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Old 14th September 2009, 18:35   #931
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@Santosh - I am a V Kool adherent, V 70 on all my front glasses for many years now! So I do not need to be converted, but the UV learning was very valuable, I must admit.
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Old 14th September 2009, 19:32   #932
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I am almost finalising on the Garware ICECOOL as recommended by few other friends here. It seems to be the best VFM product compared to all other brands, just 2500 for the windsheild. One thing I would like to clarify now is: I see lot of cars with a greenish or greyish or blueish sun shade boarder on top of the windscreen (which lightens and merges to the glass colour at the bottom). Is it part of the windscreen film or need to be done seperately ? I would love to have them as we dont need to lower the sun shade each time we face the sun. On my Fiesta, the sun shade almost touches my forehead if lowered, because of the slanting windscreen.
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Old 14th September 2009, 19:44   #933
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@Sawyer, V70 on all cars! then I can understand how valuable UV learning must have been. So far, I used to think that film model or brand doesn't matter regarding UV, because everywhere it is close to 100% blocking. It was surprising to know that in reality it doesn't matter much even between film versus no film!
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Old 14th September 2009, 21:43   #934
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Once upon a time, when Garware had just begun marketing sun-film for heat control, I happened to be loosely associated with one of the distributors of this film for use on building windows. There was one variant that was completely colorless (neutral) and was claimed to reduce radiant heat (infra-red) by 70%. We tested this qualitatively by using a Philips infra lamp available those days for relaxing muscular pain. One could easily feel the difference between the direct radiation and radiation through the film. When you go out to get the film installed, do so when the sun is bright and overhead. Take the film on offer and test how it feels on say the the back of your palms. Needless to say, you could compare the different films this way firsthand.

Now for the second point: is it effective to use sun-film on the front screen. Do this observation - park your car below and go up to the terrace. Now look down at your car and observe all the glass panes. Which of them presents the greatest area to you? I sure the answers may differ, but for me it is the front windscreen. Now if I radiate heat directly from above then my sixth sense tells me that the front window will allow the maximum of this heat into the car. Whats more, the mid-day sun is supposed to be the hottest, at least in our country, so isn't it elementary Dr. Watson?

Another point: heat radiation bounces off the road, buildings, and other surfaces and enters the car through all the glasses. Infra-red radiation is the number one carrier of heat, so I am told. Ultra-violet (UV) is harmful to skin and eyes, but I do not know how much heat it can generate, relatively speaking. Ditto for visible light; I do not know how much heat energy does it carry; but psychologically it seems hot. Tints, in general, reduce visible light hence visibility. Glasses are normally UV-opaque but transparent to infra-red. In fact UV-transparent glass (quartz) is terribly expensive and is produced in very small sizes. Whereas even some cheap plastics are UV-transparent.

Now the next point about heat and temperature. Take a little glass cube and cover it all over with the best sun film with the maximum heat rejection. Keep this cube under the mid-day sun and watch its temperature (you had put in an electronic sensor inside the cube!). I guess you will see a slow rise in the temperature of the cube. Repeat experiment with a cheaper film, and you will perhaps observe a quicker rise in temperature of cube. The point is that one film cuts more than the other, the RATE at which heat energy enters your car. You will still have to figure out how to remove the heat that is getting in anyway. I am not inclined to believe that any film can demonstrate a cent per cent block of the heat energy.
Cheers.
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Old 14th September 2009, 23:28   #935
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Your question of how hot visible light is:

The best sunfilms have 99% IR reduction at 70% VLT. And yet their total heat reduction hovers at around 60%. So y'see, even if you completely remove IR, visible light contributes quite a lot of heat. If you want to block 100% heat, you have to block 100% of radiation. Which is 100% of everything. Which is near impossible.
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Old 15th September 2009, 23:36   #936
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Guys, I just checked out my Linea's windshield: It says 70% visibility.
So looks like in modern cars, even windshields are tinted.

Now my question. Already visibility is at 70%, now adding the wind-screen film will further add 70% reduction. So net Visibility we get is 49% (70% X 70%).
Isn't this illegal/dangerous then?
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Old 16th September 2009, 01:17   #937
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ImmortalZ View Post
Your question of how hot visible light is:

The best sunfilms have 99% IR reduction at 70% VLT. And yet their total heat reduction hovers at around 60%. So y'see, even if you completely remove IR, visible light contributes quite a lot of heat. If you want to block 100% heat, you have to block 100% of radiation. Which is 100% of everything. Which is near impossible.

no windows/windscreen then?
just a couple of cameras and screens.

