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Old 8th November 2017, 21:05   #61
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Default Re: Royal Enfield unveils Interceptor & Continental 650 with new twin-cylinder engine

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Originally Posted by deevee View Post
I think he also said something which effectively meant that when enough quantity is to be produced then only they will produce in India. I guess it will be a long wait for the people in India who would want this.

Rgds
The long wait is a blessing in disguise considering how they handled the quality and testing for the Himalayan. Let them fix all the issues. We will wait.

Last edited by Torqy : 8th November 2017 at 21:07.
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Old 9th November 2017, 09:45   #62
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Default Re: Royal Enfield unveils Interceptor & Continental 650 with new twin-cylinder engine

I am not too excited by what RE is now trying to offer the Indian public after having tasted technology that RE will perhaps take decades to achieve. If they price it below 3 lacs, it may have a chance to do reasonably well. But seriously, a 47 HP twin, air cooled with oil cooler, and they are trying to pass it as something very new and revolutionary, is just taking us for a ride. We have much better products now available in India at just a slight premium. Prospective buyers must make a informed decision, and I am not one of them.

Cheers...
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Old 9th November 2017, 10:18   #63
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Default Re: Royal Enfield unveils Interceptor & Continental 650 with new twin-cylinder engine

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...But seriously, a 47 HP twin, air cooled with oil cooler, and they are trying to pass it as something very new and revolutionary, is just taking us for a ride.
Well RE has not called this revolutionary, nor are they trying to impress us with the spec sheet. But what they are rather very vocal about, is that these motorcycles would actually be very ride-able. The stress-free, easy going nature is what they wanted to achieve, and that I hope is what the Royal Enfield DNA is all about... So a motorcycle that would not intimidate new riders, and would still provide pure motorcycling for the experienced riders is what this new 650 twins' focus.
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Old 9th November 2017, 10:23   #64
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Default Re: Royal Enfield unveils Interceptor & Continental 650 with new twin-cylinder engine

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Originally Posted by dkaile View Post
I am not too excited by what RE is now trying to offer the Indian public after having tasted technology that RE will perhaps take decades to achieve. If they price it below 3 lacs, it may have a chance to do reasonably well. But seriously, a 47 HP twin, air cooled with oil cooler, and they are trying to pass it as something very new and revolutionary, is just taking us for a ride. We have much better products now available in India at just a slight premium. Prospective buyers must make a informed decision, and I am not one of them.
Cheers...
There is no way this will be priced bellow 3 lakhs. Even bellow 4 lakhs will be a miracle. While the tech is definitely not new or revolutionary, I don't agree that we have better products at slight premium. I was looking to upgrade my D390 and my only next choices are Z650 or Street 750 both of which are north of 6lakh on road. There is huge dearth of bikes in 3 lakh to 6 lakh range. IMO the Interceptor with expected flat torque curve will be very ideal for Indian conditions.
Having said that, with RE reliability, I am not considering these bikes either whatsoever the price.

Last edited by timuseravan : 9th November 2017 at 10:32.
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Old 9th November 2017, 10:33   #65
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Default Re: Royal Enfield unveils Interceptor & Continental 650 with new twin-cylinder engine

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Originally Posted by aravind.anand View Post
So a motorcycle that would not intimidate new riders, and would still provide pure motorcycling
These are nice words, but a 4-5 Lac rupees motorcycle for NEW riders is stretching your imagination a bit for Indian conditions. We are not in the US of A. And yes RE reliability and it's tendency to make guinea pigs out of customers is now a well known fact. But as they say, you can fool all the people some of the time, and some of the people all the time, but you cannot fool all the people all the time. As a former RE owner of multiple bikes, I would advise people to wait and watch.

Cheers...
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Old 9th November 2017, 10:41   #66
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A nice used japanese ninja 650 under 20k kms run, 3 or 4 years old for 3.5 lakhs in most cities. Are you kidding me? Totally agree with dhiraj here.
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Old 9th November 2017, 12:30   #67
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Default Re: Royal Enfield unveils Interceptor & Continental 650 with new twin-cylinder engine

The competition to RE classic pattern(Classic, INT, CGT, Bullet) would be similar level products from other brands like the Yamaha SR, Honda CB, Kawa W, Bonnies & such. Why would anyone compare it to ninjas of the world? Is it because displacement is similar? That doesn't cut it since the usage style & aspirations of its customers are poles apart.

A person aspiring to own a classic pattern for whatsoever their reasons be won't even glance at a modern sleek. I'm one such. Gift me a ninja & I'd sell it & get a classic design first thing. I'm not necessarily talking RE here. There are many more like me.

RE gets the sale because they give such designs at affordable rates with decent quality, clearly not the best but manageable. That 'heritage' is also a thing & they do try to keep that DNA intact in their own ways. They've won in this aspect which no amount of bumhurt gonna patch.

