Go Back   Team-BHP > Under the Hood > Modifications & Accessories


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 11th November 2010, 15:02   #1
GTO
Team-BHP Support
 
GTO's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Bombay
Posts: 47,748
Thanked: 89,396 Times
Default Open House at *Red Rooster (Bangalore)*. Free dyno run, demo drives and facility tour

As received via email from Red Rooster Performance. Whoever goes, please be sure to post pictures & a report!

Open House at *Red Rooster (Bangalore)*. Free dyno run, demo drives and facility tour-redrooster.jpg
GTO is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14th November 2010, 20:20   #2
BHPian
 
redrage's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Bengalooru
Posts: 544
Thanked: 58 Times
Default

Visited the RRR facility and got my Esteem Dynoed. They seem to have a pretty good setup.

Mine got rated at 63.6 WHP at 5500 RPM.

Comparison to another esteem with a few basic mods posted.

Leela said that the cars performance was impressive and the filter was clogged

If not for the filter it would have put a wee bit more.

Open House at *Red Rooster (Bangalore)*. Free dyno run, demo drives and facility tour-rrr-esteem-1359-web.jpg

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rudra Sen View Post
You're not the only one. Mine is running rich also..
It was great pleasure to meet Rudra sir, Ajmat and some other Bhpians.

Last edited by redrage : 14th November 2010 at 20:28.
redrage is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 14th November 2010, 20:26   #3
Team-BHP Support
 
Rudra Sen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 10,404
Thanked: 4,092 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by redrage View Post
Leela said that the cars performance was impressive and the filter was clogged
You're not the only one. Mine is running rich also..
Rudra Sen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15th November 2010, 11:14   #4
Senior - BHPian
 
Ajaybiz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 1,354
Thanked: 140 Times
Default

Awaiting more results come on guys.
Ajaybiz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15th November 2010, 13:33   #5
Team-BHP Support
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 11,892
Thanked: 9,729 Times
Default

Us mods and a young Dbhpian went along. We took the Optra and a Thai taxi with us. Was feeling bit under the weather so the RS stayed back (yes, I am an idiot!).

Team members were waiting on hand to guide us in for registration. We were then invited to view the products on dispaly. (sorry, we thought we would take pics later but nver got down to it). On display were their range of
  • BMC Air filters, Exedy clutches, Garret intercoolers
  • Tien suspension components. Some of these were adjustable and could be tweaked electronically
  • Range of diesel tuning box applications
  • Various race preparation items from racing seats, pedals to apparel
Prices were also displayed. These carried a premium but judging by the amount of work that went in to optimising and bringing to market, a cost needs to be incurred.

We were then escorted to the workshop and introduced to none other than Leela Krishnan himself. He personally took us around the facility:
Immaculately laid out with defined clean area for team members to eat, relax etc and a supervisory cabin. I know no other automotive facility offering this for its own people.

Open House at *Red Rooster (Bangalore)*. Free dyno run, demo drives and facility tour-img_0957.jpg

Open House at *Red Rooster (Bangalore)*. Free dyno run, demo drives and facility tour-img_0946.jpg
Wheel Alignment
Paint Booth - this looks more geared for painting rally cars. The place is too spic and span for basic body repairs.
Dyno Tester Meter - This is an axle based system which measures power at the axle. No power losses/ distortions due to rollers etc.

Open House at *Red Rooster (Bangalore)*. Free dyno run, demo drives and facility tour-img_0951.jpg
This room is sound proofed with extractor fans and also a blower fan to simulate speeds upto 160km/h. More on this later

Open House at *Red Rooster (Bangalore)*. Free dyno run, demo drives and facility tour-img_0947.jpg

We then went to the testing rigs

Suspension rig - this is used to test suspensions and match characterisitics to both each other and to the proposed terrain. Reliability testing is done. With that, they can document the type of shims, inserts, oil vicosity required. As a result they take very few suspension spares on a rally. Any replacements are for accidents only. They test suspension travel rate at up to 1m/s lthough 0.7m/s second is the norm. This helps in designing everything from the bumpstop lengths to ride height. The rig is also used to match components prior to a rally.


