ARTICLE: Synthetic oil vs Mineral oil

[johy]

Thanks folks,

All I could lay my hands on here is Shell Helix Ultra 15W 50. I have used it after engine flush. Nice smooth feeling now.

I think the Mobil1 is better? But very difficult to get.

[luvjascha]

Do all petrol vehicles have the 5W-50 grade oil? If so, then I'd have to look for products with the same grade, and something like Castrol Magnatec, which comes only in 10W-40, would be no good, correct?

Do the rules that apply to running synthetic oils apply to semi-synthetic oils as well? For instance, just as running synthetic during the initial running-in period is not recommended, and using an engine flush before switching from conventional to synthetic oil, do these also hold true for semi-synthetic oils?

How often is oil change recommended for petrol vehicles - every 5K / 6K / 7.5K km or 5 /6 months, whichever comes earlier?

What is the approximate price difference between mineral, semi-synthetic and synthetic oils?

[luvjascha]

Is it acceptable to run semi-synthetic oil on the very first service of a new vehicle?

[johy]

Originally Posted by luvjascha

Do all petrol vehicles have the 5W-50 grade oil? If so, then I'd have to look for products with the same grade, and something like Castrol Magnatec, which comes only in 10W-40, would be no good, correct?

I think all modern petrol cars can use 5W-50 grade oil without any issues. Castrol Magnatec, being semi-synthetic, is supposed to be better than mineral (after the run-in period of your engine). I would prefer it over the standard MGO (Maruti ) mineral oil. But I would prefer synthetic over Magnatec after 10,000 kms are clocked on a new engine.

Originally Posted by luvjascha

Do the rules that apply to running synthetic oils apply to semi-synthetic oils as well? For instance, just as running synthetic during the initial running-in period is not recommended, and using an engine flush before switching from conventional to synthetic oil, do these also hold true for semi-synthetic oils?

I am not quite sure, but I think it is okay to change engine oil from mineral to semisynthetic without engine flush. But I think one should flush the engine when moving from mineral or semisynthetic to synthetic.

Originally Posted by luvjascha

How often is oil change recommended for petrol vehicles - every 5K / 6K / 7.5K km or 5 /6 months, whichever comes earlier?

Follow the manual on this one. First change at first service of 1000 km/1month (or as the manual says), whichever is earlier. Synthetics , 10000 kms will be fine, some will recommend 12000 kms.

Originally Posted by luvjascha

What is the approximate price difference between mineral, semi-synthetic and synthetic oils?

Mineral: MGO (Maruti) 400 bucks for 2 liters, or 800 bucks for 4 liters.
Semisynthetic : Magnatec ?1500/- for 4 liters ? (not quite sure).
Synthetic: 600 to 800 (or more) per liter depending on the brand, availability, etc.

Originally Posted by luvjascha

Is it acceptable to run semi-synthetic oil on the very first service of a new vehicle?

Not sure. When I asked for semisynthetic on my first service, they asked to wait for something like 5000 kms I Think.

[nitrous]

Castrol Magnatec costs around Rs.1000 for a four litre can.

[luvjascha]

Originally Posted by johy

But I would prefer synthetic over Magnatec after 10,000 kms are clocked on a new engine

Are monthly running and driving style, factors in determining whether or not to use synthetic oils? My monthly running is very low, and am a sedate driver.

Originally Posted by johy

When I asked for semisynthetic on my first service, they asked to wait for something like 5000 kms I Think.

I am trying to understand something here. Does only the odometer reading dictate when to run the vehicle on semi-synthetic and synthetic oils?
Because in my case, because of low monthly running, chances are good that I might end up having to follow the 'time period rule' for oil changes rather than odometer reading. I wouldn't be too surprised if I clocked a little over 1K km between services!

