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Old 12th March 2011, 10:23   #1441
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Default Re: Royal Enfield 500 Classic 4100 km Ownership Review

Nice write up HEXANERAX !!

Randhawa: If the dealer is saying something there must be some weight. I am not saying that both engines are not same in their push rod arrangement. What the dealer said was, that the 350 UCE has a different (CAMS) to control the opening and closing of the valves, which is initiated by the push rods. I think we need to compare the two engines by removing the rocker covers on each...............!!
No contradictions, just discussing an issue I was informed !!
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Old 12th March 2011, 13:55   #1442
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@Naren- Yeah I agree to what you say but heat can also be dispensed from the block too which is quite a good way. C5 definitely needs a oil cooler I am working on it. Figured out the input and output ports for oil cooler but need some info on the trichodial pump to see if it works on volume or pressure as I am no good with fluid dinamics and only Er members could help me on that.

Regarding the gaskets, the block gasket has a anodized mesh in between some kind of asbestos sheets and the top gasket as in your C5 has 4-5 aluminium spacers but the updated head gasket has the same only difference is that it's coated with some kind of hard rubber/silicon.

@Bradhey- I know you mean is that there is some profile difference in the cams but thats not the case. The only difference is in the valves. Your dealer does not know much.

Here is a comparison between the two valve train part numbers.

Uce 350

1. Inlet cam 571164/a
2. Exhaust cam 571165/a
3. Valve Exhaust 571064/d
4. Valve inlet 570163/d

UCE 500

1. Inlet cam 571164/a
2. Exhaust cam 571165/a
3. Valve Exhaust 571035/c
4. Valve Inlet 571034/c

Hope it clears up..

Last edited by Randhawa : 12th March 2011 at 13:56.
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Old 12th March 2011, 13:59   #1443
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Default Re: Royal Enfield 500 Classic 4100 km Ownership Review

Could somebody post a video of how you remove the sparkplugs in your C5s? I was able to remove the primary but the secondary seems inaccessible with its narrow crevice.
I have been doing a lot of short distance riding lately and that seems to have fouled up my plugs. While i always had trouble starting the bike at traffic stops, i never had any issues starting it cold (a big Thanks to the advice given by Sanjeet). Never had any cold start issues in winter either. But today i had to crank it quite a bit before the engine stayed alive (it used to start and switch off). The Primary plug had quite a bit of soot on it, want to see what the secondary looks like.
@ Nasir, (i posted this query on BCM too) where did you get your metal brushes from?
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Old 12th March 2011, 15:59   #1444
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Default Re: Royal Enfield 500 Classic 4100 km Ownership Review

Quote:
Originally Posted by +rex View Post
Could somebody post a video of how you remove the sparkplugs in your C5s? I was able to remove the primary but the secondary seems inaccessible with its narrow crevice.
I have been doing a lot of short distance riding lately and that seems to have fouled up my plugs. While i always had trouble starting the bike at traffic stops, i never had any issues starting it cold (a big Thanks to the advice given by Sanjeet). Never had any cold start issues in winter either. But today i had to crank it quite a bit before the engine stayed alive (it used to start and switch off). The Primary plug had quite a bit of soot on it, want to see what the secondary looks like.
@ Nasir, (i posted this query on BCM too) where did you get your metal brushes from?
The secondary /Support plug can be removed with a special spanner provided in the tool kit. However, my advice "Stay away from touching it too often" My service engineer says that if your primary plug is good, then the secondary will be fine as well. Other than that there have been some cases in which this plug got damaged (the lower part remained threaded to the head and the upper part broke and came apart in the spanner......if that happens you may have to open up the head to rectify the situation.

Hope this helps......!!
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Old 12th March 2011, 18:32   #1445
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Default Re: Royal Enfield 500 Classic 4100 km Ownership Review

link to an EFI parts manual, might be good for a reference.
http://www.royalenfieldlesite.com/sp...php?article402


Along the same lines of internal differences wrt UCE engines, i read somewhere that Std 350 runs the same crankshaft unit from C5 & hence has weight advantage over rest 350's. Though unlikely, is there any chance that its right?

