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Old 2nd May 2011, 00:23   #1
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Default RE ThunderBird Silencer Blunder !?

Hello People,

I would like your advice on a few things for my 2004 Model Re Thunderbird.

It was my brothers bike and it was officially handed over to me at 28k kilometers in 2007. From then on till late 2009 (had to get the bore changed as it was seized after some enthusiastic riding on a long trip) it didnt require any big repairs or undue times in workshops - all in all it was a no problem bike considered the notorious reputation of an Enfield.

But off late it has been troubling a lot,

1) It literally caused mayhem (well to me atleast) when it just stuck up and turned off when i was on a House search mission in an unknown locality, luckily a friends friend came to rescue and had to leave the bike there for a couple of days as the RE mechanics couldnt figure out whats wrong (They checked everything from clutch casing to On-Off switch and sparkplugs to carbs and found the culprit to be the Clucth coils placement ) and finally it started and on the way home it just died on me :( . This time the culprit was found to be electrical failure and half of the wiring and electrical parts had to be changed.

2) My brother changed the stock silencer to an after market one (attaching the pics ) the problem that i have been having on it recently is the bike doesnt have enough power in 1st gear to go up a slight slope with two persons on it (which it used to well before) to better phrase it- it seems to me that there isnt enough low end torque or for that matter enough torque as most of the times its feeling out of breath.

3) The silencer allways had a knack of misfiring when a gear is lowered at a higher speed and there isnt any beat or firing to the silencer its just a loud roaring one.

My queries are i would like to know if its ordinary to change so many parts on a bike after 6 years of use and also Any good Pvt mechanics other than RE who can teach me how to Diy a few simple things on my bike.

And also what silencer should i use to restore the my bike to its original running condition and i would like to know whats the difference between a Goldie and Indoori silencer.

Thank You
Sidhu
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Old 2nd May 2011, 00:41   #2
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Default Re: RE ThunderBird Silencer Blunder !?

OK from the pics i can see that the muffler isnt properly sticking to the exhaust pipe. (the engine seems to be an AVL one)

Secondly or rather do it first, remove this muffler as soon as possible and sell it to junk, your main culprit for the breathlessness is silencer. I believe this silencer was put for the sound, but ironically the misfit is causing the roar that u mentioned which can be really annoying when it doesn't sound right.

Get an OE bullet standard silencer, fit it properly with the exhaust pipe and see to it that the gap is well fit.

Then get your tappets set as loosening of the tappets also causes the bike to loose its low end torque.

Believe me this will drastically improve the performance.

Your first point stated there was a wiring problem, this primarily "may be" due to rats (i know this sounds funny but rats do have the knack of nibbling off the wiring's, OK most of the wiring's are hidden inside the chassis but the exposed wires are a treat to mice). Also that if this is an AVL 2004 engine then it must also be a CDI one. Check whether the electrical's are not short anywhere. My advice would be to change the whole wiring set which costs about Rs.800/-.

It is not ordinary to change many parts on the bike only in 6 years. I inherited the bike in 2000, its a 1979 standard one and since then i have only changed the crank (that too only in the beggning when i was handed over the bike and that i had graduated from a 2 stroke yamaha to this bike and always wanted to win the Signal races). Other than that constant care has been taken to oil up and service it.
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Old 2nd May 2011, 08:43   #3
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Default Re: RE ThunderBird Silencer Blunder !?

@The Great - The silencer was perfectly good in the start i mean like i had it now for more than 40 k kilometers and on some long rides. The top speed was never a problem but i never ventured at more than 110kmph except a couple of times. The problems i am stating are from recently the effort taken by the bike in 1st gear etc,feeling as if its going breathless at 90km.

And RATS!!! Well i will check the whole wiring and yes its a Lean Burn engine from 2004 and a CDI one. Thank you for your suggestions.
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Old 2nd May 2011, 09:20   #4
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Default Re: RE ThunderBird Silencer Blunder !?

Misfiring can be caused due to improper air/fuel ratio setting. If it is misfiring on lowering the gear at high speed that means your engine is running lean. Get the air/fuel ratio adjusted and the misfiring will b gone. If needed upjet the carb.

It always happens that when you fit a aftermarket silencer you lose a bit on the low end torque because they are less restricting than the original silencer. So may be that is the reason you are feeling loss in low end torque.
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Old 2nd May 2011, 10:20   #5
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Default Re: RE ThunderBird Silencer Blunder !?

