Performance Mods for CNG Cars

[Gangsta]

Originally Posted by directinjection

You can switch over from CNG to petrol or vice versa whenever you want. In petrol mode, the original ECU works ensuring that you get the same performance you got before fitment of CNG. In CNG mode, the kit's ECU works. In either mode you get optimal performance because of dedicated and independent ECUs.

Approx what % of power loss you found your car running on petrol ecu and cng ecu?

[innersky]

He is the CNG guru. I wonder why he has not posted here. What is CAI ?

[Rehaan]

Originally Posted by innersky

What is CAI ?

Please see this thread for that answer and more :
http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/announ...-team-bhp.html (Commonly used Abbreviations on Team-BHP)

cya
R

[abhik]

Thank God i found this thread i thought it was deleted or something.
Well i drive a stock IKon 1.6 ROCAM on CNG.
TAP only, no LAMBDA and it performs better than on petrol.
Did 170KMPH on CNG and i return at 4am from my office so do speeds of 100-140kmph in the morning easily.
Rev-limiter somehow got removed with the TAP so the engine revs all the way to over 7000RPM so acceleration is good and have given quite a few cars in the same segment a run for their money in standstill acceleration and top-end speeds.
If CNG setting is not tuned then a prominent lag is felt when on the run car is shifted to petrol mode, this is denoted by a drop in speed, slight rise in engine temperature as well.
Once doing 120kmph i tried the same and to my surprise no lag, i tried it so many times and for once even thought the switch might not be working but it was and there was absolutely no difference in performance. The engine is smoother on CNG as compared to petrol.
As for performance mods, try google or Wikipedia and you would find that a Turbo works best on Diesel,CNG, LPG engines than on a petrol engines.

[Gangsta]

Originally Posted by innersky

He is the CNG guru. I wonder why he has not posted here. What is CAI ?

CAI = Cold Air Intake.

Originally Posted by abhik

Thank God i found this thread i thought it was deleted or something.
Well i drive a stock IKon 1.6 ROCAM on CNG.
TAP only, no LAMBDA and it performs better than on petrol.
Did 170KMPH on CNG and i return at 4am from my office so do speeds of 100-140kmph in the morning easily.
Rev-limiter somehow got removed with the TAP so the engine revs all the way to over 7000RPM so acceleration is good and have given quite a few cars in the same segment a run for their money in standstill acceleration and top-end speeds.
If CNG setting is not tuned then a prominent lag is felt when on the run car is shifted to petrol mode, this is denoted by a drop in speed, slight rise in engine temperature as well.
Once doing 120kmph i tried the same and to my surprise no lag, i tried it so many times and for once even thought the switch might not be working but it was and there was absolutely no difference in performance. The engine is smoother on CNG as compared to petrol.
As for performance mods, try google or Wikipedia and you would find that a Turbo works best on Diesel,CNG, LPG engines than on a petrol engines.

That's a good top end speed on CNG. My "Advancer Device" is working like a pete's box installed in a CNG car. Just after 1.5K RPM, my car goes crazy on CNG, i really can't feel much of a difference if the car running on CNG or Petrol . Really don't know it's performance on other engines but on Hyundai 1.6L DOHC engine it works like CRAZY.

Looking for some alternatives to remove this lag bet. 800 to 1.5K RPM.
I think CAI will do the trick, because my car runs better at night when the temperature is down. So, CAI will do the trick.

I had a talk with someone in Hyundai, he told me that Lamda is not good in 1.6L accents but it is good in 1.5L accents. He was talking about some ECU for CNG.

When i had been to Deep Hyundai, Wazirpur, New Delhi. They were installing Lamda in Accent 1.6L Viva and were tuning it with a laptop. I felt the difference bet. a Lamda car and a Non Lamda car. Intial pickup was smooth unlike my Accent (non lamda) and ideal RPM was rock static as the car is on petrol. My Ideal RPM always fluctuates very very slight fluctuation. hardly 50 rpm approx fluctuation. I think i should go for Lamda or ECU. They told me that whenever they will install ECU for CNG on any Accent they will call me up to check the performance. First i will drive the car with Lamda + CNG and they will install ECU for CNG and then i will drive it. Just to feel the difference.


Anybody can throw some light on CAI or ECU for CNG on CNG Installed Cars. ?

[coolmob]

can anyone post the contact details of a person specializing in doing these mods as i have tried to find such a guy but have so far failed. there are numerous cng/lpg fitting shops around delhi but ask them anything related to lamda or performance mods they look at you like ur talking about some aircraft parts!!

[abhik]

Originally Posted by Gangsta

Anybody can throw some light on CAI or ECU for CNG on CNG Installed Cars. ?

LAMBDA is an alternate ECU for CNG but it works in conjunction with the car's original ECU. I would not know of a standalone piggyback for CNG but a remap of the original should work wonders, but that again would turn out to be an expensive job.

