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Old 23rd May 2015, 19:54   #766
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Default Re: Hyundai Grand i10 : Official Review

Yesterday afternoon Mr. Sandeep Jha ( sandeepjha@hmil.net )called from regional office of Hyundai. Email ID is given to me verbally over telephone.

He claimed that performance will not get affected. He was very admant on that fact and wanted me to agree with him.
His eventual intention was to pass this off as normal. Counter point put forward by me : If this rust is normal, then cars not having rust are abnormal ? He was repeating the above performance statement, only with more intensity.

He once even said that the part is completely fine, and cannot be replaced under warranty.
Lost my cool, asked him if he is aware of how many kms. the car has done. Then, on further arguments ( as this was no longer discussion ), he said the rust depends upon situation. Informed him that if he is not aware of situation, how can he conclude that this is not covered under warranty ?
Asked him to define what amount of rust is Normal and how to get it checked, where to get it checked, etc. ? He was clueless.
Honestly, I felt that he was there to offer denial, and take some frustration off the end user who is dissatisfied.


It was now that he agreed to ask an area manager to contact me on Monday. Asked for his email ID and here are a few points I have raised :

Quote:

As per our discussion over phone, you ( on behalf of Hyundai Motors ) confirm that the rust observed in my car is "Absolutely Normal".
The rust formation will not affect the SAFETY and PERFORMANCE of the vehicle.

I fail to understand how come all Grand i10 cars do not have similar level of rust.
Please elaborate.

Also, you had no information on "Situation" which was a term you brought into discussion. Please provide more specifications on how an end user should technically evaluate (may be test the car in lab every time the car is used ) before driving a Hyundai car for Hyundai's specified "Situation".

Now, I will await how to waste further time for your Area manager to contact me and discuss ( I am sure that he will just argue ).

From my current situation it seems that I wasted my money and Hyundai successfully educed money from a consumer.

I would need further clarification :

1) Why other cars are not having similar rust ?

2) What do you mean by situation ? How can certain data be verified ? Then all Grand i10 operating in similar condition should have similar rust.

3) Till what extent the rust should be treated as "Normal" ?

4) How to monitor the amount of rust ?

5) Is the amount of rust specified in manual ?
TDed Swift, will go in for a change if this continues.
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Old 23rd May 2015, 20:42   #767
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Originally Posted by aaggoswami View Post

TDed Swift, will go in for a change if this continues.
I have gone through all your posts regarding rust on the lower arm area.

I can say that it isn't normal by any means. Hyundai better stand up and accept to get them change under warranty rather than writing silly reasons like situations etc.

If it was normal, all cars in your area should bear the same rusting pattern which IMO isn't there so it clearly is some defect.

Last edited by a4anurag : 23rd May 2015 at 20:51.
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Old 25th May 2015, 20:05   #768
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Default Re: Hyundai Grand i10 : Official Review

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I have gone through all your posts regarding rust on the lower arm area.

I can say that it isn't normal by any means. Hyundai better stand up and accept to get them change under warranty rather than writing silly reasons like situations etc.

If it was normal, all cars in your area should bear the same rusting pattern which IMO isn't there so it clearly is some defect.
Haven't received call from Hyundai. Did call them up in afternoon and had a word with Mr. Sandeep Jha, he confirmed that there will be an update from Mr. Swapnil who is "Area Manager".
Was waiting for their call till evening, then called up again at 5:00 pm and asked the lady who picked up the call to let me know Mr. Sandip's and Mr. Swapnil's boss. She told me Mr. Shyam heads Ahmedabad operations.
She took down my details, but yet to get any update from them.

Meanwhile, at home, I tried taking a few more shots of rusted part. Images attached. Have written a post on Hyundai's India Facebook page, but still no update.

