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Old 24th December 2013, 10:42   #931
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Noob question, can a CI engined Bullet be jerkstarted?
Never tried it despite having one for 10 yrs plus now.
Yes you can. You can do on AVL engines as well. Not sure about UCE fuel injection.
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Old 24th December 2013, 12:06   #932
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Had another oveheating incident on my 500 yesterday on a short trip.
Was doing around 90-95 for around 100 kms and the weather was still cool. As soon as the sun was out and the the coolness disappeared, the engine started heating and finally started pinging and loosing power. After riding for around 30 kms with pinging and loss of power , finally stopped to see the rear half of the bike, including the frame and wheel dripping with engine oil.Checked the dipstick and it had no oil on it.
Let the bike cool down for a while and continued in slow speed which did not result in any further issues.

Topped up oil and it drank close to 2 litres! On the return , I kept it at 80 and as the sun went down and the weather turned cool, the engine was back to prime performance.
Realized, I have to reduce my cruising speed and stop frequently if I have to do any trips on this bike.
What I could'nt understand was how 2 litres of oil went missing. Most of the oil was pumped out through the breather , because of the pressure and heat in the crankcase and the rest vaporized?
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Old 24th December 2013, 14:31   #933
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Default Re: Royal Enfield Queries

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=O-JwZfLKX1U


I don't know if this is the best place to put it, mods please move it to where appropriate. I thought this was something people would enjoy, so decided to share

Note:If a mod could embed this video that would be great, can't seem to able to figure it out, instructions just say to insert the link - Referring to this post - "http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/announcements/45720-embedding-videos-into-your-posts.html"

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Old 24th December 2013, 14:41   #934
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Yes you can.
What about the decompression part. In case the ammeter is on the negative side would it still work?
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Old 24th December 2013, 15:08   #935
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As soon as the sun was out and the the coolness disappeared, the engine started heating and finally started pinging and loosing power. After riding for around 30 kms with pinging and loss of power , finally stopped to see the rear half of the bike, including the frame and wheel dripping with engine oil.Checked the dipstick and it had no oil on it.
Let the bike cool down for a while and continued in slow speed which did not result in any further issues.

What I could'nt understand was how 2 litres of oil went missing. Most of the oil was pumped out through the breather , because of the pressure and heat in the crankcase and the rest vaporized?
If the temperature inside the crank case increases there is a chance that the oil pressure builds up and it evaporates. In the old 500, is the crank breather pipe routed to the air filter? If so, the filter might have been drenched in oil and hence the loss of power and pinging.

BTW. Did you check if any stains of oil is there in the exhaust tip?
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Old 24th December 2013, 15:18   #936
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What about the decompression part. In case the ammeter is on the negative side would it still work?
When you push start a bike in gear, the piston is doing its normal cycle inside without a spark which also results in the valves doing its thing, so the decompression is taken care of with the valves opening and closing.
The cast iron with CB ignition may not start that easily by pushing it, but the CDI does start very easily, but anyway the CDI doesnt need a battery to run, but the CB and TCI ignition system does.

Quote:
Originally Posted by man_of_steel View Post
If the temperature inside the crank case increases there is a chance that the oil pressure builds up and it evaporates. In the old 500, is the crank breather pipe routed to the air filter? If so, the filter might have been drenched in oil and hence the loss of power and pinging.

BTW. Did you check if any stains of oil is there in the exhaust tip?
This a 96. The breather is to the chain which was why the complete rear part of the bike was drenched in oil.
There was no oil trace in the exhaust, it was running clean.
I guess the heat was so much that I just missed a engine seizure.
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Old 24th December 2013, 15:33   #937
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This a 96. The breather is to the chain which was why the complete rear part of the bike was drenched in oil.
There was no oil trace in the exhaust, it was running clean.
I guess the heat was so much that I just missed a engine seizure.
Do you think the engine is running lean and hence it is running hot with pinging and power loss?

And now I remember, My TBTS was oil thirsty for some time and the engine used to ping when accelerating on 5th gear. It was worn out clutch plates in my case.
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Old 24th December 2013, 16:01   #938
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Do you think the engine is running lean and hence it is running hot with pinging and power loss?

And now I remember, My TBTS was oil thirsty for some time and the engine used to ping when accelerating on 5th gear. It was worn out clutch plates in my case.
The tuning is correct. Had played with it quite a bit thinking that was the cause.
Moreover, if the tuning is off, the pinging should happen right from when the engine is running. In this case, the pinging starts when the engine heats up and the sun is out. I feel the heat is so much and that is cause of the pinging, basically the mixture exploding because of the heat before the sparking.

The clutch is a good point, mine is worn out, but not slipping. Will have to replace that and check.