@Gangsta- As u mentioned the car runs better at night, i would definately second that as i have experienced the same, so i too was thinkin of a CAI as when on CNG every fitter will also tell you to clean the air filter as frequently as possible to get maximum efficiency and performance out of the engine.

There is a definate lag in my Ikon as well till 1500 RPM but it just picks up like mad after that, the RPM just swings towards 7000 in a jiffy.
I guess the CAI should help with that too.

I am going to my fitter tomorrow to try out the lambda. I was advised that the IKon's own ECU is powerful enough to adapt to changes occuring due to CNG and adjust accordingly and fitting a Lambda might result in a conflict but what the heck lets give it a shot, no harm in trying and if it results in busting some serious petrol A** and proving wrong all who believe CNG cant perform then i am definately game for it.

[neo_trace]

Originally Posted by abhik

As for performance mods, try google or Wikipedia and you would find that a Turbo works best on Diesel,CNG, LPG engines than on a petrol engines.

well i have LPG turbocharged baleno
works Gr8

[ashthedivx]

Originally Posted by abhik

Well i drive a stock IKon 1.6 ROCAM on CNG.
TAP only, no LAMBDA and it performs better than on petrol.

Once doing 120kmph i tried the same and to my surprise no lag, i tried it so many times and for once even thought the switch might not be working but it was and there was absolutely no difference in performance. The engine is smoother on CNG as compared to petrol.

Can you post a pic of TAP for have a better understanding of the same.

Originally Posted by Gangsta

That's a good top end speed on CNG. My "Advancer Device" is working like a pete's box installed in a CNG car. Just after 1.5K RPM, my car goes crazy on CNG, i really can't feel much of a difference if the car running on CNG or Petrol . Really don't know it's performance on other engines but on Hyundai 1.6L DOHC engine it works like CRAZY.

I hope you are talking about Timing Advance Processor (TAP).

Originally Posted by Gangsta

Looking for some alternatives to remove this lag bet. 800 to 1.5K RPM.
I think CAI will do the trick, because my car runs better at night when the temperature is down. So, CAI will do the trick.

I had a talk with someone in Hyundai, he told me that Lamda is not good in 1.6L accents but it is good in 1.5L accents. He was talking about some ECU for CNG.

When i had been to Deep Hyundai, Wazirpur, New Delhi. They were installing Lamda in Accent 1.6L Viva and were tuning it with a laptop. I felt the difference bet. a Lamda car and a Non Lamda car. Intial pickup was smooth unlike my Accent (non lamda) and ideal RPM was rock static as the car is on petrol. My Ideal RPM always fluctuates very very slight fluctuation. hardly 50 rpm approx fluctuation. I think i should go for Lamda or ECU. They told me that whenever they will install ECU for CNG on any Accent they will call me up to check the performance. First i will drive the car with Lamda + CNG and they will install ECU for CNG and then i will drive it. Just to feel the difference.

Even i am inclined towards installing CAI, talked to arush for the same. He also acclaimed that to have a better performance with CAI in a CNG fueled car.

Dealer people are piece of crap whenever we talk about CNG with them, it's still more or less a rocket science for them. Or we can they are so much rigid to share there experiences with CNG. For my car i have tried allmost all major GM dealers in delhi like Autovikas, Regent, Triumph but no where i could find a person who is capable enough of more then doing small tunings in the car. Though in this regard i found shrimankar people very much capable as they know what they are doing and troubleshooting a problem stated to them.

I suppose i have got that ECU along with Lamda installed in my car. When i say "I suppose" i mean i am not sure, as when trying to get information about the TAP online i got some pics around which looks like a gadget installed in my car too. Though weekends aren't too much free now-a-days so as i can poke into the hood.

As far as performance is concerned i am pretty happy with my car, but i want to be more happier

Originally Posted by coolmob

can anyone post the contact details of a person specializing in doing these mods as i have tried to find such a guy but have so far failed. there are numerous cng/lpg fitting shops around delhi but ask them anything related to lamda or performance mods they look at you like ur talking about some aircraft parts!!

Mate, trust me being a hard fact, even professional modifiers aren't so much informative regarding CNG tuning and modding.

[Gangsta]

Originally Posted by coolmob

can anyone post the contact details of a person specializing in doing these mods as i have tried to find such a guy but have so far failed. there are numerous cng/lpg fitting shops around delhi but ask them anything related to lamda or performance mods they look at you like ur talking about some aircraft parts!!

Bro. wait for few days, let this thread gets mature with some reviews on the performance mods on CNG, then decide and bhpians can give clearer picture of the performance mods.

Originally Posted by abhik

LAMBDA is an alternate ECU for CNG but it works in conjunction with the car's original ECU. I would not know of a standalone piggyback for CNG but a remap of the original should work wonders, but that again would turn out to be an expensive job.

