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Old 8th September 2007, 01:12   #16
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in bangalore my cousin Anil Padival Hot Tracks has green cotton
he has good stock too
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Old 8th September 2007, 01:31   #17
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@BUSA and @razor thankyou for answering my querys actually i wasn't getting the proper way to describe the performance parts and how it is installed,yesterday just gave my Ikon 1.3 for servicing and the service guy had removed the Filter from the box,so i was just thinking of installing an aftermarket performace filter after i get the car from service,if any plans to go forward with the upgrades, i will let it flash on TBHP....cheers

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Old 8th September 2007, 11:27   #18
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do any one has valid tech reason for /against k&n?
as everyone says its no good as a filter .. and still pays for it //.. is it a wow factor or the peer pressure which is triumphing over simple common sense?
has any one bothered to check the surface area and pourosity of k&n and the stock replacement filter???
ull get the answers urself .

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No i am not saying by looking at the dust at the intake tract, but i read online(there was a thread dedicated to that) saying KnN has the least filteration efficency.
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Old 8th September 2007, 13:57   #19
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[COLOR=black]Well even i was adviced to go for Green instead of K&N for my Ford Fiesta, by some of the members of tbhp saying Greens is a better option, inspite of the fact that most of them have k&n fitted in their cars [/COLOR]
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Old 8th September 2007, 20:14   #20
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So most of you recommend Green over KnN..quite strange ! But guyz, as someone(i dont remember the name)very intelligently pointed out in an earlier thread, that acc. to physics...more airflow has to mean less filtration. (The theory is correct for sure !). So, does this mean that although performance gains in Green would be marginally less than those in KnN, the overall filtration efficiency is better in Green ? But i was wondering, can fitting a KnN(which has less filtration) really harm an engine in the long run..KnN users kindly comment !
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Old 8th September 2007, 23:24   #21
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Quote:
has any one bothered to check the surface area and pourosity of k&n and the stock replacement filter???
ull get the answers urself
Here is your answer.

Quote:
this mean that although performance gains in Green would be marginally less than those in KnN, the overall filtration efficiency is better in Green
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really harm an engine in the long run
No it wont harm, but better to be on the safer side.

I have a KnN Conical in my Optra, will be shifting to Green Conical soon.
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Old 9th September 2007, 00:35   #22
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I got a Greens OE replacement filter fitted today in my fiesta,from Bhoomi Motors, Camp. But unfortunately i couldnt drive because of my leg injury.,my dad drove all to the service station and back to office. However, he didnt felt any significant performance boost in the car..(thats what he felt) . Anyways will keep you guys posted, will start a new thread.
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Old 9th September 2007, 01:37   #23
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Dhaval all OE filters will give you maeginal increase in performance.
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Old 9th September 2007, 02:18   #24
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Quote:
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Yes...i believe it is going to be worth it, given that any cotton filter (K&N, Green etc.) will be a LOT more free breathing any paper filter (OEM) at ANY time...this is a fact.
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Dhaval all OE filters will give you maeginal increase in performance
I am still confused here. If OE replacement filters are LOT more free breathing, then shouldn't the performance gains be more than marginal ?

I still wonder, for the money one pays, how much does one really gain from OE replacement filters vis-a-vis changing your OE filter every 6months or so ?
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Old 9th September 2007, 17:27   #25
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Quote:
I am still confused here. If OE replacement filters are LOT more free breathing, then shouldn't the performance gains be more than marginal ?

I still wonder, for the money one pays, how much does one really gain from OE replacement filters vis-a-vis changing your OE filter every 6months or so ?
The KnN, Green filter are not made of paper but from cotton and other materials which are better for breathing and last more. Since the replacement filter from KnN and Green is made from different materials it is better for breathing and gives a margninal increase in FE and Performance, however since the surface area is same as the OE filter the performance gains are just margnial. Where as a Conical gets more air thanks to the design and larger surface area IMO.
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Old 9th September 2007, 22:05   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shuvc View Post
Is it worth going for a stock replacement filter at all ?
Visesh, IMHO, NO.
Are you into motorsport of some sort? Does 'marginal gain' matter A LOT to you? I'm pretty sure - NO.
So, if it's merely 'concern' we're showing towards 'maintaining' our cars or increasing their 'longevity', be sensible and stay with OEM parts. You'll have a near 'voiding' of your warranty if you try to show you know better than what the Maker has advised.
And to clarify one 'tricky' issue: BETTER filtration means stopping smaller particles, which means more pressure drop across the filter (unless you increase the effective filter area VASTLY), which usually means LESS air reaches your engine, which means performance MUST reduce. And who understands WELL whether the VELOCITY of the air reaching the manifold is also important, as also the temperature?
I do not know how much design has gone into the making of these accessories, and frankly, I don't care, because I never use them. I keep wondering why the average joe is so concerned with after-market performance aids rather than simply following the book. I suspect it has more to do with social pressures or monetary excess or some such phenomenon.
Now I'm not sure what these exotic filters do because I've never given them a serious look because I'm not into exotic driving (per se) but rather more into driving to exotic places, but I do know one thing - as an avid traveller to the remotest areas of our mountains, my STOCK vehicles have performed reliably and well. NOT ONE breakdown of any sort whatsoever. Not even a puncture! (That's because of good toilet-training for my cars)!! We're talking fairly major travels here, not Shimla, Mussoorie, Dalhousie type. And well spread out in the number of years over which they were done.
I simply follow THE BOOK that comes with the car. I follow it as any engineer would - with appropriate application of mind, ie. not BLINDLY.
For conversation with friends, I never have any 'masala' like aftermarket fitments to my car and the cost at which these were procured or retro-fitted. I only have tales of the magic of the mountains, the breath-taking vistas, the gurgling brooks, the mesmerising wild flowers, the surreal beauty et all; and the fact that my car worked without causing me grief of any sort.
And of course I have to, like all of us, use my car for that daily commute through near grid-locked, polluted city streets.
Does that somewhat answer your question?
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Old 10th September 2007, 05:48   #27
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Mr. Anupmathur...

