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Old 17th January 2012, 12:05   #76
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Default Re: Spider Diesel Tuning Box VS. Pete's Tuning Box - Spider Box feedback on pg 2

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Originally Posted by kryptonite View Post
This will be useful info for this thread as well (similar as my earlier post in another thread):

I spoke to Kiran from TDI Racing (ph: 9900068200), Bangalore a day ago, they charge Rs.32,000 (best discounted price for now) for a ECU re-map for a Vento/Rapid. 30~35% claimed boost in power/torque.
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Originally Posted by Endeavour333 View Post
A fellow Endeavour owner on these forums, ssh1979, did a good test drive of my Endeavour with the Spider box and was absolutely astonished with the performance gains. An aftermarket air filter also helps gains considerably. So please consider buying an aftermarket air filter, even a stock replacement air filter from K&N or BMC will give significant gains with a tuning box.
I have already installed K&N stock replacement filter, though the effect is hardly noticeable. However having high hopes with tuning box, alas don't have any other option but buying & installing the same on my car (no option to test and buy is available).
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Old 17th January 2012, 12:42   #77
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Originally Posted by Turbo Head

I have already installed K&N stock replacement filter, though the effect is hardly noticeable. However having high hopes with tuning box, alas don't have any other option but buying & installing the same on my car (no option to test and buy is available).
The K&N filter will make more of a difference when you install the tuning box. This is because with the stock amount of fuel being injected into the cylinders the amount of air necessary is provided for almost completely by the stock paper filter. With a tuning box more fuel is injected and thus more air is required to combust it completely. This is where the stock filter will choke the power a little bit by not providing enough air. The K&N filter with its increased air flow will provide more air than the stock filter and this you will realize more power gains.
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Old 18th January 2012, 15:26   #78
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Default Re: Spider Diesel Tuning Box VS. Pete's Tuning Box - Spider Box feedback on pg 2

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Originally Posted by akshay1234 View Post
Vishnu, I just read up this whole thread again as I prepare to blow (yet some more) money on a K&N air filter and Spider

What exactly is the answer to akshay's question about using a Swift box on the Endy?

I browsed through the Spider website and saw that they have a tuning box for the Ranger 3.0 TDCi, which I think is exactly what we need: Ford Ranger tdci diesel tuning performance UK

Did you discuss this with Feroz before?

Last edited by ssh1979 : 18th January 2012 at 15:30.
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Old 19th January 2012, 02:53   #79
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Originally Posted by ssh1979
What exactly is the answer to akshay's question about using a Swift box on the Endy?

Did you discuss this with Feroz before?
I'm not sure how Feroz used a swift box on my Endy. Maybe that's why I got the problems? Have not discussed it with Feroz yet but I assumed that the box would work on any car since he used a swift box on mine.

I will ask him to keep an Endy box tuned just like mine for you
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Old 19th January 2012, 07:32   #80
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Default Re: Spider Diesel Tuning Box VS. Pete's Tuning Box - Spider Box feedback on pg 2

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Originally Posted by Endeavour333 View Post
I'm not sure how Feroz used a swift box on my Endy. Maybe that's why I got the problems? Have not discussed it with Feroz yet but I assumed that the box would work on any car since he used a swift box on mine.

I will ask him to keep an Endy box tuned just like mine for you
Hi Vishnu,

Quick question. Has the idling been affected in any way after fitting the box? Do you feel the extra power when your foot is not on the accelerator? For example, when you reverse out of your drive way (I'm assuming you do this), does it seem to move back more quickly than before? Or do you feel the power only when you need it (step on it)? That is what Spider is claiming...that the box is intelligent enough to deliver extra fuel only when you 'ask' for it and it does so many calculations blah blah blah.

I wish they would allow us to test the box :( I'm a little wary on what the effects of the increased power will be on the clutch, gear box, brakes, and other parts. As a friend was telling me the other day, most vehicles are built for a tolerance of the extra power, but this tolerance is less in the case of Indian manufacturers.

