Go Back   Team-BHP > Under the Hood > Modifications & Accessories


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 5th April 2008, 20:50   #46
BHPian
 
Gangsta's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: New Delhi
Posts: 622
Thanked: Once
Default

Nice Discussion going on. Really Appriciated BHPians.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kpzen View Post
A stock Elantra CRDi is fast and with petes it becomes insane. Not many cars pull like the Elantra does relentlessly from 0-180kmph.
Top speed of around 210kmph and it redlines in 5th gear and still u guys want some booster etc to experiment with one of best diesel engine ever sold in our country..

Do u guys get airport runways to test your cars or what??
Yes, it is fast, Mine is stock and looking for its performance mods, Had a talk with Arush (autopsyche) he told us that K&n stock replacement along with pete's Box will do the trick. I know it will surely go insane after these mods.

What about CAI too on Elantra?

Mine almost touched 210 kmph stock it was around 205 kmph, but it is fast 0-190 kmph not 0-180 kmph hehe.

Bro. You are in Faridabad, you must be knowing about Greater Noida express way. Tested my Elantra there.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mclaren1885 View Post
AFAIK, the engines on the Elantra are an import and are not made in India unlike those on the Verna. I may be wrong. Maybe Tadu and others will be able to confirm. And I am sure the manufacturers would leave room for that extra bit. According to your theory, running a turbo on a esteem (or any car for that matter) at 7psi on stock internals must be sacrileage as well isn't it? The engines are made in India, and converting a NA car into forced induction is a different ball game alltogether when compared to slightly increasing boost on an already TCed car. Yet most people I see run on stock clutch, internals, fuel pump etc. Do people do this based on hearsay? Or is it just experimenting ones own acquired knowledge and assumptions to see what transpires from it? Or is there a rule book that says one can do all of this on a NA stock engine from the manufacturers themselves?

Bottom line is, I really would not suggest anyone to turn up the boost levels to insane amounts. To neglect people from making this mistake, I am sure a boost controller can be set with a max allowable psi limit as well.

Also I was told that the engines on the Elantra and the Sonata Embara are the same except for the ECU, bigger turbo amongst other things. If that is the case, I am sure it should be able to handle more boost. A stock elantra puts out 112.2 PS and 25 kgm of torque while a Sonata Embara puts out 142 PS & 33 kgm of torque. So almost a 30bhp increase on the same engine should quantify for about 2-3 psi increase (which too would translate in the region of about 20-30bhp?) on the Elantra engine as well IMO.

I came to this conclusion based on these possible facts and not just by mere heresay. I hope you got the answer you were looking for Akshay. Google does not always provide direct results . You need to look it down carefully.
Correct me if i'm wrong, Elantra was a CBU.
Gangsta is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 5th April 2008, 23:53   #47
Senior - BHPian
 
autopsyche's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: New Delhi, India
Posts: 1,516
Thanked: 15 Times
Default

Yes u can definitely go in for a cai, something like a green storm with the dynamization kit would be perfect, i dont remember the elantras engine bay that well right now but placement should not be an issue. i have fitted one with a K&N conical once so im sure space is not a problem.
autopsyche is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 6th April 2008, 00:13   #48
BHPian
 
Gangsta's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: New Delhi
Posts: 622
Thanked: Once
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by autopsyche View Post
Yes u can definitely go in for a cai, something like a green storm with the dynamization kit would be perfect, i dont remember the elantras engine bay that well right now but placement should not be an issue. i have fitted one with a K&N conical once so im sure space is not a problem.
nah! it wont be a problem. I think we will have enough space for it.
Also, throw some light on this thread too....

