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Old 22nd July 2009, 16:50   #31
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I know many people who press clutch while turning & which IMHO is a bad practice.
Done with the perception that fuel will be saved and less wear and tear. But its exactly the other way round.

About braking : Its upto your own capabilities. If anybody feels the front rubber has improved, then I will say yes, but considering the roads and driving conditions a wider front rubber is recommended for bikes under 125cc. Directional tyres are useful for grip and helps in braking too.

About front brake, the trick is not pull down it entirely. Slow and steady pull in required, kind of progressive braking. Pull it instantly in panic and what you are inviting is a front end slide, a slide almost impossible to recover from above 50 kmph.
The front wheel alignment also plays a role. In my Zeus, the front wheel is not straight, its slightly points towards left. Front braking is very tough then.
Engine braking is the best option. Rear end slides are relatively easy to recover from as compared to front end slides.

In rains ( any surface ) : Engine braking + rear brakes + little front brake. Dont use front brake unless and untill required. This is considering the road surface and condition of tyre. If both are good, you can use front brake too.

On dry roads ( normal road ) : Engine braking + Front brake ( remember not to slam i.e. pull them in under one second ) + rear brake.

On dry roads ( mud road ) : Engine braking + rear brake + front brake.

Now repeatedly using engine braking helps one slow down fast, but the wear and tear on clutch is highest, then the engine and then sprockets.

One personal advice is that if you are not going above 50 kmph, dont use engine braking. At that speeds, its possible to use rear and front brakes quite effectively.


EDIT : Just realized by the following post by Technocrat that this thread is all about safe braking on turns and not safe braking in general. I read the thread title and posted after reading first post. My bad.
@mods : Can we update the thread topic to " Safe Braking Techniques on Turns " ?

About safe braking in turns, my trick is simple, no abrupt cut of powersupply or no sudden application of power. I reduce the throttle, keep it constant and then apply brake. As soon as I am exiting the turn, brake goes off and more throttle input follows. I avoid using the front brake during turns.

Last edited by aaggoswami : 22nd July 2009 at 17:00.
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Old 22nd July 2009, 16:51   #32
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@bblost - Thank for bringing the thread back on topic

we were essentially talking high speed turns in past few posts instead of just safe breaking techniques on turns

Last edited by Technocrat : 22nd July 2009 at 16:54.
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Old 22nd July 2009, 17:18   #33
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Hmm the text in bold is contradicting, as per first quote you should always go down to first gear?
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Try using the lowest possible cog in your gearbox possible before putting the bike down in a corner.
Read my statement again and specifically the word in bold- 'possible'. If I wanted to say that use the lowest gear, I wouldn't have used that word or plainly said- use the first gear; which doesn't make any sense.

Let me expand on it a bit. What I meant was use the lowest gear possible with a usable powerband. For the Zma the sweet spot is around 7000 (where it incidentally produces peak power) to the 9000+ redline. So I need to use the lowest gear which gives me at least this window of the rev band.


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Besides how you enter a turn depends a lot on how the turn is you cant use same technique for all turns/ curves.
For me, the technique is always the same, the difference lies in the line. If its a blind corner, of course I wouldn't take the racing line and clip the apex- I would stay on my lane (left) compromising speed but maintaining safety. But its a different story on the track or a corner with good visibility.

Sorry for going I know this thread is about braking and not cornering but I feel both these aspects of motorcycling share a lot with each other.

Here's a pic of mine on the way to Lavasa. About a 1 1/2 yrs ago. Roads were brilliant.

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Old 22nd July 2009, 17:58   #34
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Hmm it would be nice if you keep it simple.

Not everyone who reads this would be be able understand the difference between "lowest possible cog possible in your bike" from "lowest possible cog in your bike"

Besides gear would be a better term, cog is too magazinish.

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For me, the technique is always the same, the difference lies in the line.
Again you are simply playing with the words, different lines for different turns (I know you can follow different lines for same turns too).