Feeling cheated and down, I spent my hard earned money citing better quality than Maruti Suzuki. Result is a disaster, more so in form of poor, pathetic after sales and service. Nobody at Hyundai India cares which is what I can derive given their consistently arrogant and rude behaviour.
From bottom of my heart I am regretting saving just Rs. 30,000/- over Swift VDi at that time.
Attached Thumbnails
Hyundai Grand i10 : Official Review-img_20150525_192829.jpg  

Hyundai Grand i10 : Official Review-img_20150525_193312.jpg  

Hyundai Grand i10 : Official Review-img_20150525_193317.jpg  

Hyundai Grand i10 : Official Review-img_20150525_193324.jpg  

Hyundai Grand i10 : Official Review-img_20150525_193339.jpg  

Hyundai Grand i10 : Official Review-img_20150525_193516.jpg  

Hyundai Grand i10 : Official Review-img_20150525_193543.jpg  

Hyundai Grand i10 : Official Review-img_20150525_193555.jpg  

Hyundai Grand i10 : Official Review-img_20150525_193558.jpg  

Hyundai Grand i10 : Official Review-img_20150525_193603.jpg  


Last edited by aaggoswami : 25th May 2015 at 20:07.
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Old 25th May 2015, 20:11   #769
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Default Re: Hyundai Grand i10 : Official Review

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Originally Posted by aaggoswami View Post
poor, pathetic after sales and service. Nobody at Hyundai India cares which is what I can derive given their consistently arrogant and rude behaviour.

From bottom of my heart I am regretting
I put my Grand i10 on hold after seeing this. Want to be sure about Hyundai A.S.S. Please keep us updated.
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Old 26th May 2015, 12:46   #770
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Default Re: Hyundai Grand i10 : Official Review

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Originally Posted by aaggoswami View Post
Yesterday afternoon Mr. Sandeep Jha ( sandeepjha@hmil.net )called from regional office of Hyundai. Email ID is given to me verbally over telephone.

He claimed that performance will not get affected. He was very admant on that fact and wanted me to agree with him.
His eventual intention was to pass this off as normal. Counter point put forward by me : If this rust is normal, then cars not having rust are abnormal ? He was repeating the above performance statement, only with more intensity.

He once even said that the part is completely fine, and cannot be replaced under warranty.
After reading about this, I immediately checked our November 2014 manufactured Grand i10 and there is no rust formation in the areas mentioned by you. I agree that it is abnormal.

Reading about your situation, it feels like a sense of Deja Vu. When I was in based in Veraval, Gujarat, I went through the same frustration while dealing with the Ahmedabad Hyundai RO (atleast one of those fellows name sounds familiar). The issue at that time in our i20 was the dreaded i20 steering rattle.

Those fellows in the Hyundai Ahmedabad RO wanted me to believe that the steering rattle was completely normal and it would not the car's performance & safety. The Regional Service Manager even arrogantly claimed he would make sure if the dreaded steering rattle issued recurred in our car, he would make sure that they would drive to our house to fix the issue. He, of course, never kept his word.

One fine evening, when the car was being driven by me, the steering became rock hard in the middle of the road. They stopped responding properly after that , after which we had to approach the consumer forum.

May God impart some some common sense on those chaps in the Ahmedabad RO and I hope they understand that this is abnormal and help you.
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Old 26th May 2015, 20:38   #771
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Default Re: Hyundai Grand i10 : Official Review

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Originally Posted by RoadFiend View Post
I put my Grand i10 on hold after seeing this. Want to be sure about Hyundai A.S.S. Please keep us updated.
Quote:
Originally Posted by skanchan95 View Post
After reading about this, I immediately checked our November 2014 manufactured Grand i10 and there is no rust formation in the areas mentioned by you. I agree that it is abnormal.

...
Below is the mail I received today after I posted on facebook.

Quote:
Dear Mr. Goswami,

This is in reference to your mail and our telephonic conversation regarding your Grandi10 bearing Reg. No : GJ6XXXX
At the outset, we apologize for the inconvenience caused.

We would like to apprise you that the components like steering knuckle are made up of cast iron in general. The property of the
material induces oxidation on the surface of these components and the rusting in the part is a normal phenomenon. We would also
like to add that there is no manufacturing defect in the part and that the rusting may not have any effect on the performance
of your vehicle.

For any further query or assistance please feel free to write us

With Regards,

Sandeep Jha
CR West – 2
Hyundai Motors India Ltd.
Ahmedabad - Gujarat
(O) 079 - 69000027
And my reply : ( have provided TEAM BHP link for the first time to them )
Quote:
Mr. Sandeep,

First of all, let me tell you that I am repeatedly trying to contact you, but your availability over phone remains scarce.