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/modifi...-cng-cars.html (Performance Mods for CNG Cars)

CAI for CNG Cars?
Gangsta is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th July 2008, 00:47   #49
BHPian
 
Gangsta's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: New Delhi
Posts: 622
Thanked: Once
Default

Saved money. Now m planning for petes box and stock k&n for my elantra.
tyres upgraded from 195 rubber to 205 rubber bridgestone.
Gangsta is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th July 2008, 01:54   #50
Senior - BHPian
 
autopsyche's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: New Delhi, India
Posts: 1,516
Thanked: 15 Times
Default

Good stuff! You sure are gonna need the extra width of the rubber after the tuning box and filter get on the car!!
autopsyche is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th July 2008, 02:04   #51
BHPian
 
tadukuttan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 241
Thanked: 22 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gangsta View Post
Saved money. Now m planning for petes box and stock k&n for my elantra.
tyres upgraded from 195 rubber to 205 rubber bridgestone.
The Petes box at stage 2, and a stock replacement K&N are the best things for the car. Please do not put in a CAI, as the car already comes with a positive displacement CAI as stock. Only, that will blow up the engine if you are wading through water, so unless you want to wade through water, dont change the air intake design in any way.

Also, mclaren has got Greddy boost controllers for two Elantras here(not including mine). I think they are running upto 21PSI(occassionaly), and of course, a petes box at stage 2. Those cars are much faster than mine, but that 21PSI which the greddy boost controllers are showing almost looks unreal, I would have thought the engines will blow up for such levels of boost!

And yes, the stock clutch seems to be holding with the increased boost.

For the tires, the best bet is 205/55 PP2s on the stock alloys, if you have not already bought them bridgestones.
tadukuttan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th July 2008, 08:27   #52
BHPian
 
Gangsta's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: New Delhi
Posts: 622
Thanked: Once
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by autopsyche View Post
Good stuff! You sure are gonna need the extra width of the rubber after the tuning box and filter get on the car!!
Yup already upgraded will surely contact you soon i.e anytime when my bro. gets the time for the tuning box and stock K&N.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tadukuttan View Post
The Petes box at stage 2, and a stock replacement K&N are the best things for the car. Please do not put in a CAI, as the car already comes with a positive displacement CAI as stock. Only, that will blow up the engine if you are wading through water, so unless you want to wade through water, dont change the air intake design in any way.

Also, mclaren has got Greddy boost controllers for two Elantras here(not including mine). I think they are running upto 21PSI(occassionaly), and of course, a petes box at stage 2. Those cars are much faster than mine, but that 21PSI which the greddy boost controllers are showing almost looks unreal, I would have thought the engines will blow up for such levels of boost!

And yes, the stock clutch seems to be holding with the increased boost.

For the tires, the best bet is 205/55 PP2s on the stock alloys, if you have not already bought them bridgestones.
thanx for the info bro.

Nah! i wont be going for CAI. AirIntake is already good enough. I don't wanna experiment Boost Controllers, if anything happens to the car my bro will kill me He loves his Elantra as if Elantra is his gf. He don't even allow me to eat or drink anything in the car.
Clutch Assembly is really a heavy duty one, no doubt about it. Petes box is the best thing. I can experiment boost controller with my upcoming car, Verna or Avante. My friend told me about avante launch in oct. I think it is worth to wait.
Gangsta is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th July 2008, 09:59   #53
BHPian
 
sameel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: cochin
Posts: 268
Thanked: 3 Times
Default

i shouldnt be saying this but i will
the elantra engine can be taken upto 1.2- 1.3 bar . do the math for yourself on how much PSi that will come to. be sure to check out the PSP.
the scorpio runs at 1.3bar! though stock for a petrol is 7psi, for diesel 10-15 is a possible bet. the boost controllers are safe bet if you use it sanely. and for a petes added box the stock psi level will go upto 12psi [ measure the boost level with the box installed using a boost controller and you can see it howering around 12-13 . this is because for the prolonged injection window, the turbo pushes in more air[ ECU does this to compensate for a lean mixture - diesel engines should run lean for best life. . the best bet would be to put in a sonata embera clutch and take the psi boost to 16psi max and have a jolly time..lolz. we are talking about 170bhp here that will be insane!!.
off to a meeting now will post a detailed one on the boost controller and petes box viz a viz comparison. with pros and cons. if i get the time ofcourse
sameel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th July 2008, 11:34   #54
BHPian
 
brraj's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: bangalore
Posts: 794
Thanked: 351 Times
Default

Hi sameel,

Remember me, i spoke to you regarding the boost controller/Intercooler for elantra crdi over phone..

I have installed Greedy PROFEC B SPEC II in my Elantra CRDI.