Last edited by tharian : 24th December 2013 at 16:04.
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Old 25th December 2013, 10:51   #939
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Default Re: Royal Enfield Queries

Royally confused between Classic 350 or TBTS 350. I have booked both the bikes. Now i got a call that TBTS is allotted to me and can be delivered within 10 days if the payment is made. Now i don't know whether to go for TBTS or wait for 350. Please suggest.
Predominantly my usage will be city riding with very less long trips. The reason why TBTS looks good is because of the styling and all new added features like illuminated headlight,rear disc and digital odo. But classic retro style is unmatched with any bike. Seriously don't know what to do.

Last edited by rki2007 : 25th December 2013 at 10:53.
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Old 25th December 2013, 11:50   #940
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Royally confused between Classic 350 or TBTS 350. I have booked both the bikes. Now i got a call that TBTS is allotted to me and can be delivered within 10 days if the payment is made. Now i don't know whether to go for TBTS or wait for 350. Please suggest.
Predominantly my usage will be city riding with very less long trips. The reason why TBTS looks good is because of the styling and all new added features like illuminated headlight,rear disc and digital odo. But classic retro style is unmatched with any bike. Seriously don't know what to do.
Well, just decide if you want to see yourself on a Bullet or a TB.
Bullet like you said is what Enfield was all about before. You cannot look at the TB as a Bullet. TB is just another bike , of course its essentially the same with different clothing. If your not going to do too many trips, stick to the Bullet (Classic) since the new TB is made more for highway rides . I dont think you will miss much with the rear discs. but yes the digital odo and trip and fuel guage is an added bonus.
The Classic is a looker compared to TB according to me.
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Old 25th December 2013, 12:15   #941
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Originally Posted by tharian View Post
Had another oveheating incident on my 500 yesterday on a short trip.
Was doing around 90-95 for around 100 kms and the weather was still cool. As soon as the sun was out and the the coolness disappeared, the engine started heating and finally started pinging and loosing power. After riding for around 30 kms with pinging and loss of power , finally stopped to see the rear half of the bike, including the frame and wheel dripping with engine oil.Checked the dipstick and it had no oil on it.
Let the bike cool down for a while and continued in slow speed which did not result in any further issues.

Topped up oil and it drank close to 2 litres! On the return , I kept it at 80 and as the sun went down and the weather turned cool, the engine was back to prime performance.
Realized, I have to reduce my cruising speed and stop frequently if I have to do any trips on this bike.
What I could'nt understand was how 2 litres of oil went missing. Most of the oil was pumped out through the breather , because of the pressure and heat in the crankcase and the rest vaporized?
I am having the same oil drinking (disappearing) issue but without the overheating or pinking or rear wheel and frame bathed in oil accompaniments.

Yes the chain is glistening wet after a normal 100-200 kms hard ride. But just the normal breather splatters on the rim, a little on tyre sidewalls - no bathing.

I have the same duck-bill breather directly on to the chain as you do.

No black or blue smoke from the exhaust either. No trace of wet oil in the exhaust (loads of soot though).

Off late, I have noticed that the spring-loaded oil filler cap too has lost its tension and does not stay firmly twist locked in place, as well as there is a lt of oil mist all arou nd that area after a hard ride (hard ride for my old lady now means around 100, with some bursts to 110 even 120, but mainly between 90-100).

Also, see some oil below the points cover, and now also a pretty decent leak/ooze from the top right stud of the 4 that join the gearbox to the engine - oil oozing from both between the gearbox and the engine, as well as from behind the gearbox where the stud is bolted. I am guessing this is engine oil and not gearbox grease/oil mix.

There is added oil leak from the inner clutch casing gasket seal (oil on the garage floor on standing overnight), that needs to be looked into, but that is not the engine oil anyways.

Bottom line off late is that, with the oil on the dipstick a cm below max at the start of the ride, by the 125 km mark it is less than midway on the stick, and at the end of 250 odd kms, there is only a hint of oil at the tip of the stick, sometimes not even that. And she takes in about 300-400 ml to get it back to the top mark.

That is more than a mililiter of oil for every kilometer is diappearing somewhere.

Can't be the crank seal because then the bike would smoke. Ditto for valves or rings.

Right now the suspicion is on the breather, the various leaks, and the spring loaded PVC seal below the timing pinion (between the two cams) - which sometimes could be cut/split or fitted upside down (unlikely though).

Bike is running really good though, keeping up with fast LB500s most always except long straights (more because of my right hand than her heart though), and has good strong kick-back compression.

Do keep me updated if you find a cure to your 500's oil disappearing issue man. This one thing is keeping me from both pushing her bindaas as well as taking her for anything longer than the customary sub 500 km rides.

