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Old 29th May 2012, 11:34   #3451
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Default Re: ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

As per Mobil India Website (Mobil 1 Products), only the following ratings of engine oils are available in India.

Mobil 1 0W-40
Mobil 1 5W-50
Mobil Super 1000

Any idea how to get Mobil 1 5W-30? This is for my A-star.
If I am not able to source this grade, is it ok to use Mobil 1 0W-40?
Do I really need to switch to Mineral oil 5W30 if the correct grade Synthetic is not available?
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Old 29th May 2012, 13:18   #3452
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Default Re: ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

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Originally Posted by jinojohnt View Post
As per Mobil India Website (Mobil 1 Products), only the following ratings of engine oils are available in India.

Mobil 1 0W-40
Mobil 1 5W-50
Mobil Super 1000

Any idea how to get Mobil 1 5W-30? This is for my A-star.
If I am not able to source this grade, is it ok to use Mobil 1 0W-40?
Do I really need to switch to Mineral oil 5W30 if the correct grade Synthetic is not available?
If your car manual suggests 5W30, it is perfectly alright to use 0W40. As far as I know, there should not be any issues. Ask the A.S.S., I think they will also tell you the same thing. Ask them if they stock it, so in future you can always go back to them if you have any issues.

My manual recommends 20W40, and I am using Shell Helix Ultra 5W40. There are no problems, it is running perfectly fine.
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Old 29th May 2012, 14:41   #3453
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Default Re: ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

Guys,

Can you please recommend a dealer in Pune that provides Mobil at right price?

Thanks
+LT
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Old 29th May 2012, 14:51   #3454
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Default Re: ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

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Originally Posted by linuxtechie View Post
Guys,

Can you please recommend a dealer in Pune that provides Mobil at right price?

Thanks
+LT
If you are enthu enough to go to Chinchwad, then you can get any Mobil lubricant from Raka Oil Company. He is the authorized distributor for Pune region. You will not get a better price elsewhere.

Lubricants - Mobil lubricants, Industrial lubricants, Automotive lubricants, Cutting oil, Hydraulic Oil, India

Cheers,
Vikram
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Old 29th May 2012, 15:04   #3455
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Default Re: ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

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Originally Posted by swarnava.m View Post
If your car manual suggests 5W30, it is perfectly alright to use 0W40. As far as I know, there should not be any issues. Ask the A.S.S., I think they will also tell you the same thing.
Thanks, but I remember reading in this thread that W30 is thinner than W40. Wondering whether a change to (synthetic) W40 would do more harm than good.

Different MASS gave different opinions, and one MASS that I talked to was more eager to sell their oil, so I don't want to take them for granted.
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Old 29th May 2012, 15:20   #3456
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Default Re: ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

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Originally Posted by jinojohnt View Post
Thanks, but I remember reading in this thread that W30 is thinner than W40. Wondering whether a change to (synthetic) W40 would do more harm than good.

Different MASS gave different opinions, and one MASS that I talked to was more eager to sell their oil, so I don't want to take them for granted.
At the rist of repeating myself the zillionth time since member do not want to look back. Oil is rated as aaWbb. aa is the viscosity of the cold oil. This defines how fast it circulates, and may be critical only in the high himalayas. W stands for winter Grade. In fact the full first part is aaW, aa Winter Grade. bb is the hot oil. This is critical for all of us. As long aaW is equal or less than the specs and bb equal or more than the specs you are Ok.

Now there is also the oil quality which for Petrol engine oils is API-Sx and for Diesels API-Cy. Modern standards only approve of SJ, SL, SM and SN. SJ is obsolescent. As the rating moves up the oil can replace any of the earlier oils. SN is invariably Synthetic. SM can be synth, semi-synth or even mineral. SL is mostly mineral as is SJ. The ratings specified by many manufacturers as SG. This is now obsolete. Our dinosaurs (OMC-PSUs) may be the only ones still making it.

For Diesels I hope someone adds a note as to the current grades.

One more point: The multi-grade oil is the lower spec (aaW) with viscosity improvers which prevent it from getting thinner than bb when hot. As for 0 it is like a zero power bulb, not real zero. I will just say <5. Also, once a year oil chnages came in with API-SF!
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Old 29th May 2012, 16:12   #3457
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Default Re: ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

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Originally Posted by sgiitk View Post
bb is the hot oil. This is critical for all of us. As long aaW is equal or less than the specs and bb equal or more than the specs you are Ok.
Thanks so much for your patience, here is the question that I really wanted to ask:
My Alto user manual suggests 20W40.
In the Mobil Shop, I see two synthetic grades, 0W40 and 5W50. Both of these grades fit in the above logic given by you. Which is a better choice (Assuming W40 is thinner than W50)?
MASS is trying to scare me saying 5W50 is bad for my engine in this case because this oil grade is thicker at high temparatures.

Last edited by jinojohnt : 29th May 2012 at 16:15.
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Old 29th May 2012, 17:38   #3458
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Default Re: ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

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At the rist of repeating myself the zillionth time since member do not want to look back. Oil is rated as aaWbb...
Yes.. I can remember reading this same thing posted by you and others on this thread. However, I have a different query. (and i just hope this has not been discussed before).

As given above, oil is aaWbb. If we go down too much on the aa value, eg. If the manual recommends 20wX and we use 0WX, is it possible that since the oil we are using is comparitively a lot thinner, the oil pump might not be able to circulate the oil properly throughout the engine? This is because the pump is designed for the grade that the manual suggests, so there could be a possibility that it is not powerful enough for an oil with much lower viscosity?

I ask this mainly because I read this phenomenon on a web page that explains engine oils. So I would like to know the views of members on this topic..

