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Old 1st July 2013, 19:16   #16
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Default Re: The Duke Brothers - A 200 vs 390 pictorial comparo

Great thread ebonho. But photos!! enuf said already.

The radiator guards looks quite similar but I do see space for some offending pebble to squeeze in and this what might have happened to my friends bike.

It seems main work has been done on the engine which is supposedly 90% all new from the 200. The rest, frame, suspension et al, seem to be shared to quite a extent. Except for a keen eye, it would be hard to discern the difference between the two bike to a common layman, size wise.

The 390 adventure would be a true delight for people like me looking for a cruiser. I am a little sceptical whether this 390 would look good on 40+ person like me who needs this for mainly cruising and not street racing. Your comments...
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Old 1st July 2013, 20:14   #17
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Default Re: The Duke Brothers - A 200 vs 390 pictorial comparo

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The radiator guards looks quite similar but I do see space for some offending pebble to squeeze in and this what might have happened to my friends bike.
I doubt any pebble or stone or other projectile can be launched with enough force from the road past that guard to actually puncture the radiator. In all likelihood, your friend has hit the radiator against the sharp/pointed edge of a rock (probably under water) and damaged the radiator. It can happen. And does happen - which is why adventure bikes have protective steel pipe cages around their radiators.

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The 390 adventure would be a true delight for people like me looking for a cruiser. I am a little sceptical whether this 390 would look good on 40+ person like me who needs this for mainly cruising and not street racing. Your comments...
The Dukes are not cruisers bro - they were never built to cruise. That is not to say you cannot cruise with them - just that they are not great fun in that role and both bike and rider would be extremely displeased and frustrated (claustrophobic?) doing that.

About the looks part I think I have mentioned this somewhere earlier - how I look on a bike is only really important for those looking at me. Not me myself.

For me, what important is how I feel on the bike, and what I can or cannot do with the bike.

Last edited by ebonho : 1st July 2013 at 20:15.
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Old 1st July 2013, 20:34   #18
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Default Re: The Duke Brothers - A 200 vs 390 pictorial comparo

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Originally Posted by dkaile View Post

The 390 adventure would be a true delight for people like me looking for a cruiser. I am a little sceptical whether this 390 would look good on 40+ person like me who needs this for mainly cruising and not street racing. Your comments...
Another picture of the Adventure (1190). hope the 390 turns out like this.

Name:  adventure ktm.jpg
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I can't help but keep staring at this bike. It's got everything. All. No modifications needed. Gear up. Fuel up. And Go.
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Old 2nd July 2013, 09:30   #19
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Default Re: The Duke Brothers - A 200 vs 390 pictorial comparo

Doc:

Sorry for being a total dolt - what is the difference between touring & cruising; (This thread had me more confused: http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=345438 They seem to think it is only a looks/ riding position issue. Admittedly, they are talking about touring & cruising BIKES & not about riding).

Assuming that the mystery will be clarified eventually, how does the riding position work out? I am 47 years old & hence the Q. Think I will probably do 350-400 km once a month!

Another request: will you be doing a series on the accessories (powerparts) too? Want to know if the windshield is of any use & if the luggage box affects handling.

Finally: did not understand your point about electricals under the seat. Can I use any of them to get a cigarette lighter contraption set up?
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Old 2nd July 2013, 11:11   #20
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Default Re: The Duke Brothers - A 200 vs 390 pictorial comparo

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Doc:

Sorry for being a total dolt - what is the difference between touring & cruising; (This thread had me more confused: http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=345438 They seem to think it is only a looks/ riding position issue. Admittedly, they are talking about touring & cruising BIKES & not about riding).
Firstly, and admittedly, I never got the concept of "tourer" myself. Any bike can tour. Even a humble 100 cc.

A Cruiser is easier to define. Its a laid back riding position. Arms and legs splayed out and forward. Low slung. Long. Not very fast. Relaxed all-day revs. The big displacement V-twins from Harley and the Jap manufacturers are classic examples.

