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Old 19th May 2010, 16:13   #1
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Default How to improve pulsar 180's self start operation?

This is my first post! Mods! please be kind to me in case i mess something up.

As you all may have noticed , all the older gens of pulsars have a weak/cranky start. As in, it doesn't start instantly (one touch start) like a honda or a P220. It takes a second or two, with the throttle partially open for it to start. Is there any mod where in I can achieve the same? Do you think a P220 starter motor will help or is it an the sprag clutch?
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Old 17th June 2010, 13:13   #2
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I dont think the P220 sprag will fit a 180. But you can try if the CDI is compatible and give it a try. When you say older gen is your bike from the first lot of P180 or the later gens?

Problem with Bajaj spares is that they are very slightly different for each upgrade that it has gone thru. So you need to check for compatibility before changing the parts.
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Old 18th June 2010, 13:09   #3
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Originally Posted by abhinav.s View Post
I dont think the P220 sprag will fit a 180. But you can try if the CDI is compatible and give it a try. When you say older gen is your bike from the first lot of P180 or the later gens?

Problem with Bajaj spares is that they are very slightly different for each upgrade that it has gone thru. So you need to check for compatibility before changing the parts.
well mine is a UG2 dtsi with analog meter. I have always wondered what causes that noise when you hit the starter? Its not the motor for sure because i have removed it dismantled the whole thing cleaned and re lubed it. I tested it outside the bike by directly connecting it the batt. there was no noise for sure. and yes the noise seemd to originate from behind the magneto after opening LHS gear box cover.

Is this noise due to excess friction somewhere which is sapping the motors power?
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Old 18th June 2010, 13:20   #4
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I get what you are asking for.

Pulsars have a different starting mechanism from the Apaches and Hondas.

There are two types of starters. One is Bendix drive starter and the other is overrunning clutch drive starter.

The Bendix starter is the one you are referring to. AS in the Unicorn/Apache, etc.

These starters just require a push and you are done. (Well! If the engine comes to life, that is)

The other type of starter need to be pressed until the engine comes to life. As in the Pulsar and most cars.

Last edited by DRIV3R : 18th June 2010 at 13:24.
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Old 18th June 2010, 14:30   #5
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The Bendix starter is the one you are referring to. AS in the Unicorn/Apache, etc.

These starters just require a push and you are done. (Well! If the engine comes to life, that is)
Well then i think Bajaj changed to the Bendix starters in the P220 since i have owned one. I just had to push the start button and it used to come to life without any throttle or having to keep it pressed till it came to life.
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Old 18th June 2010, 14:33   #6
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Well, it depends on the bike condition on how much time\cranks it takes to start it. Possible reasons may be a badly tuned CARB. Don't open the throttle untill you hear the engine fired to life in self start bike.

Last edited by mercedised : 18th June 2010 at 14:36.
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Old 18th June 2010, 15:14   #7
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My P180 also have the same problem . I have always wondered why it is noisy compared to Uni and other machines .When the engine starts rotating throttle has to be partially opened to fire the engine. Now a days i'm used do it.
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Old 21st June 2010, 15:49   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by abhinav.s View Post
Well then i think Bajaj changed to the Bendix starters in the P220 since i have owned one. I just had to push the start button and it used to come to life without any throttle or having to keep it pressed till it came to life.

well if the 220 has a bendix then iam sure if should fit in the 180 as most of the structural element of the gear box is the same. the 220 like smooth start comes on the new 2009 180s as well as i noticed at a bajaj showroom. I am actually going to different showrooms and tinkering with the new bikes just for finding out thr "big secret"!
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Old 21st June 2010, 16:31   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sportz_kruzer View Post
well if the 220 has a bendix then iam sure if should fit in the 180 as most of the structural element of the gear box is the same. the 220 like smooth start comes on the new 2009 180s as well as i noticed at a bajaj showroom. I am actually going to different showrooms and tinkering with the new bikes just for finding out thr "big secret"!
I am not too sure of this! I just commented based on Driv3r's explanation of different type of starters. Since the P220 starts exactly like the description given by him in the post on Bendix starter's i assumed that its changed to Bendix now!

for the part in bold
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Old 23rd June 2010, 12:17   #10
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as far as introducing a totally new technology....i have full faith in bajaj - that its falter in one way or the other. Basis this iam sure they have finetuned the existing starter setup to acheive a bendix like performance and not gone for a bendix setup. The reason why i am saying this is that last week I had serviced a 180cc avenger which was a 2006 model (same as mine). His starter response was way better than mine and almost same as the new gen pulsars.

