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Old 17th July 2009, 14:45   #1726
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Originally Posted by Raccoon View Post
I guess I know the answer - dubious marketing!!
Dubious but very successful marketing, so much so that people tend to associate it as being a synthetic oil, when it is indeed a semi-synth!

Last edited by gpa : 17th July 2009 at 14:46.
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Old 17th July 2009, 15:53   #1727
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Thanks SGiitk sir, It clears my doubt. As my car is driven on weekend holiday trip and more on highways so instead of SM (synthetic) i will take API SL with OWS engine oil additive.
Shell Helix Super 15W-40 is for 900 Rs for 3 ltr from shell pump.
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Old 18th July 2009, 13:08   #1728
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Originally Posted by tsk1979 View Post
Castrol Edge turbodiesel is API-CI4 and exceeds the required specification of your car. You can go for it.
Cost for 4 liters should be around 2000rs
I heard that Castrol edge is not fully synthetic. Is that true? if yes which is the fully synthetic oil for DDiS and cost for the same?
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Old 19th July 2009, 09:08   #1729
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Dubious but very successful marketing, so much so that people tend to associate it as being a synthetic oil, when it is indeed a semi-synth!
I dont think Castrol are doing anything to mislead people into believing Magnatec is a synth oil. The fault is that of the customer who is more often than not lacks knowledge and makes assumptions based on either wrong inputs or taken for a ride by unscrupulous dealers.

Magnatec does the job really well for it's price. This is provided you get the genuine thing. As Raccoon points out counterfeits exist and you should buy from dealers you know and trust.

It was my favourite engine oil for a very long time. Used it for many years in our family cars and my Dad still does.

Rgds.
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Old 19th July 2009, 15:10   #1730
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Originally Posted by R2D2 View Post
The fault is that of the customer who is more often than not lacks knowledge and makes assumptions
Yup, it is these unscruplous dealers that tend to say that it is synthetic oil when customers are buying it. Castrol could come out with a line like Mobil 1's "The World's leading fully-synthetic motor oil" to help customers make the right choice.
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Old 19th July 2009, 15:56   #1731
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I heard that Castrol edge is not fully synthetic. Is that true? if yes which is the fully synthetic oil for DDiS and cost for the same?
It very likely is not a real fully synthetic product. If you ask me, go for it ONLY if its priced significantly lower than other fully synthetic products available like Shell or Mobil 1.

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Originally Posted by R2D2 View Post
I dont think Castrol are doing anything to mislead people into believing Magnatec is a synth oil. The fault is that of the customer who is more often than not lacks knowledge and makes assumptions based on either wrong inputs or taken for a ride by unscrupulous dealers.

Magnatec does the job really well for it's price. This is provided you get the genuine thing. As Raccoon points out counterfeits exist and you should buy from dealers you know and trust.

It was my favourite engine oil for a very long time. Used it for many years in our family cars and my Dad still does.

Rgds.
Castrol does border towards such tactics. But of course it is never done overtly. For eg. see the label on Magnatec. It says Synthetic technology. Now, to the uninitiated this can easily be a synonym for fully synthetic oil! In fact few years ago, my dad came back with a can saying he got fully synthetic oil!! Now if you look at it, it might not be technically wrong of Castrol to write Synthetic technology. Its very likely wont even be illegal (making a false claim). But just see how it works!!

Can give many examples, but I'll just give couple more. Many years ago they were branding an oil exclusively for Hero Honda (not with HH consent). And the grade was not at all what HH was recommending. But the average customer does not know about these things. He sees on the label that its recommended for all HH bikes, and uses it. Supervisors at the service centres also explicitly warned people to not use that particular brand.

Even currently the Power 1 brand for bikes does not even mention what viscosity it is! And yet they make a blanket claim that its recmmended for ALL modern bikes from Yamaha, TVS, HH, Honda, Bajaj, etc, etc. Why do they do this? Obviously so that they can sell that oil to ALL bike users. If they mentioned the truth, probably half the demand for that brand would die instantly.

Even otheriwse they give out the least tech info for their products. Just see their website. You wont find a single tech paramenter mentioned for any oil!

Its all about clever marketing... bordering on craftyness! Fact is most of their products are just average and yet overpriced.

For eg. consider Power 1 Racing. Its labelled as fully synthetic but as I hope we all know, it may very well not be (remember, they are NOT claiming which basestock they use... which in itself is fishy!) . Yet its priced the same as Motul 300V which is Ester based. And Ester based oils are supposed to be the most expensive to produce. Every single person who has used them both will say Motul blows away Power 1 Racing on every paramenter!

