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Old 4th July 2012, 12:00   #3511
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Default Re: ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

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Originally Posted by arun_josie View Post
Is engine flush a mandatory thing to do while changing the oil from mineral to synthetic? Mine is a Dzire DDiS engine. @20K I moved from mineral to synthetic(OW40-Mobil1) without a engine flush. Yesterday one of my friend was saying that engine flush is required. When I did a search in this thread i see mixed response for this.
In any half-clean engine flush is not required. I moved from Normal/Semi to Fully synth and back in my Esteem which I had from 1997 to 2005. The chap I sold it to clocked up in excess of 400,000 km before he sold it. The engine was still sound though imho a bit down on power.
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Old 4th July 2012, 12:05   #3512
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Default Re: ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

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Originally Posted by arun_josie View Post
Is engine flush a mandatory thing to do while changing the oil from mineral to synthetic? Mine is a Dzire DDiS engine. @20K I moved from mineral to synthetic(OW40-Mobil1) without a engine flush. Yesterday one of my friend was saying that engine flush is required. When I did a search in this thread i see mixed response for this.
This is a very pertinent question - engine flushes are not required when you shift from mineral to synthetic. The synthetic oil has all the detergents and additives required to flush out any sludge. Just makes sure that you adhere to oil changes at intervals that your car manufacturer prescribes. A regular oil change is all that is required to maintain engine cleanliness.

Using an engine flush has issues and risks. I've yet to come across any car manufacturer recommending a flush at ANY mileage interval. So, if someone knows of a car manufacturer prescribing this treatment for their engines please point me to that site/documentation.
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Old 4th July 2012, 17:46   #3513
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Default Re: ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

Thanks sgiitk and R2D2 for the information. In my case if Maruti has recommended engine flush then definitely the Service station will not miss to flush the engine because they charge for that. Any ways I will check with MASS once again.

Regarding the oil change interval, as per the manual and MASS its 10K KMs. But I have seen people changing at 15K Kms as well, for Synthetic Oil.
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Old 4th July 2012, 18:04   #3514
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Default Re: ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

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Originally Posted by arun_josie View Post
Thanks sgiitk and R2D2 for the information. In my case if Maruti has recommended engine flush then definitely the Service station will not miss to flush the engine because they charge for that. Any ways I will check with MASS once again.

Regarding the oil change interval, as per the manual and MASS its 10K KMs. But I have seen people changing at 15K Kms as well, for Synthetic Oil.
Some years ago, my father gave his Palio 1.6L to an auth. service centre who promptly suggested flushing the engine as it had done around 40K kms. Guess what? They charged him some Rs 500-600 including labour for it (can't remember exact amount since its been a while now) and I found very little difference in the engine after the flush AND an oil change. I would attribute the little improvement to the engine oil..not the flush. I told my Dad he was ripped off. This is a habit that most A.S.S are into for making extra money.

As your dealer to show you where in the service manual or the owners manual a flush at a particular mileage interval is prescribed. As mentioned in my earlier post I haven't heard of a mfr prescribing this...ever. Happy to be proven wrong. I use synth oil and my car's mfr doesn't recommend a flush at all either in India or other countries.

Your car's oil change interval must be 10K kms/12 months, right? It's the same as my car. You can push synthetic to 15K. But what is the reason to do it? Honestly, if owners switch to synthetic to extend oil change intervals they are barking up the wrong tree. Synthetics are to be drained at the same interval as mineral. The exception are some long drain synthetics created for this purpose. What a synthetic oil does is affords much superior protection and cleanliness for the engine during its tenure in the sump. Most people can discern the difference after switching over to synthetic.
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Old 4th July 2012, 18:17   #3515
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Default Re: ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

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Originally Posted by arun_josie View Post
Thanks sgiitk and R2D2 for the information. In my case if Maruti has recommended engine flush then definitely the Service station will not miss to flush the engine because they charge for that. Any ways I will check with MASS once again.

Regarding the oil change interval, as per the manual and MASS its 10K KMs. But I have seen people changing at 15K Kms as well, for Synthetic Oil.
There is a rider once in 12 months. So you can stretch a synth to 15k or even 20k provided you stick with the time limit. All this only after the warranty is over!
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Old 4th July 2012, 21:13   #3516
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Default Re: ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

It is a service outlet and if they do not recommend a product why would the customer bother to spend money on something that he has no idea about. 999 people out of a 1000 will go along just because the MASS or any other A.S.S. says so.

First they will flush and scrape up a perfectly good engine followed by a recommendation for a rebuilt a few thousand kilometers later.

At the end of the day it is just a service center and not the Supreme Court, you do not have to adhere to any of their utterances. It is your vehicle & your money hence your decision.


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Originally Posted by arun_josie View Post
In my case if Maruti has recommended engine flush then definitely the Service station will not miss to flush the engine because they charge for that. Any ways I will check with MASS once again
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Old 13th July 2012, 22:31   #3517
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Default Re: ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

I checked with my Service adviser in MASS today and he confirmed that engine flush is not required while moving from mineral to synthetic oil. Also, he said engine flush is done only based on customer request.
Regarding the Oil change interval he asked me to stick to 10K Kms as recommended by Maruti.

Thanks guys for the information.
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Old 14th July 2012, 18:43   #3518
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Default Re: ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

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Originally Posted by arun_josie View Post
..he confirmed that engine flush is not required while moving from mineral to synthetic oil. Also, he said engine flush is done only based on customer request...he asked me to stick to 10K Kms as recommended by Maruti.

