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Old 19th March 2010, 20:29   #181
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thanks terminator.

the 3.5 months of wait and still no news from the dealer has killed half the excitement and euphoria. Top it up with all the initial teething issues and a few major problems. Thats where the element of doubt is slowly creeping in.

let me ask another (stupid) question.
Lets say if i go for the 500 EFI now.. and the troubles continue with the EFI to an extent where it gets difficult to live with it. Will it be possible to get rid of all the sensors & ECU and convert the EFI in to a CARBED version?
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Old 20th March 2010, 00:24   #182
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@Essyouwee- you are a safe rider, keep it that way and enjoy riding. Take her to Doon, you will love every second of your ride there.


@terminator- It's a hard rubber on rear zapper so the problems are there. Once it gets warmed up and you give it a dry and gravel/sand free road, then it performs well. We need is a softer compound rear tyre.
So far RE has not acknowledged any issue with EFI due to missing O2, don't know where you got your facts.

If anyone really wants to see if RE has acknowledged the O2 issue and trying to resolve it then try mailing them with a request of you not canceling the booking if they are going to resolve it in few months before your delivery date. Then let us know.

@Nasir- If you are happy with your AVL then keep it. If you want only the top speed as your main criteria and you wish to do 120 on a regular basis for a longer stretch then its not for you. It has plenty of torque to keep you wanting for more and enough acceleration to keep the 200cc boys off your tail.

It will be possible but wont be that cheap until unless money is no object for you.
Problems with EFI are not difficult to live with and specially if you are not too deep into how the engine behaves every 5 minutes or with limited technical experience then you wont even feel a issues with the EFI.

Mine has never missed a beat or misfired nor had a starting problem. So if thats all you are bothered then you wont feel the need to have a o2 sensor on your bike.
Some people like me want things done the right way and we dig deep to find the cause of the problem and solution to it. For some it's just a bike which looks good and provides you with some poser value.

Last edited by Randhawa : 20th March 2010 at 00:35.
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Old 20th March 2010, 13:31   #183
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@ Randhawa
Thanks buddy.

the 'good looks' and 'poser value' does play a tiny role towards the C500, but than there is much more to it..

I personally do quite a bit of touring. 60% of my odo reading would be on the highways, i guess. The terrain - a mix of plains and ghats.

Considering the machine from its functionality point of view, i am very much satisfied with my current 350 AVL. In-fact we understand each other so much, that i have decided against selling the 350 AVL and passing it down to my brother-in-law so that it remains in the family.

But, i always found the 350 AVL to be underpowered in terms of acceleration as well as the top speed. And any extra torque is always welcome.
When i test-rode the C500 EFI in Nov, i felt it had all the ingredients and more, which i found the 350AVL to be lacking.

I am not a technical expert on REs, but do understand the basics, and the learning more everyday.

What is also disturbing me about C500 is, a lot of people have written it off as a tourer. 18" tyres, uncomfortable seat, problems fixing the saddle bags w.r.t the bent pipes, riding posture is bit inclined (currently i have a RD350 handle bar on my Machismo and find it very ergonomic with the stock seat), excess of technology ( seonsors, efi, ceu, etc) to leave one stranded on the highway without much help from the local mechanic, etc etc. Some of the issues may be retro-fixed ( at more cost ) but not too sure about a few critical ones.

What i would expect from the C500 is comfortable and relatively trouble-free ride with good power and a decent sound. I dont mind dirtying my hands once in a while. Now is that too much to ask? and esp for a bike which comes at a reasonably high price.
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Old 21st March 2010, 19:21   #184
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@Nasir- As for touring goes on this bike I'll say "each to it's own". Now how many foreigners you would have seen on CI touring across India? Most of the ones I have seen are usually with machismo handle with split seats or most with the one piece 2 seater. Some people find it ok on a single seater and some don't.

It also depends a lot on your built. Tall and heavy people dont have much of a problem as compared to people like me who weight 72k and 5'8 height. For me the worse part is the seat. As I am not so heavy, every jerk from rough road goes through my back and that is where I feel not happy on touring on this bike for longer stretch. I can last 1 hr max on C5, but saying that I think thats what is all about touring on this bike.