From the Advrider perspective, a tourer is classically an Enduro which is the more technical description of the bikes they refer to. Also called Dual Sports / Adventure bikes. Tough. Tall. Not very wide. Big tank. Tall windscreen. High saddle. Upright (almost standing) riding position. Dual purpose tyres. Spoked wheels - front bigger than the rear. Long travel heavy duty suspension. Protective guards and bash plates. Hard luggage panniers or mounting racks / plates. The KTM Adventure series, the BMW GS series, the Trans Alp, the Multistrada, the Varadero, and the smaller 650 cc thumpers like the KLR 650, the DR 650, the XR 650, these are the classical tourers - built to do a world tour and come back largely intact.

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Assuming that the mystery will be clarified eventually, how does the riding position work out? I am 47 years old & hence the Q. Think I will probably do 350-400 km once a month!
These are curently all academic discussions for us Indians looking at the choices we have. Buy the bike you like and are comfortable on, and ride it. The closest we have to a cruiser is the TB 500. The closest we have to a tourer is the Impulse. The CBR 250 and the Ninja 300 are sports tourers. The Ninja 650 with the right wheels and tyres and beefier suspension with longer travel would be the closest we would have to a tourer the way the world looks at it.

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Another request: will you be doing a series on the accessories (powerparts) too? Want to know if the windshield is of any use & if the luggage box affects handling.
No idea about the accessories bro. The only things I would be interested in is a bigger tank (20K+), a bigger more functional windscreen (than what they are offering as a power part - the kind showed in the 100 in under 6 seconds video), and a decent bash plate with engine/radiator protection. I am extremely comfortable with my saddlebags on the Duke - convenient, light, easy to mount/dismount, and cheap.

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Finally: did not understand your point about electricals under the seat. Can I use any of them to get a cigarette lighter contraption set up?
Those are all sensors, sockets, ABS related stuff, and Fuses. No idea about cigarette lighter - for that you could take an out directly from the battery (under the rider seat) and drill a hole to fit the lighter socket alongside the hole already there for the lock for releasing the pillion seat.
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Old 2nd July 2013, 23:24   #21
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Originally Posted by ebonho View Post

Firstly, and admittedly, I never got the concept of "tourer" myself. Any bike can tour. Even a humble 100 cc.

From the Advrider perspective, a tourer is classically an Enduro which is the more technical description of the bikes they refer to. Also called Dual Sports / Adventure bikes.
Though I agree that one can travel considerable distances on a humble 100 cc, we must understand that it wasn't designed for it. We make do with it cuz we have no options.
When people say tour, they mean travelling long distances. South India tour, north India tour, the likes. And its done in various modes of transportation. And if we had the choice we'd choose the most comfortable choice in each mode. Considering cars, we'd like to travel in an innova as against a maruti 800. Innova was built for that purpose. Ferry people across long distances in comfort. 800 wasn't designed so.
Coming to bikes, we don't have that choice. A tourer in my book, should be able to take me and my luggage to places in comfort. Comfort includes nice big engine, comfortably padded seats, heated grips, big windscreen to protect you from the elements, comfortable suspension, comfortable riding position. BMW have the best selling bikes in both segments, road going and off road.
No bike in India south of 10lakhs have these features.
Even our aftermarket is so nascent. We don't have options to customise.
The duke is essentially marketed as a street bike across the world. Since in India we tend to adjust maadi (make do with) we have marketing presentation s showing us something the bike was not designed for, cuz we have no options and since bajaj noticed that there is a small piece of the larger pie who'd prefer a MODERN touring bike they want to target whatever they can get.
I'd love to own the Duke 390, its got a very nice engine perfectly geared for touring but it ain't a tourer
1. Tank size is small
2. Suspension is stiff, designed for street
3. No fairing to protect us against the elements.
4. No creature comforts.

Just my opinion. If I have said something wrong kindly explain with logical reasoning. Please don't shoot me.
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Old 3rd July 2013, 11:31   #22
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Default Re: The Duke Brothers - A 200 vs 390 pictorial comparo

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Originally Posted by ebonho View Post
Firstly, and admittedly, I never got the concept of "tourer" myself. Any bike can tour. Even a humble 100 cc.

