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Old 3rd March 2011, 18:26   #61
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Exclamation Re: Royal Enfield - Shooting the Bullet - 500 Power

Quote:
Originally Posted by sandeepmohan View Post
Does the RC book for this bike say that it is a 500cc? Don't get me wrong here but this bike sounds like a rip off. It looks like the upper half of the bore has been installed on a standard 350 lower block just to give the person an indication that the bike is a 500. There is no other way that the problems you faced can occur on this bike.

Please take a lot of care when you purchase a bike like the 500. It is now a very rare bike to come across as nearly all of them have either wreaked their engines or have been dumped somewhere.
Hi Sandeep,

This is for sure original RE500, My friend helped me getting the bike, original owner manual, original duplicate keys, original folder given by southern motors chennai and the very original first aid (expired) kit of 2004.

Yeah, I will not buy any vehicle without personally inspecting. The damage that incured to me due to this issue are:

1. Over 23K for the damage control (Parts, Lathe Charges, Labour charges, Taxi charges to carry the parts to Chennai, Car fuel to carry the parts from chennai to Gingee)
2. 7802 additional kms (initially I was thinking this bike had run only 20K kms, but actually 27802kms when I took delivery)
3. Five days of my precious time
4. 580kms of riding
5. Rs. 1,700 worth fuel
6. Mental agony

I'm sure RE500 uses the same engine case of the RE350, only difference is in the crank. I heard my mechanic saying that the crank is little heavier than the RE350.

I/Powertwin validated the RC and it is genuine RE500 book, the only thing I missed is to check the cylinder/piston. If the cylinder/piston would have been original then I would have saved the whole expense.

I'm sure the oil pump for RE 535 was having much bigger cylinder size than the RE500's oil pump cylinder size to provide addtional oil lubrication. Hence the engine seizure had caused due to lack of sufficient oil supply to the moving parts internally. I had seen the RE535 oil pump in the shop in chennai and cornered the problem to oil pump for the following reasons:

1. The mechanic I met enroute to Tiruvannamalai told me that the oil circulation was not sufficient.
2. I felt excessive vibration due to rocker and value running with insufficient oil
3. The bigger bore/piston also added up more heating issues on the long distance
4. The carburater found to be running with RE 500 jetting and this also added to overheating as the RE535 cylinder running lean.
5. when Powertwin rode the bike in coimbatore for 450kms (as he stated on the phone), the bike didn't have any problem. I'm sure he covered the 450-kms in 10-15days tennure hence seldom ran. So the issues were not notified to them. My trip to Chennai was long enough for the oil to burn and engine to over heat so the engine seizure.

If you see the previous post before buying this bike, I did mention about 1.5mm oversize that was conveyed to me as replacement done on the previous service attempt. hence I had an impression that this bike was running on oversized piston of RE500. I only came to know when I met the lathe shop guy in chennai about RE535 cylinder kit was in use with this bike.

In anycase the whole engine components were restored to RE500 now. All I can remember now are the following parts:

1. Cylinder kit
2. Engine bearings
3. Floating bush and bearing (crank shaft)
4. Oil pump warm gears (long one and the nut type)
5. Oil filter
6. Rocker and Arm
7. Valve & Guide
8. Head, Cylinder, Clutch, Timing, Tappet and Rocker case gaskets
9. Engine oil seals (O ring type)
10. 3.5L of Castrol GTX 20w40 Oil
11. Oil pump kit


Additional fittings that I have installed:

1. Front and Rear crash bars
2. Side view mirrors (Need to change them as the ones installed are TB type)
3. Brass items:
a. Head light peak
b. Parking light rings
c. Neutral lever spring cap
d. Side lifting handle
e. Brass tapped plate with wing nut old style
f. Handle T nut
g. brake rod wing nut
h. Neutral lever
i. Pillion Handle


Apartfrom the above there are few more points to be addressed:

1. The speedo meter in this bike goes smooth until 60kmph speed, then it started shaking like a crazy fellow. - While I had discussion with the speedo meter service fellow in Chennai, he says

a. if the speedo went through correction/alternation this may happen
b. the meter is having problem
c. the warm gear is having issue

Put together I have some discomfort, as to think this way

Will the cylinder, rocker, value, guide, piston change requires for a RE500 with in 27,000kms of its life?

Mixing this question with above speedo issue and age of the bike(2004 model), I was forced to think that this bike would have been running more kilometers before handed over to Powertwin by the previous owner.

I will be changing the speedo meter with new one as I'm planning to keep this bike with me forever, the change of speedo is to make sure that I get proper reading.

In anycase I have peace of mind now as I have personally restored the bike to its origianl RE500 specs using all new parts. I'm proudly owning a very original RE500 after all the damages mentioned above, when I restored this bike and calculated all the damages I felt the bike I saw with 10K kms on the odo in chennai would have been steal to deal.