Open House at *Red Rooster (Bangalore)*. Free dyno run, demo drives and facility tour-img_0929.jpg

Open House at *Red Rooster (Bangalore)*. Free dyno run, demo drives and facility tour-img_0932.jpg

Open House at *Red Rooster (Bangalore)*. Free dyno run, demo drives and facility tour-img_0933.jpg


Their tie up with Tien entails there doing a lot of research on Indian conditions. You would have seen a lot of discussions going on about different makes elsewhere in the forum, the impressions are mixed. We know of no other such rigs in India at the moment, manufacturers excepted. The cost of the suspension are high. A full superstreet set up for a Civic was around Rs 91000. Quality and research has a price to pay.

Head Flowmeter rig
Open House at *Red Rooster (Bangalore)*. Free dyno run, demo drives and facility tour-img_0930.jpg

Here the cylinder head is mounted along with probes and inflow/ outflow velocities are measured. This is improtant as we see below


Engine Dismantling area - this is separate, the engine is dismantled and cleaned

Engine Assembly - this is a squeaky clean area where the parts are organised and engine rebuilt. You could eat your dinner or get operated out here. It is that clean. The engine is mounted on a rig, none of that three men to tip it over to get at the bottom end nonsense,

Open House at *Red Rooster (Bangalore)*. Free dyno run, demo drives and facility tour-img_0937.jpg

Leela's key points in tuning - I hope I got these correctly
  • Best gains are from improving volumetric efficiency -
  • Start with the air intake, exhaust and head porting. All these must be matched - that is an art in itself
  • Cam changes, Remapping ignition comes later when changing compression ratios, intake pressures and turbocharging - looks like we met the dark side too soon!
  • High compression pistons, con rods etc come later once you have established the kind of power and durability required.
  • Supercharging is a fuel consumption hog
  • Hyundai, Toyota and Honda are consistent in stock BHP outputs rating as also BMW and Mercedes
  • Maruti are not consistent. Now we know the dark side of Baleno's!
  • Do they remove cat cons ?- Its upto the customer but they are developing a performance version shortly
We were impressed with Leela and his ability to engage with people of all BHP IQ levels.

He also mentioned how the Cedia has driven them nuts as it is a difficult nut to tune due to its long stroke. Anyway he cracked it and offered me a ride in Naren Kumars new Cedia.

Open House at *Red Rooster (Bangalore)*. Free dyno run, demo drives and facility tour-img_0942.jpg


Sat inside with difficulty. He started it up but let it idle until the temeperature and pressure were up to the mark. The car idled without any lumpyness. Boy, it is loud, the fuel pump whined hard, as he started off it was joined by a loud whine of the straight cut gears.

He gingerly took the car onto the main road, waited for a clear opportunity and floored it. The shove was amazing. Along came a speed breaker and he braked late....well it was well in time.

Last edited by ajmat : 16th November 2010 at 19:28.
ajmat is offline   (2) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 15th November 2010, 13:49   #6
Senior - BHPian
 
rjstyles69's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Bengalooru..
Posts: 4,345
Thanked: 789 Times
Default

Had a chat with viddy and was told that it was something on the lines of opening a can of worms when it came to a few cars .
rjstyles69 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15th November 2010, 16:17   #7
Senior - BHPian
 
pranavt's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 1,628
Thanked: 272 Times
Default

Hopefully this does not spoil Red Rooster's name as the figures are so low when other dyno operators seem to get figures that are accurate to within 0.5 bhp.

You also have to remember the difference in ambient pressure due to altitude, among other things.
pranavt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15th November 2010, 16:30   #8
Senior - BHPian
 
Shan2nu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Hubli - Karnata
Posts: 5,525
Thanked: 87 Times
Default

Quote:
Hopefully this does not spoil Red Rooster's name as the figures are so low when other dyno operators seem to get figures that are accurate to within 0.5 bhp.

You also have to remember the difference in ambient pressure due to altitude, among other things.
Yup, it must be the alt which is causing this. There could be a 7-9% diff between B'bay and Blore numbers.
Shan2nu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15th November 2010, 16:34   #9
Team-BHP Support
 
Vid6639's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 14,471
Thanked: 19,384 Times
Default

My Altis output was 96bhp. Civic was showing around 84bhp. Red Rooster guys thought the Civic was a bit low and mine had a restricted air filter. AFR was running on the richer side on my Altis.

Points to note are:

1. Red Rooster has a chasis dyno which is connected directly to the hubs. Not the rolling drum type inertia dyno.
2. They use SAE dyno correction factor which is supposed to show lower numbers than the other ISO correction factors.
3. Bangalore being at a higher altitude than Mumbai means that the numbers will be atleast lower by 10-15%.

