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Old 29th December 2008, 21:13   #151
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I think a dyno sheet would be in order, to cut down any further speculation. Though I thought Autocar's figures would do the talking - but it seems not to satisfy.

Even if we agree that it is NOT 500 bhp..it is a fast car by any standards, right ?







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Old 29th December 2008, 21:15   #152
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It loses time at launch, which obviously reflects in the 0-200kmph times.

Besides, it is just a 1800cc engine that has a big turbo bolted on, to make all that power in a very narrow powerband. Coupled to a FWD system. You know the rest
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Old 29th December 2008, 21:22   #153
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Vivek, just a question, you didn't write an article about this very car in a Malayalam car mag... did you?
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Old 29th December 2008, 21:26   #154
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He he....No.


You must have read it in Malayalam top gear. That was compiled by its then editor Mr. Baiju V Nair. That story wasn't the same, was it?
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Old 29th December 2008, 21:31   #155
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Quote:
It loses time at launch, which obviously reflects in the 0-200kmph times.
Every FWD loses time during launch.

But think about this, its 0-200 time is only 0.2 secs quicker than a RWD with only 56% of its power. And its not like the Boxster is some sub 1000kg car, it weighs a good 1350kgs.

This car has turned out to be even more pointless than i had imagined. Sheesh!!!

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Old 29th December 2008, 21:32   #156
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guys lets not ponder on the fact whether its 500bhp or not...first of all the dynamics of the car is not meant to sustain and deliver such figures and for god sake its FWD!!

Secondly cars meant to deliver supercar performance are built from scratch, every detail is looked into and in the end we get a product which is fully capabe of sustaining and extracting the power...nissans and porsches of the world..

what peter has achieved is getting supercar performance out of an ordinary car meant to deliver decent streetcar performance and that fact should be worthy enough for appreciation.
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Old 29th December 2008, 21:35   #157
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a real 500bhp rear wheel drive would do it.not a front wheel drive.

also when you take into consideration that the turbo installed in this small engine to make this power is a big one and needs ages to spool up you'll know where the precious time is lost.

the power is not present all throught the power band.its only from 5000 to 7000 rpm as stated and is very much believable because its a huge turbo.

Now in super cars.also 500bhp super cars the the engines are 4Lt or 5lt approximately and the power is available throughout the rev range and not in just 2000 rpm range.

now the biggest fact.a normal person can launch a regular super car in a decent way.
but a car with a power range of just 2000rpm and that too after 5000 rpm is a very big problem to launch.
no autocar or any mag's testdriver is a professional drag racer with a huge number of turbo car starts under his belt.
so you cannot rule out human error.infact human error would be 90% of this test result.

this car in my opnion would be the most unfriendly car in india.not controllable at all.


when all that power goes into the wheels there would be huge amount of wheel spin.
and that is aided by the weight shifting back during acceleration.this leads to major loss of traction in the front wheels.which leads to more and more wheel spin.

have you ever seen the launch of a proper turbo drag car.the front wheels lift off because of the weight transfer.now in this case since the rear wheels have no power when the weight shifts back the wheels start spinning.


why do all of you believe that 700bhp civics can exist but a 500bhp octavia cannot?very surprising.

i'm not associated with pete in any way but its really very irritating to see everyone so hell bent on getting after this car.


the starter of this post did not say a 500bhp super car was built.it was a 500bhp car.simple, unfriendly car.

frankly in my opnion i would never like a car like this.basically because everytime i would hit 5000rpm it would just do wheel spin and below it,it would behave like a non powered octy.
its not drivable but can be the other car in the garage.but as the owner of the car is happy.thats where it ends.

And yes i have no reason to doubt this car being 500bhp.

when formula one engines of 1.5 Lt capacity can be made to produce 1500bhp for a very very small power band, this is very much possible.

also when 1.6 Lt cars abroad can produce 600 horses verified on the dyno,this is very much possible.



Some one commented that this car is pointless.Well i agree 100% with you on that.this car is totally pointless.from our point of view that is.

but i'd love to have it as my weekend car if i had the moolah.just go out on sunday and do a few burnouts and beat some ricers.lol.

Last edited by navpreet318 : 29th December 2008 at 21:38.
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Old 29th December 2008, 21:36   #158
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Quote:
what peter has achieved is getting supercar performance out of an ordinary car meant to deliver decent streetcar performance and that fact should be worthy enough for appreciation.
Even i appreciate the fact that it does 200 in 19.7 secs. But i definately dont agree that its anywhere close to 500bhp.

You can't just throw around bhp figs like this and expect everyone to believe it.