.
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Old 12th March 2011, 19:08   #1446
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Default Re: Royal Enfield 500 Classic 4100 km Ownership Review

Update on Bosch Platinum Plug + Black smoke feedback


Run more then 500km since putting the WR8DP and here is a picture to show you how good the plug is in burning up carbon. Tips turned out completely white.

Although black smoke remained unchanged, same amount and for same duration it was emitted. But I am able to crank, wait for 5 seconds before I can rev the engine to allow oil to reach big end, rockers and ride straight away without any hesitation or misfiring.

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@+Rex- If you have the right tool(complete- not the one from TBTS) kit then you should be able to take it off. Sometimes the secondary plug can become faulty so better get a new one if you done some good mileage on it. Removing the plug cap is a bit tricky but use booth your thumbs and index fingers to pull it upwards to access the plug.


@Rennjit- Yup you are right Std crank is heavy and thats why the kick dog issue is present on Std UCE bullets manufactured between November - december 2010. As crank was too heavy for the quality stricken kick dog to take the brunt.

By the way are you a mechanical Er if so then can you shed some light on a trichoidal oil pump if it works on providing pressure or volume.


Q for all those who bought C5 after October 2010

Just need to know if you lot felt the engine more hotter then the older C5's!!

Just found out the modification RE has done on the rocker bearings which is resulting in hotter head which is any ways good as its making the bottom less hot resulting in better heat dissipating.

The good thing is that the older C5's can modify the rocker bearings and it takes hardly 15 minutes but need to take it to a Lathe.

I am seriously considering this mod more then a oil cooler now.

Last edited by Randhawa : 12th March 2011 at 19:11.
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Old 12th March 2011, 23:35   #1447
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Default Re: Royal Enfield 500 Classic 4100 km Ownership Review

@ Randhawa, - The Trochoid Pump is a medium pressure high volume device and has the advantage of maintaining good oil flow rate even under varying pressure conditions. The addition of an oil cooler with correct pipe sizing will have minimum effect on the oil flow volume and pressure.

Regards
Naren
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Old 13th March 2011, 02:43   #1448
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Default Re: Royal Enfield 500 Classic 4100 km Ownership Review

@Naren-Thanks man, I'll try to work out the pipe size appropriately. My design will have max 2.5 to 3 Ft of piping and I am hoping it works.

I just de-carbonised the head and lapped the valves which has resulted in way too much compression and heat built up in head. On a warm engine it's showing 145 Psi without removing the auto de-comp which probably makes me think I am running + 170 Psi easily on a hot engine which has resulted in a bit more then comfortable temperature but an awesome performance. I am kind of worried now and don't want any negative consequences due to excessive heat. I think I need some carbon now.
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Old 13th March 2011, 11:09   #1449
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Default Re: Royal Enfield 500 Classic 4100 km Ownership Review

Quote:
Originally Posted by Randhawa View Post
@Naren-Thanks man, I'll try to work out the pipe size appropriately. My design will have max 2.5 to 3 Ft of piping and I am hoping it works.

I just de-carbonised the head and lapped the valves which has resulted in way too much compression and heat built up in head. On a warm engine it's showing 145 Psi without removing the auto de-comp which probably makes me think I am running + 170 Psi easily on a hot engine which has resulted in a bit more then comfortable temperature but an awesome performance. I am kind of worried now and don't want any negative consequences due to excessive heat. I think I need some carbon now.
That is a bit strange since De-carbonizing reduces compression by increasing the volume of the combustion chamber. You could do a compression gauge calibration or a baseline comparison by checking the readings on a brand new engine ( if possible). The gauge may not be indicating the correct reading since the numbers you are reporting are on the very high side. Also , The throttle opening can change the readings as can a free flow air filter since cylinder filling is less than optimal with a closed throttle or restrictive filter.