I found out from greddy boost controller that a peted elantra CRDI is showing 16.5psi without even swithing on the boost controller.

So planning to keep the boost levels at 18/19 psi. what say?

Once we had tried it at 20psi, From 0-110kmph it is just a normal peted elantra's performance but from 110-200kmph it takes off as if peted elantras are stand still.
Myself, Tadu, Satya were testing this in namakal road with three peted elantra on our way to kerala.

One thing i like about these boost controller is we can switch it on/off, though i only switch is on when i am not able to overtake other cars.

Eagarly waiting for you to put up boost controller and petes box comparison with pros and cons.
brraj is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th July 2008, 11:54   #55
BHPian
 
sameel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: cochin
Posts: 268
Thanked: 3 Times
Default

Yes i do remember ..i had myself done some research ..the psi level at 16.5 is easy on the engine read my previous post if we take 1 bar as 14psi then also 1.3 bar is ok no prob for engine block only ..but yes a inter cooler upgrade is recommended and enough to put the boost at 20 psi .get a stage three clutch which should be ok enough and please dont even think about the suspensions ..they are best in stock setup and can be used even for stage 3 settings ..wider rubber with higher speed rating can be used ..
sameel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th July 2008, 12:02   #56
Awaiting Email Confirmation
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: India
Posts: 1,745
Thanked: 19 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by brraj View Post
Hi sameel,

Remember me, i spoke to you regarding the boost controller/Intercooler for elantra crdi over phone..

I have installed Greedy PROFEC B SPEC II in my Elantra CRDI.

I found out from greddy boost controller that a peted elantra CRDI is showing 16.5psi without even swithing on the boost controller.

So planning to keep the boost levels at 18/19 psi. what say?

Once we had tried it at 20psi, From 0-110kmph it is just a normal peted elantra's performance but from 110-200kmph it takes off as if peted elantras are stand still.
Myself, Tadu, Satya were testing this in namakal road with three peted elantra on our way to kerala.

One thing i like about these boost controller is we can switch it on/off, though i only switch is on when i am not able to overtake other cars.

Eagarly waiting for you to put up boost controller and petes box comparison with pros and cons.
@brraj- would you please put a detailed review?
I have been waiting for ages, or atleast make mclaren write one.
rippergeo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th July 2008, 12:06   #57
BHPian
 
sameel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: cochin
Posts: 268
Thanked: 3 Times
Default

i am off to lunch will do a post after that in detail.
the boost controller essentially controls the boost ( at the same time gives just that extra bit of feul into the cylinder so as to not give a VERY LEAN MIXTURE which can blow your ENGINE. too much oxygen will cause much much higher explosive charge which can blow the engine !!.
but when more feul is also given into the cylinder the explosion is always controlled . hence leading to less trouble.
the way the injection is done is same in principle as in box[ prolong injection window] , but in reality is approach is opp to that of box. will expalin it in detail after lunch probably got some work also

understanding this will take some time. i will try to keep my post as simple and lucid as possible .

peace out
sameel
sameel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th July 2008, 12:21   #58
BHPian
 
brraj's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: bangalore
Posts: 794
Thanked: 351 Times
Default

Sameel :
thanks for you input.
I am not going to touch suspensions as the stock suspensions is way better. Experienced that in my recent kerala monsoon drive.
I have also changed my tyres to Michelin pp2 205/55/15.

rippergeo : Reviews will be put up shortly but was waiting for the inter cooler to be fitted.

I also have inter cooler lying in my house, but was in search for good tuners in bangalore who can fit intercooler which can hold 21psi.

