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Old 8th July 2015, 21:59   #91
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Default Re: Honda Jazz : Official Review

I wonder why everyone's reaction to the car is so negative. Agreed that the top end variants are priced higher than an equivalent i20, and it also misses some equipment. But as a package, the Jazz is a very good product IMO.

Comfort - The i20 is spacious, but the Jazz is a football field in comparison. Both have comfortable seats, but the extra space does make a difference.

Performance - The diesels are evenly matched, while the petrol Jazz is undoubtedly better than the i20, even though it is beaten by the likes of the Swift/Amaze.

Refinement - This is one area where the diesel Jazz loses out as compared to the super silent i20. But the petrols again are evenly matched.

Ride and Handling - The i20 is a big improvement over the old gen and is pretty acceptable. Neither are particularly fun to drive, but the Jazz does have a slight edge with its more mature dynamics.

Build quality and interiors - The build quality is again similar. But there's no doubt that the i20 has better interior quality and feels much more premium. It has a tad more features too.

Fuel efficiency - The i20 fares pretty well here but the Jazz is undoubtedly ahead with that 27 kmpl figure.

So overall they are pretty close on most counts, and one car's strength is not necessarily the other's weakness.

The i20 does have an edge with its features and interiors, but there's no doubt that the Jazz is a pretty solid package too, and I don't see any reason why it doesn't deserve to sell at least 4-6k units a month.

Last edited by Aaron:) : 8th July 2015 at 22:13.
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Old 8th July 2015, 22:01   #92
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Default Re: Honda Jazz : Official Review

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Originally Posted by coolmel View Post
The argument about the flat folding seats with respect to your Ecosport, well the seats don't completely fold down flat. They tumble over. For that matter I believe no other car in this segment does(Ecosport is another segment altogether). Am not saying not folding down fully flat is bad design. The argument is not many are realising the potential of this good design over the rivals. People are simply not leveraging this!
Just trying to understand here. The Ecosport has seats that tumble and result in a flat floor. The Jazz has seats that fold and result in a flat floor. Both are similar except the fact that Ecosport seats take up 5-6 inches of space.

But then is this really a factor when deciding the car? As I mentioned I have till date never found the need to fold the seats at all.

I am sure 99% of people will be the same case and and even the 1% who might have actually folded the seats for storage would have done it only for a few days in a year or even once till now.

For something which u will not even use 1% of the time in the car, why should it be a deciding factor?

While I agree it's a good design but it's not something that will be used most of the time.

More than the Magic seats I am miffed at the lack of reclining rear seats, fixed headrests and cheaper beige upholstery. If the V came with adjustable headrests, reclining seats and black upholstery, I would not miss the magic seats at all. The tall mode, long mode and refresh mode are something which I won't miss cause I will probably use it 2-3 times in 3 years.
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Old 8th July 2015, 22:05   #93
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Originally Posted by akhil994 View Post
Agree with the magic seats part, but safety? i20 , supposedly the benchmark of the segment offers dual airbags on only one variant, while Jazz offers it in 3.
i20 does not have EBD on any of the models. So safety wise I would say Honda is offering the customer what he wants.

It would have been good to have airbags on all variants like the Polo, but then sadly people prefer gimmicky features over safety.
The i20 never came with all the safety features in all the variants. But the Jazz did. And to term it as a 'premium' hatch and not offer it on all variants is disappointing.

Especially since the NCAP episode, the manufacturers are trying to add atleast a driver airbag in each of the variant, whereas the Jazz completes avoids it.

The CVT comes in V and S variants I suppose. If I want Airbags I have to choose V. See the lack of choices here? Considering the 1L premium, is it difficult for Honda to stick a couple of balloons in the S variant for the CVT at least?

Honda has always claimed premium prices but backed it up with the products. But these days they seem to have lost the way and demand premium only in price.

The Brio has a 5 speed AT. Leaving out the obvious weight advantage, I think Brio will easily trump the Jazz in performance numbers.

