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Old 5th November 2012, 18:28   #121
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Default Re: The Safe Riding thread

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Originally Posted by Harshal.Bhosale View Post
Today, my friends tease me calling me 'jacket vala' (cuz I wear mine whatever be the weather), but I don't mind, because that same little-frayed jacket has saved me many-an-instance of road rash!
Happens here in my office too. People ask me slyly why I am wearing a jacket even in hot weather. I smile it off, knowing I am already aware of what can happen!
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Old 5th November 2012, 18:45   #122
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Originally Posted by voodoochild

Now we have to tell this to all the lovely ladies in Pune who prefer to wear a insurgent-style headscarf around their faces. Doesn't THAT look silly? Wear it under a helmet, looks a lot less silly.
+1!
Abso-fricking-lutely true! The terrorist-style scarves worn by the female population of Pune are a sight unique to this city. In fact, I've frequently heard my female friends in college from other cities expressing incredulity at this typical Puneri phenomenon!

It is one of the major reasons for the almost-zilch number of ladies-with-helmets we see on Pune roads. They probably reason 'why use helmets when a scarf protects me from dust, pollution, wind blast, and cold climate!'
Yahi soch to badalni hai!

Thankfully my mother doesn't ride a bike in this chaotic 2-wheeler capital of India, but I'll make sure that my younger sister does wear a helmet if and when she gets a two-wheeler! In fact I feel it is upto us T-BHPians to ensure that all our loved ones, including ladies in our families, wear all the protective gear they can whilst on a 2-wheeler!
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Old 5th November 2012, 23:46   #123
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Default Re: When not to use your front brake agressively

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Originally Posted by Rollin' Thunda View Post
So, don't use your front brake aggressively, if you cannot see the road surface clearly...
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Originally Posted by Indraneel Bhat View Post
I totally agree with this. Using the front brake becomes almost second nature after a while for emergencies / stops. But it should be done judiciously.
# The brake should never be used aggressively.

# Always try to brake in a straight line, if you can't shed speed by going down the gears & steering away from the object. DO NOT look at it.

# Try to tip the front in (even in emergency situation)* and then brake with full force, back off the lever if the tire skids. Go braking again.

# On gravel, use engine braking and the rear brake.

*You can master it with practice.

I too am still learning
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Old 5th November 2012, 23:55   #124
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Originally Posted by Sheel
I too am still learning
Right you are, @Sheel. Its always an ongoing process, you never ever stop learning!

As you said above, I always try and dip the front end early on and utilize the full braking grip of the front tyre. On any non-slippery surface, the front almost never gives up even under hard braking. But one should worry about the front in ANY sort of slippery condition, as catching a front slide is next to impossible.

Thanks and regards,
Harshal.
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Old 7th November 2012, 16:19   #125
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Default Re: The Safe Riding thread

Hello all,

Is there an error on page 6 of Twist of the Wrist I, or have I got my theory completely upside down???

It carries a diagram that indicates positive and negative camber corners, with the captions for the two (most probably) interchanged.

Isn't a positive camber turn one with the outside higher than the inside? Apex lower than periphery?

The second paragraph here probably proves I'm right. Still open to correction though.

Cheers,
Rahul

PS: If someone's looking it up in the book, please take note of the arrow denoting direction of travel!

Last edited by voodoochild : 7th November 2012 at 16:23.
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Old 4th December 2012, 16:39   #126
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Default Re: The Safe Riding thread

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Originally Posted by voodoochild View Post
Hello all,

=============
PS: If someone's looking it up in the book, please take note of the arrow denoting direction of travel!
Hey! You are absolutely right, and your understanding isn't flawed. But, there is no mistake in the book, though I can understand why you might get that idea. The "level", "off camber" and "positive camber" drawings that are to the right are essentially cross sections of the curved road shown. You are assuming that the cross section is taken at the beginning of the curved road shown, with the arrow mark facing away from you. I think that the cross section is taken from the right end of the curved road shown , with the arrow mark facing towards you.

