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Old 12th September 2012, 09:51   #46
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Default Re: BMW 320d & 328i : Official Review

Great Review of a Great Car!


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Originally Posted by ajmat View Post
I have not seen any new 3's in town,
Same here in Goa. The only car I have seen is the TD car. Usually you see a lot of cars whenever any new car is launched. The old 3 Series was selling quite well. Is is because the new 3 is not so VFM anymore?

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Old 12th September 2012, 10:09   #47
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Originally Posted by ajmat
Although everyone is raving about the 3, I am a bit disappointed by the styling, it has become very derivative. I have not seen any new 3's in town, am not sure whether I have mistaken them for 5's.
I had also been wondering about this, but spotted new 3 s a few times in the last week, so perhaps its just that deliveries have been limited
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Old 12th September 2012, 11:07   #48
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Originally Posted by Harbir View Post
what a disappointing car.
One is entitled to one's opinion but do elaborate and tell us why you feel so.

IN fact this time I do feel BMW has improved the 3 series. For me, ride quality improvement is quite important. And in the 328i, I think they have provided almost everything that I would wish for in my next car upgrade for which I have been waiting for a year or so and would actually shell out my money for.
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Old 12th September 2012, 11:17   #49
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Default Re: BMW 320d & 328i : Official Review

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Originally Posted by ajmat View Post
An excellent review

Although everyone is raving about the 3, I am a bit disappointed by the styling, it has become very derivative. I have not seen any new 3's in town, am not sure whether I have mistaken them for 5's. Some folks might beat me up for being a mod yet not able to spot what is what! Sorry, I concentrate on the road too hard!

I have not driven this car but have driven the latest 5 and an E90. EPS does rob it of feel, I can vouch for that in the Jetta also.

The 328 sport looks hot but the 320d wheels makes the overall styling look staid. As for the spare wheel, it is a bummer. Having busted a wheel rim on a forest road between Hubli and Goa, I know that a run flat would have be of no use.

There is no doubting that it is a competent car and I would buy one if I had the dosh but I would have liked it to be provokingly styled. I like the Bangle 7 and the E90 5 since they visually challenged you. The E36 also signified a different styling path for BMW.

The derivative evolution disappoints. Audi have gone this way, Mercedes (based on the protoypes) are also following that path.

Designers, step away from the phtocopier, get a blood transfusion from Mr Bangle and challenge us!
+1, couldn't agree more. In frequent debates with friends on the design lines, the F's seem to be hitting people with a balance and sort of soothing but the freshness/striking exteriors of Bangle designs which don't time with age, especially a few of them, are priceless. I miss him for a damn good reason

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Old 12th September 2012, 11:18   #50
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Default Re: BMW 320d & 328i : Official Review

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Originally Posted by sandeep108 View Post
One is entitled to one's opinion but do elaborate and tell us why you feel so.

IN fact this time I do feel BMW has improved the 3 series. For me, ride quality improvement is quite important. And in the 328i, I think they have provided almost everything that I would wish for in my next car upgrade for which I have been waiting for a year or so and would actually shell out my money for.

When a 3 series is being praised for its ride quality and its automatic transmission and criticized for its trashy steering, you know that the 3 series has died and been replaced with a car that has borrowed the name of a legend that has passed into history.

In the world of cars, the 3 series has been for nearly 40 years one of 2 or 3 standards of what a fine driver's car is. Not just for a sedan, but absolute excellence. Now BMW has abandoned the ethos of "ultimate driving machine" in order to make it a luxury car that will appeal to markets such as China and India.

The F30 may be an excellent luxury car that still has better drivers car credentials than the others because they aren't trying to make drivers cars either, but that doesn't change the fact that with the F30, the world has lost a pinnacle of driving supremacy. It is only in countries like India where the F30 is being celebrated as an improvement for here there is no culture or appreciation of superior sporting cars.

I've no doubt that Indians and Chinese, and people in the west who would otherwise have picked a mercedes or an Audi love the F30. But long standing 3 series fans around the world are in deep mourning.