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Old 29th December 2008, 21:41   #159
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Come on, the Boxster has a perfect mid engined layout and is RWD. It can get get a better launch than a FWD family car.

And it also has a 2.7/ 3.4 litre engine that is Naturally Aspirated.

The Octavia has a very narrow powerband because of the heavy turbo. So even if one manages to get a good launch, all that power comes really late. But there is no denying the fact that it is fast.

And taking about the thing lacking 'the point', who gets to drive it? If he is happy with the way his money was spent, I believe there is a point.

Autocar says '...for all the additional performance gained, it is probably worth it'.

if you think otherwise, their email id is editorial@autocarindia.com.
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Old 29th December 2008, 21:53   #160
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Quote:
Originally Posted by navpreet318 View Post
why do all of you believe that 700bhp civics can exist but a 500bhp octavia cannot?very surprising.
Because they show dyno figures to substantiate their claims?

The real reason why people are so hell bent on picking this car apart is because the regulars here have a real bone to pick with wannabe tuners ruining cars and fleecing money from unsuspecting customers with wild BHP claims.

Pete's may not be any of those, but this fabled vRS still has no proof to corroborate the big numbers its sporting. If this thread started with a dyno figure showing the BHP hitting 500, even with the atrocious timings for so much power, people would have applauded work for the effort that went into the build and revere the car as the ultimate sleeper. But until that happens, you're going to have to live with the unbelievers.
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Old 29th December 2008, 22:00   #161
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Quote:
The Octavia has a very narrow powerband because of the heavy turbo. So even if one manages to get a good launch, all that power comes really late.
Thats exactly what "pointless" means dude.

You dont need 500bhp to do 0-200 in 19.7 secs.

Quote:
why do all of you believe that 700bhp civics can exist but a 500bhp octavia cannot?very surprising.
y do we believe? Heres why....



Shan2nu

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Old 29th December 2008, 22:13   #162
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vivekji05 View Post

Autocar says '...for all the additional performance gained, it is probably worth it'.

if you think otherwise, their email id is editorial@autocarindia.com.
Come on, its just a one man opinion. You can be serious about their comments. The vfm factor for everyone is different.

No coming to the power figures, IMO its should be nearly 375-400 reason:
Referring to the BMW 335i (e90) lap times and specs - FastestLaps.com, if the 335i with 306 hp has nearly similar figures for 0-200, plus it being a RWD, plus it is running a factory gearbox and drivetrain, the 335i being about approx 200kg heavier.

Last edited by dipen : 29th December 2008 at 22:15.
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Old 29th December 2008, 22:42   #163
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Its FWD. Its not made of Carbon Fibre. The total weight of the stock car is 1240 ( with no people in it) So with all the mods, i think it should be close to the 1500 range. ( wild guess)

How do you expect it to do better than other 500 bhps
the usually + 500 bhp cars are RWDs ( Read : Less wheelspin ) , They have way better gearboxes .

None the less , whether it does give 500 on the dyno or not,
Kudos to Peter for this amazing ride.
Keep up the good work
Cheers
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Old 29th December 2008, 23:15   #164
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Actually everyone is talking about RWD and FWD...If the car is that much heavier in the front, then it should help with the hook up and wheel spin less than if it were still lighter up front!

Thought I'd throw it out there. Oh and IMO I would much rather sell the car and buy a nice RWD that can be modded to run with the wolves. Supercar territory? Hmm I'd bet my money on a Gallardo beating this thing down hard!

Sorry, but I've seen Civics and the occasional muscle haul major butt in the states putting some real nice supercars to shame, but they had a few hundred Hp advantage over the supercars.

I don't think that this octy can hold it's own against anything better than factory tune 300-350bhp.

But that doesn't mean it wasn't a good try, even though it's a futile exercise.
Also since there are still no dyno graphs, the Hp rating being flailed around is utterly useless, please just call it a fast/Really fast Octavia rather than stating a figure which without proof is bound to be disputed!
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Old 30th December 2008, 00:19   #165
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ok let me ask a question...lets say we dyno this car and we find out that its not actually 500 bhp, lets say its more like 350 bhp, what then?? would we start questioning the timings it has clocked??
or lets say if its indeed around 500 bhp after we dyno it what then?? would we start bashing the car that its not good enough to utilize those horses and the timings are nothing to write home about??
where are we heading??
lets just accept the fact that here's a potential car which for around 20L+ (7L for used vRS + 14L for the mods done) can outperform cars of double and even triple times more cost. Its a car which can beat almost most of the cars on Indian roads...500 bhp or not.
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