Change the silencer and go for an Original silencer.

On highway runs, I usually add about 40 ml of 2T oil for every 10 Liters of fuel.
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Old 2nd May 2011, 12:21   #6
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Default Re: RE ThunderBird Silencer Blunder !?

Get a GOOD exaust dont go for the one that makes too much of sound. cause if you go free flow you would be losing on the INITIAL.

Getting an original or the So called OEM stuff from the Workshop would be good aswell. but what i have found is that the best to be used is the Ludhiana exausts, they are marketed by the names of POOJA and LAXHMI.
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Old 2nd May 2011, 13:03   #7
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Default Re: RE ThunderBird Silencer Blunder !?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Acclero View Post
@The Great - The silencer was perfectly good in the start i mean like i had it now for more than 40 k kilometers and on some long rides. The top speed was never a problem but i never ventured at more than 110kmph except a couple of times. The problems i am stating are from recently the effort taken by the bike in 1st gear etc,feeling as if its going breathless at 90km.

And RATS!!! Well i will check the whole wiring and yes its a Lean Burn engine from 2004 and a CDI one. Thank you for your suggestions.

You have a very good bike with a very bad silencer..

Get the original small muffler silencer and u will love the response on this AVL. Or the company suggested original silencer that came as the std spec for this bike.

You just need to keep checking the timing, tappets and regularly clean the carb and keep the tank always half full. Other than that your bike should run without any problems if used single handedly.

Personal advice, the more you use it single handedly the more faithful your bike remains.
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Old 2nd May 2011, 13:30   #8
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Default Re: RE ThunderBird Silencer Blunder !?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Acclero View Post
But off late it has been troubling a lot,
1) ...stuck up and turned off...
...RE mechanics couldnt figure out whats wrong...
...just died on me :( . This time the culprit was found to be electrical failure and half of the wiring and electrical parts had to be changed.
2) ...changed the stock silencer to an after market one...
...the bike doesnt have enough power in 1st gear to go up a slight slope with two persons on it (which it used to well before)...
3) The silencer allways had a knack of misfiring when a gear is lowered at a higher speed...
@Sidhu: The aftermarket silencer is not causing the other issues on your RE. Silencers don't misfire, engines do. Replacing the silencer to a stock unit is certainly something you ought to do (and others have advised before), but the misfiring, engine dying and lack of power seem to be issues related to carburation, which you would need to address first. Replacing the silencer will not solve the problems you face now.
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Old 2nd May 2011, 14:39   #9
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Default Re: RE ThunderBird Silencer Blunder !?

Quote:
Originally Posted by SS-Traveller View Post
@Sidhu: The aftermarket silencer is not causing the other issues on your RE. Silencers don't misfire, engines do. Replacing the silencer to a stock unit is certainly something you ought to do (and others have advised before), but the misfiring, engine dying and lack of power seem to be issues related to carburation, which you would need to address first. Replacing the silencer will not solve the problems you face now.

+1

Also one of the possibilities.

Being a bullet owner sets us apart from usual biking as we also ought to have minimum level of knowledge of the bike as our own body part.
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Old 2nd May 2011, 14:51   #10
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Default Re: RE ThunderBird Silencer Blunder !?

As a guy who rides a similar model, I suffered from misfiring on a 2k trip I took using the retro silencer.

Came home, threw it away and put the original back.
No change in any other part of the bike. Bike perfectly normal.
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Old 2nd May 2011, 20:36   #11
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Default Re: RE ThunderBird Silencer Blunder !?

Misfiring should be due to improper jetting and/or bad carb adjustment. Take a look at your spark plug firing end and see what color it is. It should ideally be chocolate brown. I see from the pics that you have a glodie pipe and I guess you have a Free Flow one from the "roar" you mentioned from the silencer at high speeds. So you NEED to get the jetting and adjustment right for the carb

Now about your gradual decrease in power, that's fishy. Can be due to worn out valves, bad push-rod adjustment or worst case piston rings. So you see white smoke from the exhaust?
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Old 2nd May 2011, 22:32   #12
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Default Re: RE ThunderBird Silencer Blunder !?

Quote:
Originally Posted by bblost View Post
...suffered from misfiring... using the retro silencer.
Came home, threw it away and put the original back.
No change in any other part of the bike. Bike perfectly normal.
But this wasn't accompanied by loss of power and refusal to start, I presume?
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Old 2nd May 2011, 22:48   #13
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Default Re: RE ThunderBird Silencer Blunder !?