Last edited by brraj : 30th July 2008 at 12:34.
brraj is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th July 2008, 13:22   #59
BHPian
 
roopakr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: KL-01,KL-07,KA-01
Posts: 135
Thanked: 2 Times
Default

sameel ,
Pros and Cons of Turbo Booster and the way it works is something I am keen to know about..so waiting eagerly for the output and findings of the research that you have done on it
roopakr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th July 2008, 14:47   #60
BHPian
 
sameel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: cochin
Posts: 268
Thanked: 3 Times
Default

thats great do keep us posted on the developements.
now coming to pros and cons.
box is plug and play after a couple of instalations , its a DIY thing.
but boost controller is a different ball game
box is adaptive[ hence different boxes for different cars. and not only that UIS and CRDi engines have different boxes.] while the boost controller is not.
its got only to do with the turbo.[ what is done is. increased turbo boost is set and accordingly a bypass[ generated by ECU itself with new inputs..actually only the air input is changed and ECU designs the injections accordingly..this also involves injection window to be made larger] injection map will be run by the ECU with the new Boost pressure settings].
ground level is that a simple PWM signal is what actually controls the solenoid valves in the waste gate.
the frequency of the PWM signal to the solenoid valve is hiked up to get the desired level of boost.[ bear in mind that the solenoid valves are binary devices] there is a physical limit for which the they can oprate!.
in reality we are sending false signals to wastegate to open at a higher than stock PSi level.][ but the beuty of this boost controller is its accuracy and its greater compatibility]
IN A BOX SIMPLY PUT A HIGHER RPS output causes the ecu to prolong the injection window. and a bypass map for this is required which will be present in the box!
but keep in mind that the INJECTOR + PUMPS and EMS has a tolerance limit . so leave the insane boost levels because the other non-engine parts will go for a toss. read the transmission!! in boost controllers there is no need of bypass maps.
they send the false signal to ECU also which adjusts to the higher intake.
the boost controller is a real time system it can be switched on and off. whereas box is always on or off[ when removed obviously..haha] and that is one disadvantage.
coming to the Box- it has giot a fail safe mechanism. simply put .if something goes wrong the ECU will be handed over full charge and the Box will Shut itself off..hehe .
so thats why the BOX people give warranty on box and gurantee on engine life.
but the boost controllers are having no gurantee[ and read no fail safe mechanism .you go wrong ..then you are gone..hehe] its got more to do with the tuners intention. you set the Psi so you are the boss. simple.
and yes the gain in Boost controllers is MORE than in a BOX.
a simple math is like this the stock Psi is 7. the solenoid valve controlling the waste gate can be made to oprate even at 15Psi using a Electronic Boost Controller.
but in reality the stock waste gate of an elantra can handle 12Psi as stock. as in international markets but in INDIA read cost cutting....INTERCOOLER! they set is as 8-9Psi stock . but then even 20-22PSI is possible but only with intercooler upgrade and other upgardes.[ read clutch, custom mapping. with better injection torque curves. a flat out torque in mid - higher end of engine RPM]
and by the way why only GReddy what about Apex-i and Gizmmo electronics. they also make good boost controllers ..i have no idea of indian dealers and installers though.
but i suggest to wait for as long as an official dealer and installer is available for this type of mods.
the safer bet for a novice would be a box.
but the box will CAUSE SMOKE!! .where as the boostcontrollers will be better off as the ECU tries its level best[ depends on the effeciency of the algorithm ] to do exhaust treatement within the exhaust system tolerance limits. instead of ingoring the exhaust treatment for the addtional window period..hehe.

cost wise the boost controller and Box are both around the same.
but the VGT engines .poor fellows like me. the boost controllers are of no use to us. VGT is a no-no when it comes to Boost controllers coz simply..ONLY ECU can vary the boost of the VGT which it does beutifully.
for VGT fellows like me. the BOX is the ONLY way or a complete RE-MAP.
got lots of work to do..i am out of this place.

peace out










sameel is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Elantra Petrol vs Elantra CRDi palani81 Sedans 1 24th October 2006 13:59
Elantra GT vs Elantra Crdi(Was skoda vs elantra) azifali Sedans 39 17th August 2006 12:56
elantra crdi gtd vs elantra crdi (leather pack) super_700a Sedans 3 10th August 2006 07:38
Suggest me, Elantra CRDi or Elantra GLS hsmraj Sedans 16 11th April 2006 02:28
Elantra CRDi v/s Used Elantra CRDi v/s New Ford Fiesta 1.4 TDCi lamborghini Sedans 36 30th January 2006 00:03


All times are GMT +5.5. The time now is 11:13.

Copyright 2000 - 2017, Team-BHP.com
Proudly powered by E2E Networks