Your mail do not answer my questions like why all Grand i10 cars are not having this rust ?
How can we monitor the rust ? What amount of rust can be called "SAFE AND PERFORMANCE FRIENDLY"?
Is there any mention of amount of rust being OK or not OK in the manual ?

I am yet to come across such rust in any of other cars I use or have used till date.
A forum on which I am member has data like other users of Grand i10 having rust or not. They are not having such rust. Why my car ?
Link to thread where in a few posts mention other cars not having rust : http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/offici...review-52.html (Hyundai Grand i10 : Official Review)

I am not satisfied with you answer ( which in the first place you are not answering on time ).
Area manager is yet to see the car, and you have already mentioned this being OK ?


Moreover, any such answer without even physical observation is intriguing to me, albeit in a negative way..

Totally unacceptable conclusion, wondering where derived from.

Please provide email ID and Phone number of senior officials as I do not consider this as normal.
And update on the questions raised above.


Abhinavgiri Goswami
Its sheer bad luck that I put my money on Hyundai.

Last edited by aaggoswami : 26th May 2015 at 20:43.
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Old 26th May 2015, 22:03   #772
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Default Re: Hyundai Grand i10 : Official Review

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Originally Posted by aaggoswami View Post
Below is the mail I received today after I posted on facebook.



And my reply : ( have provided TEAM BHP link for the first time to them )


Its sheer bad luck that I put my money on Hyundai.
Funny how the language has changed from "performance will not get affected" on the phone to "performance may not get affected" on e-mail. Seems to me that they are confused, do not have a proper answer and do not have confidence in their own product.

The muddled replies almost imply that if something goes wrong, they will not be responsible. Bottom line is such critical parts must must not rust(that too so badly) and I hope this point goes into their heads. The RO's attitude was like an ostrich towards the steering rattle issue and seems like that hasn't changed till now!!!!!
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Old 27th May 2015, 00:12   #773
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Default Re: Hyundai Grand i10 : Official Review

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Originally Posted by aaggoswami View Post
Meanwhile, at home, I tried taking a few more shots of rusted part. Images attached. Have written a post on Hyundai's India Facebook page, but still no update.
This is just NOT acceptable on such a crucial part on ANY car in ANY part of the country.

Rust is ONE process that damages the part inside-out.

I can't understand why is it that hard for guys @ Hyundai to understand this is clearly a manufacturing defect. IF not this should have been found in ALL Grand i10's there which sadly isn't so they better owe up and get the thing changed without making any noise and spoiling their reputation as a "Quality manufacturer"!

Quote:
Originally Posted by aaggoswami View Post
Below is the mail I received today after I posted on facebook.

Its sheer bad luck that I put my money on Hyundai.
Team-BHP is a very powerful tool Sir, they'll have to react as there are clear evident posts with images of the rusted parts and the mail conversations done with you.
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Old 3rd June 2015, 00:34   #774
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Default Re: Hyundai Grand i10 : Official Review

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This is just NOT acceptable on such a crucial part on ANY car in ANY part of the country.

Rust is ONE process that damages the part inside-out.

I can't understand why is it that hard for guys @ Hyundai to understand this is clearly a manufacturing defect. IF not this should have been found in ALL Grand i10's there which sadly isn't so they better owe up and get the thing changed without making any noise and spoiling their reputation as a "Quality manufacturer"!

Team-BHP is a very powerful tool Sir, they'll have to react as there are clear evident posts with images of the rusted parts and the mail conversations done with you.
High time I update this thread. Please accept my apologies for the delay. Was feeling quite low on this topic and was tied down to last month end work stuff.

1) I tried calling Hyundai's helpline number, they just gave me a complaint number ( which I certainly dont remember ). My first complaint was registered on 20-May-2015. A call on 28-May-2015 results into this : "We have forwarded your complaint to our concerned department".

2) If, and only if, one has energy to deal with completely non sense and utterly non professional individuals should they initiate dealing with Hyundai Regional office at Ahmedabad. Apparently Mr. Sandeep Jha did not like me posting Team-BHP thread link. He was like " You have already posted the link, so what ( said something similar to show either ego or arrogance ), if you have any complaints, drop an email to crservice".