From the Advrider perspective, a tourer is classically an Enduro which is the more technical description of the bikes they refer to. Also called Dual Sports / Adventure bikes. Tough. Tall. Not very wide. Big tank. Tall windscreen. High saddle. Upright (almost standing) riding position. Dual purpose tyres. Spoked wheels - front bigger than the rear. Long travel heavy duty suspension. Protective guards and bash plates. Hard luggage panniers or mounting racks / plates. The KTM Adventure series, the BMW GS series, the Trans Alp, the Multistrada, the Varadero, and the smaller 650 cc thumpers like the KLR 650, the DR 650, the XR 650, these are the classical tourers - built to do a world tour and come back largely intact.
Hey at the risk of sounding like an extreme novice, I got curious as to why spoked wheels are preferred over alloys? Could you elaborate on that? Likewise with the bigger front wheel as opposed to the rear.
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Old 3rd July 2013, 11:42   #23
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Default Re: The Duke Brothers - A 200 vs 390 pictorial comparo

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Hey at the risk of sounding like an extreme novice, I got curious as to why spoked wheels are preferred over alloys? Could you elaborate on that? Likewise with the bigger front wheel as opposed to the rear.
Spoked wheels can handle offroad stress much better than alloys and bigger front wheel (as in height) helps in offroad situations/handling better.
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Old 3rd July 2013, 11:47   #24
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Default Re: The Duke Brothers - A 200 vs 390 pictorial comparo

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Hey at the risk of sounding like an extreme novice, I got curious as to why spoked wheels are preferred over alloys? Could you elaborate on that?
The spoked wheel is widely considered as one of the strongest man-made structures.

Quote:
Likewise with the bigger front wheel as opposed to the rear.
Better approach angle and greater ground clearance to clear rocks, roots and other obstacles.

The smaller rear wheel is for greater stability and better low end torque to power over the same above obstacles easily.

Last edited by ebonho : 3rd July 2013 at 12:00.
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Old 3rd July 2013, 11:52   #25
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Default Re: The Duke Brothers - A 200 vs 390 pictorial comparo

Doc

Have you received the green light to write about this yet? IF not by when? You could start dribbling info at least - shocks comparo, frame comparo, engine noise comparo llike that ... :-)
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Old 3rd July 2013, 11:59   #26
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Default Re: The Duke Brothers - A 200 vs 390 pictorial comparo

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Doc

Have you received the green light to write about this yet? IF not by when? You could start dribbling info at least - shocks comparo, frame comparo, engine noise comparo llike that ... :-)
LOL no man, not yet. Lots of first test ride reports already out though to give you some idea.
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Old 8th July 2013, 12:38   #27
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Default Re: The Duke Brothers - A 200 vs 390 pictorial comparo

Write-up Update:

Guys, I was all set to give you guys a surprise over the weekend and have the write-up in for you all for a start of the week treat. Even took my laptop home to work on it from all the feedback reports, forms, logs, etc. I have saved. However, we've been asked to hold off on the write up for a bit, and I do not as yet have an idea as to till when, so a little bit of a damp squib. Apologies to all who have been waiting. Will keep you posted.

Cheers, Doc
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Old 8th July 2013, 12:44   #28
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Default Re: The Duke Brothers - A 200 vs 390 pictorial comparo

That's a big disappointment Doc! You guys being asked to hold back reviews, strike at Chakan plant - does not give a good feeling!

What's happening?
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Old 8th July 2013, 12:54   #29
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Default Re: The Duke Brothers - A 200 vs 390 pictorial comparo

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That's a big disappointment Doc! You guys being asked to hold back reviews, strike at Chakan plant - does not give a good feeling!

What's happening?
There is nothing to worry bro. Please don't read anything into it. I think maybe the juornos would be less than delighted if there are long termer reports in the internet media before they have their copies in. But again, its only a guess.
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Old 8th July 2013, 15:39   #30
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Default Re: The Duke Brothers - A 200 vs 390 pictorial comparo

Doc:

May I know exactly who is stopping you? Bajaj? Or T-Bhp mods? Part of the deal in doing the long term testing?

Just asking.
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