Personally I don't feel 18's have anything to do with touring. I have ridden enough(7.5k) to say that. So far I have not seen any faults with the sensors and even if one does go bad on you, you will still be able to reach your destination. Now tell me if your are touring on your AVL which has no sensor but the rectifier or it's digital ignition goes dead on you or it could be the coil as well then what will you do. Considering your roadside mechanics will not have the required parts to fix that.

There is a risk and thats in everything we do on daily basis. Although it's more sensible to go touring with few others so you dont get stranded at one place.

You are not traveling alone remember, you are riding on a mechanical beasty which wants to speak to you all the times. So that you can take a break, check your bike, sink into the surrounding - achieve nirvana and thump along

I will be touring soon on my C5 so you can keep an eye on my thread to see how good/bad it goes
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Old 22nd March 2010, 10:14   #185
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nasirkaka View Post
Considering the machine from its functionality point of view, i am very much satisfied with my current 350 AVL. In-fact we understand each other so much, that i have decided against selling the 350 AVL and passing it down to my brother-in-law so that it remains in the family.

But, i always found the 350 AVL to be underpowered in terms of acceleration as well as the top speed. And any extra torque is always welcome.
Hi Nasir,

You have not mentioned if your vehicle is currently stock or not. Why don't you add some details about what you have done to it. If you are not a purist and don't mind making some mods to your bike, it would be better to keep your AVL 350 and invest some time in making performance mods to achieve better acceleration and top speed.

A good bike on road is worth two at the dealership.
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Old 22nd March 2010, 12:55   #186
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Thanks guys for the valuable insights..

@ Randhawa: very well said.

I think there is not much point in contemplating what the bike can and what it cant (based on so many conflicting reviews/feedback on various forums), but to experience it first hand. Might as well get the bike (hopefully by this month end), and and take it on from there.
I am open to minor customization / modifications (seats, handle bar, foot-peg, etc) to suit my body posture / riding style and wish for improved ergonomics for touring.
Hopefully it should be a good learning process

I did three (short) test-rides on the C5 before booking and had a mixed reaction.
The bike used for test-ride was in bad shape, and must have had minor accident / fall, as the signs were visible.
What i liked: (in relation to my 350 AVL)
* much better acceleration
* the height factor (my feet were firmly touching the ground, i am 5'9")
* reduced vibration and noise (clatter) from the engine
* the braking felt better.
* the fact that is a UCE engine with reduction in no of parts resulting in reduction of transmission losses. Better reliability.
* the Electronic Fuel Injection ( resulting in immediate throttle response)
* the aesthetics

what bothered me:
* the thump (or lack of it). the bike was on stock silencer and sounded like any normal bike.
* the build quality. (rust spots, and zinc plated nuts/bolts)
* the horn was really sad and even i had to stress to hear it
* of-course the price tag

To me, there were more + points and i happily booked the bike. I think i will stick by my instinct and and get the bike. Wish me luck

@ gbanavar:

There is hardly any performance modification on my Machismo 350, except for a free flow Goldstar replica silencer. Infact, i have been wanting to re-jet the bike and gor for a free-flow air filter, but all the mechanics (from brand store to local ones in bangalore) have discouraged me saying its complicated to rejet the machismo card, and even if we do, it would not really result in improved performance. suggestions are welcome.
BTW i am keeping the (tried and tested) Machismo 350 and not planning to sell it.
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Old 22nd March 2010, 20:48   #187
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@terminator- It's a hard rubber on rear zapper so the problems are there. Once it gets warmed up and you give it a dry and gravel/sand free road, then it performs well. We need is a softer compound rear tyre.
So far RE has not acknowledged any issue with EFI due to missing O2, don't know where you got your facts.
Well Randhawa,for off roading changing the tire seems a must do.
By the way my notion of RE acknowledging the issues due to O2 was influenced by a similar thread on a different forum,from where I learnt that recently RE organized a rendezvous with Classic owners in Banglore,where Engineers from Chennai plant also hailed.And they unanimously agreed to the fact that lack of O2 sensor can or has caused some issues with the EFI.

FYI: My new Royal Enfield Classic 500 EFi !! - Page 19 - India Travel Forum, BCMTouring.com

Also to cross verify I too called up my RE service engineer & inquired about the missing first aid kit & the issues due to Lambda Sensor.Before I could complete he cut me short & said yes yes we are aware of the complains regarding missing O2 & we are looking into the issue.
He promised the first aid kit to be delivered at my home & a short round of feedback session regarding C5 as whole.