Last edited by trammway : 3rd March 2011 at 18:32.
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Old 3rd March 2011, 20:56   #62
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Default Re: Royal Enfield - Shooting the Bullet - 500 Power

Quote:
Originally Posted by trammway View Post
This is for sure original RE500, My friend helped me getting the bike
So thats clear.

Quote:
Originally Posted by trammway View Post
The damage that incured to me due to this issue are
This is huge and considering this i felt this bike was not a good buy at all.

Quote:
Originally Posted by trammway View Post
Mental agony
Something I can't tolerate.

Quote:
Originally Posted by trammway View Post
I'm sure RE500 uses the same engine case of the RE350, only difference is in the crank. I heard my mechanic saying that the crank is little heavier than the RE350.
I can't comment on this but the oil dip stick opening on your bike is a Tap type opener. Mine uses a spring loaded cap.

Quote:
Originally Posted by trammway View Post
I/Powertwin validated the RC and it is genuine RE500 book, the only thing I missed is to check the cylinder/piston.
This is not possible to inspect. Nobody will open the engine head for you to inspect unless you pay to do it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by trammway View Post
My trip to Chennai was long enough for the oil to burn and engine to over heat so the engine seizure.
The engine oil consumption on this bike is a lot more than the 350cc and it is normal for it to burn or turn black due to excess heat. This is actually quite normal for the bike.

Quote:
Originally Posted by trammway View Post
The speedo meter in this bike goes smooth until 60kmph speed, then it started shaking like a crazy
Mine actually broke 2 weeks ago. I will be replacing it this weekend.

Quote:
Originally Posted by trammway View Post
Will the cylinder, rocker, value, guide, piston change requires for a RE500 with in 27,000kms of its life?
Well my friends bike has undergone a complete engine re build some 3 years ago and is nearing this figure. No serious issues but there is some valve noise coming from the engine now. Shows up only during excess temperatures. The bike also has a tendency to loose power when it is running very hot. The same behavior on my bike as well as far as over heating goes.
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Old 3rd March 2011, 21:05   #63
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Default Re: Royal Enfield - Shooting the Bullet - 500 Power

Quote:
Originally Posted by sandeepmohan View Post
... It looks like the upper half of the bore has been installed on a standard 350 lower block just to give the person an indication that the bike is a 500.. ..
just curious, is there any such indication from the photos posted? since trammway says that RE500 uses the same engine case of the RE350. I mean, is there any such straight work that a 350 case can be fitted with 500 pot.

@trammway, to me its rather simple to blow up an RE engine if it has issues with lubing; having lost my 350's barrel-piston by seizure at ~20K km & the only cause which i couldnt eliminate was lower grade oil (meant for diesel engines?) filled up by from coimbatore RE store.

Anyways, wish you many good miles everafter

(edit: missed the previous post)

Last edited by Rennjit : 3rd March 2011 at 21:11.
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Old 3rd March 2011, 21:18   #64
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Default Re: Royal Enfield - Shooting the Bullet - 500 Power

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Originally Posted by jeepster View Post
interesting!!!

my choice will be second one.
2. Std 500CC CI w/disc brake
i assume that you already have bought the Bull.
so i demand some high-resolution pictures ASAP.

EDIT: congrats sir ji.
That's mine exactly.

Congratulations Siva.
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Old 3rd March 2011, 23:02   #65
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Default Re: Royal Enfield - Shooting the Bullet - 500 Power

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Originally Posted by iron View Post
i Was more confident while braking at high speeds or while applying sudden brakes in case of an emergency. How was the issue you are referring get sorted out on the LB500?
This may be OT, but the front brakes and suspension on the LB500 are the best part of the bike, they inspire a lot of confidence. The brakes are powerful and yet progressive, RE got the damping and spring rates pretty good on the LB500. The CI500s front suspension is from an earlier generation and was prone to diving and bottoming under heavy braking such as in an emergency.
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Old 3rd March 2011, 23:44   #66
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Default Re: Royal Enfield - Shooting the Bullet - 500 Power

Quote:
Originally Posted by sandeepmohan View Post
This is huge and considering this i felt this bike was not a good buy at all. This is not possible to inspect. Nobody will open the engine head for you to inspect unless you pay to do it.
If only I would have known before, I'm sure I wouldn't have gone all the way from Chennai. I can't blame anyone as the issue was with cylinder/piston that was changed by previous owner.