@Gangsta- As u mentioned the car runs better at night, i would definately second that as i have experienced the same, so i too was thinkin of a CAI as when on CNG every fitter will also tell you to clean the air filter as frequently as possible to get maximum efficiency and performance out of the engine.

There is a definate lag in my Ikon as well till 1500 RPM but it just picks up like mad after that, the RPM just swings towards 7000 in a jiffy.
I guess the CAI should help with that too.

I am going to my fitter tomorrow to try out the lambda. I was advised that the IKon's own ECU is powerful enough to adapt to changes occuring due to CNG and adjust accordingly and fitting a Lambda might result in a conflict but what the heck lets give it a shot, no harm in trying and if it results in busting some serious petrol A** and proving wrong all who believe CNG cant perform then i am definately game for it.

Lambda is like an oxygen sensor for CNG Cars, controlling Fuel Air Ratio.
CNG can be a threat to Performance mods for petrol cars if done in a right way. Because we can do some changes in ECU to increase more HP on CNG, and it mileage part wont hurt the pocket as well. Now i'm getting around 1.10 Rs per km if double the amount of cng can be used to increase the power (which is an extreme), max we can get 2 Rs per km which is very decent enough for an enthusiast and it wont hurt the pocket too in the mileage part. I bet it can beat the hell out of any stock petrol car in it's class or may be a modded one (only depends on the type of mods done),

Originally Posted by ashthedivx

Can you post a pic of TAP for have a better understanding of the same.



I hope you are talking about Timing Advance Processor (TAP).


Even i am inclined towards installing CAI, talked to arush for the same. He also acclaimed that to have a better performance with CAI in a CNG fueled car.

Dealer people are piece of crap whenever we talk about CNG with them, it's still more or less a rocket science for them. Or we can they are so much rigid to share there experiences with CNG. For my car i have tried allmost all major GM dealers in delhi like Autovikas, Regent, Triumph but no where i could find a person who is capable enough of more then doing small tunings in the car. Though in this regard i found shrimankar people very much capable as they know what they are doing and troubleshooting a problem stated to them.

I suppose i have got that ECU along with Lamda installed in my car. When i say "I suppose" i mean i am not sure, as when trying to get information about the TAP online i got some pics around which looks like a gadget installed in my car too. Though weekends aren't too much free now-a-days so as i can poke into the hood.

As far as performance is concerned i am pretty happy with my car, but i want to be more happier


Mate, trust me being a hard fact, even professional modifiers aren't so much informative regarding CNG tuning and modding.

here are some pics of TAP from the net, I think i have TAP installed in my Car. Today my car is there in the service station so will post the pics tommorrow.

[Gangsta]

Timing advance processor is used in CNG/LPG vehicles. It sends specific signals to ECU of car and as a result the ECU itself advances the spark timing. This results in good pickup and mileage on such alternate fuels.

Oh yes!! Advancer in my car is TAP only. 100% confirmed because the device in my car also do the same.

[gravity_sucks]

Can anyone tell me the cost of Timing advance processor??.. I hd already installed lamda to my car's LPG kit.. Can anyone plz give a proper light on CAI
[Cold air induction/intake].. is dat a device if yes hw would it works & hw it helps in improving the performance..!!! Even i had noticed this that at night car run better on lpg...

[Gangsta]

Originally Posted by gravity_sucks

Can anyone tell me the cost of Timing advance processor??.. I hd already installed lamda to my car's LPG kit.. Can anyone plz give a proper light on CAI
[Cold air induction/intake].. is dat a device if yes hw would it works & hw it helps in improving the performance..!!! Even i had noticed this that at night car run better on lpg...

TAP in my car costs me around 2500 RS.

that's due to the fact that we have Cold Air at night and engine is getting cold (denser) air.

About Cold Air Intake:
Cold air intake - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

You can get everything about it from here.

[kalpik]

How much does the CAI cost? I have a Landi Renzo kit in my Esteem with a lambda controller. Im not sure if it has TAP. How do i confirm weather it has a TAP or not? Also im planning to install a CNG kit in my Wagon R. Which is the best kit right now and if you guys know a good place to get it fitted in delhi, it would be great!

[Gangsta]

Originally Posted by kalpik

How much does the CAI cost? I have a Landi Renzo kit in my Esteem with a lambda controller. Im not sure if it has TAP. How do i confirm weather it has a TAP or not? Also im planning to install a CNG kit in my Wagon R. Which is the best kit right now and if you guys know a good place to get it fitted in delhi, it would be great!

For CAI contact Arush, Autopsyche in this forum. He is that man for such mods in delhi.

Tap is a device, i had posted the pics. Open your hood and search for such device. around 4 X 3 inch black device.

tomasetto cng kit is the best right now with 12 kg cyl. I had get it done from Tilak Nagar Area.