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Old 7th June 2016, 14:51   #16
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Default Re: Project ST: Ford Fiesta 1.6 Duratec

A masterpiece of Engineering and work of art. Itís very well augmented with topclass narration. Glued to this thread with lots of curiosities. Would be more than excited to see it in practical someday.
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Old 7th June 2016, 16:03   #17
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Default Re: Project ST: Ford Fiesta 1.6 Duratec

The details of the stock engine along with the details of the mods is much appreciated as this is a very less known engine and getting to know its unique technologies is a mind opener.

Any ball park figure that you aim to achieve from the 97 whp?

The 97 whp figure was a for me as well. Does that mean Ford quotes the power at wheels for their cars in their tech specs?
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Old 7th June 2016, 16:25   #18
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Default Re: Project ST: Ford Fiesta 1.6 Duratec

Quote:
Originally Posted by PratikPatel View Post
PiperCams Stage 1 Cams & Cylinder Head Installation

Once the head was installed onto the cylinders, it was time to install the stage 1 cams. We selected the Stage 1 cams as our primary focus is to build a streetable car with enough punch in the mid range to make it an enjoyable experience. Lets face, while all of us would like to make all out power at high rpm for bragging rights, such a car or bike is actually not a pleasant one to drive or experience. Having a strong low and mid range makes for a more pleasant driving experience in the cities.
Love the throughness of your post, and this para of your's brought back lovely memories of how nice a mild cam can be if set up right. The mild piper along with twin carbs, and a freeflow was brilliant in my 1.0L gypsy, but the tuner had also put in stiffer valve springs to avoid valve bounce (it eventually spun to 8k). Don't see a mention of that in your writeup ?

Kudos to you, and good luck on it all coming together as planned.
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Old 7th June 2016, 16:42   #19
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Default Re: Project ST: Ford Fiesta 1.6 Duratec

I had the Fiesta 1.6 for 6 years. I learnt about the car's internals theoretically more in this one thread than all those 6 years. Amazing level of detail in your narration. I still have to do a lot of googling to understand some terminologies

Eager to know how the build turns out. Good luck.
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Old 7th June 2016, 17:09   #20
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Default Re: Project ST: Ford Fiesta 1.6 Duratec

Glued to this thread. Thanks for sharing all the details and especially the Ford specific procedures like ignition timing setting etc.

Eagerly awaiting the progress of the build!!

Drive on,
Shibu.
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Old 7th June 2016, 17:59   #21
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Default Re: Project ST: Ford Fiesta 1.6 Duratec

Salute to you sir. I have just picked a Fiesta 1.6 to do this exact thing. Going to be glued to this thread.

Also as many have pointed out regarding 97WHP, I am finding this figure as 69WHP in this (Race Dynamics dyno database of Stock cars) for a Fiesta 1.6S. I guess both dynos mesaure power in completely different ways?

Last edited by akshay380 : 7th June 2016 at 18:02.
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Old 7th June 2016, 23:31   #22
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Wow! That's one hell of a project!. Love the way you put your words. It was for the first time I read something technical and simple to understand. I

Thanks a ton for this post and please to keep all of us updated.

I actually do have a similar project in mind,but time and most importantly I am a noob st anything technical.

What output are you looking at the end of stage 1?.
Any turbocharging ideas?

Wishing you all the very best with your car and hope you come up with a stonker of a car which I bet you eventually will
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Old 8th June 2016, 05:46   #23
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Default Re: Project ST: Ford Fiesta 1.6 Duratec

Brilliant narration! Absolutely hooked to this thread and can't wait to see what the eventual result is going to be. I also love those particular Momo wheels. All the best!
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Old 8th June 2016, 11:41   #24
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Default Re: Project ST: Ford Fiesta 1.6 Duratec

I have not read a more technical thread ever and a lot of it is above my head.

I had to read up on google on what is Flow Bench Testing. This is serious stuff. It sounds like the equal of wind tunnel testing a car, except that in this case, your doing the same thing to understand the air flow characteristics inside the cylinder head.

The worry of incorrect torque rating bothers me for even a wheel nut. Most tire shops use those machines to put back the wheel nuts and torque rating isn't adjusted based on the car.

Everything that your father told you is right. It is good to know that you approach things the same way he does.