I hope I'm not digressing too much here, but the Safari and Scorpio both have the same engine blocks. But the Safari churns out an additional 20 bhp. This is because the Scorpio has been de-tuned as the other components discussed above could not live up to 'higher expectations'. So that is my dilemma!

Are there any settings on the box? As spider claims these boxes can be used on different cars (same box), I'm not sure if anyone can actually 'tune' it. That's probably why I didn't get a reply from the head of spider (Europe) when I asked what value are the folks in India adding to the box
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Old 19th January 2012, 07:56   #81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by triedeverything
Hi Vishnu,

Quick question. Has the idling been affected in any way after fitting the box? Do you feel the extra power when your foot is not on the accelerator? For example, when you reverse out of your drive way (I'm assuming you do this), does it seem to move back more quickly than before? Or do you feel the power only when you need it (step on it)?

As a friend was telling me the other day, most vehicles are built for a tolerance of the extra power, but this tolerance is less in the case of Indian manufacturers.

Are there any settings on the box?
Idling has not been affected in any way.

I do feel a little bit of the extra power when my foot is not fully on the gas but that may be because the box has adapted to my driving style, which is not the slow kind. I have not noticed this to be a problem at all while driving in traffic though. Engine feels more responsive than before too - the power just seems to come earlier than before and keep building up to more than before as I depress the throttle.

When the car is started cold, the box has a 3 minute delay to prevent any damage to the engine under cold conditions. So it is not even in effect until after I back out.

The box DOES adapt to driving style. If I'm driving with a light foot in traffic and such and then suddenly floor it, the box is still in the economy fuel map but switches to a more performance oriented fuel map from then on. Important to note that the box does not switch instantly to the performance fuel map. Only the next time you hit the accelerator you will be in the performance mode and the increased acceleration will be apparent.

I agree that vehicles are built with a tolerance but cannot comment on whether it would be more or less dangerous to use the box on an indian made vehicle like the Scorpio.

Finally, there are settings inside the box for power and rpm. Basically you can set when you want the extra power and how much. Both have 8 settings and in stock form both are set at 4. When I said 'tuned' I meant just the adjustment of these settings.

Any other questions feel free to ask, will do my best to answer

Last edited by Endeavour333 : 19th January 2012 at 08:00.
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Old 19th January 2012, 13:02   #82
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Default Re: Spider Diesel Tuning Box VS. Pete's Tuning Box - Spider Box feedback on pg 2

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Originally Posted by Endeavour333 View Post
I'm not sure how Feroz used a swift box on my Endy. Maybe that's why I got the problems? Have not discussed it with Feroz yet but I assumed that the box would work on any car since he used a swift box on mine.

I will ask him to keep an Endy box tuned just like mine for you
Vishnu, if I am going for the box, it will only be if I get the Endy or the Ranger box. I am more than willing to order it myself from Spider, if RRP Chennai can fit it for me.
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Old 19th January 2012, 13:27   #83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ssh1979

Vishnu, if I am going for the box, it will only be if I get the Endy or the Ranger box. I am more than willing to order it myself from Spider, if RRP Chennai can fit it for me.
Congrats on deciding to get the box! Speak to Feroz first. The only reason he used the swift box on my car that day was because he didn't have the Endy box with him. He then got the Endy box for me when I went next time. He's a good guy, save yourself the trouble and get it from him. His number is listed earlier in this thread. On page 2. Give him a call and see if he has it.
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Old 20th January 2012, 11:48   #84
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Default Re: Spider Diesel Tuning Box VS. Pete's Tuning Box - Spider Box feedback on pg 2

Race dynamics Dieseltronic box running on a Rapid TDI, tuned on a dyno!

My initial review and dyno results posted here: http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/test-d...ml#post2652242

We're going to go higher than this in gradual steps.
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Old 20th January 2012, 13:14   #85
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Originally Posted by drpullockaran
For the love of your engine do not install any tuning box that cannot vary the turbo boost or in other words that which cannot increase the air flow. Do not install any box that increases common rail fuel pressures as a means to increase power. To the best of my knowledge there ain't no tuning box that controls air flow as yet.

