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Old 12th November 2012, 10:25   #181
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Default Re: Why Enfield Bullet?

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Originally Posted by MHG View Post
Once upon a time, if you wanted to buy a bike that was big and comfortable (I'm 6' and heavy built and the midget sized rides very popular here hurt my legs), suitable for being taken for long rides, etc there were few other options to choose from and among them RE was the best. But today, except for the low revving high displacement engine that produces a very sublime thump sound, it has nothing against competition in the same price range. Bullets last a lifetime they say, but the total cost of ownership is enough to equal that of 2-3 of these modern "plastic bikes". A lot of bikes today are equally comfortable, if not more. This may not be rightful comparison in the eyes of RE fans, but I test rode a Suzuki GS150R and it felt like a 2-wheeled Rolls Royce and was capable of doing everything that a Bullet did, performed as well and cost much less both to buy and to maintain. Then there is the set of niggles that come with every Royal Enfield that we are told are part of the "experience" and told that "if you take care of the bike, it takes care of you". This much is true for every bike. If I'd buy any bike and take care of it really well and pamper it, it too will definitely last a lifetime.

I'm not biased against Royal Enfields in general. I used to love them and still do. I just don't find the products appealing enough for me to spend my hard earned money on. If I pay 130k for a bike, it should be totally niggle free and have a premium service.
Well let me tell you something, admit it that the Bullet is NOT for you. Also from your post I can see that you have very limited knowledge about this bike else why would you compare a minnow 150cc Suzuki GS(no offence to suzuki owners here) with EFI to an oldschool carb 350 bullet. Also it confuses me when you say you can buy 2 to 3 "plastic bikes" at the behest of a Bullet's cost of ownership, when you yourself have bought a "plastic bike", what is your point?

Also this line is highly confusing "If I'd buy any bike and take care of it really well and pamper it, it too will definitely last a lifetime." We all as Bullet Owners do that and we have seen Bullets changing hands from grandfathers to fathers and fathers to sons and so on... I dont think any other bikes lasts more than 2 generations(it is actually 1 generation with an exception of few like Suzuki Shogun, Yamaha RD350, RX100, etc.) but hey remember that RE was born when the above mentioned bikes weren't even conceptualized. These bikes though are from RE's era and you will still find them running(Triumph, Norton, BSA, etc.) albeit a very few. It is imperative that you will not like the Bullet coz you want a "niggle free" bike, you can always get one the market is flooded with these nowadays.

Your line "I used to love them and still do." is also confusing. The Bullet doesn't appeals to you rendering your above statement as false. There are only two things, you either like a bullet or you don't. Decide on one of these.

Who's asking you to pay 130k for a bullet when you can get a used one for half that price and do it up as per your liking. If only, but?

It shows that you are justifying your likeness for the Suzuki GS150 when you say this statement "I test rode a Suzuki GS150R and it felt like a 2-wheeled Rolls Royce and was capable of doing everything that a Bullet did" Again if you like the Suzuki GS150 good for you but you comparing the GS150 to a Bullet shows that you know nothing about the Bullet. You came to a conclusion about a bike just by one test drive. Ok let me ask you something.

1. Does the Suzuki GS150 do 20 KMPH in 4th gear?
2. What is the bottom end/low end torque delivery, does it deliver bottom end torque instantly like a Bullet?
3. Have you taken it uphill over a steep incline with a pillion and full load, if yes how did it perform in comparison to a Bullet?

There are many more questions that I can ask, but I will stop here. I don't want any answers for these as I already know. You have to ask all these questions to yourself, then it will give you an answer as to why Enfield Bullet?

You might call me a Bullet Fanatic, but let me tell you Brother my blood boils when people try to compare Bullet with today's generation bikes. I ride a 1996 CI 350 and off lately acquired a 1961 G2 Engine(England Made) Bullet 350.
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Old 12th November 2012, 10:57   #182
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Navin, your post indicates your passion for the Bullet.
Bullet is a legend and has die hard fans like yourself.
What is disappointing to new buyers and aficionados is that the value proposition of a Bullet is quite poor. For a bike that has been around this long, Enfield is doing a poor job of maintaining quality. when people spend upwards of 1 lakh rupees on a bike, they expect a premium bike. Bullet is only premium when it comes to price. The quality and service are very under par. Like for any legend, there will always be Bullet fanboys, but for what it offers today, there won't be many new buyers happy with a Bullet.
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Old 12th November 2012, 11:59   #183
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Default Re: Why Enfield Bullet?