Thanks guys for the information.
Hey you're welcome buddy. I think the SA has given you sensible advice. Please don't waste money on needless 'treatments' and procedures. Change oil at recommended intervals or earlier and your engine will purr and last a long time.
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Old 14th July 2012, 23:16   #3519
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Default Re: ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

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Originally Posted by sgiitk View Post
In any half-clean engine flush is not required. I moved from Normal/Semi to Fully synth and back in my Esteem which I had from 1997 to 2005. The chap I sold it to clocked up in excess of 400,000 km before he sold it. The engine was still sound though imho a bit down on power.
You switched back to mineral from synthetic? I thought that was not recommended?

On a second thought, any specific reason why you did that?
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Old 15th July 2012, 18:39   #3520
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Default Re: ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

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Originally Posted by swarnava.m View Post
You switched back to mineral from synthetic? I thought that was not recommended?

On a second thought, any specific reason why you did that?
I do not see how the engine knows what oil is put in. Al long as the viscosity is fine, no damage done. Why is simple, around 1998 or so Synth was not easily available, and I saw no advantage in paying Rs.1400 for a canister. So it was back to GTX.
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Old 26th July 2012, 17:58   #3521
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Default Re: ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

I had switched to semi-synthetic (Castrol Magnatec) in my WagonR around 6 months ago. For the first time in 6 years with this car, I found leakage of oil happening (in very minute quantity). The dipstick level had reached minimum and yesterday, I topped up with 1 liter.
My question is: could the leakage be due to the change of oil type? Or is it just ageing of the rubber seals?
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Old 26th July 2012, 18:24   #3522
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Default Re: ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

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Originally Posted by anuragn View Post
I had switched to semi-synthetic (Castrol Magnatec) in my WagonR around 6 months ago. For the first time in 6 years with this car, I found leakage of oil happening (in very minute quantity). The dipstick level had reached minimum and yesterday, I topped up with 1 liter.
My question is: could the leakage be due to the change of oil type? Or is it just ageing of the rubber seals?
Oil seals are pretty hardy, normally made of synthetic rubber compound, and an oil type change should not affect them.

For it to leak about 1 litre of oil in 6 months I'd suspect a slow leak from

a) Oil filter - not torqued to specs, or oil filter gasket not seated.
b) Drain plug - not torqued to specs or washer missing

Can you inspect the car and check where the leakage is visible? Over 6 months of leakage you'd find a lot of dust and oil stuck to that area.

PS - also check the floor of the garage or on the road where you park for tell tale oil drops. That gives an indication of where the leakage is.

PPS - I assume your engine isn't consuming the oil. How many kms have you done in the 6 months since the oil change?

Last edited by R2D2 : 26th July 2012 at 18:30. Reason: PS and PPS
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Old 26th July 2012, 21:22   #3523
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Default Re: ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

Can we have a list of manufacturers using synthetic oil (or semi-synthetic or mineral) in their cars along with approximate cost of oil per litre.

Eg.

Manufacturer :VW (Skoda)
Cars : All cars
Oil Type : Full Synthtic
Cost of Oil : approx. Rs. 950 per litre


Manufacturer : Hyundai
Cars : i20 D, Verna D,
Oil Type : Semi Synthtic
Cost of Oil : approx. Rs. 250 per litre


Manufacturer : FIAT
Cars : Punto D, Linea D
Oil Type : Full Synthtic
Cost of Oil : approx. Rs. 600 per litre

Similarly for other mainstream manufacturers like Toyota, Ford etc.
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Old 26th July 2012, 21:27   #3524
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Default Synthetic Oil for Fluidic Verna

Hi All,

My one year old Verna 1.6 Diesel is nearing the 20k service date and I'm planning a shift to fully synthetic. My yearly drive pattern comprises of 8k city km and approximately 10k highway km. I live in Bangalore.

I've been researching and feel its agreed upon here that Delvac 1 would be my best bet. What's the per litre cost and also, can someone suggest me the best place in bangalore to buy these?

Does anybody have different suggestions? If you feel I should stick to mineral oil, I'm keen to hear your thoughts as well. I try and change the oil every 5-7k km even thought the manufacturer suggests 10k intervals.

Thanks a ton and looking forward to your help!

Tassem.

Last edited by Tassem : 26th July 2012 at 21:43.
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Old 26th July 2012, 21:59   #3525
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Default Re: Synthetic Oil for Fluidic Verna

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Originally Posted by Tassem View Post
If you feel I should stick to mineral oil, I'm keen to hear your thoughts as well. I try and change the oil every 5-7k km even thought the manufacturer suggests 10k intervals.
If you ask an old fashioned guy like me, I'd advise you to stick to a good quality mineral oil [there are plenty around], specially with an oil change interval of 5-7k kms.

Assuming the Verna takes 5 litres, an engine oil change with Delvac 1 @ Rs.650-700/litre would cost you Rs.3250 [minimum]. OTOH, if you use a good quality mineral oil, at maybe Rs.275/litre, it would cost you Rs.1375. So, basically, you are getting almost 3 mineral oil changes in the price of one synth oil change.

You can use the savings to fill up your Verna's tank and go on a nice looong trip

Cheers,
Vikram
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