I might be wrong, but this reasoning seems to explain it!
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Old 4th December 2012, 17:27   #127
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Default Re: The Safe Riding thread

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Originally Posted by kaushik60 View Post
I think that the cross section is taken from the right end of the curved road shown , with the arrow mark facing towards you.

I might be wrong, but this reasoning seems to explain it!
I was looking at it from the rider's PoV entering the turn, but the RH drawings are done looking back at the turn (why would you do that?). I guess I forgot to note my own "PS" in that post
Made sense to me after a while, but editing time had expired.
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Old 11th January 2013, 12:15   #128
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Default Re: The Safe Riding thread

Came across this on youtube. Really well made video!

PS: Never knew lane-splitting was ILLEGAL in the U.S (most of the states)!
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Old 27th March 2013, 13:51   #129
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Default Re: Tip 7: Use both brakes

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Originally Posted by Rollin' Thunda View Post
7. If you have practiced using the front brake and feel comfortable with it, then make it a habit to hold down the clutch and apply both brakes in most braking situations [for exceptions see Note 1]. The use of both brakes on every occasion habituates you to the proper use of the brakes, and reduces the chance that you will lock them during an emergency. Such lock-ups [Note 2]are extremely dangerous as you will then skid and fall when you are already in a critical situation. In an emergency situation, concentrate on braking firmly but gradually to avoid locking either brake [see Notes: 3 and 4]. Once braking is complete, shift gears down and then release the clutch.


Emergency braking therefore is not easy and requires a lot of practice.
I haven't completed the entire thread, only upto page 3 yet and followed the discussions on the above mentioned point. I've to disagree with it . In any stopping scenario never hold down the clutch untill u complete braking. either leave it the same gear untill it stopss and then pull in the clutch. But preferably u should downshift while braking and release the clutch . at times u may need to do multiple downshifts while emergency braking and engine is goin g to give a workout to the rev limiter . but in doing so u'll be more at control than while at pulling in the clutch. It may sound difficult to do downshifts as u brake .But just practice a lil bit , then it'll come naturally while panic braking. A simple explanation to the different points at which ur momentum is dissipated can be said as follows
1- front wheel ( since you are using front brake to deccelerate)
2- rear wheel (rear brake applied)
3- engine (when u don't pull in the clutch or wen u downshifts )
wen u cut your thrttle and leave it in gear , well u can say the bike is running on a reverse cyle. that is instead of engine turning the rear wheels , the rolling wheel is turning the engine. And a lot of power is required to turn the engine which will be absorbed from your momentum. Wen u downshifts the engine will shhot towards redline absorbing more force than that in the running gear.
I know it sounds confusing
so what i suggest u is to do a braking session as follow
roll in at 40kmph
1-brake with front brake only(clutch pulled in)
2-rear brakeonly(clutch pulled in)
3-both brakes(clutch pulled in)
4- do point 3 with downshifting a gear or two(clutch NOT pulled in)
u'll get the point

Stay safe Ride hard , cheers
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Old 3rd April 2013, 09:42   #130
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Default Re: The Safe Riding thread

Hi folks,

Remember that the larger disk brakes (or the only disk brake) is provided by the manufacturers on the front wheel. So it should be amply clear to us that the front brakes are the primary braking tool that roughly handles 80% of braking duty. (unless you believe you know more than all the manufacturers)

I have gone through a lot of serious biking manuals published in the west and after gleaning information and applying it to our low displacement bikes I have arrived at the following effective technique:

Emergency Braking Sequence and Procedure.

1. Close throttle. Do not pull in the clutch at this stage. Gently squeeze the front brake to half pressure to shift your bikes weight on to your front wheel, and say "one thousand and one" in your mind. This roughly takes one second and readies you and your bike for the next step.

2. As the weight of the bike and the rider shifts forward the front tire acquires more bite and is less likely to skid. In contrast the rear tire gets lighter and will fish-tail at the slightest hint of braking since it would effectively lock up. The engine would have slowed down providing some engine braking due to the clutch having NOT been pulled in.