[anjan_c2007]

Castrol Magnatec is the best engine oil in its class I feel.For the last one year that I have been using it ,its a class apart.
But at the same time spurious oils are proliferating in every market and its a tough job identifying fake and spurious from the genuine ones. Even many dealers are be fooled as they candidly admit. e mail for Castrol is
[FONT=&quot]ContactUs@BP.com.[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Mr Rajan P Krishnan is their contact person. Castrol needs to salvage its reputation and get surprise checks conducted for testing the genuineness of their motor oils.No way letting go the "adulteration experts" who are playing with the reputation [/FONT]
After writing to Castrol their engineer contacted me after the website complaint dated 10th Nov 2007, lodged for spurious Castrol products. He said that the complaint has reached the top management and also the Head of Operations for 48 countries that he controls.They are continuously on the job and are committed to each customer's genuine Castrol product requirements. He said that it is always advisable to contact the local Castrol company office /representatives to know the distributor/dealers who sell only genuine products.He stressed upon the fact that a little bit of care will ensure that customers will get only genuine products. Castrol according to him conducts surprise checks periodically and nabs producers of counterfeit products. So dudes if you love your machines do be careful about the genuineness of oils being used. That takes only a little bit of effort.
I requested him to please supply my requirement from their company depot. Thankfully I have had my yearly quota from them and hopefully now soon will again contact them to get more.

[johy]

Originally Posted by luvjascha

Are monthly running and driving style, factors in determining whether or not to use synthetic oils? My monthly running is very low, and am a sedate driver.

I think you should go for synthetics if you want your engine to run smoother after around 10k on the odo, irrespective of how long that took.

Originally Posted by luvjascha

I am trying to understand something here. Does only the odometer reading dictate when to run the vehicle on semi-synthetic and synthetic oils?
Because in my case, because of low monthly running, chances are good that I might end up having to follow the 'time period rule' for oil changes rather than odometer reading. I wouldn't be too surprised if I clocked a little over 1K km between services!

My running is little as well (~300 km/month). I am mostly sedate (except when I am the only one in the car - when I like to rev it - and those are the times I feel the car has become smoother than before, much smoother) driver.

I have your same doubts though. My reading of the situation was like if it says 10000 kms or 1 year (whichever is earlier), then I would probably be following the time-period rule for this car rather than the kms clocked.

Q - Would the lubricant properties be diminished over time (say 24 months), even if the car did not run much?

[luvjascha]

Originally Posted by johy

My running is little as well (~300 km/month)

Q - Would the lubricant properties be diminished over time (say 24 months), even if the car did not run much?

My monthly running is very close to yours. How much have you clocked till date, and what does your vehicle's manual say about how often oil changes are required? I'm also curious about the odometer reading when you had your first few free services, because of your low running.

And yes, you've asked a good question!

[luvjascha]

Originally Posted by lohithrao

Johy, Dont worry about the grade!
you can go for Castrol Magnetec which is 10W-40 or sny synthetic which are bien discussed here...most of them are 5W-40

The guy said that the recommended grade for his vehicle is 20W40.
The very first post in this thread advises that the choice of engine oil should be based on the grade the manufacturer recommends. If the owner’s manual suggests a 10W–40 grade oil, make certain that you use that only.

How then can you explain suggesting a different grade?

[luvjascha]

Originally Posted by GTO

No synthetics during the running-in period: Wear and tear is actually good for a new engine. Synthetic oil, with its superior lubricating properties, hinders the running-in process and is best used only after 10,000 – 15,000 km

What is the ideal odometer reading before switching from mineral to synthetic?

Originally Posted by GTO

The right grade: It is vital that you choose your engine oil based on the grade your manufacturer recommends. If your owner’s manual suggests a 10W–40 grade oil, make certain that you use that only

Does this mean that oil grades such as 20W40, 5W40, etc. is not recommended and should be avoided?

Originally Posted by GTO

The right filter: It is surprising how many counterfeit auto parts are on the market. Use only high-quality OEM oil filters, preferably bought from authorized service stations. You must change your oil filter with every oil change

Is a fuel filter and air filter change also required with every oil change? If no, when is their change recommended?

[Eddy]

Originally Posted by Eddy

My service center uses Mobil Delvac Super 1300 15W40. It retails for around 200 bucks a litre and I change it every 5000 km.

How is this oil for my Swift VDI ? I change it at every 5000 kms.

Is there a better oil available at more or less a similar price that will serve my needs better, considering the extreme temperatures of Delhi and my monthly running of 2200 kms ?

