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Old 13th November 2014, 11:27   #16
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Default Re: Hero Karizma ZMR - Fuel pump failed. Rs. 12,000 to replace!

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Originally Posted by sam_sant2005 View Post
Update:

Any points on this? Would it be a simple loose contact? Or again a sensor issue? Anyone?
Could be a loose contact . Which ASC do you go to ? Did you enquire the cost of the pump outside ? Try Parshwa motors in double road , they are the authorized dealers and stockists for hero spare parts.
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Old 13th November 2014, 11:46   #17
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Default Re: Hero Karizma ZMR - Fuel pump failed. Rs. 12,000 to replace!

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Originally Posted by sam_sant2005 View Post
Any points on this? Would it be a simple loose contact? Or again a sensor issue? Anyone?
Easy to check this. But again, it needs tank removal.
Open the connector to the pump. It is made of plastic and can be detatched with some force. Apply WD40 and wipe out everything. Fit back.
If it were a loose connection, this would solve it.
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Old 13th November 2014, 12:20   #18
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Default Re: Hero Karizma ZMR - Fuel pump failed. Rs. 12,000 to replace!

The Fuel pump is failing on most of the bikes these days. Its a common problem in FI. A loose contact won't be the problem. The issue is with the sensor. The fuel might have been the cause for the damage. There is nothing we can do to cure this problem :( But honestly if you can then switch to carburetor. Fuel pump can go anytime and not all mechanic can work on it.
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Old 13th November 2014, 14:51   #19
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Default Re: Hero Karizma ZMR - Fuel pump failed. Rs. 12,000 to replace!

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Originally Posted by girimajiananth View Post
Could be a loose contact . Which ASC do you go to ? Did you enquire the cost of the pump outside ? Try Parshwa motors in double road , they are the authorized dealers and stockists for hero spare parts.
I went to a 'local' Hero ASC near my home (I said local because it is not listed in Hero website). They themselves asked me to go to a bigger service centre now (washed their hands off) and did not take my request for ordering the fuel pump. Fuel pump costs 11500+VAT. I called Parshwa yesterday and they said minimum 20-30 days waiting period will be there.

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Originally Posted by Divya Sharan View Post
Easy to check this. But again, it needs tank removal.
Open the connector to the pump. It is made of plastic and can be detatched with some force. Apply WD40 and wipe out everything. Fit back.
If it were a loose connection, this would solve it.
Do you have any youtube references for DYI tank removal? Do I need to remove the fairing as well? My heart says WD40 spray could do the trick as you said. This bike was not used regularly by the previous owner so some kind of grease/dirt/settlements on the contact might be a possibility. I hope you are Bangalore - Can I give you a call if you dont mind PM your number if you are ok. I stay near Kagadassapura (CV Raman Nagar).

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Originally Posted by unni nambiar View Post
The Fuel pump is failing on most of the bikes these days. Its a common problem in FI. A loose contact won't be the problem. The issue is with the sensor. The fuel might have been the cause for the damage. There is nothing we can do to cure this problem :( But honestly if you can then switch to carburetor. Fuel pump can go anytime and not all mechanic can work on it.
Ok one question - If sensor is having issue, will the bike start intermittently by tapping? My understanding is if it was sensor or fuel pump going kaput, bike should have never started again. So only now my hope is back for 'repairing' this.

Last edited by sam_sant2005 : 13th November 2014 at 14:56.
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Old 13th November 2014, 15:08   #20
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Default Re: Hero Karizma ZMR - Fuel pump failed. Rs. 12,000 to replace!

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Originally Posted by sam_sant2005 View Post
Do you have any youtube references for DYI tank removal? Do I need to remove the fairing as well? My heart says WD40 spray could do the trick as you said. This bike was not used regularly by the previous owner so some kind of grease/dirt/settlements on the contact might be a possibility. I hope you are Bangalore - Can I give you a call if you dont mind PM your number if you are ok. I stay near Kagadassapura (CV Raman Nagar).
Yes, the fairing has to be removed for this. You can get the fairing + tank opened by any mech who has experience with ZMR nuts and bolts, if you're scared of breaking stuff yourself.

Sending you a PM with my number.
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Old 14th November 2014, 21:49   #21
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Default Re: Hero Karizma ZMR - Fuel pump failed. Rs. 12,000 to replace!