Fact is that Power 1 Racing still seems to be selling in substantial quantity! Why do people still fall for it?

Clever marketing!

Last edited by Raccoon : 19th July 2009 at 16:03.
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Old 19th July 2009, 19:11   #1732
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Originally Posted by srikant View Post
I heard that Castrol edge is not fully synthetic. Is that true? if yes which is the fully synthetic oil for DDiS and cost for the same?
Someone had a field day with your query!

Castrol EDGE is a proper synthetic. Race winning teams in the national championship use them and oil is so very crucial to winning. Using it inspite of it not being racing oil is itself credible to its performance.
Raccoon, I've said this before and I'll say it again. If you think its tactics, prove it.
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Old 19th July 2009, 19:50   #1733
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Originally Posted by Raccoon View Post
go for it ONLY if its priced significantly lower than other fully synthetic products available like Shell or Mobil 1.
I don't quite understand this logic
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Old 19th July 2009, 19:57   #1734
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Originally Posted by sgiitk View Post
I just cannot see how oil can make a difference to knocking! .........
I have a feeling that additiives are a no-no in crank case. On the other hand it may be useful in the gearbox!
Actually knocking was not quite the right word to describe it. More a sort of shuddering, esp at lower speeds. I never lug the engine, so this was quite inexplicable.
I agree with your pov on crank case additives. What do you recommend for the gearbox?
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Old 19th July 2009, 23:31   #1735
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Which would be the Optimal Engine oil for Santro 2002 1.1? i was thinking in the lines of Shell Helix Ultra 5W-40 is it fine to go for it?
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Old 19th July 2009, 23:36   #1736
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What do you recommend for the gearbox?
Usually your MASS will have an additive like 3M's gearbox oil additive which they will use if you ask for it. The only thing is that it might not be readily available as not many customers ask for it. So you'll have to check with them before you go for your service.

Else you can pick it up at a store like METRO and ask your MASS to add it in with the oil.
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Old 20th July 2009, 00:28   #1737
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Which would be the Optimal Engine oil for Santro 2002 1.1? i was thinking in the lines of Shell Helix Ultra 5W-40 is it fine to go for it?
Hyundai reccomends SAE 15W40 API SJ spec.

5W40 Shell Helix Ultra is SM grade and if you dont mind spending so much money on oil you can always use Helix ultra.
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Old 20th July 2009, 00:34   #1738
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@Silver Knight : So just in case i don't want to spend that much money and stick to the given norms which would be the better option Knight?
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Old 20th July 2009, 00:43   #1739
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Originally Posted by nitrous View Post
Someone had a field day with your query!

Castrol EDGE is a proper synthetic. Race winning teams in the national championship use them and oil is so very crucial to winning. Using it inspite of it not being racing oil is itself credible to its performance.
Raccoon, I've said this before and I'll say it again. If you think its tactics, prove it.
Then what was I trying to hint above? Anyway, I don't have anything personal against Castrol... lol! If you still want to patronise them in spite of having possibly better products to choose from, its entirely your call...

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Originally Posted by gpa View Post
I don't quite understand this logic
The logic is pretty simple. Edge may be a peudo synthetic. In fact it was Castrol which started this "trend" of labelling oils using hydroisomerized petroleum base stock as fully synthetic. Actually, saying fully synthetic without disclosing what basestock is actually used itself is fishy. And to be fair, this applies to other products labelled as fully synthetic also. Suggest you don't waste your money on expensive not-so-synthetic oils unless the oil company is disclosing what actually is in the bottle. Just saying that an oil has been race tested and all does not mean much in real world applications.

I believe this has been discussed before... so won't elaborate further.

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Originally Posted by Roy.S View Post
I agree with your pov on crank case additives. What do you recommend for the gearbox?
I would seriousy suggest you stay away from such additives. Oils and aftermarket additives just dont go together.

Last edited by Raccoon : 20th July 2009 at 00:45.
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Old 20th July 2009, 07:20   #1740
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Castrol EDGE is a proper synthetic
Then why dont they disclose its base stock ?

It may be a very good oil, possibly even better than a true synthetic, but the question is if it is a synthetic ?

Like they say, all that glitters is not necessarily gold.

Last edited by greenhorn : 20th July 2009 at 07:24.
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