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Old 12th October 2015, 23:34   #226
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Default Re: Ford Aspire : Official Review

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Hi methecupid,
I have driven the stock tires for close to 700 kms. They are adequate for most situations. But if you are a spirited driver and love corners I would suggest only 195/60/14. The low buy back offer for my stock tires were the only reason that I didn't go for 195.
The Rationalist.
If you could please share, what is the offer you got on the old tyres.
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Old 13th October 2015, 00:05   #227
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Default Re: Ford Aspire : Official Review

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Had a 800 km+ Wayanad trip in my Petrol Titanium+ car last weekend...
Thanks jowes for sharing your experience. Probably the torque at low-end is on limited supply, not completely unexpected.

Have a good time with your Aspire.
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Old 13th October 2015, 06:03   #228
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Default Re: Ford Aspire : Official Review

Forgive me if my question is naive - Why did Ford plonk in a much bigger 1.5L engine in the automatic variant as compared to the mannual variant? Given the 1.5 engine has higher torque and HP rating, does it make it more pleasurable to drive as compared to the mannual petrol engine? Won't a 1.5L has lower fuel efficiency?
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Old 13th October 2015, 06:35   #229
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Default Re: Ford Aspire : Official Review

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Forgive me if my question is naive - Why did Ford plonk in a much bigger 1.5L engine in the automatic variant as compared to the mannual variant? Given the 1.5 engine has higher torque and HP rating, does it make it more pleasurable to drive as compared to the mannual petrol engine? Won't a 1.5L has lower fuel efficiency?
I think Ford just did it to keep things simple. They already had the 1.5 mated to the DCT first in the fiesta and then in the Ecosport. I don't think they have the 1.2 mated to the DCT anywhere and to do it just for India could have meant extra work.

In addition a fast gear box such as a DCT needs a powerful engine. The general opinion is that even the 1.5 struggles a bit. So I believe a DCT would have been wasted on a 1.2 NA engine. Ideally they should have given the ecoboost with the DCT both for the Aspire and Ecosport( would have driven up costs though). I think that is the default pairing in several international markets.

The 1.5 will be less fuel efficient. But to an extent will be compensated by the DCT, which can shift faster than most drivers and in D mode will attempt to maintain the best efficiency.
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Old 13th October 2015, 07:12   #230
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Default Re: Ford Aspire : Official Review

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Why did Ford plonk in a much bigger 1.5L engine in the automatic variant as compared to the mannual variant?
It's not a naive question, it's a very good question, particularly because it examines why the Figo/Aspire AT loses out on the benefits given to <1.2L petrol cars. Rajeevraj has summed it up very well in his reply, I'll just add on a few comments.

Remember, that a DCT (dual-clutch transmission) needs to be mated to an engine not just physically, but also in terms of characteristics. Key points are things like when the torque peaks, the range of the useful torque curve, etc. These parameters will determine at what rpm upshifts and downshifts need to happen based on D or S mode.

On that basis, there is an investment of initial R&D effort, as well as ongoing support to update the firmware that the DCT uses, which Ford will have been reluctant to invest in, in mating the 1.2L to the DCT. Given that the 1.2L engine is specific to India, there are no export benefits to make this investment worthwhile either. Moreover, the 1.2L engine isn't exactly oozing with torque to make it feasible.
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Originally Posted by Rajeevraj View Post
The 1.5 will be less fuel efficient. But to an extent will be compensated by the DCT, which can shift faster than most drivers and in D mode will attempt to maintain the best efficiency.
Very true - the DCT is very aggressive in upshifting in D mode (usually under 2000 rpm), and people will often find themselves in 5th or 6th very quickly. The downside is that if kickdown mode requires dropping 2 gears, the appropriate gear will not be pre-selected, resulting in a delay.

Having said that, here's my opinions -
  • I don't think Ford have done a good job of mating the DCT to the 1.5L either. Firstly, the 1.5L Ti-VCT engine is a tame sibling of the praised international 1.6 Ti-VCT engine (which is even better than the 1.6 Duratec we got in the older Fiesta), so its not an ideal combination.
  • Secondly, from my little research, the 1.5L Ti-VCT engine itself is either exclusive to India, or also does duty in Brazil (but without an automatic). Although both might be important sales targets, I don't think Ford would have invested as much R&D into fine-tuning the engine/gearbox pairing as they would have done in more matured markets like Europe or the US - several reviewers complain about a mismatched feel between the engine and gearbox.

