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Old 8th January 2011, 12:06   #1141
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Default Re: Royal Enfield 500 Classic 4100 km Ownership Review

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Which motorcycle do I see next to the C5.
Looks like a dual sport!!!
OT..Thats my funduro, just finished off a project on that and have nothing to do so have started off on the enfield..in a way I pity the enfield



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Old 8th January 2011, 12:22   #1142
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Default Re: Royal Enfield 500 Classic 4100 km Ownership Review

Hey Randhawa,

that spitfire helmet is a real neat one. I can only wish...

Waiting for some other local but reliable but cost-effective alternative for the hitchcocks..

Need a few tips regarding my 4th and last free service, which is due on the coming wednesday:

1. the bike is 9 months old and has done about 9500 kms. Is it good time to change to motul synthetic? If yes, what is the exact specs of motul oil which i need to buy. and how many litres? Should i get the oil changed at service station? i have personally never done an oil change, so not too confident. anything else i need to keep in mind?

2. was planning to source a STD 350 swing arm bush, and get it replaced during this service. Will it be a direct fit?

3. do i need to get the front fork oil level checked at this stage?

4. do i need to ask them to open the steering column and check for bearing condition and lubrication at this stage?

5. when i tighten my rear brakes, within a week they become loose again at the pedal (play). should i get the drum pads replaced?

6. i am replacing the disk pads anyways, as the squeaking is still persistent. If the squeaking still continues after the new disk pads, will make noise and ask for a disk assembly replacement from RE under warrenty.

7. are the cracks on the hoses something to worry about? should i get them replaced? (dont think they will have it in stock anyways) :(

8. when i leave my handle when the bike is in motion, the bike slightly pulls towards right side. Had mentioned this issue, and RE guys re aligned the wheel, but still the problem continues. what do i ask them to look into? the gap between the tyre and swing arom visually looks equal.

9. anything u suggest should be checked/ lubricated/ replaced at the last free service stage?

i know they are some silly questions, but might as well ask for your opinion.
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Old 8th January 2011, 19:57   #1143
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Default Re: Royal Enfield 500 Classic 4100 km Ownership Review

@Roughseas- Is your bike the one which was launched in India a decade ago? I remember these bikes used to have a charging unit problem and people used to get either the RD or RE one to get going as OEM was quite expensive and hard to get. But a very sweet bike to tour with plenty of power to spare. But I don't remember the twin headlight set-up. Did you got it done later? Love the set-up though, one for short/wide through and another for long.

For you upgrades, you can tune the front suspension by just playing around with fork oil level.

Yeah the rear shocks is a must upgrade for C5 along with the bushes from Hotchcocks. A must upgrade is the swing arm bushes to CI ones even if you are not planning any mods.

Best and cheap mod is to go for carb, I think it will also eliminate rev limit unless the TCI unit has the limit pre-programmed.


@Nasir- A little while ago the spitfire helmet was available at 50% discount for around 12k including shipping. If you have anyone going to UK then you should get one. It even has a similar c green colour matching the bike

REgarding your 4th service, I recommend the following which are must;

1.Change the fork oil

2.Get the T cone bearings inspected and greased, probably replaced if they are rusted. It could be the cause of your bike pulling to right. (if replaced Under warranty then savings of Rs500)

3. Get the front brake fluid changed (Rs 80 for oil)

4. If you are still on OEM supplied rear brake pads then you have made them last a decade. Our bikes get the smaller pads from factory and the ones you will get from service centre are a inch longer and provide better braking due to larger surface contact area. (Rs 250)

5. Get the rear cushion rubber pads replaced. They will help you getting rid of any shuddering you might have felt during braking and get rid of dead play which you might have felt when you apply brake and the rear wheel still rotates around a inch.(Rs 90)

6. Get the rear drum bearings and hub bearings checked along with the front hub bearings as well. If the rear hub bearings are fine then don't bother to get them greased as for greasing them, they need to be removed and once removed/greased they don't last long. (drum bearing Rs 150)

7 .Front pads wont be covered under warranty I think ( Rs300) They will easily last 30k but if you feel the necessity then do the needful. It wont be easy to get the disc replaced by them. "Remember" the moment your bikes crosses 10k, even if they diagnosed a problem with the disc under 10k but if they haven't got the disc in by the time you have crossed 10k. They will quite politely refuse you a replacement. Do the needful Tell them to check according to the service manual and check for run out. If they cant check the run out technically then its their incompetency and their problem. Insist on a replacement then.