That CVT is not going to be a match for the 5 speed with a weight disadvantage as well. CVT isn't going to respond to the throttle as good as the 5 speed AT with the rubber band effect thrown in.

If one doesn't want the space offered by Jazz, they can safely go with the Brio and save a cool 1.5L on ex-showroom alone. Touchscreen ACC being the only big difference in the features between both along with a couple of connectivity options thrown in.

Last edited by SchumiFan : 8th July 2015 at 22:33.
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Old 8th July 2015, 22:08   #94
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But that is because of the market demands. I am not justifying it, or saying that it is correct.
But Honda is doing what every business would do, maximize profits. Each of us would do the same if we had such a business.

Things can only change once the rules are enforced. If you give the choice to the company, they would always choose the option generating the maximum moolah!
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Old 8th July 2015, 22:12   #95
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Default Re: Honda Jazz : Official Review

WOW!
I am shocked to see such negative reactions on this thread.

The Jazz offers mid-segment sedan like space and also a much bigger boot. This itself is a huge advantage over the competition. It's basically a bigger car than the rest with similar external dimensions. You have to appreciate the packaging brilliance here.

Also, Honda offering ABS and airbags in 3 variants. Can you tell me which other manufacturer is offering the same in this segment? If they are asking for slight premium for additional safety features, is it totally unjustified?

I think Honda could have specced the variants better..particularly the VX having odd placement for USB, mic etc looks shoddy. Also, it loses out on the very useful 3 reverse camera positions.

The parking sensors and driver armrest are available as accessories from Honda. So, that should come in handy unless Honda prices them ridiculously high.

I still believe Honda has a very solid package in the Jazz. Let's see how the market reacts to it.

Question to suhaas - Did you find any difference in the performance of the previous generation Jazz versus the new one (petrol)? I was hoping that Honda would have tuned the engine and gear ratios to give a better bottom end but it seems like they focused only on the mileage which is a downer for me.

I find the Honda Jazz petrol a very competent package and should give tough competition to the I20. I am not so sure about the diesel due to the bigger premium and the unrefined motor. Also, the CVT is much more advanced than the normal 4 speed AT available in Brio and hence a higher premium seems okay to me.

Last edited by adimicra : 8th July 2015 at 22:15.
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Old 8th July 2015, 22:14   #96
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Default Re: Honda Jazz : Official Review

A missed opportunity by 'overconfident' Honda.

The i- Dtec variant in Jazz is only being offered in India, is it so unrefined for acceptance in other markets?

Somehow, I don't think the Jazz will even come close to becoming the sales phenomenon Honda wish it to be.

In coming few months it will follow Polo in monthly sales numbers with Swift and Elite leading this segment.

Last edited by volkman10 : 8th July 2015 at 22:16.
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Old 8th July 2015, 22:16   #97
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Default Re: Honda Jazz : Official Review

Great review! Jazz has been and is my all time favorite hatchback. Glad to see it back in the Indian market. It is an amazing product, I love the petrol CVT variant.

In somewhat weird way, the Jazz has always attracted a lot of flack in Team-Bhp forums - the old one did and so does the new variant. I thought the old variant was hated due to higher price, and maybe sour grapes, but even the sensibly priced new version gets same treatment here I would differ from the crowd here, its the Jazz over the i20 for me anytime. I believe Hondas have way better long term reliability and superior support. I prefer that over the 1000 nick nack features other competitors pack in.
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Old 8th July 2015, 22:18   #98
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Default Re: Honda Jazz : Official Review

There is nothing really jumping as unique for a Honda Jazz. Feature list does not have anything out of the ordinary. From the pictures the materials and fit/finish come out as not very high standards as it used to be from Honda. i20 fares much better.
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Old 8th July 2015, 22:20   #99
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Default Re: Honda Jazz : Official Review

Quote:
Originally Posted by volkman10 View Post
A missed opportunity by 'overconfident' Honda.

