You also mention that some discounts are possible, so please try to test the extent of your negotiation skills!
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Old 27th June 2011, 13:56   #161
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Default Re: Punto / Swift / i20

Quote:
Originally Posted by .anshuman View Post
Punto is very comfortable car thanks to the composed ride BUT the ergonomics are POOR, even after living with the car for more than 2 years i am yet get used to weird driving position and i am yet to find the perfect driving position unlike the Swift where even without the adjustable steering the driving position is much more comfortable.
While I agree with most of things you have said, some of the things are way exaggerated like the one above. Ergonomics is a personal opinion so what works for you may not work for me. I for one hate the driving position on the Swift compared to the Punto because I like the seats to be low which gives a feeling of sitting in the car. Compared to Punto's front seat, the seats on the Swift feels flat and high perched.

Quote:
Originally Posted by .anshuman View Post
Another concern is poor service support and terrible supply of parts. You may have to wait for parts for months. God forbid if the car gets into an accident, you may have to wait for months.

List of parts i've had to wait-
  • Key replacement under warranty- Months
  • AC Filter- I could not find one so got it replaced in next service.
  • Steering lock- Did not arrive after months of waiting, finally a Tata mechanic fixed it.
Again this is hugely exaggerated. I have 5 friends who own a Punto and not one of them has even faced a problem with spares, regular or accidental. Mind you two of the car have gone for accidental repairs and on one car the left hand side stalk was changed under warranty in 2 hours flat and that is without prior appointment!


Quote:
Originally Posted by .anshuman View Post
  • Thanks to the better sorted gear ratios, the Swift is much more peppier to drive than the Punto, it's even faster than the 90hp version.
Add weight to the list. I also have to mention that Punto is definitely more driveable in the city compared to Swift which is like a 0 or 1. Try this with a Punto, put it in fourth gear and let go of the accelerator pedal and let the speed drop. Even at 30 kmph or so in fourth with 4 people in the car and A/C running, there wasn't even a murmur, knocking or protest from the engine. Try that with a Swift and let us know.
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Old 28th June 2011, 08:04   #162
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Default re: Life with a Fiat Punto *UPDATE* Car sold

Quote:
Originally Posted by Irish View Post
Thanks Anshuman and selfdrive.

You guys have confused me more. I can not wait for more than 15 days. So i20 may be out of list now as the waiting period for i20 is more than 1 month. Need to finalise the car now. Either Swift VDi or Punto.


Don't know if others also get confused.

We have a 1.3 MJD EP, and from our ownership experience (38,000 KM in 20 months), the only major concern was the service. To be more specific, spares were not always available. Besides that, service was good and more importantly spares were very affordable and much cheaper than VW & Skoda (i could even add Hyundai).

Coming to the driving position, i have gotten so used to the high driving position of our Punto that i find our Hyundai Verna too low. Thigh support is very good and i would recommend Leather Upholstery.

FIAT-TATA have replaced door beading, rear shock assembly, Clutch assembly, rear window button and rear door knob under warranty without any questions asked. So i was kind of happy with their customer support.

Irish, Emotion was not an option for me back then because of the following features offered in EP.
a. Great Alloys (IMO the best alloy wheels on a Hatch)
b. Blue & Me (Great Microsoft Bluetooth feature)
c. Airbags & ABS
d. Bigger Tyres
e. Leather Steering with Mounted Stereo and Blue & ME Buttons
f. Auto AC

Above all, you will always have the regret that i should have opted for the top end instead in the future. A prime example is yours truly. We opted for Toyota Qualis GS instead of GST, Skoda Octavia Elegance instead of L&K and we always felt that we should have opted for the top end instead.

From our ownership experience, we are very happy with the vehicle and we intend to keep it for another two years atleast.
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Old 28th June 2011, 12:52   #163
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Default re: Life with a Fiat Punto *UPDATE* Car sold

Quote:
Originally Posted by .anshuman View Post
75HP vs 90HP
The only noticable difference is beyond 3000rpm, if you intend to travel a lot on Highways at speed or you love revving the car consider the 90hp version. NVH is also slightly better in 90 hp.
Thanks Anshuman. I do travel on the highways. Minimum highway travelling is 1000 Kms per month. The price quoted for a 90HP is 7.38 Lacs whereas the Emotion Pack is quoted as 7.02 Lacs i.e. a difference of 36 thousand. The salesman says 90HP doesnt sell too many. I know, he may not have th9 90HP in stock.

Quote:
Originally Posted by selfdrive View Post
^^+1; while looking out for my car too, I was recommended to go in for the Emotion Pack 90 HP. While the 90 HP part is a bit subjective, I would definitely recommend the Emotion Pack due to the airbags if nothing else. You also mention that some discounts are possible, so please try to test the extent of your negotiation skills!
Thanks Selfdrive. The same dealer has revised his quotes. He is now offering a gold coin of 1 gm + 5000 cash with every model but he can give a cash discount of Rs 2000 instead of gold coin. So the latest quotes (Delhi - On Road) are as follows:
  • Emotion: 6.24 Lacs
  • Emotion Pack: 7.02 Lacs
  • Emotion Pack 90HP: 7.38 Lacs
Any idea if these quotes are okay as compared to other dealers?

Quote:
Originally Posted by krreddy View Post
Irish, Emotion was not an option for me back then because of the following features offered in EP.
a. Great Alloys (IMO the best alloy wheels on a Hatch)
b. Blue & Me (Great Microsoft Bluetooth feature)
c. Airbags & ABS
d. Bigger Tyres
e. Leather Steering with Mounted Stereo and Blue & ME Buttons
f. Auto AC

Above all, you will always have the regret that i should have opted for the top end instead in the future. A prime example is yours truly. We opted for Toyota Qualis GS instead of GST, Skoda Octavia Elegance instead of L&K and we always felt that we should have opted for the top end instead.

From our ownership experience, we are very happy with the vehicle and we intend to keep it for another two years atleast.
Thanks Krreddy. How much do you travel on the highways in your 1.3 MJD? Are you satisfied with its behaviuor on the highways?

Cheers!
Irish
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Old 28th June 2011, 13:08   #164
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Default re: Life with a Fiat Punto *UPDATE* Car sold

Quote:
Originally Posted by Irish View Post
Thanks Selfdrive. The same dealer has revised his quotes. He is now offering a gold coin of 1 gm + 5000 cash with every model but he can give a cash discount of Rs 2000 instead of gold coin.
Sounds ok to me, but you should try to haggle further. Do ensure you wave your cheque book when you negotiate, it has a great impact. I dont know about current prices; its been sometime since I ventured anywhere near the Tata-Fiat dealership. Which is actually good, because it means my Nano is running ok!

Nevertheless, I assumed you were only considering hatchbacks. If not, you may want to consider a TD of the Fiesta Classic. It is as good a car as the Punto, if not better. Only in case you are still not convinced about Fiat *** and if a sedan is fine for you.
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Old 28th June 2011, 18:30   #165
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Default Re: Punto / Swift / i20

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Originally Posted by Irish View Post
You have faced problems in all the three workshops of TATA in Gurgaon. I am not sure if HIM Motors at Patparganj, Delhi better than the Gurgaon workshops? If I buy the Punto than this is the workshop where it will be serviced. I know the workshop manager here and may be he can help me by giving me the better support.
If you are located in the Patparganj area, look no further than Elegant Motors for servicing and running repairs. You also have Oberoi Cars in Noida which is pretty efficient in service but Elegant gets my vote. I have not faced any issues with spares (common ones) and other stuff is ordered and delivered on time (case in point - I placed an order for the Linea armrest and with in 5 days, all the requisite spares were available with them).
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