The formula for theoretical peak cylinder pressure is P=BDCPressure * CR ^ 1.4 where BDCpressure is the bottom dead centre pressure ( essentially 1 atm or 1 bar) and CR is the compression ratio (8.5). All pressure numbers in bar ( 1 Bar ~~ 14.5 psi). 1.4 is the specific heat ratio for air.
Regards
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Old 13th March 2011, 12:20   #1450
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Default Re: Royal Enfield 500 Classic 4100 km Ownership Review

Only one reason I can think of is lapping has made valve seal better. Rest every thing is stock on my bike. Although I am on 3rd block but I always had +120 psi. I will take the readings again.
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Old 13th March 2011, 14:14   #1451
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Default Re: Royal Enfield 500 Classic 4100 km Ownership Review

Quote:
Originally Posted by Randhawa View Post

Just need to know if you lot felt the engine more hotter then the older C5's!!

Just found out the modification RE has done on the rocker bearings which is resulting in hotter head which is any ways good as its making the bottom less hot resulting in better heat dissipating.

The good thing is that the older C5's can modify the rocker bearings and it takes hardly 15 minutes but need to take it to a Lathe.

I am seriously considering this mod more then a oil cooler now.

Well! I got mine in December. I'm not sure how hot pre-oct 2010 models were, but mine is hot near the top of the engine compared to the bottom. This happens only after a prolonged run (45 mins-1 hour) in the city. It's not so hot either. I can just feel it.
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Old 14th March 2011, 11:09   #1452
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Default Re: Royal Enfield 500 Classic 4100 km Ownership Review

Thank you, Sanjeet and Bradhey.
I was able to remove it albiet with a little bit of struggle. I can see how one could easily snap the plug in two; so your caution to not fiddle with it too much is good advice, Bradhey.

Cheers!
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Old 15th March 2011, 13:35   #1453
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Default Re: Royal Enfield 500 Classic 4100 km Ownership Review

Hey guys,

Good to see some healthy discussions in progress. lots to catchup on.
Was out of country for a week, missing my C5. Got back last night and this morning the bike started without any trouble after lying idle for over a week.
felt good.
Quote:

@ Nasir, (i posted this query on BCM too) where did you get your metal brushes from?
Whereelse but JC road in bangalore. Thats the place all petrolheads are always headed to.
forgot the name of the shop but thats one of the few places selling tools for royal enfields.

Last edited by nasirkaka : 15th March 2011 at 13:36.
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Old 15th March 2011, 21:53   #1454
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Default Re: Royal Enfield 500 Classic 4100 km Ownership Review

@Classi586- Thanks for your input. I'll have to check few more parts to see if that was a odd one out from the parts bin of RE to confirm that was really an upgrade or a quality issue part.

Last edited by Randhawa : 15th March 2011 at 22:00.
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Old 15th March 2011, 21:53   #1455
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Default Re: Royal Enfield 500 Classic 4100 km Ownership Review

@Nasir- Welcome back

@Bradhey- Update on your gear shifting issue

As I said to you previously about the issue that I feel it's the clutch assembly to blame so I did R&D on the clutch assembly of some UCE and all the parts associated with it's working.

I made some observation and if you are lucky then probably you would be able to resolve is quite easily.

Look at the part no 21(clutch push pad) and part no 1(lay shaft). When you engage the clutch, the push pad goes into the lay shaft to disengage the clutch(pointed the hole with arrow).
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Now the problem lies with the clutch push pad. What's happening is the outer dia of the push pad is not completely round or uneven which is not going in smoothly at certain points hence it's not disengaging properly resulting in the problem(kind of getting stuck).

You need to remove the clutch assembly and then just use the push pad to insert it manually into the lay shaft, rotate and take out. Keep rotating and repeating the steps to find out if there is any point where it does not go in and comes out smoothly. If you have any problem with the push pad not going in/ coming out smoothly at any rotation then you have just nailed your problem. Mechanic would know how to sort it out.

Try it out and let me know!

Last edited by Randhawa : 15th March 2011 at 22:01.
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