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Old 28th October 2016, 07:52   #46
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Default Re: Mahindra is bringing Jawa back

All Yezdis had the auto clutch, in the sense that the first pressure on the foot shifter did the same thing that the clutch lever on the handle did, so one could change gears without using the handle lever.

However, the release of the lever at the foot was not easy to control, so starting from stationary without using the handle lever, while possible, was not easy to do if one wanted a smooth take off. It was almost impossible to use in slow moving traffic.

Basically the feature was there as a fallback in case the clutch cable broke. Which used to be quite frequently because of the cables available then.

Last edited by Sawyer : 28th October 2016 at 07:53.
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Old 28th October 2016, 09:11   #47
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With auto clutch function Yezdi were good for drag races. Basically after start you just did a quick stomp on gear lever to get into next ratio
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Old 28th October 2016, 09:37   #48
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Default Re: Mahindra is bringing Jawa back

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Originally Posted by Mad4bhp View Post
If I'm right, there was as such no 'auto clutch' mechanism. If you hold the gear lever in one position/pressed inside, it would engage/dis-engage the clutch. It was fun doing that.
Actually, it did have a semi automatic clutch. Changing gears on the move, did not need the clutch to be manually engaged - an internal cam actually engaged and disengaged the clutch when the gear shifter was moved. It was unique to the bike along with the common gear and kickstart lever
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Old 28th October 2016, 23:19   #49
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Default Re: Mahindra is bringing Jawa back

A "visionary" suggestion to M & M for their long term success:

- Jawa be renamed as Jawo

- BSA be renamed as BSO

This is because eversince the turn of the century, M & M has believed that a last letter or digit "o" or "0" is good omen for any model of the brand. The success of the Bolero kindled such a thought-process with the M & M honchos.

So we soon got Scorpio, Xylo, Quanto, Rodeo, Mojo, Centuro, Duro, Genio, XUV 500, KUV 100, ( the SSyangyong Rexton and the Nuvo Sport are revolutionary deviations lately but not taking off anyway). The Thar is also an exception.
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Old 30th October 2016, 18:34   #50
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Default Re: Mahindra is bringing Jawa back

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Originally Posted by ashis89 View Post
I can't see through their strategy. They bought stakes in Ssangyong and tried selling it with some co-badging. They bought Kinetic and tried selling under their own brand. Now they are buying brands/licenses to sell some more products. At the end of the day, a customer is concerned about the end product. Even if the product sports an iconic brand and but isn't upto the mark, hardly anyone would touch it.

The very first thing Mahindra should do is invest in R&D and strive to make good products from scratch (like the Mojo).
I recall someone commenting that the great industrialists of the subcontinent were in reality simply traders. Insensitive perhaps, but observant. In that way, in times past it was really the "luck of the draw" whether a foreign-conceived, rebadged product was going to work out here or not. Rajdoots, Yezdis, Bullets, Vespas, Lambys, Ambys, Fiats, and Jeeps all have had their time in the limelight and in the past a lot of the success had to do with the basic ruggedness, economy, and serviceability of the design. Many, many others fell by the wayside and have been long since forgotten - one recent example would be the Brazilian-origin Hero Impulse, which has proved (like Bajaj's similar "Endura" much earlier) a complete flop and will prove another forgotten "orphan" model.

I've admired those companies who've stepped out and been willing to design more to a particular purpose, more to a specific context. I think TVS tried early on with the Victor, and Bajaj, even if their QC has sometimes been spotty, has seemed to be constantly innovating and refining, the almost countless models/variations on the Pulsar over the past ten years being a prime example. And now we have something like the V15... Last I knew they were seriously threatening / surpassing (much more conservative) Hero's market share.

Long story short, I think R&D would be a good idea; but in the minds of many it's unfortunately a lot harder and less profitable work than just buying something elsewhere and trying to see if it works here.

Let's hope for some fresh re-thinking. It has been paying off for RE as of late, as well.

-Eric
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Old 30th October 2016, 18:59   #51
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Default Re: Mahindra is bringing Jawa back

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Waiting eagerly to see in what new avatar they bring it. A bigger engine is a must if they are targeting RE market.
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Originally Posted by ShaileshHinge View Post
AWESOME news ! I got my dads Jawa restored 5 yrs ago. will be good as availability of spare parts might be better.
In all probability the new Jawas will use Rotax 4 stroke engines just like the Jawas sold in Europe.
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Old 30th October 2016, 21:49   #52
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Default Re: Mahindra is bringing Jawa back

Interesting, ive been secretly hoping that some major manufacturer would revive the Jawa/Yezdi brand of bikes. But now im not so sure.

M&M can only re-launch the Jawa marque as a lifestlye product. Im sure they dont expect volumes on something they intend to sell soley on nostalgia.
There are benchmarks in the 350, 500, 750 & 800 CC segments already. Each having their own brand appeal, ecosystems and a grip on their own target market. The only way M&M can disrupt the market is by a superior product, clear positioning and smart pricing, among other things(easier said than done).
But based on their track record and the complications in pulling it off, it seems unlikely that they will get it right in their first attempt.

Purists will steer clear and casual customers will compare them with established names, that leaves us with nostalgic fans who may or may not whip out their cheque books.

And most importantly with the re-launch slated for 2019 expect the Indian motorcycle scene to throw up a few surprises that could upset any plans for the Jawa.

I'll be waiting and watching.