These are like reincarnations from a bygone era which people still find desirable. 7lacs+ sales by RE last year is no small feat for a brand belting out 'unusual' models. Those customers could've easily bought ninjas instead but one has to alter the past for that to happen. They don't seem to care for the vibes from a repackaged 50+ year old engine tech either which surprisingly does work. 650 twins should be better in this regard but I for one wouldn't want it all to go away.

Any brand is free to bring in proper competition & take this special pie in part or in full from RE. None's doing that so far, & the one's that do price it outside the mass's reach. But it should never go unsaid that a Bajaj or Hero can't bring in an honest 'classic' motorcycle, it's simply not there in their bloodline. A BSA or Java can, something these brands figured out already.

Also a food for thought would be a Thumper without its thump or an HD without its burble. The Japs would keep on whining as they do now. That time isn't far away.
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Old 9th November 2017, 12:56   #68
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Default Re: Royal Enfield unveils Interceptor & Continental 650 with new twin-cylinder engine

RE is back , meaning i think is not to compete with ktm, ninja or xyz , rather the twin is back . Twin is not new for RE as a company , it was there more than 50 years ago. RE had a couple of parallel twins , 500cc twin , meteor and interceptor .

RE, Triumph, Matchless , Norton , Bsa , Ariel , etc had twins and were on par with each other in one way or another and better than the Harleys of that time. These twins had that distinct beating, character , torque curve and wonderful distinctive looks. Its ridiculous to compare this with anything other than maybe the Truimph retro series motorcycles or the soon to be out BSA by Mahindra .

Only concern is quality and how they maintain it , going by the price of old British twins which is a minimum 7 and upwards , this is a good buy below 5 lakhs provided its flawless.

Wonder when Norton and Ariel will be launched again, ohh forgot the Panther

Last edited by Frankenstein : 9th November 2017 at 13:06.
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Old 9th November 2017, 14:39   #69
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Default Re: Royal Enfield unveils Interceptor & Continental 650 with new twin-cylinder engine

Yeah, and then they will ask you to take in your brand new 500kms ridden RE, get it's brand new engine opened, change a few parts, and Yes Saar, we have changed the rocker arms, now the knocking will be gone. And as a RE enthusiast I will keep on singing praises and hiding it's flaws. I have been through that road mate. Now imagine the same being done by a Honda or a Kawasaki or a Harley or a Triumph? Would you forgive them? No Sir, but for RE.... ALL SINS FORGIVEN. Because we love the 2 lac rupee Thumpers!! Is that a rational excuse?

I urge people to wait and not be guinea pigs. But then it's your hard earned money. Cheers...

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Old 9th November 2017, 14:49   #70
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Default Re: Royal Enfield unveils Interceptor & Continental 650 with new twin-cylinder engine

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Originally Posted by SandyX View Post

A person aspiring to own a classic pattern for whatsoever their reasons be won't even glance at a modern sleek. I'm one such. Gift me a ninja & I'd sell it & get a classic design first thing. I'm not necessarily talking RE here. There are many more like me.

RE gets the sale because they give such designs at affordable rates with decent quality, clearly not the best but manageable. That 'heritage' is also a thing & they do try to keep that DNA intact in their own ways. They've won in this aspect which no amount of bumhurt gonna patch.
Well said. REs are by no means the perfect motorcycles. They have their disadvantages, they have quality issues but by far nothing that is not manageable. Any other company which can offer modern classics at similar price tags and better quality can definitely win big in the market.

Well coming to the recent launch, for somebody like me who dreams to own a Bonneville someday, RE Interceptor650 sounds very very interesting. Because, given the price of Bonneville, I don't think I can own that anytime soon. Also, the disadvantage with Bonneville for me is the unnecessary tech that I'll have to pay for. For example, I don't need different modes of riding. Let's just say I know how to ride in the rain.

But one thing that worries me is, on RE website there is a '*' at the bottom of specs sheet of Interceptor which says INT 650 is for US and Canada. It appears that RE has decided to keep CGT650 as slightly superior to INT650. Looking at so many similarities between the two, I hope they don't decide to drop ABS from INT650 in India.

If launched in India with same specs as announced yesterday, and priced right (Around 4.5L). I'll wait for RE to resolve their issues during the first year and buy it by 2019-20. That INT650 looks like a treat
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Old 9th November 2017, 16:32   #71
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Default Re: Royal Enfield unveils Interceptor & Continental 650 with new twin-cylinder engine

Forget 5, even at 4 lacs this purchase would be nothing short of moronic. 3 lacs and it will sell / deserves to sell

People - try and look through the dazzle of all that chrome and shiny paint. 5 lacs opens a whole different class of motorcycles for you, without the (perceived) gremlins
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Old 9th November 2017, 17:20   #72
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Default Re: Royal Enfield unveils Interceptor & Continental 650 with new twin-cylinder engine

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People - try and look through the dazzle of all that chrome and shiny paint. 5 lacs opens a whole different class of motorcycles for you, without the (perceived) gremlins
Umm, 5 lacs opens up what exactly? Used Bonnies, HDs, Versys, Ninjas?

If someone wants to buy a modern classic and their budget is around 5 lacs, what should they buy?