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Originally Posted by vroomsome View Post
Navin, your post indicates your passion for the Bullet.
Bullet is a legend and has die hard fans like yourself.
What is disappointing to new buyers and aficionados is that the value proposition of a Bullet is quite poor. For a bike that has been around this long, Enfield is doing a poor job of maintaining quality. when people spend upwards of 1 lakh rupees on a bike, they expect a premium bike. Bullet is only premium when it comes to price. The quality and service are very under par. Like for any legend, there will always be Bullet fanboys, but for what it offers today, there won't be many new buyers happy with a Bullet.
Agreed dude, all I am saying is people cannot and should not compare a Bullet with modern bikes. Thanks to RE INDIA that the quality levels are compromised. I blame RE INDIA for this. I am specifically talking about the original CI 350 bullets based on the British underpinnings while it was still a part of Enfield England. While I myself ride both of these bikes 1996 350 standard CI(RE India) and 1961 G2 350 CI which I recently acquired(again not RE but Enfield India tooling, engines, parts, etc. from England and assembled in India) both these bikes are very different in terms of quality, ofcourse the 1961 model is much better overall. I have read a lot of horror stories of RE owners in this forum as well as elsewhere. Believe me Brother, I bought my first motorcycle in 2010 and that was RE 1996 350 CI. I had never ridden any motorcycle before that. After I rode the bullet I felt like this was made for me. Initially I had to face a lot of problems like kicking it about 20-30 time to start it, constant starting problems, tappet noise, etc. the list was endless. But then I started listening to the bike like it was communicating to me(like Bumblebee in The Transformers) and I haven't looked back since then, the bike starts in first kick, it rides like a charm and haven't given me any issues. I was also going to buy a new bike in 2010 but the Bullet Bug had bit me in 2003 but was unable to afford it then. In 2010 I bought the bullet wihout any second thoughts and am not regretting my decision and probably never will.

Why am I telling all this, coz I not only ride but live Bullet 350. No doubt the modern bikes do offer quality and reliability at low cost or same cost(read Yamaha R15, CBR 250, Pulsar 220, 200 NS, KTM Duke, etc.) but a true, genuine, loyal Enfield Bullet rider will always ride the Bullet. I might buy a Harley or Triumph in the future but I will never part with my Bullet 350's(1996 & 1961) EVER.

Navin_V8
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Old 12th November 2012, 17:19   #184
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Default Re: Why Enfield Bullet?

Quote:
Originally Posted by navin_v8 View Post
1. Does the Suzuki GS150 do 20 KMPH in 4th gear?
2. What is the bottom end/low end torque delivery, does it deliver bottom end torque instantly like a Bullet?
3. Have you taken it uphill over a steep incline with a pillion and full load, if yes how did it perform in comparison to a Bullet?
1. Even today's Enfields cannot emulate this feat :(
2. low RPM torque is pretty low in today's enfield.
3. 1st gear required in today's enfield to climb up slopes.

It's sad to see that the progress being made to make Enfield more "reliable" is also causing it to lose it's identity (and I am not talking about reliability aspect).

http://www.indiancarsbikes.in/motorc...-engine-34402/
Check out the comments section in the bottom of the page.

Last edited by alpha1 : 12th November 2012 at 17:27.
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Old 12th November 2012, 18:49   #185
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Default Re: Why Enfield Bullet?

Quote:
Originally Posted by navin_v8 View Post
1. Does the Suzuki GS150 do 20 KMPH in 4th gear?
2. What is the bottom end/low end torque delivery, does it deliver bottom end torque instantly like a Bullet?
3. Have you taken it uphill over a steep incline with a pillion and full load, if yes how did it perform in comparison to a Bullet?

