ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

[akshay4587]

Originally Posted by R2D2

Simple arithmetic works here:

a) Cost of 4 ltrs of synth oil (say Mobil1) - Rs 4000/-
b) Cost of 4 ltrs mineral or semi synth - ~1200 (Castrol Magnatec) June 09 batch

Assuming a mfr recommended interval of 1 year/10K Kms, you could change the oil thrice over in a year for the cost of a synthetic fill and have a few hundred bucks left over. This is leaving environmental considerations aside.

OR, if I change mineral or semi synth oil at 6 month/5K kms interval I still save Rs 1600 on oil per annum. Not much in todays terms but these are tough times. Comon guys we all love our cars but lets not get carried away by synth. I'd have loved to use synth regularly had it been reasonably priced.

The choice is quite obvious for me at least.

Rgds,

A little correction here
Mobil1 4L can is for 2900 bucks

[Gansan]

I see from the manual of my Alto that even mineral oil change is recommended every 10,000 KM / one year mark only.

First (free) service (1000 KM/one month) - Oil & filter change.
Second (free) service (5000 KM/six months) - Oil inspection only
Third (free) service( 10,000 KM/One year)- Oil & filter change.
Fourth (paid) service(20,000 KM/Two years)- Oil & filter change
Fifth (paid) service(30,000KM/Three years)- Oil & filter change

BTW went to Shell bunk today to buy a 1 litre can of MGO to keep as standby (as usual MASS refused to sell it to me). Saw a 4 litre can of Shell Helix there. Costs Rs 4000.00. Has anyone used this brand?

[R2D2]

Originally Posted by akshay4587

A little correction here
Mobil1 4L can is for 2900 bucks

Uh uh...nopes. Checked last saturday 25/7. Rs 4000 for a 4 Litre Mobil 1 5W-50 can and 4200 for Castrol Edge 5W-40.

These are MH prices and may vary in Delhi (we're paying hell of a lot more in MH even for petrol/diesel when compared with Delhi) but certainly not by over 1K. How current is the price you are quoting?

Rgds,

[R2D2]

Originally Posted by Gansan

BTW went to Shell bunk today to buy a 1 litre can of MGO to keep as standby (as usual MASS refused to sell it to me). Saw a 4 litre can of Shell Helix there. Costs Rs 4000.00. Has anyone used this brand?

You must've seen Shell Helix Ultra. It is fully synth oil. People have used this brand here on TBHP. Search this thread for feedback.

Rgds,

[akshay4587]

Originally Posted by R2D2

Uh uh...nopes. Checked last saturday 25/7. Rs 4000 for a 4 Litre Mobil 1 5W-50 can and 4200 for Castrol Edge 5W-40.

These are MH prices and may vary in Delhi (we're paying hell of a lot more in MH even for petrol/diesel when compared with Delhi) but certainly not by over 1K. How current is the price you are quoting?

Rgds,

I bought it for 2850 15 days ago
print rate is 4200,but actual retail price is what i paid.
if someone is paying 4K for it
then i Have no words.

[R2D2]

Originally Posted by akshay4587

I bought it for 2850 15 days ago
print rate is 4200,but actual retail price is what i paid.
if someone is paying 4K for it
then i Have no words.

Wow! If printed price is 4200 and he's selling it for 2850 then you are lucky. I am speechless too. It this a case of something being too good to be true? Food for thought.

Rgds,

[akshay4587]

Originally Posted by R2D2

Wow! If printed price is 4200 and he's selling it for 2850 then you are lucky. I am speechless too. It this a case of something being too good to be true? Food for thought.

Rgds,

I confirmed this at 2 shops,got a quote of 2900 bucks at the other,and i guess he quoted similar figures for castrol oil too.
so i think its dealers down there who are earning a lot

[R2D2]

Originally Posted by akshay4587

so i think its dealers down there who are earning a lot

You're probably right, the dealers are ripping us off.

Either way I choose to go with OEM mineral multigrade oil at this time mainly coz my car's under warranty and followed by the price (at least in MH).

Cheers!

[amit_mechengg]

R2D2, you are not looking at right places in pune. Mobil 1 costs 3200 for a 4 litre can in pune.

[R2D2]

Originally Posted by amit_mechengg

R2D2, you are not looking at right places in pune. Mobil 1 costs 3200 for a 4 litre can in pune.

In that case you need to tell me where I can get the oil for Rs 3200/4 litres. Please point me in the right direction. PM me if you can.

I got this price whilst buying a 4 litre magnatec can for my Dad's Palio 1.6. Rs 4,000 printed on the Mobil-1 can so I thought it is nothing out of the ordinary.

Incidentally Rs 800/litre or 3200/4L is what I paid for Mobil-1 when I used it in my OHC back in 2004-05. Still have a 1 litre bottle left over, which I had bought for top ups. Thought the increase may be due to exchange rate, oil prices and the usual yada yada.