The i- Dtec variant in Jazz is only being offered in India, is it so unrefined for acceptance in other markets?
That is because India is the only market where there is demand for a diesel Jazz. A product is termed dead on arrival if it is launched without one. It has nothing to do with its acceptance in other markets.
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Old 8th July 2015, 22:20   #100
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Default Re: Honda Jazz : Official Review

Thank you @Suhaas307 and @Vid6639 for releasing the review today. If Honda had read this review before, possibly they would have charged a higher premium on all variants.

I am not too happy with the pricing, specially CVT variants. They are easily 35k more than the sweet spot in my opinion. Lets not forget that there will be a 5k addition for metallic colore. In fact I would have preferred Honda offering SV (CVT) for 7.5 lacs and VX (CVT) for 8.3 lacs.

With not much difference between SV and V variant, consumers wanting CVT at a lower price would have gone for SV while those wanting a fully loaded CVT would have gone for VX.

Following is the difference between SV and V variant
  • Alloy wheels
  • Leather wrapped steering wheel
  • Silver finish door ornament
  • Electrically folding ORVM
  • Auto AC with touchscreen panel control

I have seen so many SV (CVT) City variants, I am sure they would have been far less if Honda had offered S (CVT)) City instead. S (CVT) is just a waste according to me.

The worst thing is some of the ridiculous cost cutting measure despite charging a premium over Elite i20. Spare tyre in all variants are 175/70 R14... seriously?

Uncomfortable rear seats across all variants (barring VX) is not good news. You would ideally want to buy a car which offers loads of boot space to fill it to the brim and go for long trips with family only for them to complain on reaching the destination of body ache.

Not expected this from a premium hatch. At least lack of features like Push Start/Stop button, Keyless entry, etc. should have been compensated with a comfortable rear seat.

Ideally for the price premium offered for both CVT variants, Honda should have offered magic seats. (At least in the V variant)

Following is the price list for Jazz in Bangalore (Source TAI)
Attached Thumbnails
Honda Jazz : Official Review-bangalore.jpg  


Last edited by damager21 : 8th July 2015 at 22:36.
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Old 8th July 2015, 22:23   #101
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Default Re: Honda Jazz : Official Review

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Originally Posted by damager21 View Post
Uncomfortable rear seats across all variants (barring VX) is not good news. You would ideally want to buy a car which offers loads of boot space to fill it to the brim and go for long trips with family only for them to complain on reaching the destination of body ache.
Although the seats in the lower variants are not as good as the ones in the VX, they are by no means uncomfortable, and one wouldn't be complaining of body ache after a long drive.

Not as comfortable does not mean uncomfortable.
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Old 8th July 2015, 22:32   #102
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Default Re: Honda Jazz : Official Review

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Originally Posted by Aaron:) View Post
Although the seats in the lower variants are not as good as the ones in the VX, they are by no means uncomfortable, and one wouldn't be complaining of body ache after a long drive.

Not as comfortable does not mean uncomfortable.
My uncomfortable point was in relation to long drives which I have stated. This has been clearly captured in multiple reviews I have read till date where every where it is stated that long drives will require multiple pit stop for rear seat passengers as the under thigh support is lacking.

This is what I would interpret from Team BHP review as well

Quote:
Things aren't as bright with the Jazz' lower variants though. Those who opt for lesser trim levels will have to make do without the flexible "magic seats". Now, we'd naturally assume that non-flexible seats should offer you even more support, right? Not in the Jazz. Under-thigh support is seriously lacking in variants below the VX...this is disappointing as a majority of sales are usually from mid-variants. Not only is the rear bench less contoured, it has been set too low for comfort. This, coupled with the raised floor, makes a noticeable difference in comfort levels between the Jazz top-end and other variants.
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Old 8th July 2015, 22:33   #103
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Excellent Review Suhaas and Vid! Astonishing level of detail!