While i agree that you take care of your vehicles as per manufacturer's specifications (a VERY good thing), i disagree vis-a-vis the your other statements..i.e. exotic filters...exotic driving...monetary excess etc...

The reason is this...ALL vehicle manufacturers (except the likes of rolls, ferrari etc) make or source parts that:
1) Cost the least to manufacturer,(most important to them)
2) Can be made in large volumes,
3) Are easily repaired/replaced,
4) Can be sourced very easily.

So, as you can see from the above...corners ARE cut for better price margins...air filter is merely one of the components (though a major one).

A better breathing engine will also give you a better fuel economy...not just power.
& while i am not sure about the aftermarket replacement ones giving a quantifiable better mileage (guys any data from your side?)...the conical CAI definately has given me a 2kmpl extra...that in itself will recover the cost of the filter in no time...

Last edited by 1self : 10th September 2007 at 05:58.
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Old 10th September 2007, 08:09   #28
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Mr 1self,
I agree with you on everything you've said; perhaps it is the way I've put it that you didn't like.
It's your prerogative to disagree. What you are disagreeing with, I'm not quite clear.
Still, it would be 'logical' for the car maker to offer me an enhanced air-filter, free-flow exhaust, etc. as performance or economy enhancing optional accessories.
Someone on this thread also mentioned that these air-filter manufacturers do not quote the micron size, flow rates, pressure drops etc. for each of their filters. To be able to do that for EACH model of car for which their filter is a potential candidate would require prodigious amounts of data, which, clearly, they do not have. Does that not seem to indicate that perhaps not enough 'design' has gone into their making? And if an air-filter can improve the FE by 2 km/ltr, why, that is a handsome increase! An increase for which any car maker would give an arm and a leg. After all, particularly here in India, FE is one of THE most important specs that a buyer looks for.
Which brings us to the next logical question: What is being 'compromised' to obtain such a significant increase in FE, as in your case? NO car maker cuts corners to the extent of reducing the FE by such large numbers! What does your own 'gut feeling' tell you?
IMHO, somewhere, somehow, you are being 'took'. Especially if you believe that both economy AND power can be simultaneously improved by an after-market air filter.
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Old 10th September 2007, 08:16   #29
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Guys. Are there any green air filters for the Aveo 1.4? Stock or CAI?
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Old 10th September 2007, 08:34   #30
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@ Anup,
Nice replies, good points.
Correct me if i am wrong, but are you trying to suggest that manufacturers do NOT cut corners to do cost saving and to increase their profit margins ?
If yes then i will have to disagree. If you are not aware, most of the accidents that take place on the Pune-Mumbai E-Way are because the pathetic tyres provided by manufacturers give way !
Here is a simple comparison,
A Swift LXi / VXi comes with 165/80R14 Tires stock [Not sure if its 175 or 165] and the ZXi comes with 185 ones, why ?

Coming back to the topic, you make it feel like it is like a crime or something to go in for a small thing like an air filter.

I am not making comments just for the heck of it, i say this from my own experience, the paltry 5k i spent on a K&N OE replacement filter for my skoda is totally worth every penny because after fitting it, i get better mileage for sure and the engine has also become a bit smoother.
I am not claiming huge gains here but i have seen the benefits.

Regarding you maintaining the car as per the manual, excellent thing to do, no doubt about that but then you claim that by doing so it has given you no problems at all, isn't that taken for granted that by following the manufacturers instructions, the car is SUPPOSED to work flawlessly ?

My point is, there are gains from the after market performance related upgrades. Whether to go for it is a personal decision. Branding it as useless and just another means of blowing cash would be a bit harsh and unfair.
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