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Old 20th May 2009, 21:08   #1
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Default RTR 180 is out (a.k.a Menace)

Source: OVERDRIVE

The RTR 180 has been announced and will be out soon. Quite surprising to see that its back to carbs. Question is...can it beat the R15 in overall performance?

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What the heck? Another bike, another 20cc? When will this stop? From what I felt after riding the RTR 180, I think the stopping can wait just a little longer. Oh shoot, snookered by the charms of another bike, when will I ever learn?

Anyway, TVS' new Apache 180 is a phenomenal little motorcycle. Yes, I did just use the P-word. To give you a little background, I've always liked what the RTR stood for, even if I never quite got along with the fuel injected version. The FI proved to be noisy and ultimately, I think its output was more impressive in decibels than in horsepower.

TVS has found me the solution I was looking for. What they did was take the muscular engine from the 160, give it a lot more stroke, a little more bore and then they sat back and relaxed for a bit - a good day's work was already done. With the displacement boosted to 177.3cc, they set about tuning the peripherals, ending up with a lighter crank, lighter magneto and a bigger carburettor (Note that this means the RTR 180 does not have fuel injection) .

It seems simple, what has happened is fairly dramatic. You see, the lighter rotating bits give the RTR a crispness that is rather likeable. The lightening also offsets the increase in displacement and so the motor - indeed the motorcycle itself - weighs roughly the same as the 160. And the power output is up to 17.3PS which makes for a fun bike to ride.

The twitchiness of the earlier RTR has been subdued by the extension of the swingarm (and thus, the wheelbase) by about 30mm. The result is a light-feeling motorcycle that likes to change direction quickly but without the nervousness that came with the earlier chassis package.

Having spent a day on board at the test loop (it's too short to call it a track), I was convinced that the RTR 180-Pulsar 180 battle would be pitched and hard fought, and I simply cannot wait to throw them in what promises to be a bloody cage match.

However, TVS threw a minor spanner in the works by saying that they will not be announcing the prices just yet and that sales will begin in another fortnight and take roughly a month more to spread across the country.
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Old 20th May 2009, 21:30   #2
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One of the forces to rekon with in the Indian motorcycle Industry, apache has taken the game further from where Pulsar stopped.
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Old 20th May 2009, 21:35   #3
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Don't know why, but i'm not exited at all. Maybe its a good bike. Should be even.
But a lot of guys are looking at Yams and waiting for Ninjas. So something sub 200 is luke warm. The day one of these biking companies brings the 250 out, then the wars begin.
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Old 20th May 2009, 21:36   #4
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This is getting boring now how many more sub 250 cc engines is TVS going build [like bajaj]. TVS is playing the same game even with the Fi, now carb 180RTR and later sometime down the year they'll come out with a Fi version and give it a boost of .4-.7 bhp and charg for it, why can not they give it in the first palce.
Couple of years back I would be jumping wiht joy hearing this news [every shogun owner would] but now it high time india gets a 250-500 cc twin from an indian manufacturer.
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Old 20th May 2009, 21:51   #5
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Well, i kinda like the way Apache looks since the time it was launched...but i must say i am not really a fan of the same.I would have been excited, rather really excited if TVS or BAJAJ comes up with something more street savvy maybe like Ducati monster or on the lines of Fz 16, or lets say MT01, obviously with more muscle ( ermm 400 cc v twin ).
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Old 20th May 2009, 22:05   #6
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50cc to 180cc took 29 years. Forget 300cc+...

Jokes apart, the original Apache is great bike to ride. I had a chance to push it quite hard on the twisted roads near Manimala, Kerala. All I can say... wow!!!

It handles great, though not very refined and smooth as a Karizma. Apart from the pesky body panels, it rode really well. Very apt for a short rider like me.

A 250cc Fi version should have been the logical successor to this awesome bike. I dont understand why manufacturers are scared to push beyond the 223cc mark?

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Old 21st May 2009, 00:43   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mail4ajo View Post
I dont understand why manufacturers are scared to push beyond the 223cc mark?
to put it simply, it get harder and harder as the cc goes beyond 200 to build and efficient engine without decades of r&d and several crores of expenditure. its not overnight that the japs learnt to build big bike engines. when it comes to cars, the japs still focus and are good at smaller engines compared to the europeans or americans.

technology is available for purchase but a very steep price for engines above 200cc.

Last edited by hollywoodhogan : 21st May 2009 at 00:45.
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Old 21st May 2009, 01:10   #8
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We need something more than just 223cc, please!