I want to take her to the mountains again, with my friend riding the Duke 200, and I know she can and will and not let me down, but like this I will have to carry a large jerry can of 20W50 with me on the ride! Money is not the issue obviously - its the mental stress of not knowing if you are running dangerously low on oil and thus not being able to enjoy the ride and pull bindaas as before. Not a good feeling.

Last edited by ebonho : 25th December 2013 at 12:19.
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Old 25th December 2013, 15:53   #942
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rki2007 View Post
Royally confused between Classic 350 or TBTS 350. I have booked both the bikes. Now i got a call that TBTS is allotted to me and can be delivered within 10 days if the payment is made. Now i don't know whether to go for TBTS or wait for 350. Please suggest.
Predominantly my usage will be city riding with very less long trips. The reason why TBTS looks good is because of the styling and all new added features like illuminated headlight,rear disc and digital odo. But classic retro style is unmatched with any bike. Seriously don't know what to do.
Hi rki2007,

welcome to the club and congrats in advance.

You share the same delima that I had when I wanted to Own a RE, I did multiple trips on both the bikes and the only reason for me to opt for the TBTS 500 was the riding comfort. I am 162 cms approx and the sitting position in classic was with a slightly forward stance for me ,my lower back was hurting after 20 min of riding, again not that this is a deal breaker, my wife was along with me and for her the classic was not as comfortable as the TBTS, her opinion matters as she will be riding with me often. Also this was going to be my daily ride forever

So check out both the options and decide keeping comfort + ride + look + day to day activities in mind.

PS-Even today the classic make our heads turn when one passes by

Last edited by Jimmy_u : 25th December 2013 at 15:54.
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Old 25th December 2013, 16:11   #943
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its the mental stress of not knowing if you are running dangerously low on oil and thus not being able to enjoy the ride and pull bindaas as before. Not a good feeling.
Exactly how my last ride had been.


The oil reduction over a distance that you mentioned is normal on these engines i feel. My bike in its good days used to drink around half litre oil over 500kms . Small Oil leak stains on the casings doesn't contribute to less oil unless what happened to me happens.
In my case i know when oil was being pumped out. After the bike started pinging ,i could hear another kinda breather sound which was not like the usual duck quacking sound,that sound was the oil being pumped out through the breather. Normally its just pinging and loss of power that happens during long trips. The oil being puked out is a first.

According to my mech.,the oil was not being circulated throughout which was why the pressure built up at the crank and the oil was thrown out. Once i reduced speed and hard acceleration,it ran fine.

I concluded its old age.
I know if i keep a mid rev cruising speed,and regular stops,she will still take me places.
On the last trip,i was pushing it quite a bit and it did perform,until the sun came out.
I should rename her to Dracula from Greyhound !
Doing another trip tomorrow in which I'm planning to take it easy. Will keep you posted.
The gearbox leak on your bike which you mentioned ,if its on the back wall of the gearbox,its the grease and there is an adjustment to stop it. I forgot what it was.

Last edited by tharian : 25th December 2013 at 16:20.
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Old 25th December 2013, 16:33   #944
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The oil reduction over a distance that you mentioned is normal on these engines i feel. My bike in its good days used to drink around half litre oil over 500kms .
That's what I've heard as rule of thumb as well for the old standard CI engines - 1 liter for every 1000 kms. 1 ml per km. Mine is slightly more currently though. And in her young days the level on the dipstick would fall from top to maybe half or a little lower for a normal 800-1000 km day. Which is around 150 ml only if you consider that the standards take in approximately 300 ml from min to max levels on the dipstick.

But yes, our Bullets are old now, and regardless of new/refreshed top ends, the internals are tired.

At the rate she is throwing/losing oil currently (I still think oil is not being burnt - fellow riders riding behind me have confirmed many times that there is absolutely no smoke - either on hard acceleration or on letting off the throttle under load or for shifts), I will have to stop at every fuel stop or even earlier (considering I get around 350 kms on a tankful before hitting reserve, and by then oil might/will be dangerously low) and refill her with oil. So in addition to spares, I now have to carry enough 20W50, because there is hardly any pump on our highways who stock it.

Problem here is, especially for us Indian Bulleteers, these are machines with ancient machining and metallurgy and tehnology. Add to that we suck the life out of them with the throttle from early on in their youth instead of riding them like modern classics need to be ridden. And still on top of that, even now in their old age, with their prime behind them, we still push them to 90-100 and want them to keep up that pace over pretty long distances, when in reality their comfort speed now is actually 80, with periods of 60-70 to cool down, especially when the sun is up.

Last edited by ebonho : 25th December 2013 at 16:43.
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Old 26th December 2013, 11:06   #945
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tharian and ebonho how old are your bullets?
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