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Old 23rd April 2013, 12:48   #436
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Default re: KTM Duke 390 - 375cc, 45 PS, 150 kg

Dont see braided lines on the 390!.. More evidence of cost cutting ? or is not a necessity for ABS equip. brakes ?
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Old 23rd April 2013, 12:56   #437
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Default re: KTM Duke 390 - 375cc, 45 PS, 150 kg

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Originally Posted by RX135 View Post
Leaving price tag aside, it would be interesting to compare bike against bike, D390 vs. N300.

A parallel twin would no doubt be more refined than single cylinder. Ninja has also better clutch, better wind resistance (fairing) and 'probably' better build quality.

Duke has displacement and power on its side. Fuel efficiency appears to be on Duke's side (I have not seen N300 figures).
Its so obvious that the Duke will outrun the N300 in terms of acceleration.

For record sake, putting down a short comparison:

From the video available on the internet- the Duke does 0-100 under 6, the N300 does it shade over 6 (from my riding experience)

As per ACI,
Duke 100kph @ 5000 rpm, N300 100 kph @ 6800 rpm
Duke 130kph @ 7000 rpm, N300 150 kph @ 10,100 rpm (didn't check the 120, 130 rpm figures on the ride)

From where the N300 would score over the Duke would be engine refinement. If we consider that the 390 feels similar to the D200- then the Ninja takes the cake on smoothness. It is unbelievably smooth at the redline!

If the 390 is a 130 all day cruiser, the N300 would run at 150 kph whole day without breaking into sweat. Point to consider is the windblast at 130 kph on a naked street bike compared to a faired N300 on which you hardly feel the drag on the head and body even at 150 kph- its got such a good aerodynamic design.

Top speed, where the N300 easily go over 180 clicks!

Long distance comfort- on the 300 you feel very naturally seated, in fact it feels better than the CBR250R. The Duke has got an awkward riding position and though both bikes are shod with stiffer suspension setup- the Ninja owing to a better seating position would still be a comfortable bet. Also ACI did mention that the 390 has a comparatively stiffer setup than the 200.

But in the end, the price difference between the 2 bikes is what aids the deciding factor.
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Old 23rd April 2013, 15:00   #438
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Default re: KTM Duke 390 - 375cc, 45 PS, 150 kg

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Originally Posted by nitro.1000bhp View Post
Dont see braided lines on the 390!.. More evidence of cost cutting ? or is not a necessity for ABS equip. brakes ?
Its definitely steel braided lines. Look at the hi-res images more closely, the steel braided lines are wrapped in a rubber tube.

@Pulsurge : Very different bikes, even from a touring perspective. The N300 would be best suited GQ mile munching. For the kind runs where one wants do fast intercity travel. The Duke on the other hand would more of a back roads/twisties/state highway kind of a bike. Not saying the N300 doesn't handle well to take on twisties, just that the Duke will be "more" fun and superbly light weight to throw around.
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Old 23rd April 2013, 15:05   #439
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Default re: KTM Duke 390 - 375cc, 45 PS, 150 kg

Since we are talking touring, ask yourselves one question.

Which bike would you choose for a world tour, if these two were the only ones you could choose from?

(I had to use my smiley quota on this one)
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Old 23rd April 2013, 15:10   #440
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Default re: KTM Duke 390 - 375cc, 45 PS, 150 kg

While I wont want to rely too much on web review and KTM dealerships regarding prices, almost every online review and dealer seems to be contemplating a near 200000 INR ex showroom.

Now when the 200 costs 4200 pounds in UK and the 390 4500 pounds i.e less than 10% over the 200; why is KTM India planning to charge a near 40 % over the 200 especially since over 80% of the bike is carried forward from the 200 + ABS

I understand they cannot charge 10% over the 200, but if they go ballistic like the rumored numbers, I am wondering how much premium margin they are planning to make from the 390.

Also since the 390 is slated to be launched in multiple countries, KTM must try to price the bike in lines in global strategies and proportional global price variances.

Technically the 390 should be in the range of 170k ex-showroom (133k for the 200 + 15k for ABS = 148k. Add 15% to this).

Might be wishful thinking, but couldn't help doing this excel calculation.
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Old 23rd April 2013, 15:10   #441
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Default re: KTM Duke 390 - 375cc, 45 PS, 150 kg

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Originally Posted by ebonho View Post
Which bike would you choose for a world tour, if these two were the only ones you could choose from?
If people can tour the world on a R1 ....



Then I think one can tour the world on anything!
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Old 23rd April 2013, 16:36   #442
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Default re: KTM Duke 390 - 375cc, 45 PS, 150 kg

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Originally Posted by praful View Post
If people can tour the world on a R1 .... Then I think one can tour the world on anything!
Yes, I can run a marathon in my office brogues too, to prove a point.

Does not make it any less traumatic.

Note from Support - Post edited to remove embedded video in the quoted text as it could inconvenience mobile and small screen users.