The surprise was the Swift D. Another member Dreamy, his Swift D showed 66bhp at the wheels. Red Rooster also had a graph from a Swift D with a BMC filter and that peaked at 69bhp but the torque improvement was much much more thorughout the range.
Vid6639 is offline   (1) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 15th November 2010, 17:11   #10
Distinguished - BHPian
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: KL
Posts: 4,680
Thanked: 3,508 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by redrage View Post
Visited the RRR facility and got my Esteem Dynoed. They seem to have a pretty good setup.

Mine got rated at 63.6 WHP at 5500 RPM.

Comparison to another esteem with a few basic mods posted.

Leela said that the cars performance was impressive and the filter was clogged

If not for the filter it would have put a wee bit more.
This is indeed impressive, compared to the Baleno.

Quote:
Originally Posted by crazydiablo View Post
my car got dynoed at 74WHP@ 5800rpm. Torque 99NM@4500rpm.

To get a good comparison I dont have a stock car dynoed. But only one other NA Baleno was there which was a Group N rally car.

Group N rally car with 60.8WHP@5400 rpm. Torque 83NM@5200 rpm.

Turbo baleno at around 120bhp at the wheels. I wonder what a stock baleno should make on this dyno? 50bhp or what?
Sankar is offline   (1) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 15th November 2010, 17:19   #11
BHPian
 
redrage's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Bengalooru
Posts: 544
Thanked: 58 Times
Default

I think one of the stock civics (the white one) who ran early got a figure of 90 hp (hub dyno). Whereas the recently tested gto's civic in bombay got a 117 bhp (roller dyno). A 27 hp difference!

Leela also told me during my interaction with him that my car might be making just over 5-6 hp over a stock esteem and this is after i have P&P, added Performance exhaust, airfilter, performance plugs, synthetics. My car has done close to 80K kms. I am quite satisfied. Only niggle is the lag below 2k rpms. I was wondering whether to go in for a custom ecu and maps or change the gear ratios to a shorter one. I was told to simply change the ratios and this would eliminate the initial lag.So i will surely be trying this.

Last edited by redrage : 15th November 2010 at 17:32.
redrage is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 15th November 2010, 17:34   #12
BHPian
 
crazydiablo's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Bangalore/San Francisco
Posts: 854
Thanked: 21 Times
Default

Yup thats true.

Another thing I wonder, all the runs were 4th gear runs, will that make any difference.

My dyno chart for comparison.
Attached Images
 
crazydiablo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15th November 2010, 19:15   #13
Senior - BHPian
 
Captain Slow's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 1,256
Thanked: 650 Times
Default

redrage 64bhp for a esteem is good! Is it a stock car? MPFI or carb?

GTO/Guys
Can I take my car over this weekend for a free Dyno run ?
Captain Slow is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15th November 2010, 19:22   #14
Team-BHP Support
 
Vid6639's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 14,471
Thanked: 19,384 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Slow View Post
redrage 64bhp for a esteem is good! Is it a stock car? MPFI or carb?

GTO/Guys
Can I take my car over this weekend for a free Dyno run ?
Sorry dude, Free dyno run was only for last weekend.
Vid6639 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15th November 2010, 19:26   #15
GTO
Team-BHP Support
 
GTO's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Bombay
Posts: 47,748
Thanked: 89,396 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by vid6639 View Post
My Altis output was 96bhp. Civic was showing around 84bhp.
Quote:
Originally Posted by redrage View Post
I think one of the stock civics (the white one) who ran early got a figure of 90 hp (hub dyno).
How can two cars rated for 130 BHP - the Altis & Civic - show 25 to 35% loss? Remove the wheels from the equation, and any loss therein ought to be minimised for calculation at the hub.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Slow View Post
GTO/Guys
Can I take my car over this weekend for a free Dyno run ?
Call them up directly!
GTO is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Baleno - now with a Red Rooster free flow spider77 Modifications & Accessories 58 23rd November 2014 21:42
Red Rooster Performance sets up a 2nd shop in Bangalore! suhaas307 Modifications & Accessories 34 21st January 2014 12:49
Bangalore! - A new tuner in town - Red Rooster Performance Harrie Modifications & Accessories 70 28th March 2012 09:57
Open open open Sesame!! VJ_MAVRICK Shifting gears 12 10th January 2008 15:24


All times are GMT +5.5. The time now is 18:44.

Copyright 2000 - 2017, Team-BHP.com
Proudly powered by E2E Networks