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Old 24th October 2005, 13:07   #1
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Smile Should I convert to LPG?

Hi guys,
I am new to this forum from bangalore, & i brought ZEN in this Aug, Zen Vxi, 2001 apr. for 2.6 Lakhs.

As i want to drive everyday at average of 25kms in b'lore city, B'caz of high petrol rate, thinking to switch to CNG kit,[ as of now i getting 15km w/o AC, my friends say it will be1or2 km less with CNG!] which will be around 19-20k, & it will be authorised by RTO by marking in RC Book.

Guys, I need your suggestions, feedbacks regarding mileage, safety, resale value, & other considerable issues.
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Old 24th October 2005, 13:17   #2
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subbarao. Welcome to tbhp.

I think you are confused about CNG. I believe you are refering to LPG. It's true, the mileage with LPG is 1-2 KMS less than with petrol. Also keep in mind that you will loose complete trunk space if you go for LPG kit.
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Old 24th October 2005, 14:01   #3
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Hi, sathish

No, i am not confused, there is an 2 kits available, one is with LPG,[unauthorised domestic LPG cylinder, they say it is authorised!!] & other one with CNG[compressed natural gas] which will be filled in petrol pump for Rs23/Ltr.[exact price not known] there is an 4-5 pumps in b'lore.
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Old 24th October 2005, 14:46   #4
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If you dont mind loosing whatever boot you have in the zen (Its already very small in the Zen) go for it...Great savings...
CAT
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Old 24th October 2005, 15:07   #5
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Do you get CNG in b'lore ? If yes, then how many outlets do we have ?
I know LPG is available more easily though.

For 25 kms/day of travel, converting to CNG/LPG is not at all good option.
You will be compromising on the safety and the resale value too if you convert.
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Old 24th October 2005, 15:27   #6
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Using LPG is no more illegal if you don't use subsidised domestic gas cylinder. A legal LPG kit comes with it's own cylinder which is permanantly fitted in the car trunk. You have to fill the gas at a gas pump. So still I feel you are refering to LPG kit. And this commercial gas cost as much as you have stated. After the recent hike, it cost Rs. 27/liter in Hyderabad.

Quote:
You will be compromising on the safety and the resale value too if you convert
This is a false assumption. The authorized gas kits and cylinders are all certified by the concerned departments for the safety. Your dealer will give copies of all these certificates to you to present to the RTA.

Also, I don't believe this will affect the resale value. Instead it will increase the value as anybody going for a second hand in the entry level segment will also be happier to enjoy the cost of running the car.
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Old 24th October 2005, 17:04   #7
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Sorry to type wrong information, it's LPG not CNG, u can refer these links,


http://www.indiacar.net/news/n10112.htm

http://www.zeropollutions.com/lpgkits.htm#INTRODUCTION
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Old 24th October 2005, 17:11   #8
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Just type 'LPG' in the tbhp search and there is huge information for you.
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Old 24th October 2005, 18:25   #9
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Converting to LPG is a good option.. Even one of my friend converted his Zen (Carb engine) to LPG and getting 11-12 in city..


And Subba rao, it is LPG and NOT CNG.
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Old 8th November 2005, 08:45   #10
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Default Retrofitted with LPG

Hi,
As i got reasonable reply's from you guy's & from my friends who are fitted with LPG, i also made my ZEN to run on LPG. It's a ZAVOLI kit with torodial tank, fitted on 28th oct.

If anybody want further info on this, let me know.

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Old 11th November 2005, 08:21   #11
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Further to add info on LPG, i mailed to Maurti udyog, asking is there any problem with engine when it runs on LPG, i got the ans. for the same, please read on....


Date: Thu, 10 Nov 2005 07:45:50 +0530
From: "MARUTI"<contact@maruti.co.in>
Subject: RE:'CaseID=639-142' Technical Query/Maruti Zen
Delete message excluding attachments Show Related Mails


Dear Sir,

Thank you for visiting our website.

Here is the current status about running your vehicle on LPG:

1. It is technically possible to convert Maruti vehicles to run on LPG. With proper conversion kit use of LPG has no ill effects on the engine. 2. CNG (Compressed Natural Gas) is presumed to be safer as LPG being heavier settles down and can catch fire with any spark. CNG being lighter escapes into air.

3. Although Govt has allowed the use of LPG as an automotive fuel, MOST (Ministry of Surface Transport) is still working on various regulations for this purpose. That is why we cannot recommend any conversion kits at this moment.



Please also note that using a domestic cooking gas cylinder is most unsafe. Such cylinders are not designed keeping in mind impact or heat resistance, and have been known to explode in some cases of rear-end collisions.

Regards

Maruti Customer Care

(Anytime Maruti: 1600 11 1515 -- toll free, 24 hours, every day)
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Old 12th November 2005, 11:05   #12
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Thumbs up LPG conversion

One has to be very careful and alert while LPG conversion is being done to your car.

Last edited by arun_112 : 12th November 2005 at 11:12.
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Old 12th November 2005, 11:06   #13
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Thumbs up LPG conversion in Maruti Alto

As Maruti Alto is MPFI engine, LPG is most suited to this machine.

Good things about LPG:
1) Clean fuel, it cannot be adulterated like petrol.
2) Creates less pollution.
3) Running costs is about 40% lower than petrol.
4) Does not heat up the engine like CNG.
5) Does not show major power loss as in CNG.
6) LPG tank is smaller than CNG tank for same capacity, because it is liquid.
7) LPG tank is much stronger than petrol tank, hence, safer.
8) No vibrations, as compared to diesel.