Can any one tell why and where the sound comes from. I am referring to the sound the cranking (chai...chai..chai...) when you hit the starter. On close inspection the sound is accompanied by slight vibrations as well....only felt when you touch the crankcase. So if am not mistaken - it is friction that causes sound and friction kills power. Cant understand why the sound comes from.

Is my starter clutch slipping therby not transmitting the instant kick the the magneto? is it the same as sprag coz there is no clutch like thing in the service manual but they do talk about springs falling out while dis assembly of the magneto. Does this add up anyone?

I am hell bent on solving this issue. This has given me creeps and I have vowed to kill it at all cost (yes iam obsessed!). I am sure I have your support!

Last edited by sportz_kruzer : 23rd June 2010 at 12:23.
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Old 23rd June 2010, 13:12   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sportz_kruzer View Post
.
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Is my starter clutch slipping thereby not transmitting the instant kick the the magneto? is it the same as sprag cos there is no clutch like thing in the service manual but they do talk about springs falling out while dis assembly of the magneto. Does this add up anyone?
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......I am sure I have your support!
I had seen my starter clutch a.k.a sprag clutch being replaced on my 220 due to a manufacturing defect. There were some springs that were removed and put back in a different arrangement or so i think.

Due to the sprag problem, the service center replaced the sprag and also the CDI. Though there was not much difference before and after, i was told that due to defective sprag they have replaced it.

So the problem could be your sprag springs not aligned properly or the CDI. Give it a shot.

And don't worry you will have replies pouring in to help you solve the problem!
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Old 23rd June 2010, 14:28   #12
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Thanks for the boost abhinav! Can you tell me what was the problem you were facing when your sprag was replaced? If possible can you attach a pic of the old sprag clutch? and also if I may ask why did you sell it?

Last edited by sportz_kruzer : 23rd June 2010 at 14:31.
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Old 23rd June 2010, 14:45   #13
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Originally Posted by sportz_kruzer View Post
Thanks for the boost abhinav! Can you tell me what was the problem you were facing when your sprag was replaced? If possible can you attach a pic of the old sprag clutch? and also if I may ask why did you sell it?
I was not having any issues with the Sprag. Dealer themselves called up to inform me that there are issues with Sprag clutch for the batch of 220's in my lot from Sept'09 and asked me to come and get it replaced. But the common problems faced by others having this defective sprag is that when starting the vehicle sounds like a tractor literally. I was given a demo of one 220 whose sprag had gone kaput and it was sounding really rough and similar to a heavy vehicle engine sound.

Sorry dont have any pics as i did not have a cam with me when i went for the replacement. Since I knew the SA a little closely, this is what he informed me. For 220 DTS-i, Bajaj tried a new sprag clutch. But due to some issues, the sprag would go kaput and also the CDI was supplying more than required power when cranking the engine. So Bajaj advised the service centers to replace the sprag with that of DTS-Fi and also change the CDI. This is what was carried out on my bike. Like i said i did not find any difference except for the fact that for the first few 100 kms, the cranking was not smooth after which it was back to how it was before.

As to why i sold off the bike, well it was bought with an intention of taking it mainly for long rides. I did do quite a few long rides with it as well. But when using in the city, the front-heavy design and the huge fairing was a royal pain. So sold it off and got the RTR. I somehow prefer the well balanced ride of the RTR compared to Bajaj bikes.

Coming back to topic, if you are planning to go for the 220 sprag, ensure that its not the faulty one which came with a certain lot of bikes from the factory.

Last edited by abhinav.s : 23rd June 2010 at 14:47.
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