HI Navin,i have a few questions. but before is start. I would like to mentioned that i have two Bullets and i have been riding bullets for Many years now if i put then in number then around 12 years. that thats almost half my age. i dont ride bullet but i too live them and i am not affraid of experimenting and accepting its faults and if possible correct them.

my first question that is based on your question.

1. Does the Suzuki GS150 do 20 KMPH in 4th gear?

Why does one need to do 20 in 4th gear? what do you want to prove?

2. What is the bottom end/low end torque delivery, does it deliver bottom end torque instantly like a Bullet?

I have other bikes (Yamaha RX, Yamaha RD 350, Karizma, Pulsar 220) and yes they are way better than in Torque Delivery when compared with Bullet.


I just want to know why is bullet even compared to the New bikes, why dont the So called Hardcore bullet guys just understand that they cannot compare themselves with the new bikes.
3. Have you taken it uphill over a steep incline with a pillion and full load, if yes how did it perform in comparison to a Bullet?
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Old 13th November 2012, 13:12   #186
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Smile Re: Why Enfield Bullet?

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Originally Posted by kph View Post
Why you love the 'Bull' so much?
I’ve seen people who ride for the sake of riding and that's because of the only reason that it's a “Bull”. Some are so much fond of old classics, anyway not to keep it as an antique in their showcase but to maintain and ride it. Some even say it’s a way of life, passion, attachment…. The list is endless…
What brings you so close to a Bull..?
Is it its thump?
not necessarily for me , but this is a 'Practical ' classic -- one can have the feel yet you dont need to Hunt for parts .
this was a sheer fantasy at the age of 18 , just a fantasy which was possible , which could be bought brand new.

Quote:
Is it the Power?
Japs are faster & good power to weight ratio than this

Quote:
Is it the Size?
Is it because it’s heavy?
Not impressed , its bit inconvenient

Quote:
Is it because it’s a Legend??
May be

Quote:
Is it the overall beauty?
Yep , yes it is in its own way the black & chrome near naked style ( in todays standards ) & the no plastic iron horse this is .

Quote:
Is it because it’s a nonstop rider?
Hope so , yet to prove to myself

Quote:
Is it individuality you feel when you ride it?
yes thats my need it completes

I have used a Yezdi for 27 yrs on all roads , In all seasons & times .I like all metal Iron horses , not plastic toys ( which may run fast ) , I like overall repair-ability ( typical old style Britt / European ) the CI std 350 provides exactly that . Its strength is tested & I am sure it will last like the Yezdi on all kinds of roads .

yes its not like the Jap bikes which are reliable more , but I can face it , I do my own repair /maintenance jobs ( including tyres ) so no worries.

But the last word is , as I read in one of the posts ; Childhood Fantasy

Sudarshan
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Old 13th November 2012, 14:18   #187
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I ride a May 2012 Classic 500 Desert Storm and quite frankly I don't know why I got an Enfield. I test rode all the bikes available in the market, but it was the Enfield which had hit the sweet spot.

Its heavy, it vibrates, the paint quality sucks, screws come loose often, maintaining the matte paint of the Desert Storm is a pain. But I ride it everyday, caress it everyday like its my child, my classmates love it, no matter how many times my professors ask me in disgust to leave the class but I always get a thumbs-up from them in the parking lot, I am often asked plenty of questions in traffic about my bike, at times I have even noticed people clicking pics of my bike while its parked.

One thing which I really love about my bike is the humongous torque. It feels planted at 70-80 kph on the highway and then you twist the wrist and it overtakes with such gusto. The thump, oh yes, it is brilliant. No matter for the price, the CBR250 would have been a better bike for me but then I would have never enjoyed situations where people exclaim in disbelief "Paanch sou see see...baap re".

My mom still believes I got my bike straight out of a battlefield from Iraq.
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Old 14th November 2012, 08:16   #188
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Talking Re: Why Enfield Bullet?

Got a friend's STD 350 for test ride ,
Wife Loved the back seat comfort --- another reason to get a bullet

I hardly ride as pillion ,so I dont know if its really comfortable for the passenger ( have no comparison for ) -but Is it so ?? Can anyone confirm my claim ?