Last edited by arunphilip : 13th October 2015 at 07:28. Reason: Tyops! ;-)
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Old 13th October 2015, 09:37   #231
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Default Re: Ford Aspire : Official Review

Hi guys, My Dad uses a Figo and it runs on steel wheels. My Aspires's alloys are a match for Figo. I can give my alloys to his car and get 15 inch alloys and drive on them and at the time of service that is every 10000 kms can swap the original alloys and get Aspire serviced !That way I won't get into voiding warranty. Agreed its bit trouble to change the wheels but then I can't fight with morons at Ford who are adamant. They already have 15 inches as option for export! Any suggestions?
The Rationalist.
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Old 13th October 2015, 09:58   #232
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Default Re: Ford Aspire : Official Review

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Hi guys, My Dad uses a Figo and it runs on steel wheels. My Aspires's alloys are a match for Figo. I can give my alloys to his car and get 15 inch alloys and drive on them and at the time of service that is every 10000 kms can swap the original alloys and get Aspire serviced !That way I won't get into voiding warranty. Agreed its bit trouble to change the wheels but then I can't fight with morons at Ford who are adamant. They already have 15 inches as option for export! Any suggestions?
The Rationalist.
Hi rationalist, my suggestion would be to stick to the stock tyre at least till the first tyre change//warranty period unless you are a really passionate enthusiast.

I TD the vehicle and found it good enough with the stock tyres. I cannot be defined as an enthusiast or a sedate driver but somewhere in the middle.

So unless you are really a braveheart; I'd advice you to not change them so early on.

Do let us know either way. Thanks!
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Old 13th October 2015, 10:01   #233
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Default Re: Ford Aspire : Official Review

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Originally Posted by arunphilip View Post

Remember, that a DCT (dual-clutch transmission) needs to be mated to an engine not just physically, but also in terms of characteristics. Key points are things like when the torque peaks, the range of the useful torque curve, etc. These parameters will determine at what rpm upshifts and downshifts need to happen based on D or S mode.


Having said that, here's my opinions -
  • I don't think Ford have done a good job of mating the DCT to the 1.5L either. Firstly, the 1.5L Ti-VCT engine is a tame sibling of the praised international 1.6 Ti-VCT engine (which is even better than the 1.6 Duratec we got in the older Fiesta), so its not an ideal combination.
Very good points. I think this is what puts the GT TSI at a different level. VW has got it spot on with the engine and gearbox combination. They are a perfect match. Of course, the down side is the premium one has to pay.

Having said that, Ford's offering is better than most and at a very competitive and affordable price. Kudos to Ford for that. Hope the market responds positively to this effort by Ford which may encourage them to bring in higher performance options (Like the Ecoboost paired with the DCT- Maybe in the Fiesta replacement? - Too much to hope for?)
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Old 13th October 2015, 10:05   #234
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Default Re: Ford Aspire : Official Review

Between the Figo/Aspire DCT and the Jazz's CVT , which will be better? to me the DCT felt like a pretty confused box, especially in combo with the 1.5NA.
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Old 13th October 2015, 10:50   #235
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Default Re: Ford Aspire : Official Review

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Between the Figo/Aspire DCT and the Jazz's CVT , which will be better? to me the DCT felt like a pretty confused box, especially in combo with the 1.5NA.
In fact I am super confused between Aspire DCT and Polo TSI DSG. I thought I had decided on DCT until 12 hours ago, but the heart is overpowering the head yet again

Will post in "which car" section today evening after putting together all data and requirements. Will add Jazz CVT too.
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Old 13th October 2015, 11:07   #236
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Default Re: Ford Aspire : Official Review

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Originally Posted by The Rationalist View Post
Hi guys, My Dad uses a Figo and it runs on steel wheels. My Aspires's alloys are a match for Figo. I can give my alloys to his car and get 15 inch alloys and drive on them and at the time of service that is every 10000 kms can swap the original alloys and get Aspire serviced
Definitely a cunning idea to work around Ford A.S.S.'s threats of voiding warranty. You've already identified the one drawback, which is the slight work associated with swapping the wheels around
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Originally Posted by nivatakavacha View Post
Hi rationalist, my suggestion would be to stick to the stock tyre at least till the first tyre change//warranty period unless you are a really passionate enthusiast.
Good advice if The Rationalist wants to take the cautious and safe approach.
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Originally Posted by Rajeevraj View Post
I think this is what puts the GT TSI at a different level. VW has got it spot on with the engine and gearbox combination. (Like the Ecoboost paired with the DCT- Maybe in the Fiesta replacement? - Too much to hope for?)
Thank you, that reminded me of one other point I failed to mention in my previous post - I think Ford's combination of 1.5 Ti-VCT + DCT is one of the rarer combinations of a naturally aspirated engine with a DCT. Diesels are always turbocharged, and VW pairs their DSG with only turbocharged TSI engines. I pretty sure that dual-clutches have it easier when they have a broader torque curve to play around with. So yes, the EcoBoost+DCT will be something to wish for, even if it stays unfulfilled!
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Originally Posted by BUXX View Post
Between the Figo/Aspire DCT and the Jazz's CVT , which will be better? to me the DCT felt like a pretty confused box, especially in combo with the 1.5NA.
Honda's experience with CVTs is tremendous and spans decades. So one shouldn't discount CVT on the basis of DCT being 'cooler technology' alone. In fact, I think that a CVT (given that it is continuously variable) is probably better suited to the pyramid-shaped torque curve of an NA engine.