Last edited by Harbir : 12th September 2012 at 11:31.
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Old 12th September 2012, 11:31   #51
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Originally Posted by Harbir View Post
The F30 may be an excellent luxury car that still has better drivers car credentials than the others because they aren't trying to make drivers cars either, but that doesn't change the fact that with the F30, the world has lost a pinnacle of driving supremacy. It is only in countries like India where the F30 is being celebrated as an improvement for here there is no culture or appreciation of superior sporting cars.

I've no doubt that Indians and Chinese, and people in the west who would have picked a mercedes or an Audi would love the F30. But 3 series fans around the world are in deep mourning.
Well yes, I agree with you there to some extent. But for superior sporting cars, if one is so inclined / needs, should go for the M in BMW, AMG in Merc and S in Audi. For us regular 'poor' Indians, we will celebrate the new 3 as an improvement because it really gives us driver enthusiasts an almost impeccable aspirational compromise. We simply do not have the roads / infrastructure for enthusiast drivers and BMW has recognised this (other than the RFTs). Yes, they probably could give an option for the 'sports' suspension package, but they would probably only sell a couple a year. For the rich, they would never consider the 3 series anyway.

I do not think most are in mourning, in fact the 328i is being raved about all over the world, including Europe and US.
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Old 12th September 2012, 11:38   #52
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Originally Posted by Harbir View Post
When a 3 series is being praised for its ride quality and its automatic transmission and criticized for its trashy steering, you know that the 3 series has died and been replaced with a car that has borrowed the name of a legend that has passed into history.

In the world of cars, the 3 series has been for nearly 40 years one of 2 or 3 standards of what a fine driver's car is. Not just for a sedan, but absolute excellence. Now BMW has abandoned the ethos of "ultimate driving machine" in order to make it a luxury car that will appeal to markets such as China and India.

The F30 may be an excellent luxury car that still has better drivers car credentials than the others because they aren't trying to make drivers cars either, but that doesn't change the fact that with the F30, the world has lost a pinnacle of driving supremacy. It is only in countries like India where the F30 is being celebrated as an improvement for here there is no culture or appreciation of superior sporting cars.

I've no doubt that Indians and Chinese, and people in the west who would otherwise have picked a mercedes or an Audi love the F30. But long standing 3 series fans around the world are in deep mourning.
+1

My brother and I couldn't believe our eyes when we saw it in pics last year and in flesh this Feb in London. We altered our plans & bought the Exx's only because the F seriously wasn't to our taste in design. We are not experts but straight from the heart we didn't love it and it still hasn't grown on us. Its just our opinion. A few would definitely enjoy their new ownership but should also remember that a few good ol' things are history now. Otherwise, I don't think anyone can stop these companies and designs from evolving, but I wish they stayed put until this generation ended haha

pEaCe

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Old 12th September 2012, 11:46   #53
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Well yes, I agree with you there to some extent. But for superior sporting cars, if one is so inclined / needs, should go for the M in BMW, AMG in Merc and S in Audi.
Firstly, Since the M3 was not a substitute for the pleasures that the non-M 3ers provided, that is no solace.

Secondly, I cannot accept that a car with anything less than brilliant steering is a drivers car or an enthusiasts car.for me a 3 series with bad steering is as appealing as pile of dung, it is a travesty, a reason for profound sadness. That it is not even offered with a manual transmission in India makes the indian market car a worthless luxury marshmallow in my view and not an enthusiast or drivers car in any regard whatsoever.

However, if this thing appeals to what you consider the enthusiast in you, do go for it.

Last edited by Harbir : 12th September 2012 at 11:49.
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Old 12th September 2012, 11:47   #54
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Default Re: BMW 320d & 328i : Official Review

Richard Hammond’s comments on the new 3-series. Interesting read
http://www.mirror.co.uk/authors/rich...he-best-782945
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Old 12th September 2012, 11:47   #55
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Default Re: BMW 320d & 328i : Official Review

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Originally Posted by sandeep108 View Post
Well yes, I agree with you there to some extent. But for superior sporting cars, if one is so inclined / needs, should go for the M in BMW, AMG in Merc and S in Audi. For us regular 'poor' Indians, we will celebrate the new 3 as an improvement because it really gives us driver enthusiasts an almost impeccable aspirational compromise. We simply do not have the roads / infrastructure for enthusiast drivers and BMW has recognised this (other than the RFTs). Yes, they probably could give an option for the 'sports' suspension package, but they would probably only sell a couple a year. For the rich, they would never consider the 3 series anyway.