Sudarshan
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Old 14th November 2012, 10:00   #189
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Default Re: Why Enfield Bullet?

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Originally Posted by desideep View Post
HI Navin,i have a few questions. but before is start. I would like to mentioned that i have two Bullets and i have been riding bullets for Many years now if i put then in number then around 12 years. that thats almost half my age. i dont ride bullet but i too live them and i am not affraid of experimenting and accepting its faults and if possible correct them.

my first question that is based on your question.

1. Does the Suzuki GS150 do 20 KMPH in 4th gear?

Why does one need to do 20 in 4th gear? what do you want to prove?

2. What is the bottom end/low end torque delivery, does it deliver bottom end torque instantly like a Bullet?

I have other bikes (Yamaha RX, Yamaha RD 350, Karizma, Pulsar 220) and yes they are way better than in Torque Delivery when compared with Bullet.


I just want to know why is bullet even compared to the New bikes, why dont the So called Hardcore bullet guys just understand that they cannot compare themselves with the new bikes.
3. Have you taken it uphill over a steep incline with a pillion and full load, if yes how did it perform in comparison to a Bullet?
Well Desideep I respect your opinions but I have to say this again and again that you have very limited knowledge about "bikes" and Bullet. Let me answer your answers first:

Answer 1:
Why does one need to do 20 in 4th gear? what do you want to prove?

One doesn't deliberately do 20KMPH in 4th gear it just happens coz the Bullets' CI engine with a heavy flywheel/crank is capable of that, and mind you this is not a flaw but a feature. Originally the Bullet was made for narrow city and country roads of England and not to forget the design dates back to World War II. Understand that it was a bike extensively used by the military during the war era which required motorcyles to have this kind of engineering to take on the punishing terrains. Heavy crank played a vital role here while pulling the Bullet from as low as 20KMPH with full load and a side car attached. Our very own Indian military have been using the bullet in all the past battles (read war with Pakistan in 1947, 1965 and 1971) in the desert, cold rocky mountains, inexistent roads, etc. The Bullet was chosen by the Indian Military as a Patrol bike in 1949 after extensive testing. And YES heavy crank was one of the factors that enabled the Bullet to carry heavy loads and chug at 20KMPH on fourth gear. I am telling as this coz of my Uncles(dad's elder brother) has served in the Indian Army in "The Corps of Signals" division and I've got this information from the man himself who said the Bullet was extensively used for reconnainsance due to its rugged features and capacity to haul at extremely low speeds over punishing terrain.

Answer 2:
I have other bikes (Yamaha RX, Yamaha RD 350, Karizma, Pulsar 220) and yes they are way better than in Torque Delivery when compared with Bullet.

Really that's quite a number of bikes you have. Again I repeat myself you have no knowledge about bikes. The first two bikes you've mentioned are two stroke bikes and moreover RD350 is a twin cylinder engine. Karizma and Pulsar are the 21st century bikes with EFI and twinspark incase of P220. The torque delivery of these bikes if compared with the modern UCE Bullets is less. But I am here talking about the "bottom end/low end torque delivery" and CI 350 Standard has a bottom end torque delivery better than any of these, the bottom end torque delivery of a bullet starts at idling RPM which might be roughly around 800 or so. First understand the dynamics of a big single cylinder push rod heavy crank engine and then talk.

You have got no answer for my answer 3 so I will pass it as you read the above two paragraphs you will get the answer.

"I just want to know why is bullet even compared to the New bikes, why dont the So called Hardcore bullet guys just understand that they cannot compare themselves with the new bikes."

Reply to the above paragraph: That's exactly what I am saying why is the bullet compared to modern new bikes when it belongs to a completely different era and has its own legacy which is respected by Bullet enthusiasts like Me. The new bikes aren't worthy of being compared with the iconic Bullet which dates back to our Grandfather's era and still running. I won't be able to comment on the UCE Bullets as I've ridden a friends Thunderbird Twinspark just once. My above comments are specific to the iconic Standard 350 Cast Iron.
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Old 14th November 2012, 10:50   #190
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Hi Sudarshan,

I've taken some people pillion on my Bullet including my sister, cousin brothers and myself. All were happy with the ride and comfort. Infact I as a rider felt more comfortable while riding when there is a pillion.