My friend has a white ZMR. He also replaced the fuel pump once because he used all the Petrol of the bike. Due to this the fuel pump got fried. This information was given to us by the official service centre when we took his bike for the fuel pump replacement. Also, this happened after 8 months of the delivery of the bike. He was thinking of getting warranty claim but the service centre guys said that because the fuel pump was fried due to lack of Petrol so it was the owner's fault, so no warranty.

I have a CBR250R and I never run it on low fuel.

Last edited by 0xTKB : 14th November 2014 at 21:51.
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Old 14th November 2014, 22:44   #22
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Default Re: Hero Karizma ZMR - Fuel pump failed. Rs. 12,000 to replace!

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Originally Posted by 0xTKB View Post
My friend has a white ZMR. He also replaced the fuel pump once because he used all the Petrol of the bike. Due to this the fuel pump got fried. This information was given to us by the official service centre when we took his bike for the fuel pump replacement. Also, this happened after 8 months of the delivery of the bike. He was thinking of getting warranty claim but the service centre guys said that because the fuel pump was fried due to lack of Petrol so it was the owner's fault, so no warranty.

I have a CBR250R and I never run it on low fuel.
This logic completely blows my mind.

What is the most likely issue a fuel pump can face?
Bad fuel
or Low/no fuel?

The engineers over at Hero must not have done their FI localization properly that running a vehicle low on fuel causes the fuel pump to get fried.

Can the techie folks help me understand why? By that logic, most cabbies driving CRDi or even CNG vehicles should've busted tens of thousands of pumps by now.
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Old 14th November 2014, 23:13   #23
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Default Re: Hero Karizma ZMR - Fuel pump failed. Rs. 12,000 to replace!

I don't have any knowledge regarding the technicalities of the fuel pump. But according to this website, the fuel pump is cooled by Petrol. So, low fuel will not be able to cool the pump and it will get damaged by its own heat. This is exactly what the mechanics at the Hero dealership told to us.
http://mechanics.stackexchange.com/q...he-tank-matter

P. S. This works in the case of Petrol. My friend works as a Workshop Manager in Mahindra dealership, I'll ask him for more information on the fuel pump matter.

Last edited by 0xTKB : 14th November 2014 at 23:16.
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Old 15th November 2014, 08:00   #24
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Default Re: Hero Karizma ZMR - Fuel pump failed. Rs. 12,000 to replace!

FI bikes require atleast 3 litres of fuel in reserve to keep the pump submerged inside and to keep it cool.
Prolonged usage of bike with very low fuel will heat the pump and it will eventually fail earlier than its designed to fail. Keihin pumps don't fail that quick. A lot of pulsar Fi owners and ZMR owners who have gone from carb bikes to Fi didn't know this and ended up getting their pumps damaged.
Also since this is a used bike and you have said that the previous owner did not run it as often as one would like to, did you change all the fluids and filters when you bought it off of him?
Kindly check and replace the filters if needed. Also get the FI relay checked and see if enough voltage is passing to the FI unit with a voltmeter.
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Old 15th November 2014, 09:55   #25
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Default Re: Hero Karizma ZMR - Fuel pump failed. Rs. 12,000 to replace!

Quote:
Originally Posted by 0xTKB View Post
I don't have any knowledge regarding the technicalities of the fuel pump. But according to this website, the fuel pump is cooled by Petrol. So, low fuel will not be able to cool the pump and it will get damaged by its own heat. This is exactly what the mechanics at the Hero dealership told to us.
http://mechanics.stackexchange.com/q...he-tank-matter

P. S. This works in the case of Petrol. My friend works as a Workshop Manager in Mahindra dealership, I'll ask him for more information on the fuel pump matter.
Do let me know more.

IMHO this fuel pump getting damaged by lack of fuel logic is equivalent to saying that driving a car over a pothole will break the suspension!!

Whereas we know destroying a suspension on a pothole takes a BIG pothole and a total lack of awareness to cause that much damage. Suspensions are designed to take abuse, why aren't FPs designed to tolerate low fuel volume esp in a country where 80% two wheelers at a pump only get 1.5-3L filled (rs 100-200 or even lesser) any given time!
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Old 16th November 2014, 06:13   #26
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Default Re: Hero Karizma ZMR - Fuel pump failed. Rs. 12,000 to replace!

