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Old 28th April 2017, 13:50   #106
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Default Re: Maruti Baleno RS : Official Review

Though i agree with most of Autocar's article, the in gear acceleration measurement seems flawed for what are supposed hot(or atleast warm) hatches.

Shouldn't the 20-80 time be calculated at 2nd gear and 40-100 in 3rd for a better measure of the actual performance on offer? Because I don't think being at 40kmph in 4th gear is right especially for these hatches
(Polo TSI in gear can be measured using tiptronic to hold gears i guess)
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Old 29th April 2017, 22:24   #107
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Originally Posted by jvm_1986 View Post
Though i agree with most of Autocar's article, the in gear acceleration measurement seems flawed for what are supposed hot(or atleast warm) hatches.

Shouldn't the 20-80 time be calculated at 2nd gear and 40-100 in 3rd for a better measure of the actual performance on offer? Because I don't think being at 40kmph in 4th gear is right especially for these hatches
(Polo TSI in gear can be measured using tiptronic to hold gears i guess)
40 kmph in 4th is pretty doable by these hatches especially the turbo charged ones who have a wide and pretty flat torque curve. A lot of cars are pretty okay with 40 in 5th too. When I test drove the RS it was pretty okay even when I dropped the speed to 20 kmph in 3rd gear and pulled without any fuss without lugging. I am pretty sure the TSI should manage this easily too.

20 - 80 in second and 40 - 100 in 3rd are actually pushing pretty high rpms which is rarely done in real life situations. We of course occasionally do it.😂

Drive on,
Shibu

Last edited by shibujp : 29th April 2017 at 22:25.
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Old 29th April 2017, 22:42   #108
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Default Re: Maruti Baleno RS : Official Review

Is BalenoRS faster than Polo TSI?
Or am I missing something here?
Sorry for my ignorance.
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Old 29th April 2017, 23:43   #109
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Originally Posted by MercFan View Post
Is BalenoRS faster than Polo TSI?
Or am I missing something here?
Sorry for my ignorance.

From the review the RS is quicker but the GT seems to be the faster one as the review said that the RS losses steam early when compared to the GT.
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Old 30th April 2017, 16:05   #110
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Default Re: Maruti Baleno RS : Official Review

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Originally Posted by jvm_1986 View Post
Shouldn't the 20-80 time be calculated at 2nd gear and 40-100 in 3rd for a better measure of the actual performance on offer? Because I don't think being at 40kmph in 4th gear is right especially for these hatches
You cannot be faulted from a purely performance perspective. That is the reason 0-100 timings seem so much faster compared to in-gear timings. In-gear timings though would give more realistic assessment of how good a car would be for brisk driving in normal driving conditions. In other words, driveability combined with performance.

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From the review the RS is quicker but the GT seems to be the faster one as the review said that the RS losses steam early when compared to the GT.
RS is quicker, GT is faster - I can try to guess what you want to say. But the chart above shows that Baleno RS has not lost steam at least till 140kph.
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Old 30th April 2017, 18:50   #111
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Default Re: Maruti Baleno RS : Official Review

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Originally Posted by MercFan View Post
Is BalenoRS faster than Polo TSI?
Or am I missing something here?
Sorry for my ignorance.
It's fairly accurate.

The Abarth has a whole lot of power and the Baleno may be a touch short on power, but it makes up for it by virtue of its weight.

Also, you simply cannot do full-bodied starts in the Polo for two reasons: (1) There is no 'launch control' of any sort, for you to be able to register a good time off the line, and (2) Even if you try some sort of stunt by keeping the revs high and 'dumping' the brakes as if it were a clutch, you run the risk of leaving the gearbox on the road

P.S. Have a look at those in gear times! The Polo leaves the others for dead! And it's not a typo, I can vouch for it! The manner in which the Polo makes it to 100 whilst doing 30 in 3rd is seen to be believed!
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Old 30th April 2017, 23:09   #112
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Originally Posted by suhaas307 View Post
P.S. Have a look at those in gear times! The Polo leaves the others for dead! And it's not a typo, I can vouch for it! The manner in which the Polo makes it to 100 whilst doing 30 in 3rd is seen to be believed!
In my 2016 GT , on a highway trip with cruise control set at 120 and after braking for the toll booth, the acceleration after exiting the toll booth was really scary! It pulled seamlessly in one monstrous wave of torque all the way to the limit !

I promptly deactivated cruise control 😁
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Old 30th April 2017, 23:16   #113
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Originally Posted by MercFan View Post
Is BalenoRS faster than Polo TSI?
Or am I missing something here?
Sorry for my ignorance.
A manual (in the same category) will smoke an automatic in the 0-100 kmph timings and the automatic will make up for it in the in gear timings, if you notice.
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Old 1st May 2017, 01:17   #114
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Originally Posted by jhaji View Post

RS is quicker, GT is faster - I can try to guess what you want to say. But the chart above shows that Baleno RS has not lost steam at least till 140kph.