Quote:
Originally Posted by jinojohnt View Post
Thanks so much for your patience, here is the question that I really wanted to ask:
My Alto user manual suggests 20W40.
In the Mobil Shop, I see two synthetic grades, 0W40 and 5W50. Both of these grades fit in the above logic given by you. Which is a better choice (Assuming W40 is thinner than W50)?
MASS is trying to scare me saying 5W50 is bad for my engine in this case because this oil grade is thicker at high temparatures.
I do not know about 5W50, but I am using 5W40 shell helix ultra in my Alto which suggests 20W40.. And there are no issues.

Last edited by swarnava.m : 29th May 2012 at 17:42.
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Old 30th May 2012, 09:19   #3459
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Default Re: ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

Quote:
Originally Posted by jinojohnt View Post
Thanks so much for your patience, here is the question that I really wanted to ask:
My Alto user manual suggests 20W40.
In the Mobil Shop, I see two synthetic grades, 0W40 and 5W50.
Quote:
Originally Posted by swarnava.m View Post
Yes.. I can remember reading this same thing posted by you and others on this thread. However, I have a different query. (and i just hope this has not been discussed before).

As given above, oil is aaWbb. If we go down too much on the aa value, eg. If the manual recommends 20wX and we use 0WX, is it possible that since the oil we are using is comparatively a lot thinner, the oil pump might not be able to circulate the oil properly throughout the engine? This is because the pump is designed for the grade that the manual suggests, so there could be a possibility that it is not powerful enough for an oil with much lower viscosity? ....

I do not know about 5W50, but I am using 5W40 shell helix ultra in my Alto which suggests 20W40.. And there are no issues.
Both your queries are very similar. Modern pumps can circulate 0W or 5W with no sweat. The Maruti SM is just trying to scare you.

As long as you are equal or higher than the 'bb' value specified there is no sweat. So my Santro specifies 20W40 and I use 10W40 and do not think about it. My Civic allows 10W30 so I have used 0W40 and am now using 0W30.

Why this switch. two reasons:
1. Idemitsu 0W30 costs about 1k less than Mobil1 for 4l.
2. Theoretically 0W40 should consume more fuel than 0W30, but I will be surprised if it is even a 1% difference.

Also, remember very few engines rev about 6000rpm (Honda is an exception). So any decent oil (of the right spec) is a massive overkill. Remember the FIAT 128 in 1974 (max oil was API-SF then) went up to 8300rpm!

Quite often 'aa' is specified higher to accommodate the 'sarkari' oil, since they may not have a higher range available, which in any case will cost more..

If you have not noticed the Santro is on a Semi-synth while the Civic runs a synth. Both are on a annual oil change schedule.

Watch the 'bb'and let the lower end go lower with no sweat. In a few minutes this becomes irrrelevant, as the oil gets warm.

A piece of warning, old Maruti engines asked for SAE40 while the new (K-series) engines are happy with SAE30. Many MA$$es are just stocking and filling the latter! It may be similar with the Hyundai Epsilon and Kappa engines.
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Old 30th May 2012, 10:38   #3460
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Default Re: ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

Quote:
Originally Posted by jinojohnt View Post
Thanks so much for your patience, here is the question that I really wanted to ask:
My Alto user manual suggests 20W40.
In the Mobil Shop, I see two synthetic grades, 0W40 and 5W50. Both of these grades fit in the above logic given by you. Which is a better choice (Assuming W40 is thinner than W50)?
MASS is trying to scare me saying 5W50 is bad for my engine in this case because this oil grade is thicker at high temparatures.
Go for Mobil 0W40, don't use 5W50 it will make the engine sluggish. I was using 0W40 in my Astar till it got sold. If you can get 0W30 oil then that is safe to use as well.

I have a Swift K series now, i'm changin the oil to Mobil 0W40 or 0W30 Idemitsu from Honda. Mobil's xW30 isn't available lcaly last time i checked, but if you happen to source it let me know too.
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Old 30th May 2012, 10:52   #3461
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Default Re: ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

If it is the old M800 block I think SAE40 is required. AStar is the new K-series and is quite happy with SAE30. I do not agree that 5W50 will make the engine sluggish. I think you may not even notice the difference.
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Old 30th May 2012, 10:57   #3462
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Default Re: ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

^^ I agree with sgiitk here. I have also used the 20W50 in the 800cc Alto without issues in the Delhi summers. If there is any difference at all, it is only marginal & hardly noticeable.
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Old 30th May 2012, 12:00   #3463
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Default Re: ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

Quote:
Originally Posted by sgiitk View Post
Both your queries are very similar. Modern pumps can circulate 0W or 5W with no sweat. The Maruti SM is just trying to scare you.

As long as you are equal or higher than the 'bb' value specified there is no sweat. So my Santro specifies 20W40 and I use 10W40 and do not think about it. My Civic allows 10W30 so I have used 0W40 and am now using 0W30...
Thanks.. Now that's a lot of new information.

So I am using 5W40 Shell Helix Ultra in my Alto 1.1 2003. So this is not an issue of worry right?
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Old 30th May 2012, 12:46   #3464
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Default Re: ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

So long as we stick to oils that are = / < aa and = / > bb, and are also = / > the API specification (SG,SL,etc), no issues.

Holds good for any brand, any model car.

Last edited by Gansan : 30th May 2012 at 12:47.
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Old 4th June 2012, 14:28   #3465
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Default Re: ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

Bought Mobil1 Fully Synthetic 5w-50 for 3500/- from JK Automoblies JC road Bangalore, he was also selling Shell Helix Ultra 5w-40 for 3100/- thought it might be useful for the folks here.

Cheers!
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