8. Get the CI bull bushes and they have to be shaved a wee bit, just few mm.

9. For the fuel line, they wont have it in stock. Better not to get a new one from them as it will again develop cracks within few months. Better to get a fuel line from any car manufacturer and replace it. Although it's a two layer pipe but why to take chances hey.

10. Get the wheel aligned and spokes tightened. The spokes on my wheels were loose at just 5k.

11. Get the rear shocks pressure checked. should be around 100Psi

12. Get the auto chain tensioner checked, for that they will have to remove the LH side cover to inspect it properly.

13. If they can get the engine compression checked and if above 140Psi then get the head de-carbed. Although according to their manual it says to de-carb if above 110Psi.

14. Change to fully synthetic only if you intent to do some hard riding and can change at every 3k. I suggest to keep the stock oil and get oil changed every 3k. You should see the colour of engine oil at 3k. It should not be kept till 6k.

But if you want to then go for Motul 300V 15w50 grade. It comes in 1L packing and you need 3L. Engine needs only 2.3L. Its around Rs850 per litre.

The above to do list is must and worth only if you will be there while servicing, otherwise it will never get done. Most time consuming is fork oil changing and Tcone greased.


Lot of Indian cars have same size piston or bore of 84mm so one can check out the specs and see if any engine have 86.9**mm size and same deck height+ few other matching parameters then one could try to make it work on C5 while making the bore to 87mm. Although a very possibility is to find the 535 lightening piston and go with that but I think the design of the oil rings on the piston is different to the C5 piston oil ring.

@Naren can you shed some light or info on the 535 piston rings design or a picture so we can compare? I think you had re-built a 535 of you brother in-law.

Last edited by Randhawa : 8th January 2011 at 20:00.
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Old 8th January 2011, 22:03   #1144
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Default Re: Royal Enfield 500 Classic 4100 km Ownership Review

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Originally Posted by Randhawa View Post
@Roughseas- Is your bike the one which was launched in India a decade ago? I remember these bikes used to have a charging unit problem and people used to get either the RD or RE one to get going as OEM was quite expensive and hard to get. But a very sweet bike to tour with plenty of power to spare. But I don't remember the twin headlight set-up. Did you got it done later? Love the set-up though, one for short/wide through and another for long.
The funduro sold by Hero Honda, you are right about the charging problem. I have cured mine for good with a VR from a 2010 up CBR1000RR, same as the R1 VR but with different connectors. The twin headlight from a 2010 F800GS and the fully adjustable forks from a Yamaha YZ. Tons of goodies not possible to list here .
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Old 9th January 2011, 09:50   #1145
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Default Re: Royal Enfield 500 Classic 4100 km Ownership Review

hi,
iam planning to attach a saddle bag for storage in bike,another thought was to put a tough box and luckily came across image of yours.How did you fix that luggage box? i would like to see some more images!
Quote:
Originally Posted by nasirkaka View Post
Whats a PC-V? and are you changing your piston to 535's? what would be the benefits?


Hey guys,
Finally managed to get my TK-2 helmet.

Its made by a chinese company making helmets for fighter pilots. This one is a stripdown version of an aviation helmet, meant for motorcycles. Goes well with the C5, and gives the feel of flying a sukhoi

It features 2 visors, a clear and another tinted. both the visors are protected under an FRP cover, and can be brought down based on the need.

a bit on the heavier side, and am not too sure about the safety aspects, but comfortable for daily commutes.
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Old 9th January 2011, 10:03   #1146
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Default Re: Royal Enfield 500 Classic 4100 km Ownership Review

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Originally Posted by Randhawa View Post
Now you are on right track my friend. That looks a lot better and if you do some more longer runs, the excess carbon deposited inside the engine will clear up a bit. Then you will see better results but stick to longer rides and ride only when engine nicely warmed up. On your next run if you can do again 30km+ ride then try to keep it between 60-80 and then check the plug.