I myself have sat pillion on my own bike and one thunderbird. The Tbird was very comfortable, also when I sat on my bike as a pillion I didn't get any cramps as I usually get while sitting on other bikes, it was comfortable. I dont know about the comfort in rear gas shock absorbers though which is a norm nowadays coz I have conventional oil filled rear shock absorbers(Armstrong brand).

One more thing I forgot to mention in my earlier post for Desideep. Let me post it here instead of adding another reply. Desideep the Bullet is actually a Warhorse disguised as a Workhorse. Also I wanted to say one more thing about lowend/bottom end torque. As I had mentioned the low end torque enabled the Bullet to pull itself(apprx 180 kgs), rider(apprx 60-65 kgs), materials(apprx 30-35 kgs) surpassing quarter ton without adding the side carrier and additional materials. It was able to carry or may I say haul this weight from idling thanks to its enormous low end torque that enabled it to have enough pulling power at such a low rpm with a small blip from the throttle.

Let me give you a real life example that happened when I and a group of friends went on a picnic to the infamous Erangal Beach in Bombay. It's a challenge to get to the beach as you have to muddle through narrow village hutments. I along with another friend had a bullet he had a Tbird. And the rest 4 of them had other bikes. As we were coming back two bikes got stuck in dry sand and were stranded. We had some ropes lying there maybe used by the local fishermen. I took one of the ropes and tied to to the rear end of my bullet and the front end of the bike that got stuck. The instant I engaged the first gear and mildly blipped the throttle the Bullet awesome low end torque kicked in and we were able to pull out that stranded bike out of the dry sand at such low rpm. My friend with his Tbird pulled out the other bike but he had to turn the throttle more than I did at a higher RPM.

I am not here to justify that Bullet is the best motorcycle ever and no other bike is like it. Ofcourse there are better bikes but each has its own strength. I acknowledge the other bikes supremacy but also know what they can't do and the Bullet can.
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Old 14th November 2012, 10:57   #191
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Talking Re: Why Enfield Bullet?

It may be

But Logic ! Dreams , Fantasies, Affection , Addiction , Passion -- have NO logic .

Part of my childhood dream of Bullet ( read age 15 & above ) was collecting anything related to Bullet

Here to share something , some part of it

Why Enfield Bullet?-dscn3873a.jpg

this is perhaps the reason why we are on the Forum ,Just Passion ,no reason

Sudarshan
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Old 14th November 2012, 11:38   #192
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I have been riding for over 22 years now. initially when I started out, I used to ride a Yezdi and then moved on to a Yamaha. Now a days I drive a car as I do not consider riding a bike every day as practical and safe in Delhi/ NCR traffic.

The choice of my earlier bikes was dictated by my pocket and the use I put them to. The modern day Jap. Indian/ European bikes available in India are great commuters (except for a few high end models). They are reliable and require minimal maintenance, are easy to use in heavy traffic and are highly fuel efficient. Over the last 10-12 years, I have been using my bike sparingly on weekends to run short errands. It has been very relaible and efficient and the only parts I have changed are a set of tyres, a chain sprocket set, some batteries and air filters. The Yam is still on its original spart plug and control cables.

I am nearing 38 yars of age. My current bike is efficient but lacks character. it is at best an appliance. I have now gone in for a RE thunderbird 500 and have only had this bike for the last 3 days but have enjoyed every bit of it. I now ride becasuse I "like to ride" rather than "have to ride" and may be categorised as a "recreational biker."

The TB oozes of character, presence and attitude. In the last 3 days the I have been riding this bike, it has drawn a lot of smiles from the fellow road users ( across age groups). This is something that I have never experienced before.