Last edited by n_aditya : 23rd April 2013 at 17:41.
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Old 23rd April 2013, 16:44   #443
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Default re: KTM Duke 390 - 375cc, 45 PS, 150 kg

Think the reason why KTM would price this bike at a 100 grand more than the 200 is so that it doesn't kill the duke 200 sales. The 200 is still a running, on going model.
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Old 23rd April 2013, 17:08   #444
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Default re: KTM Duke 390 - 375cc, 45 PS, 150 kg

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Originally Posted by Red Liner View Post
Think the reason why KTM would price this bike at a 100 grand more than the 200 is so that it doesn't kill the duke 200 sales. The 200 is still a running, on going model.

I think they will do it because they can. As long as they price it above the CBR 250, and below the Ninja 300 - at something around 2.50 lakhs to 3 lakhs - they pretty much have the game in hand.

Because -
1) they are not diminishing the brand value as a cheap brand.
2) yet they are showing how Honda is overcharging for its bike (250).
3) yet they are showing how Kawasaki is overcharging for its bike (300).
4) such pricing gives them a really nice cushion of profit.
5) Duke 200 continues to plug the market at another level.
6) A 400cc bike is already targeted at the higher income audience - I think the EMI customer becomes relevant at price point - and to the EMI customer, 2k more per month won't hurt too much.
7) The customer who is stuck at being able to spend 2L, is forced to choose between CBR and Duke 200, at which point he is more likely to choose the duke as it is just much cheaper.
8) The customer who has more than 3L cash, is likely to think hard and decide that the Duke 390 gives me more CC for less rupees (as compared to the Ninja 300), and choose the Duke 390.
9) At 2.5-2.75L, there is still flexibility to price the future variations (the tourer, and the faired versions) such that these other versions fall within the gap between the CBR and the Ninja.

PS: This of course doesn't take into account people who buy a bike for its riding characteristics or styling properties. Duke's headlight designs have a really polarising design.

Last edited by manolin : 23rd April 2013 at 17:10.
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Old 23rd April 2013, 17:12   #445
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Default re: KTM Duke 390 - 375cc, 45 PS, 150 kg

Quote:
Originally Posted by praful View Post
The Duke on the other hand would more of a back roads/twisties/state highway kind of a bike. Not saying the N300 doesn't handle well to take on twisties, just that the Duke will be "more" fun and superbly light weight to throw around.
If the tarmac is good and well laid, the N250 itself is as fun as it can get on twisties and state highways. The handling is so taut that you'll never want the turns to end. And the N300 is supposed to handle even better! However, if the road's bad and there's dirt, slime, gravel what not, then the Duke is a blast. Because you will slide on it, and then pull it back up. Again and again.
If it is fun you want, there is no going wrong with either.
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Old 23rd April 2013, 17:26   #446
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Default re: KTM Duke 390 - 375cc, 45 PS, 150 kg

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Originally Posted by dipen View Post
Now when the 200 costs 4200 pounds in UK and the 390 4500 pounds i.e less than 10% over the 200; why is KTM India planning to charge a near 40 % over the 200 especially since over 80% of the bike is carried forward from the 200 + ABS
And how much does 4200 GBP amount to when converted in INR?
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Old 23rd April 2013, 17:36   #447
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Default re: KTM Duke 390 - 375cc, 45 PS, 150 kg

Quote:
Originally Posted by pulsurge View Post

But in the end, the price difference between the 2 bikes is what aids the deciding factor.
N300 would win on quality too.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ebonho View Post
Since we are talking touring, ask yourselves one question.

Which bike would you choose for a world tour, if these two were the only ones you could choose from?

(I had to use my smiley quota on this one)
Just had this thought; why dont we see tourists riding Dukes from Delhi to Kerala etc? They still do it on REs.

Quote:
Originally Posted by pulsurge View Post
And how much does 4200 GBP amount to when converted in INR?
348,193.67 INR
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Old 23rd April 2013, 17:39   #448
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Default re: KTM Duke 390 - 375cc, 45 PS, 150 kg

Quote:
Originally Posted by dipen View Post
348,193.67 INR
The Indian junta should thank Bajaj of not pricing the Duke on par with international prices then. It would have made the N300 look like a VFM bike
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Old 23rd April 2013, 17:44   #449
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Default re: KTM Duke 390 - 375cc, 45 PS, 150 kg

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Originally Posted by jkdas View Post
Just had this thought; why dont we see tourists riding Dukes from Delhi to Kerala etc? They still do it on REs.

A big chunk of those RE riders are waiting for the 390. Some of them succumbing earlier to the 200 itself.

Quote:
Originally Posted by pulsurge View Post
The Indian junta should thank Bajaj of not pricing the Duke on par with international prices then. It would have made the N300 look like a VFM bike
Internationally the baby Ninjas are budget bikes, the baby Ceebers more so. And the baby Dukes are lustworthy "exotics."

As they say, ghar ki murgi daal barabar.

Last edited by ebonho : 23rd April 2013 at 17:47.
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Old 23rd April 2013, 17:46   #450
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Default re: KTM Duke 390 - 375cc, 45 PS, 150 kg

merge back to back posts.
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