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Old 17th August 2010, 12:22   #4126
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Originally Posted by dinu2506 View Post
I'm sure its possible. I've seen many Altos with fog lights. Why don't you try with Maruti dealers?
Maruti dealers are very expensive! Just for the old Zen ORVM's they quoted me Rs. 4700/- (internally adjustable one's). I will try to ask for a quote from them and will ask around in the car accessory stores.

Cheers!
-Z
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Old 17th August 2010, 12:36   #4127
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Originally Posted by motomaverick View Post
This is a myth coz I have been using higher rated bulbs first in my karizma for 1.5 yrs & now the zen for close to 1yr but nothing of that has happened. I have driven for 2 drives in the night both around avg of 400kms with the same headlight. I also use it for my regular use in the city.
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Originally Posted by goandude View Post
I upgraded to 100/90 many months ago. so far no change in the headlamps color. but the increased brightness is appreciable.
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Originally Posted by naveen.raju View Post
There isnt a solution for this. If you use high rated bulbs for long term, the headlights will blacken. It also depends upon the headlight assembly. My friends Getz headlight got blackened in 10 months of regular use.
Well with such mixed feedback I guess I should ask you all what is the cost of a new pair of headlamp front cover for swift in case it does blacken or peel off maybe?
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Old 17th August 2010, 12:40   #4128
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Originally Posted by naveen.raju View Post
There are two options:
1) Go for the readymade projector headlight assembly. You will have to replace your existing headlight with the new projector HL. This is simple.
2) If you dont get readymade projector HL for your car, you will have to modify your existing HL. You will need a very good installer for this.

What's your ride btw?
Thanks.. its NHC Zx.

Peninsular Honda quoted ~10k for upgrade w/o projectors.

My worry is that HID on stock H/L will be blinding the oncoming vehicles...my regular COK-BLR rides are in night with lights on for ~8hrs. That's another reason I don't want to try with higher rated bulbs(90/100)
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Old 17th August 2010, 14:06   #4129
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Thumbs down Hella H4 90/100 Bulbs - A short review

I recently upgraded my Chevy Spark with Hella H4 90/100 lights along with the matrix relay kit.

Upgrade did make a positive difference with the high beams but felt that the low beam had degraded. Low beams on the left had good throw. Low beams on the right were miserable, after 10-15 feet, I have to literally search for them with a torch

Much of the usable light falls on the left pavement. Has the installer (Evo) messed up with the horizontal alignment of the lights?. Open the hood but there are no screws for horizontal alignment in Spark.

The hella lights were also very 'yellow' at 3150K. When driven on a road flanked with Sodium vapor lights, it will be fairly difficult to tell if the lights are ON or OFF from the driver's seat.

Since the Hella 90/100s were inadequate, I tried Phillips Rally 90/100 and it made hell of a difference (+ve) in visibility. The Philips were near to daylight color (4000-4500K).

Conclusion: Philips 90/100 fares much better than Hella 90/100 with the Chevy Spark optics. If their performance is compared in a different car (make), the results could be different.

Incidentally, Spark stock headlights are Philips 55/60.
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Old 17th August 2010, 14:49   #4130
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Originally Posted by Twiny View Post
Thanks.. its NHC Zx.

Peninsular Honda quoted ~10k for upgrade w/o projectors.

My worry is that HID on stock H/L will be blinding the oncoming vehicles...my regular COK-BLR rides are in night with lights on for ~8hrs. That's another reason I don't want to try with higher rated bulbs(90/100)
You can try in blr to source the readymade projector HL assembly. This should make your work simple.
Yes, HID's on oem HL will blind oncoming traffic. But if you use branded HID's and do a proper install it should be fine.
I initially thought all the HIDs installed in OEM HL will blind oncoming traffic, but that aint true. I have got mixed reactions and people using Philips found it really good. Maybe you can try that option too.
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Old 17th August 2010, 14:51   #4131
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Originally Posted by fine69 View Post
Well with such mixed feedback I guess I should ask you all what is the cost of a new pair of headlamp front cover for swift in case it does blacken or peel off maybe?
Well, am not sure whether they will have just the cover. They might ask you to buy the whole H/L assembly.
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Old 17th August 2010, 17:22   #4132
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Well, there are mixed opinions about the HID conversion kits. Some says all the HID conversion kits creates glares and some say that branded one’s have less glare. Lets consider the facts first before arriving any conclusion.

Please go through this write up before you go for the HID conversion kits.

An "HID kit" consists of HID ballasts and bulbs for retrofitting into a halogen headlamp. Kits for replacement of standard round or rectangular sealed-beam headlamps usually include a poor-quality replaceable-bulb headlight lens-reflector unit that's not safe or legal even when equipped with the intended (usually H4) halogen bulb. Often, these products are advertised using the name of a reputable lighting company ("Real Philips kit! Real Osram kit! Real Hella kit!") to try to give the potential buyer the illusion of legitimacy. On rare occasion, some of the components in these kits did start out as legitimate HID headlight bulbs made by reputable companies, but they are modified (hacked) by the "HID kit" suppliers, and they aren't being put to their designed or intended use. Reputable companies like Philips, Osram, Hella, etc. never endorse this kind of hacked usage of their products. Nevertheless, it's easy to get "HID kits" from China bearing the (unauthorised, counterfeit) brands of major, reputable companies.