3) Frustrated, I called the guy who sold me the car. He was teaching me whom to call, but somehow got number of Mr. Kumar who is heading service department at Downtown Hyundai Vadodara service centre located at Chhani area of vadodara.

He asked me to come in on Saturday, 30-05-2015, went there and in 30 mins my car was on a car lift. Mr. Kumar was very cooperative and to the best of his knowledge told me that this is normal as the component is cast iron.

An i20 old generation bought in Feb or Mar 2014 was in for servicing and was on another car lift. The steering knuckle had rust. I am attaching an image which Mr. Kumar allowed me to take.

A few kite flying threads on the my car's rubber boots were removed. Question in my mind : My car was serviced in Feb 2015 after Uttarayan ( Makarsankranti ), so why did Car Scanner ( an authorised service center very near to where I am employeed ) not notice and remove them ? Means Car Scanner did not care.

I raised my concern over the service of Car Scanner and if at all the oil was changed. Immediately Mr. Kumar asked a mechanic to open the hood and checked the oil, both visually and taking a few drops on his hand. He said it looks OK.

At the end of the day what I feel is that my money is wasted. I am now again using the Grand i10 less than my Wagon R.
The arrogance of Hyundai is a rude shock to me. Audacity with which the regional office guy responded was a further blow and now I dont recommend Hyundai to anybody. Even posting on facebook does not help. And I dont have energy to visit Hyundai regional office personally to seek further clarification.

What next : My Grand i10 evaluation by True Value guys is Rs. 4.5 lakh. But I am not depressed. My Baleno was evaluated at Rs. 65000/-, sold it at almost double the price. As of now, I am searching a customer for my Grand i10. Can take a loss of 1.5 lakh, but no Hyundai. Lost confidence in the brand. Feeling a bit low, though, may be defeated. But lessons learnt.
Attached Thumbnails
Hyundai Grand i10 : Official Review-i20-rust.jpg  


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Old 5th June 2015, 16:45   #775
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Default Re: Hyundai Grand i10 : Official Review

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Apparently Mr. Sandeep Jha did not like me posting Team-BHP thread link. He was like " You have already posted the link, so what ( said something similar to show either ego or arrogance ), if you have any complaints, drop an email to crservice".
I don't understand what was the need for that fellow to take it so personally, in the first place!!!!
If he has to show such high handedness, its better he step down and join some money recovery agency!!!!! I don't think he realises that he is there to serve the customers and it is his duty to help them. His true potential only comes to fore if he solves issues satisfactorily. Its high time Hyundai thinks of appointing people with more professionalism, common sense and humility to such responsible posts.

The arrogance shown by the same RO and its pathetic Junagadh service center made swear never to buy an Hyundai ever again. But things changed drastically when we moved to Mangalore with our i20. The service support and the humility with which the service center in Mangalore approached the customers blew me away. As a result, ended up buying two more Hyundais from that Mangalore dealership. May be that RO in Ahmedabad can take a cue from this. Its only after sales support that makes or breaks a company and I don't think the RO realises this.

Quote:
Originally Posted by aaggoswami View Post
What next : My Grand i10 evaluation by True Value guys is Rs. 4.5 lakh. But I am not depressed. My Baleno was evaluated at Rs. 65000/-, sold it at almost double the price. As of now, I am searching a customer for my Grand i10. Can take a loss of 1.5 lakh, but no Hyundai. Lost confidence in the brand. Feeling a bit low, though, may be defeated. But lessons learnt.
The Grand i10, like other Hyundais, is a good car. But when you get to face such poor after sales support from the service center or the RO, one can only blame the company. I hope someone responsible and sensible from Hyundai reads about your plight, specially the arrogance of the Ahmedabad RO. Clearly things haven't changed much there.

Anyway, I hope you get a better car and better after sales support from other brands. Its not worth wasting your time on the car or on those fellows. Wishing you the best!!!