Well being fast has to do with top speed and being quick has to do with acceleration. So according to that review it seems that the RS is quicker and the GT is faster. Maybe after 140-150 the RS doesn't feel that punchy. I hope now we are on the same page.
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Old 1st May 2017, 09:44   #115
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Default Re: Maruti Baleno RS : Official Review

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Originally Posted by Durango Dude View Post
A manual (in the same category) will smoke an automatic in the 0-100 kmph timings and the automatic will make up for it in the in gear timings, if you notice.
A manual will smoke an automatic if the automatic has no launch control. If it has launch control then just forget about winning anything.
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Old 1st May 2017, 11:02   #116
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Originally Posted by suhaas307 View Post
P.S. Have a look at those in gear times! The Polo leaves the others for dead! And it's not a typo, I can vouch for it! The manner in which the Polo makes it to 100 whilst doing 30 in 3rd is seen to be believed!
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Originally Posted by Durango Dude View Post
A manual (in the same category) will smoke an automatic in the 0-100 kmph timings and the automatic will make up for it in the in gear timings, if you notice.
I am sorry, I still am unable to understand how you can measure in-gear timings for an automatic. If you press the accelerator fully, say, at 40kph in 4th gear. Won't there be downshifts as a result? So you are out of 4th gear immediately as you stomp down on the accelerator. If so, how can we compare it with in gear timing of a manual which starts from 4th gear and remains there?

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Well being fast has to do with top speed and being quick has to do with acceleration. So according to that review it seems that the RS is quicker and the GT is faster. Maybe after 140-150 the RS doesn't feel that punchy. I hope now we are on the same page.
I guessed as much. By your definition, it the 'quicker', that interests me.
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Old 1st May 2017, 11:12   #117
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Default Re: Maruti Baleno RS : Official Review

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Originally Posted by jhaji View Post
I am sorry, I still am unable to understand how you can measure in-gear timings for an automatic. If you press the accelerator fully, say, at 40kph in 4th gear. Won't there be downshifts as a result? So you are out of 4th gear immediately as you stomp down on the accelerator. If so, how can we compare it with in gear timing of a manual which starts from 4th gear and remains there?
If you put the DSG into manual (aka tiptronic mode), it holds the same gear until the engine hits the rev limiter. It will not upshift or downshift unless revs are below 1200 rpm.
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Old 1st May 2017, 11:13   #118
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Default Re: Maruti Baleno RS : Official Review

Quote:
Originally Posted by jhaji View Post
I am sorry, I still am unable to understand how you can measure in-gear timings for an automatic. If you press the accelerator fully, say, at 40kph in 4th gear. Won't there be downshifts as a result? So you are out of 4th gear immediately as you stomp down on the accelerator. If so, how can we compare it with in gear timing of a manual which starts from 4th gear and remains there?
You have the option of engaging 'S' or using the tiptronic function in order to hold it in a particular gear and measure the time. This has been discussed before.
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Old 1st May 2017, 11:19   #119
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Quote:
Originally Posted by reignofchaos View Post
If you put the DSG into manual (aka tiptronic mode), it holds the same gear until the engine hits the rev limiter. It will not upshift or downshift unless revs are below 1200 rpm.
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Originally Posted by suhaas307 View Post
You have the option of engaging 'S' or using the tiptronic function in order to hold it in a particular gear and measure the time. This has been discussed before.
Is the tiptronic mode or manual mode different from the so-called kickdown mode, which is apparently used in testing as mentioned earlier in the thread?

Found this explanation in Quora upon a google search (https://www.quora.com/Why-do-automat...nsmission-cars)

"So when Autocar conducts a full-throttle acceleration test with an automatic it may be difficult or impossible to keep the car in a specific gear. Instead, it uses kickdown as indicated in the test data. It's important to understand what they're telling you here. Throttle Kickdown is a feature of most automatics which is triggered when the driver floors the throttle pedal to give you the best possible acceleration. It simply shifts the gearbox into the lowest possible ratio for the car's current speed. As the speed rises it will shift when necessary into the next lowest gear speed.

So when comparing the in-gear times for a manual and automatic, you're not getting an apples-to-apples comparison. While the manual is constrained by the chosen gear, the automatic is allowed to choose the best ratio for the best possible acceleration. For an automatic, it's not really an in-gear test at all."

Please note that it is not an explanation given by Autocar.

Last edited by jhaji : 1st May 2017 at 11:44. Reason: Found a relevant quote and inserted it here.
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Old 1st May 2017, 11:58   #120
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Default Re: Maruti Baleno RS : Official Review

Quote:
Originally Posted by jhaji View Post
Is the tiptronic mode or manual mode different from the so-called kickdown mode, which is apparently used in testing as mentioned earlier in the thread?

Found this explanation in Quora upon a google search (https://www.quora.com/Why-do-automat...nsmission-cars)

Please note that it is not an explanation given by Autocar.
Yes it is very different. In tiptronic where the shifter is moved to the left from D, the chosen gear sticks like a manual.

It does not downshift unless engine revs are really low (<1200 in case of the Polo GT) nor does it upshift until it hits the rev limiter.

The normal D/S mode are where you will see kickdown to a lower gear on flooring the throttle.
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