Quote:
Originally Posted by sandeepmohan View Post
I can't comment on this but the oil dip stick opening on your bike is a Tap type opener. Mine uses a spring loaded cap.
If you look at the pictures I have posted about the 3 bikes I was evaluating to buy, you will notice the RE CI500 ES having different mudguards and fuel tank (look at the fuel tank cap). Actually those were original which I have confirmed yesterday after meeting couple of other RE CI500 ES owners. Hence the oil dip stick opening also would have been in some of the models under RE 500 category. As I remember the RE500 was made available from 1996 and by the way which year was your bike mfgd ?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Beast_of_Burden View Post
This may be OT, but the front brakes and suspension on the LB500 are the best part of the bike, they inspire a lot of confidence. The brakes are powerful and yet progressive, RE got the damping and spring rates pretty good on the LB500. The CI500s front suspension is from an earlier generation and was prone to diving and bottoming under heavy braking such as in an emergency.
What you have said is 100% right, I have not mentioned in my previous post but while riding from Coimbatore to Tiruvannamalai on the NH66 where the roads are badly damaged, I had to apply front disc brake to avoid falling on to a path hole (dug up like a well). Since it was harsh braking I could see the suspension bottomed and the newly installed front crash bar damaged my front mudguard (earlier there was a small dent, but after my braking that dent became very big)


Quote:
Originally Posted by dwaraka View Post
That's mine exactly.
Congratulations Siva.
Thanks Bro. Cool.. within our Jeepers community I know Utkarsh and you along with me are using RE CI500 w/disc brake.

Guys,

After spending money and riding her daily, I have no regrets except the hard time that I had when she seized. All I feel now is a authentic brand new (atleast the parts went in are vital) RE CI500 and I could see many future miles of living with her.

Last edited by trammway : 3rd March 2011 at 23:56.
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Old 4th March 2011, 09:23   #67
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Default Re: Royal Enfield - Shooting the Bullet - 500 Power

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Originally Posted by Rennjit View Post
just curious, is there any such indication from the photos posted?
No. However the bore is a 2 piece unit and you can easily be ripped off if someone simply mounts the upper section of a 500 bore just to give an indication that it is a 500 by means of the extended cooling fins.

Quote:
Originally Posted by trammway View Post
As I remember the RE500 was made available from 1996 and by the way which year was your bike mfgd ?
Yes. The fuel tank cap is different. I am not sure if the year 1996 was the start for this bike. I know a friend who sold his 1994 500 some months ago. The bike was put up for sale on Team Bhp. I have a 1996 model 500 CI.
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Old 4th March 2011, 10:46   #68
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Default Re: Royal Enfield - Shooting the Bullet - 500 Power

I made a mistake & you are correct. 500 production re started in 1996. The one I spoke about earlier in my previous post is a 1998 model; not a 94.

A picture attached of 2 1996 500's. The one on the left is mine and the bike on the right belongs to a good friend and has been rebuilt from scratch a couple of years ago. We both got lucky with our bikes as far as sale price and overall bike condition. Mine was 40k and my friend paid 38K for his. He spent another 40K on a complete rebuild. I have not spent anything apart from electrical upgrade to 12volt and regular service expenses. My engine is not mint & I recently installed new pistons rings. Not a single break down for both the bikes.
Attached Thumbnails
Royal Enfield - Shooting the Bullet - 500 Power-dsc01392.jpg  


Last edited by sandeepmohan : 4th March 2011 at 11:15.
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Old 4th March 2011, 12:42   #69
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Default Re: Royal Enfield - Shooting the Bullet - 500 Power

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Originally Posted by sandeepmohan View Post
I made a mistake & you are correct. 500 production re started in 1996. The one I spoke about earlier in my previous post is a 1998 model; not a 94.

A picture attached of 2 1996 500's. The one on the left is mine and the bike on the right belongs to a good friend and has been rebuilt from scratch a couple of years ago. We both got lucky with our bikes as far as sale price and overall bike condition. Mine was 40k and my friend paid 38K for his. He spent another 40K on a complete rebuild. I have not spent anything apart from electrical upgrade to 12volt and regular service expenses. My engine is not mint & I recently installed new pistons rings. Not a single break down for both the bikes.

Hey, Both the bikes are looking good. You are one luck chap to have RE500 at that price. I could see your friend has reached almost my budget. Just have him install a crash bar, I guess that is neccessary.

With reference to the our previous discussion, yes this model would have come with spring loaded oil cap. I could see you have the older non-disc brake model RE500.

Mine was the younger sibling of your CI500, may be the tap type oil cap introduced in the later days. ;-)
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Old 4th March 2011, 14:05   #70
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Default Re: Royal Enfield - Shooting the Bullet - 500 Power

This picture is quite old and both the bikes look a little different now. There is a crash guard if you look close. Its the army butterfly crash guard. We both have the same crash guard installed. Mine now runs a up swept exhaust and the bike on the right is on the stock long bottle exhaust. Not the same long bottle that comes with the Machismo but the original 500 long bottle with a wider mouth at the end. Goes with the profile of the bike and makes it look longer than it actually is.
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Old 4th March 2011, 14:19   #71
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Default Re: Royal Enfield - Shooting the Bullet - 500 Power

Another snap showing you the army crash guard and up swept exhaust. Exhausts are constantly swapped between the bikes
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Old 4th March 2011, 14:51   #72
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Default Re: Royal Enfield - Shooting the Bullet - 500 Power

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Originally Posted by sandeepmohan View Post
... A picture attached of 2 1996 500's. The one on the left is mine and the bike on the right belongs to a good friend ...
simple & clean .