Can you tell me the no on the plugs? How was the ride, did you felt any change in jerks/misfiring while riding? Do you use choke in the morning to start and if so for how long do you keep it on?

On a general note the problem with cold start on C5 is that the injector spits out so much fuel on first crank that the whole if it does not gets burnt and blackens the plugs straight away which takes more then 20km before it even start cleaning itself.
Hi Randhawa,
After cleaning the sparkplug,for few moments there was no problem of missing but later it increased like hell and started misfiring(referring to flames coming out of silencer and noise like bursting of cracker"phatt") and average is near to 20km/ltrs.
I immediately called up the engineer to discuss this issue.They are on the conclusion that is all because of sparkplug(note-till date 5 already been replaced)and has sent some new ones from the market.
iam still jizzed and puzzled what to do?
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Old 9th January 2011, 13:12   #1147
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Default Re: Royal Enfield 500 Classic 4100 km Ownership Review

@ Randhawa- The 535 piston is very long and has an extended skirt.The added mass in this piston may lead to balancing and vibration issues if used in a C5 not to say anything of the valve clearances and the effect on the compression ratio. The metallurgy is also substantially different and this piston is notorious for seizure due to expansion at high temps. I have an old 535 piston lying around and will try to dig it up and post pictures this evening.
Regards
Naren
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Old 10th January 2011, 13:53   #1148
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Default Re: Royal Enfield 500 Classic 4100 km Ownership Review

@ randhawa:

Thanks for the detailed checklist @ 4th service. I am sure it would come handy to a lot of other riders as well.

As u mentioned, unless self supervised, there is no guarantee that all thats asked for will be sincerely looked at, during service. I am not sure, if i can manage to take a day or two off from work, given the work pressure. :( (Keeping a watch on the bike being serviced makes sense even from a distance, as in the workshop here, they dont let you go near the bike when being serviced, but one can watch from a waiting room with a glass window).

Just wanted to understand a few points, so as to answer the typical 'WHY' from the service incharge. (basically to counter-attack them)

Quote:
1.Change the fork oil
the manuel says to replace in the 5th service. could they ask why in the 4th, as long as i am willing to pay for the oil? also, any way of maknig sure that they have changed the oil?

Quote:
2.Get the T cone bearings inspected and greased, probably replaced if they are rusted. It could be the cause of your bike pulling to right. (if replaced Under warranty then savings of Rs500)
Did not understand the location of T cone bearings. Is it the cylindrical part in front of the tank, in which the handle assembly rotates? if asked, why do i want to get that inspected, what reason could i give them?

Quote:
5. Get the rear cushion rubber pads replaced. They will help you getting rid of any shuddering you might have felt during braking and get rid of dead play which you might have felt when you apply brake and the rear wheel still rotates around a inch.(Rs 90)
Did not understand this part described as rear cushion rubber pads. Where are they located?

Quote:
6. Get the rear drum bearings and hub bearings checked along with the front hub bearings as well. If the rear hub bearings are fine then don't bother to get them greased as for greasing them, they need to be removed and once removed/greased they don't last long. (drum bearing Rs 150)
OK, i think these technical names are getting me all confused. i sort of understand the hub bearing, but did not understand the location of drum bearing. Also when you say "checked" whats the procedure of checking them?

Quote:
8. Get the CI bull bushes and they have to be shaved a wee bit, just few mm.
How do i shave the bushes. (opps.. sounds corny). But, is it something the service guys would be able to do, or do i need bu the CI bushes, and take it to a metal workshop?

Quote:
11. Get the rear shocks pressure checked. should be around 100Psi
How is the pressure checked? Any external equipment is required? will they have one?

Quote:
12. Get the auto chain tensioner checked, for that they will have to remove the LH side cover to inspect it properly.
They have sealed the LH side cover with silicon (after the sprag change), and would be asking for strong reason to check the auto chain tensioner. What do i tell them?

Quote:
14. Change to fully synthetic only if you intent to do some hard riding and can change at every 3k. I suggest to keep the stock oil and get oil changed every 3k. You should see the colour of engine oil at 3k. It should not be kept till 6k.
I was planning to change to synthetic thinking it would make the bike smooth, and reduce the unwanted noises from the engine. Also i read that typically the synthetic oil last much longer (almost double) compared to mineral. I would stick to the mineral, if the outcome from synthetic is not very drastic. your thoughts on this.

