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Old 8th February 2008, 00:59   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vikram_d View Post
Chetan - I agree with you on most points but if the intake is breathing properly then there should be no sound (resonator box present or not). Air or wind for that matter causes a sound only if there is an obstruction in the way.


ok fine..could we look at this with a diff angle also.. ?
Any intake would make noise.. agreed?
OK now ..if the end sucking in the air was conical, cartridge type, wire mesh with some element, etc etc each would create a distinct noise of its own. Also if the housing of the element was shaped diff assuming we have the same element ..again the noise would be diff maybe louder maybe quiter.
Air flowing with velocity would make noise depending on the design of the housing, shape of filter element, bends of the pipe, if the pipe has grooves etc
So from this POV I feel noise could be becoz of the design of the intake system also which may be efficient but more noisy.
Now Efficient = ?
= more mass of air flow ?
No

In intake systems its not just the volume of the air but more importantly its the velocity of the air w.r.t to the TB +intake manifold+runners+cams etc.
The intake is a part of the overall engine so it should match with it. On its own as a separate unit brand X may flow more than brand Y and be very silent but when bolted to the engine it may be bringing down performance..

One of the factors in slowing down the intake velocity is the air filter.. to big a column of air thru a large dia pipe will move slower as compared to the narrower diameter.
therefore the same with your Intakes.. the runnerlengths, TB, intake manifold is designed to provide optimum velocity wrt to your cams etc.
So if u are having a silent filter with an oversized pipe it may be disturbing this air intake flow chracteristics, a noisier intake may be optimising this air flow and enhancing the performace and matching perfectly with your runner lengths etc etc etc etc etc etc.....

Thats why I dont feel that :low noise = more mass of air = better performance
even a noisy one could be better than a quiet one as ultimate mass of air is not the main thing its the velocity also.
Please let me know ur views considering these points..

Quote:
Originally Posted by vikram_d View Post
Trust me I have spent my whole day driving around bangalore with a modified air intake but no filter attached to it and the difference was amazing. My car is a completely stock car except for a RD ECU. It even has stock headers.
Definately Vikram, u are the best judge on this matter, since u have extensively tested this..Im only discussing the noise part..

Last edited by chetanhanda : 8th February 2008 at 01:03.
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Old 8th February 2008, 01:06   #17
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Well what you have said makes sense. I stand corrected.

No offence meant.
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Old 8th February 2008, 01:58   #18
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So to summarize the whole thing,the sound of the filter doesnt mean that its pulling in less or more air and is just due to the design of the filter or the materials used.Am i right?
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Old 8th February 2008, 02:13   #19
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Originally Posted by vikram_d View Post
Well what you have said makes sense. I stand corrected.

No offence meant.
thanks dude..
BTW how much fun are u having with the RD ECU? how long have u been playing with that ? can u put up some screenshots etc of the MAPS u are runnig etc, would be cool to have a new thread on this without hijacking this one ?

Last edited by chetanhanda : 8th February 2008 at 02:20.
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Old 8th February 2008, 02:19   #20
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Originally Posted by hellspawn View Post
So to summarize the whole thing,the sound of the filter doesnt mean that its pulling in less or more air and is just due to the design of the filter or the materials used.Am i right?
You are correct.
Every car has its own characteristics, someone else's KnN/Ractive/Piper setup is not always good for your setup depending on how much u have altered.
You need to find a match for your engine and driving style.
Noise doesn't mean a thing - Manveet's theory of "panting breathing sucking" makes no sense to me at all.
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Old 8th February 2008, 09:10   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nitrous View Post
Ractive = dry type(non-oiled)
K&N = wet type(oiled)
Hence the difference.
really? i just oiled my ractive yesterday. dosent seem to make a difference.
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Old 8th February 2008, 11:29   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chetanhanda View Post
I may have a different theory from scientific "Dr Watson" over here...
Thank you for the warm welcome. I can see that time has not healed your wounds or mellowed your antagonism. I really don't remember what it was, but I must have really hurt your feelings - I apologize.

Quote:
Originally Posted by chetanhanda View Post
Even a stock intake makes noise very loud sucking noises its only that u cant hear it becoz of the resonator.
Have u looked under the hood of your OHC ? there is something called a resonator used in Stock intake systems, its a black colored box behind the bumper, the stock filter box is connected to this.. it provides some amount of muffling for the intake noise.. remove it and see how loud ur stock intake becomes ..