Last edited by skanchan95 : 5th June 2015 at 16:49.
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Old 6th June 2015, 08:22   #776
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Default Re: Hyundai Grand i10 : Official Review

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Originally Posted by aaggoswami View Post
1) My first complaint was registered on 20-May-2015. A call on 28-May-2015 results into this : "We have forwarded your complaint to our concerned department".
Ah, standard reply this is in the initial stages.

Quote:
Originally Posted by aaggoswami View Post
2) He was like " You have already posted the link, so what ( said something similar to show either ego or arrogance ), if you have any complaints, drop an email to crservice".
You have told him that, what made me post on Team-BHP is because of you and your CR Service team as they weren't responding to me clearly on the issue. What an Idiot he is! He is not fit to be in that post be it either at Hyundai or any manufacturer.

Quote:
Originally Posted by aaggoswami View Post
Mr. Kumar was very cooperative and to the best of his knowledge told me that this is normal as the component is cast iron.
One sane person in the crowd!

Quote:
Originally Posted by aaggoswami View Post
An i20 old generation bought in Feb or Mar 2014 was in for servicing and was on another car lift. The steering knuckle had rust. I am attaching an image which Mr. Kumar allowed me to take.
If the rusting is common then why don't the other cars too have them?

AFAIK, very few cars would have the issue so it is clearly a defect. BTW did you check if both your car and the i20 were from the same batch or may be near around so that the issue can be traced better.

Quote:
Originally Posted by aaggoswami View Post
What next : My Grand i10 evaluation by True Value guys is Rs. 4.5 lakh. But I am not depressed.
Any update on this?

What's thy final decision?
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Old 7th June 2015, 20:06   #777
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Default Re: Hyundai Grand i10 : Official Review

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I don't understand what was the need for that fellow to take it so personally, in the first place!!!!
If he has to show such high handedness, its better he step down and join some money recovery agency!!!!! I don't think he realises that he is there to serve the customers and it is his duty to help them. ...

The arrogance shown by the same RO and its pathetic Junagadh service center made swear never to buy an Hyundai ever again. But things changed drastically when we moved to Mangalore with our i20. The service support and the humility with which the service center in Mangalore approached the customers blew me away. As a result, ended up buying two more Hyundais from that Mangalore dealership. May be that RO in Ahmedabad can take a cue from this. Its only after sales support that makes or breaks a company and I don't think the RO realises this.

The Grand i10, like other Hyundais, is a good car. But when you get to face such poor after sales support from the service center or the RO, one can only blame the company. I hope someone responsible and sensible from Hyundai reads about your plight, specially the arrogance of the Ahmedabad RO. Clearly things haven't changed much there

Anyway, I hope you get a better car and better after sales support from other brands. Its not worth wasting your time on the car or on those fellows. Wishing you the best!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by a4anurag View Post
You have told him that, what made me post on Team-BHP is because of you and your CR Service team as they weren't responding to me clearly on the issue. What an Idiot he is! He is not fit to be in that post be it either at Hyundai or any manufacturer.
Worst thing is, my facebook comments to Hyundai India page are going unnoticed. No reply after I gave them my complaint number. Earlier, when I posted images, there was a reply asking to provide contact details ( which I did ), but nothing happened. Now, its almost zero response.

Yes, the hunt for a new car is ON. I am even ready to have a used car, and I am practically trying to convince my parents for this. EMI are still on for this car.

Yes, the dealer seems so much better than Ahmedabad RO guys. Dealer can be make or break experience.

Its good to know that you are having a different experience with Hyundai down south. Till date, Toyota seems to be the most professional. Maruti has lost edge, response time is nice, quality not so.

Quote:
Originally Posted by a4anurag View Post
1) If the rusting is common then why don't the other cars too have them?

AFAIK, very few cars would have the issue so it is clearly a defect. BTW did you check if both your car and the i20 were from the same batch or may be near around so that the issue can be traced better.

2) Any update on this?