Quote:
The above to do list is must and worth only if you will be there while servicing, otherwise it will never get done. Most time consuming is fork oil changing and Tcone greased.
Do you think all this could be done i a days time? or would require two days, giving the lazy work pace of RE service station.

All the above doubts/queries are for my understanding, to i could explain and counter-explain the questions thrown by the workshop guys.


@pratikjammy87:

Hey, the box is available as an accessory. i had posted some pics and details for the same, earlier in this thread.

here is the link:

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/motorb...review-40.html

Last edited by nasirkaka : 10th January 2011 at 13:55.
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Old 10th January 2011, 20:00   #1149
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Default Re: Royal Enfield 500 Classic 4100 km Ownership Review

@Roughseas- How much did you payed for those lights?

@Pratik- I gave you my opinion oh how you can go about checking for the real cause step by step and what needs to be checked. You come back by only cleaning the plugs and same problem. I don't know how can I help you further.

You really need to get electrical's checked and that includes the MAP and Temp sensor. It might not show up on MIL but if the sensors are inaccurately providing data to ECU but not that off the chart to show up as problem so MIL will not flash. You need to check the complete wiring for any loose connectors. I have never seen or heard of any case on UCE where it has blown 5 plugs under 2k. I seriously don't believe it's plugs at fault but something electrical.

Do as I suggested you previously only then I can help you further.

@Naren- Thanks for the info. There are pros and cons to every design and so is with the 535 piston and C5 piston.

What I have gathered so far is that pistons with longer skirt actually add more balance to the piston movement but the down size is as you said heating issues. That's also due to the oil ring design of the 535 piston. If I am not wrong then the 535 piston rings are quite thick ones(two rings joined together at intervals and non flexible. Where as on C5 piston which has shorter skirt and whole new design of quite thin and flexible rings which has a advantage of better oil scraping and heat tolerant. But due to the shorter skirt it isn't balanced well compared to the piston with longer skirt and hence the oil rings on C5 are wearing out much faster then the compression rings.

But do post the picture so we all can see the difference visually and discuss about the best suitable piston design for our C5.

Following answers are for your service engineer.

1. Why fork oil change at 9K- I do not trust factory assemblers for putting the right amount of fork oil and the change interval does not depend upon just the mileage done but time to. Weather you ride 12k in a year or not, the oil looses its properties and does not perform its intended duty properly. Different level of oil in each fork will result in handling issues and tyre wear out plus not to forget the instability issue my bike has.

(When I got the fork oil checked on mine, it had 150ml and 170ml in forks and specs says 195ml in each fork)

2. T-cone also known as steering ball race. Its what holds your whole front suspension and steering assembly. - My bike has instability issue/bike pulls to right side plus your(RE) setup is not water resistant or maintenance free. During monsoons the grease on the bearings get contaminated with water and rust is the result.

5. Cushion rubbers- located inside the rear hub. Part no 2 in the picture.
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6. Drum bearing- see the picture and its part no 4. Easy to check, once the drum is removed off the swing arm, simply use your finger to rotate and feel if the bearing is rotating freely/any play or hesitates while rotating.
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8. They will be able to grind it easily and they will take your swingarm to a lathe to get the bushes in. If they have never done it then they will advice you against it.

11. Yes a pressure gauge is required with a special needle to insert into the pressure reservoir on the shocker. As per RE requirements a RE workshop should have one. If they are ill equipped or does not want to do it for you thinking if there is something wrong and they have to replace the shocks then they will give you any excuse to not do it. Why you want to get it checked?- Instability issue.

12.Auto chain tensioner. It's just rubber silicon and it takes hardly 15min to remove the LH side cover and put it back. You can do it yourself if you want. Reason for asking to get it inspected?- I have a slouchy gear shift and bike jerks a lot during acceleration and deceleration.

14. Fully synthetic oil is a performance oil and not ever lasting oil. It's all crap if anyone says it lasts twice. The way a UCE is designed, the oil cleans the inside of the engine very well and hence gets dirty quite fast too. Remember any wear from the clutch also gets mixed up in the same oil where as on CI bulls the clutch has its own oil to live with.