Last edited by sandeepmohan : 8th June 2016 at 12:06.
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Old 8th June 2016, 11:49   #25
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Default Re: Project ST: Ford Fiesta 1.6 Duratec

A true masterpiece. Do you have a video about the project? It would be really handy.
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Old 8th June 2016, 13:03   #26
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Default Re: Project ST: Ford Fiesta 1.6 Duratec

Wow!!! . The phenomenal number of responses leaves me a bit overwhelmed! Just proves that team-bhp & its members are in different class of their own. Thank you all for taking the time and effort to read through the posts. I would love to keep this thread as interactive as possible.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tharian View Post
We have plenty of Jap cars mod'd reviews on the forum.
A 1.6 and a Ford, can't wait for the rest.
Yes, strange isn't it? I have not seen any either. I find people working on Skodas, VWs and Hondas (other than a occasional Mondeo) but not so much on Fords. A little bit of mystery considering how good Ford engines are. Cosworth came to India offering crated Duratec engines but they finally left without any success (no doubt they were expensive). There is huge aftermarket industry for performance parts and tune ups internationally but no-one seems to be taking Ford seriously over here.


Quote:
Originally Posted by aravind.anand View Post
I guess you meant the 1.3 Rocam? As Ikon had 1.3 Rocam, 1.6 Rocam and the 1.8 TDi , if my memory serves right... Fiesta came with a 1.4 DuraTec - the one you had bought.
Yes. You are right. My bad.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mayankk View Post
If this works out, I have no qualms getting my clunker down to Mumbai and spend some time. Don't know though how feasible it would be on a 130k run engine, which however, has been overhauled at 100k, and has a new lower half(?).

Waiting for the rest, the next dyno, and the costs as well....
There is no question of it not working out. It is only a matter of how it will happen and what paths the journey will take us down. Engine tuning is a science and to a certain degree an art that is very much dependent on the tuner's knowledge and experience. I have started this journey with the intention of learning along with the build. Failures will happen, I have no doubt about that, but each failure will open the door for new opportunities. This is a very high risk hobby and my advice to anyone who is risk averse, don't do it. Its expensive and is a bottomless pitt which will consume you once you start going down this road.

As for your car; it is feasible to work on a 130k engine. However, it will also be very expensive. The complete engine will need to be stripped down and blue printed. Every part will need to be examined and tested for metal fatigue. Your car may take stage 1 mods without any problems but beyond that it is a big unknown.


Quote:
Originally Posted by tharian View Post
Any ball park figure that you aim to achieve from the 97 whp?

The 97 whp figure was a for me as well. Does that mean Ford quotes the power at wheels for their cars in their tech specs?
We have a ball park figure in mind, but will share it with in subsequent posts. Do not want to spoil the suspense. And no, Ford does not quote power at wheel. In fact no-one does that anymore. All of them have adapted PS (horse strength in German) form as it is 'legally' mandatory in EU. PS is normally quoted at the crankshaft.

Quote:
Originally Posted by keroo1099 View Post
The mild piper along with twin carbs, and a freeflow was brilliant in my 1.0L gypsy, but the tuner had also put in stiffer valve springs to avoid valve bounce (it eventually spun to 8k). Don't see a mention of that in your writeup ?
As mentioned in my post, Ford has designed a very robust valve train. The stock springs are strong enough to take additional load put on by stage 1 cams. The other reason for not replacing the springs is the rev limiter built into the ECU. The stock ECU rev limiter is set at 7,000 rpm. Therefore, there is no point in putting in springs unless we remove the rev limiter. Even with the rev limiter removed we estimate that the springs are good enough to hit 8,000 rpm.

Quote:
Originally Posted by akshay380 View Post
Also as many have pointed out regarding 97WHP, I am finding this figure as 69WHP in this (Race Dynamics dyno database of Stock cars) for a Fiesta 1.6S. I guess both dynos mesaure power in completely different ways?
Yes, I am aware of the results on Race Dynamics dyno. I cannot comment on the dyno as I have no personal knowledge on what type of Dyno they have (I am definitely not saying that their results are wrong). There are various types of dynos and there are various ways in which HP is calculated. There are host of variables and all of them have a significant role to play in the final results. A lot depends on the condition of the car. Another significant aspect that affects power output is height above sea level. The RD dyno is based in Bangalore which is a significant 980 meters above sea level (Mumbai is 14 meters). This aspect affects naturally aspirated engines more than turbo or supercharged ones. For this reason normally a correction standard such as SAE J1349 is used to correct the power curve. Anyway, the subject is too vast to deal with over here requires a dedicated thread of its own.