Not that I am inclined to buy this (I don't want to become a guinea pig), should I increase my budget and get a Bonnie, ST?

You speak like a knowledgeable rider, but our junta does not think on the same terms! Coupled with disposable incomes that people have, this is going to sell like anything at 4-4.5 lacs, 5 maybe a little less.

I have friends who have happily spent 2 lacs or so on a Classic 500, despite me telling them to buy a KTM/Dominar etc. They have only 1 requirement -- old school retro looks.

They don't care about anything else. And that is how the market decides the price.

RE knows this!

And milk they shall my good sir!
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Old 9th November 2017, 18:14   #73
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Default Re: Royal Enfield unveils Interceptor & Continental 650 with new twin-cylinder engine

There is a lot about these bikes so far that says "smart move" to me. By going for a 650cc displacement they have swerved direct comparison with Triumph & HD products, and 47bhp is absolutely spot on the power output limit for a European A2 bike license - not a coincidence. The bike was revealed in Europe, and will be launched in Europe too. IF (big if) these ride well and have that certain Enfield charm, they could be onto a real export winner. There simply isn't a relatively cheap credible twin cylinder retro in the A2 license market, it's wide open. You have to buy a bigger more expensive bike and have it restricted if you want multiple cylinders and genuine cool factor.

I'm not sure whether that means these are supposed to be primarily export models, or whether they are intended to be a big seller in India and the Euro launch and allignment is simply a strategy to control volume/quality and shake the bikes down in what is in some ways, a less demanding market.

It's clear from this forum that some people will never cut Enfield a break and unless they can deliver Triumph quality and performance with a Hero price tag, they will be criticised.

We cannot have it both ways. The Street 750 is made in India and I think, costs around 5 lac, the Duke 390 is also made in India and I think costs about 2.5 lac. If we want similar material and build quality to those bikes, then in terms of cost, it will need to be in between the two in price in India, as the material costs are much closer to the HD - but, it's 100cc and a few bhp short of the Street, and, it's not a Harley, so has to come in somewhere under that bike - it needs to be 10% cheaper at the same quality?

However, if Enfield have to knock them out at under 3.5 Lac to find buyers, because the perception is that Enfields are supposed to be cheap because they are not that well made, then it must be obvious that will be a little self-fulfilling, as it will be built to that price and quality will suffer accordingly? You'll get cheaper fasteners & switchgear, fewer layers of paint and chrome, nasty tyres, lower grade steel etc...

Some of you are quick to point to issues with the Himalayan, but that's a 1.65 lac bike - it was clearly made to a price to slot into the current single cylinder line up in India, and didn't meet export standards. They've had to go back and add injection and so on in order to sell it elsewhere where they didn't plan to sell it - yet there is demand! Maybe that was a missed opportunity in some ways - rather than slotting the model into the current Indian line up, if they had looked at the world market and gone with a bit more power, injection, ABS, better build quality and a higher price, that would be a clear statement of intent.

They have a fresh opportunity with these twin cylinder bikes, I hope they build them to Japanese/European standards, get their export markets ticking over nicely, then ease them into the Indian market at a controlled rate at a realistic rather than bargain basement price.

The volume sales can come later - take the basic frame/engine platform, and make an Indian market model called something else - keep the basic quality right, but cut the price by using cheaper parts on things that can be replaced and upgraded - seat, tyres, use cast wheels, no chrome etc... and pitch that model between the top of the single cylinder range and the Interceptor. That should be the 3.5 lac model, not these.

I am a proud Englishman who loves India and I am a real fan of Royal Enfield. The very first time I sat on a 350 classic in Goa, it just felt "right". I love the connection Enfield shares with 2 countries I love that have so much shared history. I was delighted when Enfield opened their R&D facility in the UK and renewed that connection. As the Tata-JLR tie up shows, together we can do great things. I wish Enfield all the best with these models and I can't wait to ride one, I am quite nervous to do so, I really really want it to be good... by good, I don't mean it has to be dynamically brilliant and built like a Triumph, I mean it has to move the soul. It has to make you feel like you want to walk away from the trials and tribulations of life, point it at the sunset, and open the throttle.

Fingers crossed!

Last edited by Rob UK : 9th November 2017 at 18:20.
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Old 9th November 2017, 18:21   #74
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Default Re: Royal Enfield unveils Interceptor & Continental 650 with new twin-cylinder engine

In looks and specs they are a match to the rest on the same grid. Launching it abroad first makes sense. Chain now comes back to the left hand side. It just didn't look right to me when they shifted the chain to the right hand side on the UCE 350/500.
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Old 9th November 2017, 18:28   #75
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Default Re: Royal Enfield unveils Interceptor & Continental 650 with new twin-cylinder engine

The RE Interceptor looks sweet to me ala Bonnie modern classics. If RE manages to build it without much niggles then it should do well. In a way its good that its launching first in the foreign markets as when it will reach India at least the known issues would be put to the rest. Pricing would be a key as well. Interesting times ahead!
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