I don't think that silencer is an issue here as I too have the same one installed on my thunderbird(replaced the OE one to get the thump) and till date did not observe any issues.
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Old 2nd May 2011, 23:01   #14
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Default Re: RE ThunderBird Silencer Blunder !?

My bike never refuses a ride.

Not sure about the loss of power but the bike was on a Hyderabad to Ooty trip and it climbed the mountains without any issue.

I am not light.
Plus my luggage that would have weighed around 30 kilos.


I would proceed with the following checks.
1. There is a oil overflow container. It will be under the seat on the left hand side. Drain it.
2. Check airfilter. If the above mentioner gets full, the oil overflows into the air filter.
3. The carb has two rubber manifolds on either side, check them. If they have cracks in them, it will cause issues.
4. The carb is a Constant Vacuum one. I don't think you will be able to tune it.
5. Replace spark plug and check.

Not Related: Throw away that crash guard before it breaks your leg someday.

Last edited by bblost : 2nd May 2011 at 23:20.
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Old 2nd May 2011, 23:54   #15
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Default Re: RE ThunderBird Silencer Blunder !?

Quote:
Originally Posted by desideep View Post
Get a GOOD exaust dont go for the one that makes too much of sound. cause if you go free flow you would be losing on the INITIAL.

Getting an original or the So called OEM stuff from the Workshop would be good aswell. but what i have found is that the best to be used is the Ludhiana exausts, they are marketed by the names of POOJA and LAXHMI.
@desideep - The original silencer is what most of the people are suggesting so i guess i will take a look into that and btw could you please elaborate more on the ludhiana exhausts.

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Great View Post
You have a very good bike with a very bad silencer..

Get the original small muffler silencer and u will love the response on this AVL. Or the company suggested original silencer that came as the std spec for this bike.

You just need to keep checking the timing, tappets and regularly clean the carb and keep the tank always half full. Other than that your bike should run without any problems if used single handedly.

Personal advice, the more you use it single handedly the more faithful your bike remains.
@The Great - By the small muffler silencer you mean the long, Lean one ??
or ??

Will get down to the business of tappets and carb.


Quote:
Originally Posted by SS-Traveller View Post
@Sidhu: The aftermarket silencer is not causing the other issues on your RE. Silencers don't misfire, engines do. Replacing the silencer to a stock unit is certainly something you ought to do (and others have advised before), but the misfiring, engine dying and lack of power seem to be issues related to carburation, which you would need to address first. Replacing the silencer will not solve the problems you face now.
@SS-Traveller - Problem with The carburation?? Could you please elaborate on what to do to remedy this.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jingaboysr View Post
Misfiring should be due to improper jetting and/or bad carb adjustment. Take a look at your spark plug firing end and see what color it is. It should ideally be chocolate brown. I see from the pics that you have a glodie pipe and I guess you have a Free Flow one from the "roar" you mentioned from the silencer at high speeds. So you NEED to get the jetting and adjustment right for the carb

Now about your gradual decrease in power, that's fishy. Can be due to worn out valves, bad push-rod adjustment or worst case piston rings. So you see white smoke from the exhaust?
@jingaboysr - Well i will get the necessary checkups done on jetting and carbs and the spark plug is brown in colour.
And i dont see any white smoke, will check the valves and pistin rings when i am at it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bblost View Post
My bike never refuses a ride.

Not sure about the loss of power but the bike was on a Hyderabad to Ooty trip and it climbed the mountains without any issue.

I am not light.
Plus my luggage that would have weighed around 30 kilos.


I would proceed with the following checks.
1. There is a oil overflow container. It will be under the seat on the left hand side. Drain it.
2. Check airfilter. If the above mentioner gets full, the oil overflows into the air filter.
3. The carb has two rubber manifolds on either side, check them. If they have cracks in them, it will cause issues.
4. The carb is a Constant Vacuum one. I don't think you will be able to tune it.
5. Replace spark plug and check.

Not Related: Throw away that crash guard before it breaks your leg someday.
@bblost - Will get to the checks asap. Its killing me to see my bike like this. Imran bhai could you please PM Sudhakar anna's Number. I will take my Bird to him and sort these things out.

P.s - Could you tell me whats wrong with the crash guard?
Because i had a very nasty accident when an Santro with out any indication decided to take a u turn after crossing more than 10 feet from the turn radius and knocked me down the crash guard and my helmet saved me from busted leg and a bruised face for sure!
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