Originally Posted by nitrous

Perfect. Stick to this oil and change interval.

I have a situation here. Am almost at 25k for my Swift Diesesl VDI and its time for an oil change. Now, for some reason I can't go to my regular service station which is 40kms from my place.

The MASS's near my place all use Servo engine oil.

What is my next best option in terms of brand ? Is Servo any good ?

Is the grade 15W40 fine considering the Delhi temperatures ?

[muralisk]

Some gyan:

SYNTHETIC vs. MINERAL (battle of the advertisers)

The differences between these types of oils are all in the molecular makeup. Synthetic oil has a very consistent molecule size which gives the oil very good and consistent properties. Mineral oil being a product of nature has lots of different sized molecules in its makeup. The advantage of synthetic is that it potentially has a more stable suite of properties that can be tailored to a wider range of applications. This is why you can now find oils that can cover huge viscosity ranges such as 15W40 and even OW30! There are definite advantages to this ability but careful consideration of application is necessary.

To review some of the oil jargon let's look at what the numbers and letters mean that I just referred to. Viscosity is determined by measuring the flow properties at a fixed temperature. A base number is set as standard then relative flow numbers are assigned to describe the relative viscosity of the oil being measured. The lower the number the "lighter" the oil is. That means it flows much easier at the same temperature than one with a higher viscosity rating. There are single viscosity oils so it is simple to understand that 10 weight oil flows easier than a 30 weight oil under that same temperature circumstances. Multigrade oil is what has become possible due to additive packages and has been further enhanced by synthetic oils. A number such as 10 W 30 means that the oil has variable properties between this range of viscosities. The best thing about this is that it can compensate (within its designed capability) for the negative effects of temperature on viscosity. High temperatures drive viscosities down but multigrade oils have the ability, due to their additives, to compensate. So back to our 10 W 30 example. The 10 means that it has the viscosity (flow properties) of a single grade 10 weight oil at LOW temperatures. The "W" following the first number is the convention that verifies this tested ability. The last number is the viscosity rating at HIGH temperatures. The working temperature range is approximately between 0 and 100 degrees Celsius.Things go out of whack above and below. Above 100 degrees C. the viscosity begins to lower as it would with single grade oil. The viscosity can be lowered by as much as 50% for higher than 100 deg. C temperatures.

You need "thinner' oils like 10 or multigrade with 5W or 10W when the engine temperature is low particularly here in Canada where we can see quite cold temperatures even in good driving months, never mind winter. This low viscosity allows the engine to receive vital lubrication. Imagine trying to pump grease versus olive oil. A 30, or worse, a 50 weight oil would look, feel and work just like grease at 0 degrees Celsius. Your engine will suffer. Olive oil would in fact work better under these conditions, but not for long!

The need to have good lubricating properties at low temperatures but then have good lubricating properties at high temperatures is what has stimulated the development of multi grade oils. So our 10 W 30 has the easy flowing viscosity of a 10 weight oil when cold and then the lubricating properties of 30 weight oil when it is hot. Just what we need in a country like ours where the temperatures are widely variable at nearly anytime of the year.

Engine design has a lot to do with which grade and which type of oil you should choose. If the engine was designed to work with a single grade mineral oil with its multi sized molecules and low or high single grade viscosities then using something "better" may not have any significant benefits. If however your engine is designed to exploit the benefits of multi grade fully synthetic oil then that is exactly what you should be using. Therefore putting new multi viscosity synthetic oil in your old iron horse could present a problem and vice versa.

Advertisers are not engine designers. They publish brochures to make people think that they are getting better value or in some case something for nothing. Go by the manufacturers recommendations. They are the ones who have designed and extensively tested the engine and know what it needs.


Source: Lubrication

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[nitrous]

Please don't use oil of standard less than API-CH4.
I don't think Servo has a product that is CH4+.
I would suggest you find the biggest oil distributor in ur area and source Castrol GTX diesel 15W40(API-CI4) or Mobil Delvac MX 15W40 (CI4)

[Eddy]

At the cost of repetition and apologies for that, how is 15W40 related to temperatures and hence the other part of my question. Is it good for Delhi conditions ?