See this page (WebCite query result) for just a few examples of the many packaging options offered by just one Chinese maker of "HID kits".

Halogen headlamps and HID headlamps require very different optics to produce a safe and effective—not to mention legal—beam pattern. How come? Because of the very different characteristics of the two kinds of light source.

A halogen bulb has a cylindrical light source: the glowing filament. The space immediately surrounding the cylinder of light is completely dark, and so the sharpest contrast between bright and dark is along the edges of the cylinder of light. The ends of the filament cylinder fade from bright to dark. An HID bulb, on the other hand, has a crescent-shaped light source -- the arc. It's crescent-shaped because as it passes through the space between the two electrodes, its heat causes it to try to rise. The space immediately surrounding the crescent of light glows in layers...the closer to the crescent of light, the brighter the glow. The ends of the arc crescent are the brightest points, and immediately beyond these points is completely dark, so the sharpest contrast between bright and dark is at the ends of the crescent of light.

This diagram shows the very different characteristics of the filament vs. the arc:

Name:  filamentarc.jpg
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When designing the optics (lens and/or reflector) for a lamp, the characteristics of the light source are the driving factor around which everything else must be engineered. If you go and change the light source, you've done the equivalent of putting on somebody else's eyeglasses: You can probably make them fit on your face OK, but you won't see properly.

Now, what about those "retrofit" jobs in which the beam cutoff still appears sharp? Don't be fooled; it's an error to judge a beam pattern solely by its cutoff. In many lamps, especially the projector types, the cutoff will remain the same regardless of what light source is behind it. Halogen bulb, HID capsule, cigarette lighter, firefly, hold it up to the sun—whatever. That's because of the way a projector lamp works. The cutoff is simply the projected image of a piece of metal running side-to-side behind the lens. Where the optics come in is in distributing the light under the cutoff. And, as with all other automotive lamps (and, in fact, all optical instruments), the optics are calculated based not just on where the light source is within the lamp (focal length) but also the specific photometric characteristics of the light source...which parts of it are brighter, which parts of it are darker, where the boundaries of the light source are, whether the boundaries are sharp or fuzzy, the shape of the light source, and so forth.

The only safe and legitimate HID retrofit is one that replaces the entire headlamp—that is lens, reflector, bulb...the whole system—with optics designed for HID usage. In the aftermarket, it is possible to get clever with the growing number of available products, such as Hella's modular projectors available in HID or halogen, and fabricate your own brackets and bezels.

Courtsey: Daniel Stern Lighting Consultancy and Supply
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Old 17th August 2010, 21:22   #4133
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An HID in retro fitted in a halogen lamp assy is not street legal. Thats why u see all the OEM cars with HID have projector setup. Projector assy is like a torch light which throws out light in a uniform direction.

Further, the ones that u get in the market are all 6k color temperature which has a slight bluish hue, it will certainly strain the eyes in longer drive.

Go for a Bosch or Roots relay kit (w/ ceramic holders) and a 90/100 Philips Rallye to get decent halogen brightness for city plus fix HIDs on the fogs which can be used for highway driving as the fogs can uniformly illuminate the road upto a height of 1 to 2 feet (not the distance from the car) for the driver to see any potholes at high speeds.

Last edited by motomaverick : 17th August 2010 at 21:23.
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Old 20th August 2010, 17:42   #4134
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Guys i'm not happy with the illumination of my cruze. I want to install something which is bright and gives white tinge. Ideally i'm thinking of HIDs with projector setup. Is it possible to get projectors in cruze headlamps. Also i will be requiring the same light in my fogs as i don't want to differentiate the light tinge of my headlamps and fogs. SO here are my queries
1. How can i fit projectors in my existing cruze headlamps. Or can i get retrofitted projector lamps for cruze?
2. If i upgrade my fogs to powerful bulbs will it be suffice for better illumination, keeping headlamp bulbs stock.
3. I want to avoid fitting powerful bulbs in headlamps as i fear that they will blacken or damage the lamp. So can i get something better in stock wattage?
4. If i install good quality HIDs in headlamps with proper installation but without projectors will it be suffice?
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Old 20th August 2010, 18:02   #4135
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fine69 View Post
Well with such mixed feedback I guess I should ask you all what is the cost of a new pair of headlamp front cover for swift in case it does blacken or peel off maybe?
i guess another option is to leave the stock headlamp as it is and go for an HID set up in the fogs.
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Old 20th August 2010, 18:31   #4136
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Originally Posted by sajjt View Post
An "HID kit" consists of HID ballasts and bulbs for retrofitting into a halogen headlamp. Kits for replacement of standard round or rectangular sealed-beam headlamps usually include a poor-quality replaceable-bulb headlight lens-reflector unit that's not safe or legal even when equipped with the intended (usually H4) halogen bulb. Often, these products are advertised using the name of a reputable lighting company ("Real Philips kit! Real Osram kit! Real Hella kit!") to try to give the potential buyer the illusion of legitimacy. On rare occasion, some of the components in these kits did start out as legitimate HID headlight bulbs made by reputable companies, but they are modified (hacked) by the "HID kit" suppliers, and they aren't being put to their designed or intended use. Reputable companies like Philips, Osram, Hella, etc. never endorse this kind of hacked usage of their products. Nevertheless, it's easy to get "HID kits" from China bearing the (unauthorised, counterfeit) brands of major, reputable companies.
Isn't Philips advertising & selling HID kits with warranty officially?