RE seemed charming this time for their concern to Customer service .
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Old 22nd March 2010, 23:13   #188
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@Terminator- Yes I do agree, for off roading we do need off road tyres and MRF does have a fatter offroad tyre for our bull. I always liked the front tyre grip but as people suggested to go one size up to help cure the instability, I am on the look out for Pirelli Sport Demon 100/90. Once I get that then I can be sure to comment on that.

The thing about the meeting in Bangalore is not the only one took place. It took place all over India and it will continue and happen every month across India. It was cancelled down here due to some reason.

I am a bit surprised that people are intimidating RE using my thread! and not just that, following my thread and using pictures I posted on my thread. There were few people in the beginning who started making fuss about missing O2 sensor and still there are few who genuinely know what exactly is the issue related to it. But as it seems, people are aware of it and everyone is talking about it so RE has to listen to us.

I remember when first I started kicking about it and I was banging my head when I could not get a satisfying answer or RE was refuting my claim to any issue related to EFI. I am happy that I have made few people aware of the issues and that will help all of us RE lovers prompt RE to improve and benefit future RE owners. In long run, we all will benefit.

I have gone to to much in depth to understand the C5 engine apart from the gearbox. Have spent lot of time with the mechanics and RE engineer to know it inside out. Although someone else helped me a lot to understand few things to whom I am grateful. If a hear any C5, I can surely tell you if that bike has the same noise which I had from the beginning, why it is there in the first place and what can be done to avoid it. I am trying to pass my experience to R&D at RE. So they can improve and help others in my position.

Wait for my 8k update in which I will explain it all. Some people might not be that fussy or anal to care about it until one fine day when they will be in my boots. Now seriously tell me, how many people are there who looked at the air filter box design and noticed the design flaw? Still people are riding their bikes without doing a Rs 10 mod to protect their engine from water and dust. So if people are feeling sorry for me cause I have so many issues then let it be. I am just trying to help my fellow comrades and wish them happy thumping.

Last edited by Randhawa : 22nd March 2010 at 23:15.
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Old 23rd March 2010, 19:04   #189
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To help & serve a common cause is great gesture Randhawa & undoubtedly this thread is one of the stepping stones to eventually get things wonderfully set for CL500.Now since RE somehow knows about the much talked C5 issues,it becomes our responsibility to hit the nail hard & get things done.

By the way I feel that being too meticulous about something can ultimately lead to our dismay as nothing can exactly be perfect.
However to address issues which seem to grow insuperable one day can be of great value.

My air filter box is still stock,can you explain how & what portion of that you got laminated,perhaps I will go for that considering the unforeseen issues of future
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Old 24th March 2010, 10:07   #190
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My air filter box is still stock,can you explain how & what portion of that you got laminated,perhaps I will go for that considering the unforeseen issues of future
Well a duct tape is sufficient for that
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Old 24th March 2010, 13:34   #191
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Check on first page, issue 3. You will get your answer.

@Indian- Hey come on man, would you really want to stuck a duct tape on the lovely C green
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Old 24th March 2010, 15:04   #192
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Check on first page, issue 3. You will get your answer.

@Indian- Hey come on man, would you really want to stuck a duct tape on the lovely C green
Had been to the Bandra showroom here in Mumbai & clicked some pictures (Air Filter box etc...) to see the amount of dust accumalated in the test rides. The amount of dust was pretty high considering the clean roads they ride in.

Here you go :-
Attached Thumbnails
The Royal Enfield 500 Classic thread!-dsc00673.jpg  

The Royal Enfield 500 Classic thread!-dsc00675.jpg  

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Old 24th March 2010, 16:00   #193
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You should see the amount of dust it sucks in on a 80km ride through a dusty road, specially riding through the Himalays's where roads are not so good.

@Mantrig- Thanks for sharing the pictures.
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Old 24th March 2010, 17:16   #194
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Check on first page, issue 3. You will get your answer.

@Indian- Hey come on man, would you really want to stuck a duct tape on the lovely C green
well I meant the scotch tape. Duct tape would sure look weird.

@ mantrig there is some digging going on near the bandra store. I guess that is why there is so much dust.
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Old 24th March 2010, 17:31   #195
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Well I was wondering if i need to fully or partially laminate the same,can it affect the the operation of air filter somehow.Sorry not sure !
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