The TBHP review of the Jazz CVT noted that it had a pronounced rubber-band effect typical of CVTs, but a similar trait was also found (maybe to a lesser extent) in the Aspire/Figo AT by other reviewers. The Jazz comes with much more convenient paddle shifters which work in D and S mode, the Fords come with a dinky little button that works only in S mode. I think this will eventually come down to the individual's preference after a test drive.
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Originally Posted by manish84 View Post
In fact I am super confused between Aspire DCT and Polo TSI DSG. I thought I had decided on DCT until 12 hours ago, but the heart is overpowering the head yet again
3 questions: 1: Can you afford the Polo TSI? 2: Are you OK to take a risk with the DSG gearbox? Remember, the DCT isn't bulletproof either, and I can't recall any DSG problems with the Polo TSI. 3. Are you OK with the lesser space in the Polo? If the answer is yes, then its Polo TSI all the way.

Last edited by arunphilip : 13th October 2015 at 11:11. Reason: Response to manish84
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Old 13th October 2015, 13:11   #237
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Default Re: Ford Aspire : Official Review

Excellent point @arunphilip.

Those who are risk- averse should not discount the CVTs on offer.
Honda has tremendous experience of selling ATs in India.
And Honda being Honda, it is much likely to be reliable in the long run as well.
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Old 13th October 2015, 14:05   #238
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Default Re: Ford Aspire : Official Review

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I have one. This being my first car, I have not seen it in any other car so my observation may not be taken for comparison. I am not happy with the quality of the video in IRVM. It is manageable, thats about it. For instance, when I reverse in the parking lot in my apartment, I have a hard time distinguishing between floor and compound wall. I also have sensor, so that helps. The IRVM does not have day/night mode, so when there is sun-light, its hard to see the camera display as well.
Thanks for the details jowes. Do the sensor readings overlay on the camera video as well? If possible, please post some pics of the reverse IRVM. Actually I had requested the dealer to show me a demo but he is not able to do so (not sure why). On the other hand, if I buy from the accessories shops, I am not sure of the brands available and their reliability.
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Old 13th October 2015, 14:09   #239
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Default Re: Ford Aspire : Official Review

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Originally Posted by arunphilip View Post
Good to hear an owner's review of the 1.2 Ti-VCT engine, thank you.

.....

How was the AT? Was it good in performance (and just that the diesel was much more torquey), or was the AT lacking?
Also - do you have any real-life pictures of the Deep Impact Blue? I know it looks darker than Ford's previous signature colour of Kinetic Blue, but am curious to see how it looks on a car.
I had seen it in the showroom & it is deeper than the kinetic blue shade. The AT & 1.5 TVCT combo was not bad at all & if the AT was available in the T+ variant I would have gone ahead & booked it without a second thought. The diesel has a lot of torque available right from 11 - 1200 rpm which makes it very easy to drive in the city. So while I give up the convenience of an AT but gain in much better safety in terms of 6 airbags, much better interiors, sync system & a better FE. All of this made me change from the AT to the diesel T+.
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Old 13th October 2015, 15:50   #240
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Default Re: Ford Aspire : Official Review

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Congrats methecupid. So did you book Figo or aspire? And which color is this - grey or black or blue?
Hi Manish, it's a Smoke Grey Figo.

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/attach...1&d=1444733173

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If you could please share, what is the offer you got on the old tyres.
I got a lousy set of MRF ZVTV with my car. Hence, the buy back was rather low. If I'm not mistaken, it went for 2500 a piece. This without any haggling or negotiating (quite bad at it!). People have reported much better value for their Apollo's on the forum.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BUXX View Post
Between the Figo/Aspire DCT and the Jazz's CVT , which will be better? to me the DCT felt like a pretty confused box, especially in combo with the 1.5NA.
Quote:
Originally Posted by manish84 View Post
In fact I am super confused between Aspire DCT and Polo TSI DSG. I thought I had decided on DCT until 12 hours ago, but the heart is overpowering the head yet again

Will post in "which car" section today evening after putting together all data and requirements. Will add Jazz CVT too.
One of the comments on our drive back home from my wife was "why you driving like this?" She referred to the intermittent gear change jerks. I can be blamed for it partially, since I am not acquainted with the throttle response yet; but surely the 1.5 is not a substitute to the 1.2 TSI. Let's be reasonable in what we expect out of it too, the response isn't very bad. But if one expects to be the first one off the line at a signal, maybe the Figo will not suffice their requirements. On the other hand, the Polo TSI is a full 1.5 lakhs dearer, and didn't make sense on a purely economic front. Would I have loved to have it? Sure! Make it available at 9 OTR, and I would have seen my Polo replaced with another one

P.S. The party trick
http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/attach...1&d=1444733173
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Last edited by methecupid : 13th October 2015 at 16:17.
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