Quote:
Originally Posted by motomaverick View Post
An HID in retro fitted in a halogen lamp assy is not street legal. Thats why u see all the OEM cars with HID have projector setup. Projector assy is like a torch light which throws out light in a uniform direction.
The Toyota Altis comes with HIDs as OEM without projectors.
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Old 21st August 2010, 08:55   #4137
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Originally Posted by ashish22 View Post
Guys i'm not happy with the illumination of my cruze. I want to install something which is bright and gives white tinge. Ideally i'm thinking of HIDs with projector setup. Is it possible to get projectors in cruze headlamps. Also i will be requiring the same light in my fogs as i don't want to differentiate the light tinge of my headlamps and fogs. SO here are my queries
1. How can i fit projectors in my existing cruze headlamps. Or can i get retrofitted projector lamps for cruze?
2. If i upgrade my fogs to powerful bulbs will it be suffice for better illumination, keeping headlamp bulbs stock.
3. I want to avoid fitting powerful bulbs in headlamps as i fear that they will blacken or damage the lamp. So can i get something better in stock wattage?
4. If i install good quality HIDs in headlamps with proper installation but without projectors will it be suffice?
1. It is possible to fit projectors in your stock headlights but you will need a very skilled technician for this. I havent seen retrofitted projectors for cruze. Maybe you can try to source it from abroad.

2. Upgrading fogs will definitely bring some difference but since these are fogs, the range wont be large and you can expect the same performance as the HL's.

3. I also wouldnt recommend this. You can try different brands, maybe Philips with the stock wattage. But there wont be considerable amount of difference.

4. This is one of the most discussed topics. HID's without projectors are not actually recommended since they blind oncoming traffic and much of the light is wasted since there's a lot of light scattered. But, people claim that when they use Philips, they find it better.

But the point to be noted. You said you wanted a white tinge but wants the fogs and HL to be same. Well, this wont be possible. Reason:
1) Philips HID's start from 6000k and this is pure white.
2) Else, you can try other brands and get the best color temp of 4300k - This is pure white with yellow tinge. But the stock fogs and this HID will also show difference. I use 4300k HIDs with projectors and there is a difference between these and fogs.

I would recommend you to go for HID's.
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Old 21st August 2010, 17:28   #4138
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If Toyota is using HID in its Altis without projectors then is it true its lights get scattered or it is not roadworthy and illegal i don't belive it there must be something more, Please any one who has got thorough knowledge of HID comment on this so that members who are willing to upgrade to HID need not go for additional expence on projectors if not needed.
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Old 21st August 2010, 18:08   #4139
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Originally Posted by sathyaprakash View Post
If Toyota is using HID in its Altis without projectors then is it true its lights get scattered or it is not roadworthy and illegal i don't belive it there must be something more, Please any one who has got thorough knowledge of HID comment on this so that members who are willing to upgrade to HID need not go for additional expence on projectors if not needed.
Yes, Altis use HID's only for low beam while normal halogens for High. Using HID's on low would be much of a problem, but using it in high is illegal (as per the book). Am not sure of the light performance of the Altis although I have seen them a couple of times. It is fitted with 4300k HID's.

There are mixed reactions when it comes to this particular topic - Are HID's good with or without Projectors?
Just browse a couple of pages back and you can see my ride's light output which are 4300k HID's running on projectors.

HID's are basically meant to be used only on Projectors. Projectors are used to project the light beam onto a particular area (Just like a torch). Unlike normal stock HL, the light wont be scattered.
Projectors will use maximum light emitted from the HID's while stock HL will scatter these since there isnt any source to project the light. So a lot of light is actually wasted.

But if you check this thread you can actually find many bhpians stating that branded HID's used on stock HL will actually do a great job. Philips is really good, but expensive. Also, Philips stopped manufacturing 4300k HIDs (Which is the best - for it's max light output). They now start from 6000k which is pure white. This is less effective than 4300k. Check out "Cochin Meet Thread". There is a comparison between mine (4300k with Projectors) and my friends car (6000k without projectors).

BTW, what's your ride?
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Old 21st August 2010, 18:32   #4140
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Does anyone has a pic of a Projection lights on a Scorpio? If so, can you please post it here.
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