Cheers!

[amit_mechengg]

^^ gyani oil in nana peth, universal oil corporation in nana peth and anand motors at kalewadi phata near pimple saudagar.

infact the oil prices have decreased in international market. every lot coming to the dealer is having varying prices. mainly dealer margins on synthetics is very high.

for example last time i managed to procure Petronas syntium 3000 for 2200 rs.
then we got a petronas syntium 5000 for 2200rs for my friends swift.

and now yesterday when i went to enquire about the same oil at same place he says now he cannot afford below 2600rs.

[Sawyer]

Not to belabour the point here, but the fact is that synth oil costs about four times as much as a good brand mineral. This higher price for the synth, and the extended drain would only be usable in a 6 month period if one is doing long distances daily, allowing for the engine to be running most of the time at normal operating temperatures. For example, if I were to do 15k-20k in 6 months, the synthetic would make some sense, because for that running, a mineral would have to be changed at least once, maybe even twice, incurring the hassle of doing this, cost of oil filters etc. , to allow for the synth to start making sense.
But if running is in the region of 10k-15k in a year, then for half the cost of a synth changed annually, one could change the mineral oil every six months. And in the case of such running, the engine would actually be in better shape by the latter regime.
Again, most car manuals that I have come across do not recommend oil drain periods of more than 6 months in severe operating conditions. And for the most part, in most Indian cities, driving conditions are just that, even though we take them for granted as normal! The engine spends a large part of its working life coming up to optimum operating temperatures, not at them.
Of course, if one can afford to throw away the synth every 6 months, by all means! The oilcos will be happy, you will feel like you do after you take vitamins, and the engine will not be harmed either!
In these times, just thought I would place this perspective in front of people. A lot of what you pay for the synth is for the spot of sticker space on the F1 cars, quite honestly. In terms of extended drains it is indeed better than mineral oils, if one can keep it in the sump long enough. It will have no effect on how contaminants build up and do not get burnt off in an engine that has not come up to optimum temperatures, and it cannot cope with suspended contaminants a lot better than minerals either.
Finally, remember that API gives both kinds of oils the same performance grades. Which would indicate that both oils, freshly made, are equivalent in all respects.
Btw, Warren Buffett still refuses to wear branded clothes - he thinks that a supermarket brand shirt works just as well for him, and he refuses to be ripped off in paying brand premia.
Food for thought? I am pretty sure that this applies to the premium fuels as well btw. And to many things in other spheres of life.

[R2D2]

Originally Posted by amit_mechengg

^^ gyani oil in nana peth, universal oil corporation in nana peth and anand motors at kalewadi phata near pimple saudagar.

infact the oil prices have decreased in international market. every lot coming to the dealer is having varying prices. mainly dealer margins on synthetics is very high.

for example last time i managed to procure Petronas syntium 3000 for 2200 rs.
then we got a petronas syntium 5000 for 2200rs for my friends swift.

and now yesterday when i went to enquire about the same oil at same place he says now he cannot afford below 2600rs.

Thanks for those dealer names dude. Looks like dealers are the ones that decide the final price.

As I said my 1st and previous experience of buying synth was in 2004/05 for my OHC (with 6m/5K kms recommended drain intervals) once the warranty had expired. Havent really ventured into that area as I didnt think it worth the money. I am very particular about oil changes and would never extend drain intervals only to offset the cost of synth oil. Also oil prices have changed in the past 5 years. I used to pay approx Rs 41-42/litre of petrol in 2004.

We are all car lovers but then we need to let our wallets have say in purchases not get swayed by plain emotional hyperbole about 'wanting the best for my car'. This may be ok for people with deep pockets but not for most folks.

For the kind of running most of us put our cars thru (not applicable to people with sports and high end cars), mineral does the job well and cars are designed to run hundreds of thousands of kms or miles on plain ol mineral oil. Obviously you need to stick to the drain intervals and use good quality lubes. Sometimes the head must rule over the heart. And I have my noggin doing just that.

Yes, once again I say that I would love to use synth if it is reasonably priced in this country. Current prices are a rip off and they have the wrong viscosity grades to boot! So what does that get me? Not much I am afraid.

Rgds,

[R2D2]

Originally Posted by Sawyer

Not to belabour the point here, but the fact is that synth oil costs about four times as much as a good brand mineral.
=================
Food for thought? I am pretty sure that this applies to the premium fuels as well btw. And to many things in other spheres of life.

Absolutely. You said it.

[nitrous]

Two things:
1) Just because a caterham works as well, people don't stop buying Ferraris.
2) Synthetics cost only 2000-2500 bucks for an oil change. Not 4000 bucks!