This is probably the umpteenth time that I am making the above statement but it is because I love engines.

EndTuning - Tech - Tuning Boxes
I remember reading an older post of yours saying one should stay away from boxes or remaps that increase boost pressure.
Increasing boost pressure can risk the turbo.
What is the risk of increasing fuel pressure or increasing injector duration?
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Old 23rd January 2012, 17:49   #86
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Default Re: Spider Diesel Tuning Box VS. Pete's Tuning Box - Spider Box feedback on pg 2

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Originally Posted by paras211 View Post
I remember reading an older post of yours saying one should stay away from boxes or remaps that increase boost pressure.
Increasing boost pressure can risk the turbo.
What is the risk of increasing fuel pressure or increasing injector duration?
You can have a look at this website -- www.enginecal.com

In the "About us" section they have answered your query above. They are the same guys who have modified my Chevy Spark and can vouch for their work. You can clarify your query from the above link and also contact them for any further questions you might have. They are very cordial and will be happy to help in your quest for a tuning box for your diesel car.
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Old 23rd January 2012, 18:23   #87
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Default Re: Spider Diesel Tuning Box VS. Pete's Tuning Box - Spider Box feedback on pg 2

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Originally Posted by paras211 View Post
I remember reading an older post of yours saying one should stay away from boxes or remaps that increase boost pressure.
Increasing boost pressure can risk the turbo.
What is the risk of increasing fuel pressure or increasing injector duration?
Its a gross error on my part if I did write that turbo pressure should not be varied. On the contrary if you are going to increase fueling there should be commensurate increase in turbo pressure to increase Oxygen flow. Increasing fueling without increase air flow is just a waste of fuel. Majority of the tuning boxes do not increase turbo pressure; in fact none that I know of. Remap is the way to go if you want to get fueling right. Cars with DPF are especially at risk with increased fueling without increased Oxygen flow as the unburnt fuel will clog the Diesel Particulate Filter which costs a bomb to replace once the regeneration cycle fails to do the needful.

Once again I repeat " Stay away from boxes or even remaps that do not alter the turbo pressure commensurate with increased fueling".

Increasing fuel flow is child's play but controlling turbo pressure to burn all the fuel is tough chemistry and physics.
Make sure to read up on EGT and ECU tuning the links of which I had posted some months ago.
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Old 24th January 2012, 14:07   #88
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Default Re: Spider Diesel Tuning Box VS. Pete's Tuning Box - Spider Box feedback on pg 2

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Originally Posted by drpullockaran View Post
Majority of the tuning boxes do not increase turbo pressure; in fact none that I know of.
Now, is that even possible without some sort of mechanical intervention? This can't be done just electronically, can it?
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Old 24th January 2012, 14:17   #89
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ssh1979

Now, is that even possible without some sort of mechanical intervention? This can't be done just electronically, can it?
It can't be done with the Endeavour as the ecu has no control over turbo pressure. The turbo pressure is mechanically controlled. Maybe for much more advanced cars, they might have an ecu that is linked with the turbo. I have never heard of such a thing though.
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Old 25th January 2012, 18:11   #90
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Default Re: Spider Diesel Tuning Box VS. Pete's Tuning Box - Spider Box feedback on pg 2

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Originally Posted by Endeavour333 View Post
Maybe for much more advanced cars, they might have an ecu that is linked with the turbo. I have never heard of such a thing though.
Every single VGT unit just has to have the ECU control the turbo.
The engines that come to mind are the VGT fitted Punto, Linea and Cruze. FGT engines need not have the ECU control the Turbo.

The angle of the vanes in the VGT control the turbo pressure and hence the need for computer wizardry. The ECU controls a stepper motor which is connected to a rod that alters the angle of the vanes in VGT turbo.

Last edited by drpullockaran : 25th January 2012 at 18:13.
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