3. Now you progressively squeeze the front brakes from half to full and at the same time apply the rear brakes gently and progressively along with simultaneous pulling in of the clutch. You can keep squeezing the brakes till the tires squeel but not to the extent that the wheels lock. You may if you think you have over-squeezed the lever, release the brake levers momentarily and then re-apply the brakes.

At no time should you lose traction during braking. If you do so your technique needs to be worked upon.

4. Keep your elbows slightly bent to allow your body to rock forward as you brake. Keeping your arms stiff and rigid transfers your body's inertia of motion to the bike thereby destabilising it.

5. If your bike is leaned over at the time of initiation of braking, start uprighting the bike simultaneously as you progressively brake.

6. As you come to the end of the braking procedure (not necessarily to a standstill) you need to drop your vehicle into 2nd gear and be prepared for any emergency evasive exit procedure that may be needed. (to avoid an oncoming vehicle etc) This has to be a practiced routine so that everything happens "automatically" in an emergency.

****WARNING****

Any rear wheel braking when the bike is even slightly leaned over will cause the rear wheel to move sideways instantaneously as we all would have noticed from experience and now understood from the above paragraph.

Recommended reading :
Twist of the Wrist II - Keith Code (California Superbike School)
Proficient Motorcycling - David Hough

Recommended Viewing
Twist of the Wrist II - DVD by Keith Code
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Old 4th May 2013, 23:23   #131
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Default Re: The Safe Riding thread

Engine braking does not work efficiently with low cc bikes, since, bikes engines are high revving ones, as soon as you shift down, the rpm rises. And as they have continuous gearbox, you cannot shift more then one gear down effectively.

Just an example: R15 does 100kmph around 7000rpm in 6th gear, if you shift it down to 5th, the rpm will shift upwards to around 7500rpm, because the bike is easily capable of doing 10000rpm.

About efficient braking, in bikes it comes with practice, do not grab the clutch (let the rpm come done, pull the clutch when it almost reaches the idling rpm), use front brakes evenly, DO NOT GRAB THEM, by doing this a few times, you will get a rough idea of what your bike is capable of.
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Old 5th May 2013, 10:02   #132
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Default Re: The Safe Riding thread

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Originally Posted by crazyfordriving View Post
Engine braking does not work efficiently with low cc bikes, since, bikes engines are high revving ones, as soon as you shift down, the rpm rises. And as they have continuous gearbox, you cannot shift more then one gear down effectively.
You don't need to. Brake, while downshifting & blipping. Continue braking while going down the 'box, clutching-in & out.

Quote:
Just an example: R15 does 100kmph around 7000rpm in 6th gear, if you shift it down to 5th, the rpm will shift upwards to around 7500rpm, because the bike is easily capable of doing 10000rpm.
It slows down the bike if I am not wrong.
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Old 5th May 2013, 10:32   #133
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Default Re: The Safe Riding thread

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Originally Posted by Sheel View Post
You don't need to. Brake, while downshifting & blipping. Continue braking while going down the 'box, clutching-in & out.


It slows down the bike if I am not wrong.
It will slow down, but not at all effectively, like in case of cars. You need to expertise your front braking, even in MOTOGP, riders use around 90 percent front brakes, and only 10 percent rear braking.
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Old 5th May 2013, 22:25   #134
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Default Re: The Safe Riding thread

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Originally Posted by crazyfordriving View Post
It will slow down, but not at all effectively, like in case of cars.
To slow down, you have to use brakes. Going down the 'box, supplements it.


I find perfect symphony in using both. I am unsure of doing it in a Car. Yet to get the hang of it.
Quote:
You need to expertise your front braking, even in MOTOGP, riders use around 90 percent front brakes, and only 10 percent rear braking.
How did you arrive at this conclusion? Any literature for you claim?

Last edited by Sheel : 5th May 2013 at 22:27.
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Old 6th May 2013, 10:19   #135
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Default Re: The Safe Riding thread

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Originally Posted by Sheel View Post
How did you arrive at this conclusion? Any literature for you claim?
Please have a look at the link, it clearly explains all your doubts.

http://www.f1complete.com/content/view/4638/389/
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