If you are interested in knowing more, here is an interesting article from Hot Rod magazine for further reading http://www.hotrod.com/how-to/engine/...-dyno-testing/

Quote:
Originally Posted by nitinrawatdun View Post
A true masterpiece. Do you have a video about the project? It would be really handy.
Nope, we have not made any videos of the build. We will post videos of the final build and for test runs done using a G Tech data logger.
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Old 8th June 2016, 14:53   #27
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Default Re: Project ST: Ford Fiesta 1.6 Duratec

Quote:
Originally Posted by PratikPatel View Post

With crates full of toys, mostly cars, trucks, airplanes, he also introduced me to my first Meccano building set. This started a lifelong hobby of scale modeling that I still find immensely rewarding. He taught me to appreciate great engineering designs and the thinking behind the designs. A natural extension of the same was love for cars and bikes. From a very early age cars and bikes became an integral part of life. Words like crankshaft, head, valves, carburetors were part of daily life. This also made me a tinkering guy. Any new toy that my dad bought me was taken apart within a few hours of being given to me. The moment I learnt how to use a screwdriver, I started looking for things to unscrew. Nothing was safe in the house; I would drive my mom up the wall, whereas my dad would very patiently explain how things worked.

Once the decision to keep the car and tinker around it was made, it was now time to plan for the changes. I approached Vikram and Vijay of Motozone Performance to work on build. My bikes are tricked out at Motozone Performance and I have always been satisfied with their quality of work.
Haha. I can relate. Nothing was safe form my hands once i learnt how to use a screwdriver. I would literally take anything and everything apart just to see how it was put together and how it all worked. I'm sure that my mom too can vouch that i drove her up the wall.


Firstly. WOW. What a read. My condolences for the sad and early demise of your father. He must have been a truly Wonderful and inspirational person. May he Rest in Peace.


Looks like this Ford is going to be a truly stupendous one off custom. 97Whp!? Looks like Ford built this engine to last.


Any plans to alter the gear ratios or to possibly even add a cog or 2 more, possibly in stage 2 or maybe 3? An all wheel Disk conversion with (larger) ventilated disks would be killer! Couple that with High performance calipers and brake pads and it'd have unmatched stopping power. I do not know how feasible this is , but a limited slip differential would change the characteristics of the car by leaps and bounds.


Good luck with the build. Cant wait to see the process and the end result.
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Old 9th June 2016, 12:32   #28
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Default Re: Project ST: Ford Fiesta 1.6 Duratec

Subscribed!
First up, thanks for sharing this journey. Deepest condolences for your father's passing. I cannot think of a better way of honouring his memory than this build you are doing.

Your father reminds me in several ways of my own and that generation of men who had more valuable vocational skills than educational degrees. Wish I had learnt more from the old man, when I was younger. Maybe I still can and drove the old dog/new tricks things wrong.

I can understand the concepts but am too clumsy with my hands to work on the hardware. But every time I see a skilled workman work on a mechanical problem, the hair on the back of my neck stands up in respect. Goosebumps, bro!

I feel the same reading your thread. And I think I learnt more here than in any other wiki article. Mad respect. Keep at it and we will wait for your next update eagerly.
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Old 9th June 2016, 13:13   #29
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Default Re: Project ST: Ford Fiesta 1.6 Duratec

Standing ovation !! Hands Down Man.. You are doing some real good work
Eagerly waiting for more to come on this thread with pictures.

I, being a Ford Fan, can back your words about the Ford engines and Ford Cars. I fail to understand why Ford is still failing to make a mark on Indian roads, finally they have started some marketing with their latest commercials on air.
Ford lost out a big market just because of sluggish marketing, Their iKon was far ahead of its competitors but lagged in sales,
Fusion was much ahead in time and people failed to understand a big hatch like Fusion, I still drool over a few Fusions running strong on road.
Fiesta - I was totally in love with it when my cousin bought it in 2005, unfortunately could not buy it due to $$ constraints, but happily settled for a Figo Duratorq.

Hope this thread lifts up the Ford Following as well ..

Keep up the good work, Glued to this thread

Last edited by ashishmathur14 : 9th June 2016 at 13:15.
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Old 10th June 2016, 14:22   #30
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Default Re: Project ST: Ford Fiesta 1.6 Duratec

A bit late to the party, but WOW what an excellent thread! Take a bow!

Heartfelt condolences on the passing of your father. I can feel how much of a role model he was to you, and the level of inspiration he is to you.

I am not much of a car person, but all the parameters are so well explained, that I am able to understand (almost) all of what is being done. Subscribed and glued to this thread.

Would also love to hear your experiences on your various motorcycle mods! Cheers!
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