I do not think most are in mourning, in fact the 328i is being raved about all over the world, including Europe and US.
I don't think it's the soft-suspension that Habir is complaining about. That can be sorted outside the factory, if one really wants a different setup.

I haven't driven one, but I should get the opportunity to sample one soon *fingers crossed*

What's got the enthusiasts cribbing is the 'lifeless' steering-wheel, and unlike the 'India-specific' soft-suspension setup, the EPS is a feature that's been added on F30 3ers universally.

EPS is something every car-maker is adding to all their cars these days, for the purpose of meeting the required emission-norms. If you watch the video reviews of cars that epitomize driving-experience, like the 911 for example, auto-hacks have vehemently written it off for its steering-feel, or rather the lack of it. It's still sharp and precise. But it doesn't communicate with the driver like it used to. And this is what has got everyone's goat.

What we can do now, is just move on and accept the changes that cars are going through, in the name of efficiency and emissions.
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Old 12th September 2012, 11:55   #56
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Default Re: BMW 320d & 328i : Official Review

The E90 was already on the path to seriously diluted steering feel. If you have driven a 1995 325i or a 1998 328i or 2002 330i, only then will you realize what has been lost.
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Old 12th September 2012, 11:57   #57
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Default Re: BMW 320d & 328i : Official Review

The features list mentions variable sports steering for the 328i. However the review does not seem to have touched on this aspect. What is the difference between the normal 320d EPS steering and the 328i's variable sports steering? Is it only the paddles or do they add something to improve the feel of the EPS.

And yes I do enjoy my civic's steering and get what Harbir means. But to write it off as a complete disappointment I feel is too extreme.
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Old 12th September 2012, 12:04   #58
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Default Re: BMW 320d & 328i : Official Review

If it is otherwise a good car, then sure, to people who are looking for the attributes it does offer, its far from a disappointment.

For me, If the car has lost the essence of its excellence, it can be nothing but a disappointment. I am a fanatic for good steering feel and cannot consider any car to be a good drivers car if it does not have really superb steering. And the BMW inline 6 engine, paired to a manual transmission is the finest driveline in all of autodom short of a V12. Lousy steering, turbo four engine, automatic transmission only in India, its all deeply disappointing to me.

I am of course not arguing that you have to agree with my views or that your own preferences need my approval.

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Old 12th September 2012, 13:16   #59
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Default Re: BMW 320d & 328i : Official Review

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Originally Posted by sandeep108 View Post
The features list mentions variable sports steering for the 328i. However the review does not seem to have touched on this aspect. What is the difference between the normal 320d EPS steering and the 328i's variable sports steering? Is it only the paddles or do they add something to improve the feel of the EPS.

And yes I do enjoy my civic's steering and get what Harbir means. But to write it off as a complete disappointment I feel is too extreme.
The " Variable Sport Steering " specific to the 328 the only difference i could make out is that during making U-Turns or in tight parking spots the steering will turn to lock & lock position in only just over 2 turns as compared to about under 3 in standard steering setup.

As far as steering feel is concerned i think it is very enjoyable and weighs up nicely on high speeds ( Especially in Sport modes ) . Havent driven the E90 much but yes there is a difference and the " connected " feel or the " driver involvement " has reduced .

^ Which is true ( as being talked worldwide ) .

Also im a first time BMW owner so i may not be knowing how " it used to " feel

Still the F30 be it the 320d or 328 it is the most involving car to drive in the bunch ( i.e. against C , A4 ).

@ Sandeep - You should just go ahead with your buy

As far as comparing the F30 to the previous gen. cars may go , it might be true that the BMW'ness has been reduced but it might not be fair as BMW has gained much more than what it has lost.

Its like for an example a FIAT UNO owner will never like a PALIO
& i also know a PALIO owner who hates a PUNTO, So there goes.

Last edited by karan561 : 12th September 2012 at 13:19.
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Old 12th September 2012, 14:05   #60
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Its like for an example a FIAT UNO owner will never like a PALIO
& i also know a PALIO owner who hates a PUNTO, So there goes.
True. At the end of the day, all that matters is how you smile when you look at your car in the morning and how much you enjoy your drives!

pEaCe
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