Think of it in this way.. sucking through a pipe directly or sucking air thru the same pipe with the tip placed in a large box with a large opening for air. The second setup will be less noisy.
More noise doesnt mean its dying for air etc etc or start "panting".

In a "so called" CAI setup the airfilter directly sucks air so u can hear the intake suction..
I am no car expert and was offering my humble opinion to hellspawn as you had not graced this thread up till then.

Anyways, I don't know about resonater vesonater but I definitely know the sequence of progression wrt the filter on my OHC (which you don't). So for benefit of everyone I am mentioning the details below:
  • First I had the stock = Almost no Noise in the cabin.
  • Then I moved to Ractive with Aluminum Piping = Normal Noise associated with Conical Filters.
  • Then a tuner put this Ractive filter in a fibreglass "box" and my intake sound multiplied 5 times and car climbed the revs slower.
  • Then I threw away the box and noise is fine now - as expected from a conical filter.
Hope you can use the above info appropriately to help hellspawn.

OT:

Quote:
Originally Posted by chetanhanda View Post
I may have a different theory from scientific "Dr Watson" over here...
I didn't understand the reference to Dr. Watson. He was simply a friend, confidante and biographer of Sherlock Holmes - hardly a detective . So what was the point you were making exactly?
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Old 8th February 2008, 11:46   #23
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Hellspawn and I have the same filter dude, and mine is F-I-N-E fine. Abhimanyu yaar, lets meet for coffee sometime and feel the car.

Note from Mod - Post edited. Lets not get into interpersonal politics, you can discuss that over PM if necessary. Thanks

Last edited by Rehaan : 8th February 2008 at 22:37. Reason: Please see note in post.
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Old 8th February 2008, 12:18   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chetanhanda View Post
thanks dude..
BTW how much fun are u having with the RD ECU? how long have u been playing with that ? can u put up some screenshots etc of the MAPS u are runnig etc, would be cool to have a new thread on this without hijacking this one ?
Will be posting a detailed review of it shortly.
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Old 8th February 2008, 21:28   #25
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Originally Posted by vikram_d View Post
Will be posting a detailed review of it shortly.
cool ..
whenever u get time
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Old 8th February 2008, 22:52   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by manveet View Post
Hellspawn and I have the same filter dude, and mine is F-I-N-E fine. Abhimanyu yaar, lets meet for coffee sometime and feel the car.

Note from Mod - Post edited. Lets not get into interpersonal politics, you can discuss that over PM if necessary. Thanks
chalo...atleast good to know marriage hasnt sapped your humour..
the weekend is coming up..anytime you are free...give me a buzz and we shall discuss filters.
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Old 8th February 2008, 23:11   #27
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Abhimanyu,your an old man! People like that induction sound..

Can its be your filter+the engine sound...?
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Old 8th February 2008, 23:47   #28
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hellspawn get some damping done on your ride!!! It will improve your ICE setup and decrease the In Cabin Noise!!! I use this funda to cutoff the In Cabin Noise i get from my Exaust and Filter!!!!
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Old 9th February 2008, 00:16   #29
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Originally Posted by noidaboy View Post
Abhimanyu,your an old man! People like that induction sound..

Can its be your filter+the engine sound...?
OLD man.....damn!!
I like the induction sound,its just that i wanted to know why the ractive has more sound than a k&n.

Quote:
Originally Posted by m4ugr8 View Post
hellspawn get some damping done on your ride!!! It will improve your ICE setup and decrease the In Cabin Noise!!! I use this funda to cutoff the In Cabin Noise i get from my Exaust and Filter!!!!
Yup!I'll try that.....only if Gunbir gets free
But how much has the damping decreased the the incabin noise from the exhaust and filter??
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Old 9th February 2008, 07:56   #30
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Quote:
Yup!I'll try that.....only if Gunbir gets free
But how much has the damping decreased the the incabin noise from the exhaust and filter??

There is a fast difference!!! I can barely Hear the Sound of my Filter or my Exaust!!! Exaust is only audible when i rev it past 4000 RPM. Its silent inside and with the hertz playing i can not hear anything from outside!!!
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