When you decide about converting your car to LPG following things come to your mind:
1) Cost of running.
2) Loss of boot space in dicky.
3) Convenience
4) Safety
5) How much abuse the car will have to bear by drilling and hammering

ANSWERS: Low running cost, 50% loss of boot space, very convenient as no alterations done to your original petrol settings, only extra parts are added. Safer than petrol, Your car body will be drilled to screw the parts. The car body will be cut by circular cutter to fit the inlet of LPG on the rear side. The dickey's raised floor portion where the stepney is placed will be hammered to flatten it to accommodate the toroidal tank. The ignition switch will be opened to add some more connections with a safety fuse.

Some advice for Maruti Alto / 800 car users:

1) Cost of running on LPG is about 40% lower than petrol.

2) To save space, the best option is to go for 35 Litre toroidal tank. This is of the same size as the stepney of the car and fits in the space provided for stepney. In this way you don't lose in the dickey space.

3) The best and most popular model is STAKO toroidal tank manufactured in Poland. This tank costs about Rs. 4000 more than cylindrical tank. Indian ''Econ'' tank of 35 litres capacity is also being used. It costs Rs. 3000 more than cylindrical tank. This tank is manufactured in Visakhapatnam and is approved by the Chief Controller of Explosives, Nagpur.

4) Now, you will have to keep the stepney in an inclined position on the left side of dickey. When you go for shopping to nearby places, you can take a little risk and leave behind the stepney in order to use the full dickey space.

5) There are two types of kits: one that requires manual switching to LPG from petrol after ignition (generally for carborater cars), other that does this job automatically (for MPFI cars).

6) So, be aware of this, automatic version costs Rs. 2,000 more. In this version you have option to switch to a)always on petrol, b) always on gas and c) starting on petrol and switching to gas on acceleration.

7) The total cost of automatic system with toroidal tank will cost Rs. 24,000. (Cost of imported toroidal tank is Rs. 4000 while indian toroidal tank is Rs. 3000 more than cylindrical tank).

8) <b>If using ordinary cylindrical tank (larger capacity) with manual system, including RTO formalities), the cost will be about 20,000.</b>

9) During installation, be ready to get your car's body to be drilled at a few places to fix the vapouriser, solenoids, etc. To fit the toroidal tank, the dickey base has to be flattened by hammering (sometimes with little damage). Prefer to have the filling inlet for gas on the right hand side opposite to the petrol inlet. You can have it inside the dickey also (t avoid geting the car body drilled), but only if you agree to open the dickey every time you need to fill the tank.

10) There are many varieties and makes of the kits available in India. Popular names are LOVATO, BRC, LONGAS, LANDIRENZO, TARTARINI, etc. These are all Italian kits. LOVATO and BRC is expensive as it has all imported parts. But the others have only the multi valve, and vapouriser made in Italy, and rest of the parts like copper pipes, change over switch, solenoids, etc are Indian. Yes, if toroidal tank is being used, only imported version ''Stako'' is now rarely available in India, the indian version is ''Econ'' which is very common. Normal cylindrical tanks are all of Indian make, generally Econ, having larger capacities of 40 litres and 60 litres is preferred ny many people who have big cars.

11) The process of installation is as follows: First you have to take permission from the RTO on Form BTI to install the LPG kit , (then again get clearance within 14 days of approval for using the kit after installation). The fee is only Rs. 50 but the LPG fitters charge somewhere Rs. 1500 to 2000 if they get this clearance through RTO agents. After getting this permission, you can go ahead with fitting the kit. (You can do the simple RTO formality yourself and save another Rs. 2000)

12) It takes about 6 to 8 hrs. for fitting the kit. After fitting the kit, it is advisable to fill the gas to full tank and check the indicators. You have to take RTO permission within 14 days after approval. RTO will write details and stamp your original RC book. Now, you are fully authorised to use this kit. hence, minimum it takes 2-3 days for the whole process.


Running costs:

Milage on petrol worth Rs. 500:
Assuming that you fill petrol for Rs. 500 (@Rs. 48.30 paise as on 27-9-05 in Mumbai) you will get 10.35 litres of petrol. At the milage of 17 Kms/lit your Alto/800 would run 176 Kms.

Milage on LPG worth Rs. 500:
Now, if you fill LPG for Rs. 500 (Rs. 24.50/Lit) you will get 20.40 Litres of LPG. At a milage of 15 Kms/Lit your Alto/800 would run 306 Kms.

How much extra milage you will get on LPG worth Rs. 500?
On every Rs. 500 you get 130 Kms extra (on LPG as compared to petrol)

How much petrol will I save on every Rs. 500 on gas?
Well, in order to run this 130 Kms extra you would have required 7.64 lit of petrol costing Rs. 369.
In short, on every Rs. 500 consumed on LPG (instead of petrol), you will save Rs. 369 worth of petrol.

So, go ahead and enjoy your trip on LPG. But remember, when your kit is being installed, don't move away from your car, as lot of supervision will be required to see that the work is done neatly. Don't rely on the mechanic, sometimes they are in great hurry to finish the job. One more thing, pay only after the job is done. Take proper bill. Inform them beforehand that you will require a pukka bill, else the installer will put 12% more as taxes if you ask for the bill after the job is done.

Complaint against defective product and services.
Visit www.icrpc.org for free help if you have a complaint against any defective product or service, including faulty LPG equipment, or defective fitting.

Last edited by arun_112 : 12th November 2005 at 11:09.
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Old 13th November 2005, 20:04   #14
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Thats some very useful information.
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Old 13th November 2005, 20:20   #15
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arun, that a load of useful info. Any idea how exactly the MPFI system works. Does the ECU have to be recalibrated so that it knows that fuel is changed.
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