I also ride a white 2010 ZMR, and can clearly recall the recurrence of fuel pump and injector failures in the initial batches of this bike. Your problem seems to be of a worn-out brush / loose contact inside fuel pump, but I won't advise you for the DIY solution as it can reduce the reliability of this otherwise bulletproof bike.
Riding on low fuel is not likely to cause such a failure..
But the most important thing is - the ZMR always came with a 3 year/40000 km warranty. So your bike must be within warranty and this replacement shouldn't cost you a penny. Even if the service history of the bike is not regular (which is must as per warranty rules for honoring the warranty) you can follow-up with higher authorities.
(I got my ZMR's fuel pump + injectors + sensor assembly replaced under warranty after 1 year of purchase, when an issue was identified with injector only).
Even if you don't get it done under warranty, get the fuel pump replaced with genuine spare. Rest assured, the bike will give you trouble free riding for years to come.
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Old 18th November 2014, 03:09   #27
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Default Re: Hero Karizma ZMR - Fuel pump failed. Rs. 12,000 to replace!

I talked to my friend who works at Mahindra. He gave me two different explanations for the two fuels.

Diesel :- When someone runs the diesel vehicle on low fuel and completely dries the tank up, then the pump sucks in the air and feeds it to the injectors. Due to this, the vacuum lock fails and the vehicle refuses to start as it has no fuel and there's air in the fuel delivery mechanism as well as the injectors.

To fix this issue, they first fill the diesel tank to at least 25% of the capacity. Then, they bleed the injectors. This is done while manually running the diesel pump as it is safer. They do it until the air is out of the pump as well as the injectors and the diesel starts flowing again.

Petrol :- Petrol fuel injection systems are very tough and almost impossible to fix than the diesel ones. This is due to the fact that Petrol evaporates quickly whereas Diesel is slippery. When a Petrol bike runs out of fuel, the remaining Petrol in the pump evaporates due to heat and it makes the fuel pump completely dry. The only way to save the fuel pump is by completely shutting off the vehicle when the fuel tank is empty and refrain from starting it, filling the Petrol tank with at least 25% of fuel and then waiting for at least 15 minutes to let the fuel pump cool off.

Carburettor based bikes are not affected by dry tanks as there are no fuel pumps present in them.

So, the conclusion is that, fill up the bike's tank as soon as possible when you're at reserve mark.

Last edited by 0xTKB : 18th November 2014 at 03:11.
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Old 18th November 2014, 09:09   #28
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Default Re: Hero Karizma ZMR - Fuel pump failed. Rs. 12,000 to replace!

Bit OT, but related to FI bikes. How are such bikes transported without any petrol? Because AFAIK, for any bus/train transport, you have to remove every last drop of petrol. Is transporting such FI bikes safe in such case?
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Old 19th November 2014, 12:48   #29
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Default Re: Hero Karizma ZMR - Fuel pump failed. Rs. 12,000 to replace!

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Originally Posted by ani_meher View Post
Bit OT, but related to FI bikes. How are such bikes transported without any petrol? Because AFAIK, for any bus/train transport, you have to remove every last drop of petrol. Is transporting such FI bikes safe in such case?
This should answer your question.

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Originally Posted by 0xTKB View Post
The only way to save the fuel pump is by completely shutting off the vehicle when the fuel tank is empty and refrain from starting it, filling the Petrol tank with at least 25% of fuel and then waiting for at least 15 minutes to let the fuel pump cool off.
Get the bike by train, fill in petrol, give it ample time to reach the injectors. Cross your fingers, say your prayers, turn the key, crank her up.
There you go!Your bike is all ready to be ridden again.

Last edited by Roomy : 19th November 2014 at 12:52.
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Old 27th November 2014, 07:43   #30
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Default Re: Hero Karizma ZMR - Fuel pump failed. Rs. 12,000 to replace!

Update:

Fortunately (too early to say though), I got a used Fuel Pump Unit through a friend for half the price. However even after fixing it, though the bike is starting, there is some issue with sensors now. The orange light is blinking. I had noticed the orange light coming up after several rounds of cranking (just before the battery was going dead) when the engine was failing to start three weeks back.

Later they replaced the sensor unit as well with that of the new ZMR. However that doesn't seem to match correctly and resulting in jerking. Bike has completed 2 weeks in workshop now. Need to wait for some more time before they conclude that that the bike is usable. As of now, planning to order a older model ZMR sensor which costs another 4k.

Never ever did I think that the ZMR journey would be this bumpy. My thoughts are in a different line now - I am thinking of selling my ZMR (2012) and ZMA (2011) combined for a lakh and going for a Unicorn 160 or R15. Feeling pathetic :(
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