I hear microsoft is working on a project that renders 3D models of locations based on photos that have been clicked.

That'll be cool. Microsoft's concept car
controlled by project natal

with only 3 buttons CTRL, ALT & DEL
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Old 17th September 2009, 21:26   #938
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I'm buying a new civic, the dealer is giving me V-Kool J60 / T35.

I'm told J60 is the cheapest in v-kool, how much should it cost for all 4 windows + front and rear?

And is it worth upgrading to the premium v-Kool 70, what should the price differential be?
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Old 17th September 2009, 22:27   #939
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^ya v-Kool 70 is worth the price paid, you can also check 3m films which gives somewaht same performance for half the price.
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Old 18th September 2009, 01:26   #940
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I have a Linea MJD Emotion in Black, and felt the need for going in for Sunfilm especially after the previous car did not have any.

I drive equally at night too, hence visibility was always a prime criteria while reducing heat.

Evaluated on paper and a few demos with a heat lamp and sun film.
Compared Huper Optik, Garware, 3M, V-Kool.

Finally settled on 3M CR70 for the entire car.
This has 99.9% UV Rejection, 97% IR Rejection, 50% Total Solar Energy Reduction & 70% VLT. So it does allow heat to come in, albeit more slowly.
But i have never felt the need to keep the AC fan speed at more than 3 steps at 20 Degrees (Linea has 11 Steps for fan speed on the ACC) to feel cool.
Got it for INR 18000 at Bangalore. Black Car looks cool and has high visibility.
Unless you notice the 3M logo or are told, you would not be able to make out that the front windscreen has a sun film.
Works beautifully night and day.

However, i am not sure this is because of the installtion/film, the rear windscreen at night shines along the defogger copper strips when you have headlights from other vehicles.

Will get it checked shortly with 3M.
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Old 18th September 2009, 23:47   #941
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shajufx View Post
I am almost finalising on the Garware ICECOOL as recommended by few other friends here. It seems to be the best VFM product compared to all other brands, just 2500 for the windsheild. One thing I would like to clarify now is: I see lot of cars with a greenish or greyish or blueish sun shade boarder on top of the windscreen (which lightens and merges to the glass colour at the bottom). Is it part of the windscreen film or need to be done seperately ?
Please be specific to ask for Ice Cool Shield.

Moreover, the greenish part or of any other color is a part of the glass only. I think Esteem was among the first inexpensive cars to introduce this.
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Old 22nd September 2009, 07:15   #942
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Well said Immortalz. Visible light forms a significant part of incident solar energy and converts to significant heat energy. But as sprucegoose put it, you cannot cut out the visible spectrum without going blind. Although the statute for VLT stands at seventy percent, a hundred percent VLT on the front screen would mean non-compromised vision at night. I am personally repenting for allowing the accessories guy to put an unsuitable film on my windscreen. I intend to correct this ASAP.
Thanks to guys like tsk13 for specifying a particular windscreen sun film. Is the Ice Cool Shield from Garware? Does it allow good visibility for night driving? Does it retain the clarity of the front glass even after film application? Your inputs would be valuable. My current film seems somewhat foggy.
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Old 22nd September 2009, 12:02   #943
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gostel,

If you choose a high VLT (I have 70%) You would not be able to make out that there is a sunfilm on the front windscreen unless you look carefully or are told. And absolutely no issues at night. I have used CR70 from 3M. The other specifics are in my post above.
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Old 22nd September 2009, 12:37   #944
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mwzd View Post
I'm buying a new civic, the dealer is giving me V-Kool J60 / T35.

I'm told J60 is the cheapest in v-kool, how much should it cost for all 4 windows + front and rear?

And is it worth upgrading to the premium v-Kool 70, what should the price differential be?
I would get VK-70 for the front windshield. Cost is around 12k. I don't know how much J60 costs for the windshield though. 60% VLT might cause problems with the cops and/or night driving. You do not want to reduce visibility at night.
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Old 22nd September 2009, 13:12   #945
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I picked the topic a bit late. Glass History from PPG
Today, in order to avoid Sunlight's bleaching property to the Glass additives are added that give greenish tinge to the glass. This removes most of the UV but not IR.

Thus its only for IR that we require heat control screens.
I wonder what brand does best. More research required... Thanks!
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