Thats a nice pic but a pic from the other side would give a better idea about the technique used. In this pic I see you on the right most lane for a right hander which baring a few instances is not a good technique especially on a public road
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Old 22nd July 2009, 18:10   #35
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I wonder now how a forum such as this is going to do anything to a newbie other than to leave him thoroughly confused. All of us are experts, and there quite a bit of disagreement on key subjects. How does he decide who to listen to?! I have no solution to offer.
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Old 22nd July 2009, 18:16   #36
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I wonder now how a forum such as this is going to do anything to a newbie other than to leave him thoroughly confused. All of us are experts, and there quite a bit of disagreement on key subjects. How does he decide who to listen to?! I have no solution to offer.
Is the rest of the internet any different?
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Old 22nd July 2009, 18:31   #37
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All of us are experts, and there quite a bit of disagreement on key subjects.
I am no expert, atleast not yet.
I share knowledge that I have & try to learn what I dont know from others & hence dont mind being corrected if I am wrong.

After all we are all here to learn right
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Old 22nd July 2009, 19:24   #38
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I applaud that sentiment. But the thing is, when there are two contrasting pieces of advice, if you were a newbie, how do you proceed? I know what I did when I learnt the ropes, there were some excellent books in the British Library to learn from, and we did not have the internet to confuse the hell out of us!
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Old 22nd July 2009, 19:28   #39
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That's why we are discussing to make things clear, even in those days two books could confuse you, right
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Old 22nd July 2009, 19:34   #40
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No not really. Because every Tom Dick and Harry can post on the forum. Not so easy to write books, and in those days, even less easy than today. Publishers would vet the credentials of the authors because they had a reputation to protect as well.
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Old 22nd July 2009, 19:39   #41
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hmm but then how many really had the exposure to such books?

Besides whoever is reading should post questions to clear his/her confusion.

Anyways we are way Off Topic now.
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Old 22nd July 2009, 20:58   #42
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Anybody ridden the new Activa scooter with the linked braking system?

I believe one lever operates both F and R brakes
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Old 22nd July 2009, 21:06   #43
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I am not sure if it has hit showrooms yet.

Even though Honda has been publicizing this variant the showrooms were saying its yet to be launched till May in Pune.

Btw this is thread for Combi Braking

Would be interesting to see how it works
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Old 22nd July 2009, 22:28   #44
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Hmm it would be nice if you keep it simple.
Point taken.

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Besides gear would be a better term, cog is too magazinish.
Didn't want to use the words gear and gearbox in quick succession, sorry but its just an old habit.

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Again you are simply playing with the words, different lines for different turns (I know you can follow different lines for same turns too).
I'm really not. There is a difference between the line and the technique. In this instance, the technique is the strategy of using the lowest gear possible- irrespective of the line. Which will net good traction from corner entry to exit. And of course I'm assuming that you are riding spiritedly and not on a commute where none of these techniques should be implemented and lean angle should be as close to zero as possible in interest of both rider's and public safety.

There is another variable in this equation as well, which is 'countersteering' or more precisely voluntary countersteer which no one has brought up yet. It plays a massive role in the dynamics of single-track vehicles. However the discussion has already gone way off-topic, so I'll draw the line here.

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Thats a nice pic but a pic from the other side would give a better idea about the technique used. In this pic I see you on the right most lane for a right hander which baring a few instances is not a good technique especially on a public road
Not at all recommended on an open public road- simply put I'm in the wrong lane. However, the road in question was closed (traffic stopped on a 500meter stretch) for a few minutes for a couple of pics. So it was as safe as it could get.
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Old 23rd July 2009, 09:38   #45
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One personal advice is that if you are not going above 50 kmph, dont use engine braking. At that speeds, its possible to use rear and front brakes quite effectively.
Coincidence! Today, I was driving at around 50 in my third gear. When I was trying to overtake a stationary bus, from no where, a pedestrian came in front of me (was trying to cross the road after getting down from a bus) and the only way i could stop was to come down to 2nd then to 1st gear else I'd have hit the person for sure! I couldn't have done without the engine braking.
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