There is a issue with the piston oil rings on c5 due to its specs and if you use the dirty oil for long will effect a lot on wear of the barrel. So you decide what you want, longer life and better compression with frequent oil changes at every 3k or vice versa.

In my experience with 300v, the engine smoothness lasted 1500k as compared to with the stock oil which lasts only 500km at every oil change.

So what I am saying is no matter what oil you put in, get the oil changed at every 3k. Put 300v only if you are going to ride it hard (hard acceleration, 100km/h+ all day long). Regard to advantages of 300v!. It's just awesome and you will love the smoothness in acceleration and gear change plus less noisy engine and temperature, specially in summers and longer life for the internals.

But if you don't intent to ride it hard and still want the fully synthetic advantage then go for it but get it changed when you feel the bike slouching again in performance. Thats when you feel something is not right or the bike is not performing at its best.



It can be done in a single day easily thats only if they start working on your bike earliest possible. Most time consuming is the fork oil change(approx 2hrs) and greasing part is easy.
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Old 10th January 2011, 21:29   #1150
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Default Re: Royal Enfield 500 Classic 4100 km Ownership Review

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@Roughseas- How much did you payed for those lights?
I think it was 153 pounds without shipping and around 4k for customs, but then I got it through DHL instead of Royal mail as I didn't want the headlight damaged. Royal mail would have been cheaper but more of a problem with customs.
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Old 10th January 2011, 22:11   #1151
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Default Re: Royal Enfield 500 Classic 4100 km Ownership Review

Has anyone tried importing/ fitting a Harley seat onto the Bullet? If so which seat would be advisable. I am looking for something like http://www.bikerzbay.com/images/stor...LHTCUSE5_3.jpg or Harley-Davidson Hammock Seat And Backrest | Baggers Magazine Article at Automotive.com for long distance touring. The stock double seat hurts a bit, so I am at the stage where I am ready to give up the classic look for comfort.
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Old 10th January 2011, 22:49   #1152
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Default Re: Royal Enfield 500 Classic 4100 km Ownership Review

Sorry not able to edit my previous post :( Has anyone fitted any of the seats from Royal Enfield Zone - Seats for Royal Enfield Bullet, Electra, Machismo, Thunderbird, Standard :: Royal Enfield Zone, New Delhi, India How did you find it? Where did you fit it? How expensive was the fitting? How is the ride quality now?

For now, the current bike setup is too hard on my backside and the position is a bit weird. I don't know much about bikes, so I don't know whether a lower seating position would help or higher :( FWIW, I am 193 cm tall, And I do get a bit of a wrist ache too after about 30-40 kms. I want to try the RD350 bar soon, to see whether there is any improvement. But I am wary of such mods that might not be good, hence looking for some tall person / expert's feedback on this kind of mods.
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Old 11th January 2011, 00:49   #1153
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Default Re: Royal Enfield 500 Classic 4100 km Ownership Review

Just borrow a machismo from someone and ride for a day or so. If you find that setup comfy then a lot can be done.
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Old 11th January 2011, 12:25   #1154
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Default Re: Royal Enfield 500 Classic 4100 km Ownership Review

Thanks Randhawa.

Now i feel much confident to talk to the service guys.
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Old 11th January 2011, 15:23   #1155
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A Big thanks to Randhawa from my side too. The RE people should be paying U for building confidence in people like me who are sitting on the fence whether to buy a Classic 500 or not.

I've booked a CBR250 ( due by April) but am still considering a Bull. Why I'm still hesitant is, apart from the usual problems of the Classic 500, the Last bullet I owned, a Lb 500, was very rough. It looked fantastic, had a good acceleration and was relatively trouble-free, except for the starter motor. There was a lot of torque and it was fun going fast uphill but the bike sounded/ felt like a tractor and on straights and downhill.

All in all, a very unrefined motorcycles. Compared to that, the standard 500 with the Cast Iron Engine, though not as powerful and with a lot of reliability issues, was much more refined and smoother...

I HAVE to borrow the UCE 500 for a day and try it out....
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