What's thy final decision?
1) I was a bit shocked to see this :

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/offici...ml#post3521709 (Hyundai Elite i20 : Official Review)

The same part in Elite i20 test drive thread shows rust. Attaching image. This is from official review thread. The quality of Hyundai seems to be going down where end user generally wont notice. Give nice NVH, good plastic. .
Hyundai Grand i10 : Official Review-elite-i20-test-drive-car-rust-team-bhp.jpg

2) I am still hunting for a good price, else go for a used car. My parents are not happy with my decision of buying something used. Maruti Dealers all over are quoting very less for my car, and the new cars do cost lot more, specially with "Handling charges" and dealer offered insurance.

On the whole, did a small trip with my friend, not bad, but the product is not at home on highways. Two image of my trip.

One thing I noticed :
If car is on idle and one repeatedly presses brake pedal ( had to do this on ghat section ), the brake pedal becomes stiff. Engine was ON, but the pedal became stiff. I had to brake and change gear which brought the engine to idle, release brake, but then apply brakes again due to oncoming traffic ( cabs overtaking downhill ). Wasn't very confidence inspiring.

On highway at speeds of 90, the brake pedal becomes super, super sensitive. This varying sensitivity is not helping much. The other two car at home do not suffer from this.
Attached Thumbnails
Hyundai Grand i10 : Official Review-img_20150606_155217678_hdr.jpg  

Hyundai Grand i10 : Official Review-img_20150606_150154786_hdr.jpg  


Last edited by aaggoswami : 7th June 2015 at 20:08.
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Old 7th June 2015, 22:22   #778
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Default Re: Hyundai Grand i10 : Official Review

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Originally Posted by aaggoswami View Post
One thing I noticed :
If car is on idle and one repeatedly presses brake pedal ( had to do this on ghat section ), the brake pedal becomes stiff. Engine was ON, but the pedal became stiff. I had to brake and change gear which brought the engine to idle, release brake, but then apply brakes again due to oncoming traffic ( cabs overtaking downhill ). Wasn't very confidence inspiring.
I think your problem as described needs to be solved by a process called "brake Bleeding".

Most likely caused by air pockets in the brake lines. When you hit the brake pedal , the brake fluid which is an non-compressible fluid activates the brakes. If there are air pockets / bubbles, these get compressed , instead of the brake fluid being pushed along the lines.

Treat this issue as urgent and take care of this immediately.

Last edited by john doe : 7th June 2015 at 22:23.
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Old 8th June 2015, 09:56   #779
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I think your problem as described needs to be solved by a process called "brake Bleeding".

Most likely caused by air pockets in the brake lines. When you hit the brake pedal , the brake fluid which is an non-compressible fluid activates the brakes. If there are air pockets / bubbles, these get compressed , instead of the brake fluid being pushed along the lines.

Treat this issue as urgent and take care of this immediately.
Brake bleeding was done in Feb 2015 at around 47XX kms. or so.
Shall do it again, but this has been present since long. Earlier I thought it was my lack of adaptability to new car, but not so.

May be I am not habituated to doing this once ever quarter, but will do it and update. A little "experiment" I did later. Kept the car on idle at my home parking, pressed the brake pedal a few times. The pedal becomes hard after 2 hits. Engine rpm remains unchanged. Did the same with Wagon R and engine speed increased in Wagon R.

If bleeding does not solve this, the car will have to see service center. Cant take chance on this.
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Old 8th June 2015, 10:28   #780
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Default Re: Hyundai Grand i10 : Official Review

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Brake bleeding was done in Feb 2015 at around 47XX kms. or so.
Shall do it again, but this has been present since long. Earlier I thought it was my lack of adaptability to new car, but not so.

May be I am not habituated to doing this once ever quarter, but will do it and update. A little "experiment" I did later. Kept the car on idle at my home parking, pressed the brake pedal a few times. The pedal becomes hard after 2 hits. Engine rpm remains unchanged. Did the same with Wagon R and engine speed increased in Wagon R.

If bleeding does not solve this, the car will have to see service center. Cant take chance on this.
If you have already done brake bleeding, one more cause could be a problem with the brake booster. The brake booster is the part that uses vacuum from engine to multiply the force on the brake pedals, making it easy to push the brake pedals. Once the engine is off you feel the brake pedal going hard after a few pushes as there is no more vacuum from the engine.

There could be a problem with the brake booster in your car which is causing the brake pedals to go hard. Have this checked as well.

Below video explains the concept of brake booster.

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