I loved the old Jazz very much because at that time there was nothing like that in the market. I even managed to convince one of my friends to go for the price cut version. The love affair continues but the feeling is not so strong for the new one. Here are few of the my reasons:
  • I believe Honda needs to have an automatic in the top version
  • Price difference between Petrol and Diesel is too high
  • I am not too sure if international versions get projectors and DRLs but Honda should have bought it on the top variants. Euro version gets this I believe
  • Agree with the Mods that the black looks richer and better than the beige. Also beige is a pain to maintain in our climate
  • No Start Stop button
  • Airbags and ABS on all versions, Only 2 Airbags. How will you differentiate from the competition Honda! (To be fair even the City gets only 2 Airbags)
  • No 1.5L I-Vtec + CVT option. This would have helped it go against the Polo GT TSI but would have been priced around 10 lacs ex showroom!
  • No CVT with the diesel engine. Hyundai should now get that rumoured 6 speed AT on the Elite i20 diesel and hurt the Jazz even more
  • Magic Seats should have been present on more than one variant. Clearly Honda are greedy and not thinking straight with their variants
  • Pricing could have been better (read introductory) just to gather the initial euphoria

I will be surprised if this matches the numbers of the City let alone dethroning the Elite i20. Honda has the arsenal to do better but refused to do so.

Been having discussions around this and the GT TSI (Need an AT as a daily drive in place of the Vento). Dad loves the Jazz and everything about it and won't even consider the GT. I can't get over the driving experience of the GT which I know will not even come close in the Jazz. I feel the Jazz will however be easily acceptable to and drivable by the women in the house! GT is still perceived as a racing toy and I have been told more than once about how selfish I am being by being adamant for the GT

Last edited by miharbe : 8th July 2015 at 22:34.
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Old 8th July 2015, 22:44   #104
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aaron:) View Post
I wonder why everyone's reaction to the car is so negative. Agreed that the top end variants are priced higher than an equivalent i20, and it also misses some equipment. But as a package, the Jazz is a very good product IMO.

Comfort - The i20 is spacious, but the Jazz is a football field in comparison. Both have comfortable seats, but the extra space does make a difference.

Performance - The diesels are evenly matched, while the petrol Jazz is undoubtedly better than the i20, even though it is beaten by the likes of the Swift/Amaze.

Refinement - This is one area where the diesel Jazz loses out as compared to the super silent i20. But the petrols again are evenly matched.

Ride and Handling - The i20 is a big improvement over the old gen and is pretty acceptable. Neither are particularly fun to drive, but the Jazz does have a slight edge with its more mature dynamics.

Build quality and interiors - The build quality is again similar. But there's no doubt that the i20 has better interior quality and feels much more premium. It has a tad more features too.

Fuel efficiency - The i20 fares pretty well here but the Jazz is undoubtedly ahead with that 27 kmpl figure.

So overall they are pretty close on most counts, and one car's strength is not necessarily the other's weakness.

The i20 does have an edge with its features and interiors, but there's no doubt that the Jazz is a pretty solid package too, and I don't see any reason why it doesn't deserve to sell at least 4-6k units a month.
You said it brother!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by SunilM View Post
Great review! Jazz has been and is my all time favorite hatchback. Glad to see it back in the Indian market. It is an amazing product, I love the petrol CVT variant.

In somewhat weird way, the Jazz has always attracted a lot of flack in Team-Bhp forums - the old one did and so does the new variant. I thought the old variant was hated due to higher price, and maybe sour grapes, but even the sensibly priced new version gets same treatment here I would differ from the crowd here, its the Jazz over the i20 for me anytime. I believe Hondas have way better long term reliability and superior support. I prefer that over the 1000 nick nack features other competitors pack in.
Hahaha, buff said Sunil, bulls eye! One could not have put it any simpler than this.
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Old 8th July 2015, 22:48   #105
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Default Re: Honda Jazz : Official Review

I test drove the petrol V MT variant today. The car is very spacious! However, it has a van sort of feeling while driving. I did not find the engine to be sluggish compared to Amaze, but that could be because I did not test the two cars one after another. The engine revs reasonably well. Overall, I liked it. I was thinking whether to save 2lakh rupees and get the Jazz V MT instead of the Polo GT TSI.

I guess I will still go with the Polo GT TSI.
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