The RTR looks a fair bit like the Suzuki Gladius,IMO.
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Old 21st May 2009, 02:34   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hollywoodhogan View Post
to put it simply, it get harder and harder as the cc goes beyond 200 to build and efficient engine without decades of r&d and several crores of expenditure. its not overnight that the japs learnt to build big bike engines. when it comes to cars, the japs still focus and are good at smaller engines compared to the europeans or americans.

technology is available for purchase but a very steep price for engines above 200cc.

The chinese have 250cc -400cc Vtwin bikes made in China that run better and longer than our rusty bajajs
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Old 21st May 2009, 05:01   #10
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Topic has been beaten to death. If people wanted hi cc bikes, then there would be a huge waiting list for P220s and Karizmas and unsold 100 cc languishing at dealers. But it is not the case...in fact its quite the opposite with hardly any takers for the Zmas and the 220s.

So, lets move on and talk about this VFM sporty bike from TVS that takes one step up the performace ladder.
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Old 21st May 2009, 08:28   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gregory View Post
The chinese have 250cc -400cc Vtwin bikes made in China that run better and longer than our rusty bajajs
sorry for OT but couldnt resisit!

real surprising this.! u own such a Chinese bike.?and do u have any link that supports your statement?(no offense meant just out of curiosity). AFAIK a couple of chinese companies copied pulsar and sold it named gulsar. BTW in India patent laws are a bit stricter than in china so a Japanese bike cant be carbon copied here so r&d has to be done for design of bike and engine which takes time. i have seen countless chinesse rip offs of japaneese bike which i might say is rather easy . Building a new one is more difficult.i am not defending our manufactures this is plain fact.
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Old 21st May 2009, 08:38   #12
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TVS should have taken it to the big boys by getting a 400cc bike with 25BHP, Full fairing, Fuel injection and stuff like that for a lakh.

This is a small attempt not even worth the recognition it is getting to be honest. I mean, this upgrading the cc slowly is killing.

High time the government steps in and brings about uniformity among bike companies. Likes cars being defined by length and displacement, bikes have to be 50cc, 100cc, 150cc, 250cc and 600cc.
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Old 21st May 2009, 09:06   #13
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So many people are cribbing here, but how many will actually buy a 400cc bike, which i believe is very very minimal. So first the consumers need to get educated to bigger bikes and get out of the mileage kya hai thingy.

By the way I would like to know the number of R1, CBR1000, Suzuki Hayabusa, all sold. Atleast I would like to see if there is a market for bigger cc bikes read 300 - 600cc

I'm not supporting any manufacturer here, just that i'm trying to use a bit of my grey cells on a business sense.
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Old 21st May 2009, 09:07   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheARUN View Post
TVS should have taken it to the big boys by getting a 400cc bike with 25BHP, Full fairing, Fuel injection and stuff like that for a lakh.

This is a small attempt not even worth the recognition it is getting to be honest. I mean, this upgrading the cc slowly is killing.

High time the government steps in and brings about uniformity among bike companies. Likes cars being defined by length and displacement, bikes have to be 50cc, 100cc, 150cc, 250cc and 600cc.
we are going way OT here:
am sorry but is there a BIG enoughmarket for 250cc bike let alone a 400cc? like mpower said ,p220 and karizma would have had waiting list then.
even for a international brand like yamaha , in india fz16 sells more than r15 even though the latter is R SERIES bike being faster more sporty and has full fairing.Reason.? simple first is the cost and second is FE.The indian mentality is why pay 1.5 lakhs for a bike when u can buy a nano or a second hand car.!

i am not saying there is not market for such high powered bikes but it would cost a bomb to design one so its safer for indian manufactures to use existing engine and increasing the displacement to the max possible( like 220 from p150) rather than starting from ground up.! They will start with new v twin engines once there is fairly decent demand for such bikes in a few years from now.

i think it would be better if people discuss about the bike rather than complaning that we need 250cc vtwin etc (which i am sure will come in a years time from a indian co)
back to topic

This might be a small atempt but has anyone here ridden it so far.?The specs and reports in other forums seems to suggest it will be the fastest indian bike around the track in chennai(the record which r15 own) which is very comendable indeed.The rtr 160 if u have read the bike india report was nearly as fast a karizma around the track even with less power so now with 17.3 ps it would surely rock the competition.The only problem i have with the Apache series is that its a bit uncomfortable for tall riders.Pricing close to the rtr160 efi will be killer news indeed.!

cant wait for it to be tested around the track by the MAGS.!
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Old 21st May 2009, 09:44   #15
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I love the white paint scheme and gold fork legs. It certainly is a good looking bike.

Whatever happened to promises of ABS on the RTR 180??
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