PS: I dont see how this affects the spares availability/quality for the older 2 stroke Jawa/Yezdi motorcycles.
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Old 31st October 2016, 05:55   #53
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Default Re: Mahindra is bringing Jawa back

Here's the thing - in India, the Yezdi wasn't a lifestyle product, even back then the RE trumped it for that. But many, like me, bought the Yezdi as the only practical, cheap to run choice because RE was known to be a mechanic friendly bike even back then. And Rajdoot was too agricultural in looks. But even Yezdi had to concede the battleground to Suzuki and Honda because even then, the latter two wiped the floor with Yezdi when it came to economy, practicality and maintenance needs.

I can't see them now being able to be lifestyle products either. The brand has no aura around it.
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Old 31st October 2016, 07:34   #54
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Default Re: Mahindra is bringing Jawa back

The Mast head of the HINDU used to carry ads for the Yezdi in the 1980's. The Yezdi 250 Classic, the Roadking and the Yezdi 350 which had a brief flutter and then the Yezdi 175 too.

If I remember right, the Yezdi used to cost about 14175/- then and that went up to about 20K a little later.

And then the brand died.

Now if M&M do a "retro revival" a la Bullet, I think they'll have to seriously change all the mechanicals and engine and brakes and all the rest of it. How they will quite do that while still preserving the inimitable Yezdi sound, I don't know.

And at what price they will introduce it to make it a desirable motorbike for nostalgia prone enthusiasts, is anybody's guess!

Tough task but I think M&M will think it through and pull it off!
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Old 31st October 2016, 09:59   #55
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Originally Posted by shankar.balan View Post
Now if M&M do a "retro revival" a la Bullet, I think they'll have to seriously change all the mechanicals and engine and brakes and all the rest of it.

How they will quite do that while still preserving the inimitable Yezdi sound, I don't know.

Not possible. The Yezdi/Jawa were the 2 strokes... and the era of 2 strokes have London ended.

Expecting similar sound and 2 stroke performance is not possible.

Mahindra would have to find some other way to leverage the Jawa brand

Last edited by payeng : 31st October 2016 at 10:02.
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Old 31st October 2016, 11:29   #56
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Default Re: Mahindra is bringing Jawa back

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But even Yezdi had to concede the battleground to Suzuki and Honda because even then, the latter two wiped the floor with Yezdi when it came to economy, practicality and maintenance.
Exactly, now we have so many established names that are offering almost everything. And these guys are the best at what they do..KTM=Performance, Bajaj=VFM, Honda=Reliability, Refinement etc so where does Jawa come in? And if you want to just launch a competetive bike whats the point in bidding for the Jawa name?
If they think Jawa will do big numbers im afraid i dont see that. My unscientific guess is if the product is good(looks, features, performance & quality) and the price is right, it will eat into Mojos share and maybe dent the RE upto 30%. But expect RE to comeback stronger. Wow! It can only get better for us.
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Old 1st November 2016, 21:26   #57
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Default Re: Mahindra is bringing Jawa back

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Originally Posted by anjan_c2007 View Post
The Mahindra- Jeep/ Willys/ Kaiser Corporation collaboration was pretty successful. Its only when Chrysler acquired Brand Jeep that the collaboration with Mahindra was over and called off, due to the then government's extant policies of indigenisation.....
Slightly off-topic: If I am not mistaken, Chrysler ended the collaboration with Mahindra because Mahindra chose to tie-up with Ford to manufacture cars instead of (with) Chrysler!

Chrysler had apparently been wooing Mahindra for quite sometime since they wanted to enter the Indian car market, but Mahindra thought fit marry Ford instead - not that the marriage lasted long!

But thanks to Chrysler walking out from Mahindra, we lost the beautiful Jeep branding on the Mahindras

Last edited by cpbopanna : 1st November 2016 at 21:27.
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Old 1st November 2016, 21:55   #58
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Default Re: Mahindra is bringing Jawa back

If I remember right, the Jawa (Yezdi) had two USPs - kick starter doubling as gear shifter and interchangeable front/rear wheels. Had excellent pick-up and a very distinctive sound, due to the twin silencers.

Everything else can be reproduced, but the sound of that two stroke can't be. It won't sell if it is Jawa in name alone.
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Old 2nd November 2016, 07:32   #59
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Default Re: Mahindra is bringing Jawa back

Quite correct; and the rear wheel removal did not require the chain to be disturbed at all. The thread patterns were different, but one could think of bolting a spare for long distance rides where the crash bar was otherwise mounted.

It also did not need the battery to run - only the horn would not work with a missing battery. In the last two years that it was with a financially constrained me at the time, I lived without one and was probably a better rider for not using the horn!

Aren't two stroked banned now though - that bit can't be reproduced then.

And like I said, even in its heyday, the "Real men ride a Bullet" thing did exist.

Last edited by Sawyer : 2nd November 2016 at 07:34.
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Old 2nd November 2016, 17:46   #60
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Default Re: Mahindra is bringing Jawa back

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Aren't two stroked banned now though - that bit can't be reproduced then.
Its not that the two strokers are banned, its just that they are not efficient in their emissions when compared to four stroker. Two Stroke technology did not progress as the US (which was the primary market back in 70s) came out with stringent laws in the late 70's and rest of world followed soon.

Yes, Yezdi were unique in the sense you could swap the front and rear tires just like how you would do in a scooter.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sawyer View Post
Here's the thing - in India, the Yezdi wasn't a lifestyle product,

I can't see them now being able to be lifestyle products either. The brand has no aura around it.
Please don't take me to be a Yezdi Bhakt, but I do not see any problem if they want to enter the market as a lifestyle product.

Remember HD Vs Indian...Even though Indian is technically more advanced they are unable to outsell HD. But still they have their own set of loyal ownerbase.

In other words, as long as there is place in the market, then am sure Jawa will still sell. Might not do ground breaking numbers as RE but am sure they will have their own space under the sun.
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