When you buy a RE, you buy into a lifestyle and brotherhood. No other bike/car evokes such passion in India ( Harley Davidson does so abroad).Riding this sinflr cyllinder thumper is an experience. The TB may be different from the tradional RE's and may not appeal to the purists. However, it has good brakes and electricals,along with EFI and gearshift lever on the LHS and the brake lever on the RHS. This is REML's bid to make it more appealing to the newer crowd who are not die hard fanatics. Those who appreciate the bike but would want the modern day features as well. Going y by the initial response, they have been largely successful>

My bike has cost me more than 2.3 times of what a 18-200 CC modern day bike manufactured in india would cost. However, in my opinion it is worth every penny. FInances permitting, I may go in for a Harley Davidson or a Triumph, but the RE Thunderbird will be a part of my garage for a long- long time.


To summarise, I is not right to comapare the two genres of bikes, each ahs their own place under the sun.

I can recall the old TVC from RE : "yeha bullet meri jaan".
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Old 14th November 2012, 15:45   #193
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Default Re: Why Enfield Bullet?

Quote:
Originally Posted by navin_v8 View Post
Let me give you a real life example that happened when I and a group of friends went on a picnic to the infamous Erangal Beach in Bombay. It's a challenge to get to the beach as you have to muddle through narrow village hutments. I along with another friend had a bullet he had a Tbird. And the rest 4 of them had other bikes. As we were coming back two bikes got stuck in dry sand and were stranded.
Since we are talking real life incidents here, let me share one.

Heard of a place called Dhanushkodi? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dhanushkodi
I have not seen any other vehicle but old Mahindra 4WDs go there, carrying passengers but it was my dream to touch that cornerstone of the country with Don (my Electra) and I rode to Rameshwaram to try it.

Once I reached the end of the tar road(which is where all the vehicles are parked), all I could see was a vast expanse of dry, soft sand. I asked the Navy personnel to show me the trail and they said that the best way for me is to follow a 4WD at some distance and reach the land's end.

I was skeptical but decided to wait for a jeep.

In sometime, a jeep with 5 people began to drive into the sand and I followed it all the way to the dilapidated Church, the railway station and the last possible point. I could not make it to the beach since it is at a slope after the land ends.
People who have been to the place would know it.

As I was taking in the views and enjoying my achievement when the driver came up to me and sarcastically said:
"Saar, if you get stuck here, you will have to walk all the way, and call one of us to pull you out. We will charge you 3000.00".
I told him that I was prepared for the worst and kept quiet.



Since I knew the way back now, I spent as much time as I wanted to and then started back on my own.

The last leg between the sand and the tar road is a slope of sand, much like a sand dune, full of soft sand and these jeeps too go up the slope with a lot of momentum and barely manage to make it, sliding and swerving all over the place, much to the excitement of the passengers.

When I reached the beginning of the slope, I could see that Jeep driver and his accomplice looking at me with a wicked gleam in their eyes.

I put Don in second gear, build up speed (around 30kmph) and he clambered up the slope like it was his daily walk.

As I parked on the road and was dusting myself, I overheard the driver's accomplice telling him:
"I told you it will come out on its own. It is a Bullet."

Let the thump continue...
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Old 15th November 2012, 11:05   #194
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Default Re: Why Enfield Bullet?

An old Bullet Advertisement , had a certain impact on my mind

Here to share




None of the other ads had such impact on me , may be its the easy music

Sudarshan

P S ; dear bhp support , please delete this post if the link has already been posted on this thread or is off topic .
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Old 15th November 2012, 12:37   #195
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Default Re: Why Enfield Bullet?

I have encountered a similar query many a times. I am still not able to find a suitable answer to " Why a Bullet?". Only those who owns one knows the reason. I have see that all Bull Owners develop an emotional bond with the bullet and I am no different.

When I joined for a job, I had been driving a 100cc. My office is in a 14 storied building. For two years I have been coming in and out of the building and I was just a commoner there. But the day I bought my Bullet, every tom dick and harry that used to pass by me started coming forward and ask details on the bike. After that day all used to give be a good smile as I pass by. Have had many such experiences like this.

My Wife calls my bullet as " your girlfriend" . At least in this case, she does not get jealous when I drool over a "girl" .

No offense meant, but I am not too happy about loosing the "select few" image after the launch of the UCE bullet. With the old CI engine, it was a privilege. Anyhow...more the merrier.
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