Name:  AF ref.JPG
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This air filter box is a different one? I got this detail pic but couldn't make out purpose of item no18 - just a cover, possibly a resonator? Or was it a makeover primarily for the export markets.
Name:  AF dtl.JPG
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It seems a good design considering the older square box (open bottom) & newer toolbox (bulky) setups. Can any post an actual picture of that item no18? or rather would a spare box be available?

EDIT: is that rear carrier (plated one) on the right side bike an the off shelf item? any close pics? more info pls..

Last edited by Rennjit : 4th March 2011 at 15:04.
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Old 4th March 2011, 15:51   #73
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Default Re: Royal Enfield - Shooting the Bullet - 500 Power

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Originally Posted by Rennjit View Post
simple & clean .

Attachment 511164
This air filter box is a different one? I got this detail pic but couldn't make out purpose of item no18 - just a cover, possibly a resonator? Or was it a makeover primarily for the export markets.
Attachment 511165

It seems a good design considering the older square box (open bottom) & newer toolbox (bulky) setups. Can any post an actual picture of that item no18? or rather would a spare box be available?

EDIT: is that rear carrier (plated one) on the right side bike an the off shelf item? any close pics? more info pls..
Hey, You brought another interesting thing to differentiate the CI500 from CI350.

Yes my bike uses that square box (air filter box) as dummy junction box for the filtered air. The actual air filter element is in the triangle shaped toolbox like the new C5. The square box got an inlet (connected to the triangle airfilter(formerly toolbox)box) and outlet connected to carb.

I'm sure the CI350s were using the square box for air filter element.

Now seeing your picture the point 18 shows that there is some kind of pre-filter used before the element. Hence the air that comes into the squre box sucked through the duct (point 18) before getting into the air filter element.

Can some one point which model of RE this type used? (Electra, Machimo, STD)
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Old 4th March 2011, 17:00   #74
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Default Re: Royal Enfield - Shooting the Bullet - 500 Power

I will confirm on the air box being a resonator as well. I have never opened it for anything. Will check and put up a picture over the weekend.

I know for sure that the Machismo and Electra don't use this resonator system. These models use a circular air filter element fitted in what was once the tool box.

The Machismo air filter box has more interesting bits and stupid in some ways. Stupid cause it can leave you with a oil soaked air filter. This actually happened to a friend of mine when we were touring. There is an stale oil drain outlet from the engine that runs to a reservoir behind the battery. This reservoir is meant to be drained at every service interval but is forgotten at times or gets full sooner than it normally should. It all depends on how much running the bike does. There is a over flow pipe from this reservoir that goes into the air filter element box. When the reservoir gets full the over flow goes directly into the box that contains the air filter element and ends up soaking it. It takes time for the filter to get soaked to the point where the engine no longer gets any air or rather starts pulling in stale oil via the air filter box. Once this happens you are screwed. I don't blame Enfield for this design as in export markets bikes are not supposed to leak any oil so the stale oil is stored in a reservoir. Experienced mechanics disconnect this reservoir over flow pipe and completely remove the stale oil reservoir and direct the stale oil pipe from the engine to the chain so there is some sort of lubrication. This is how it is on the old school standards.

The chromium plated carrier is an off the shelf accessory. I have seen it on quite a few bikes though few uses it as it can hardly hold onto anything.
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Old 4th March 2011, 20:22   #75
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Default Re: Royal Enfield - Shooting the Bullet - 500 Power

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Originally Posted by trammway View Post
Hey, You brought another interesting thing to differentiate the CI500 from CI350.
....
Now seeing your picture the point 18 shows that there is some kind of pre-filter used before the element. Hence the air that comes into the squre box sucked through the duct (point 18) before getting into the air filter element.
Can some one point which model of RE this type used? (Electra, Machimo, STD)
No it rather differentiates CI 500 models because CI350's never featured these. Item no18 bottom cover+intake resonator hopefully cuts down on intake noise. CI500-Lightning 500/535-machismo A350 had these during different times.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sandeepmohan View Post
I will confirm on the air box being a resonator as well. I have never opened it for anything. Will check and put up a picture over the weekend.
Thank you. I really would like to have one such on my 350 since it seems a better option than old open bottom type to free up the right side toolbox. With a good reference pic i could atleast replicate one.

Last edited by Rennjit : 4th March 2011 at 20:34.
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