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Old 25th April 2010, 15:47   #1816
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If the Punto Sports is launched in the same spec as in Auto Expo, I guess it would cost around 70-80K more than current Emo.Pack.

What I would like to see is:
1. Currnent Emo.Pack trim + Linea Spec MJD + Rear disc brakes: At around 6.85L (ex-showroom). Current emo.pack costs just under 6.5L ex-showroon in my city.
2. Auto expo spec Punto Sports (with new alloys, leather seats, sunroof etc) at around 7.3L ex-showroom.
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Old 25th April 2010, 18:33   #1817
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@better4worse, check http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/techni...antages-8.html (Petes box - Disadvantages?) and http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/modifi...e-punto-7.html (Pete's for Linea and Grande Punto) for the issues i'm talking about.
My car has done 14200kms. I'd planned on getting the box immediately after the 15k service but this thread has put me into two(many more) minds.

I'm going to wait for someone else to first take the plunge and then follow suit.

Last edited by sukrit7 : 25th April 2010 at 18:41.
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Old 25th April 2010, 19:06   #1818
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^^ I have seen premature turbo failures in a lot of cars with Tuning box installed.A lot of them were Swift d with this same engine. A lot of cases can be seen on forum as well.

Since i retain most of my cars till around ~150k kms reliability is of supreme importance to me, And this is the only reason i am still confused regarding getting a tuning box for my Punto.

The thread referred by sukrit in the post above is must read before buying a Tuning box for a diesel car.

Last edited by .anshuman : 25th April 2010 at 19:14. Reason: forgot something
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Old 25th April 2010, 19:18   #1819
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Quote:
Originally Posted by .anshuman View Post
^^ I have seen premature turbo failures in a lot of cars with Tuning box installed.A lot of them were Swift d with this same engine. A lot of cases can be seen on forum as well.

Since i retain most of my cars till around ~150k kms reliability is of supreme importance to me, And this is the only reason i am still confused regarding getting a tuning box for my Punto.

That's exactly my problem as well, I also intend to use the car for a long period of time and reliability is an absolute must as our cars do many highway and outstation trips.
Anshuman, point is, will fiat find out or not ?
What's your take ?
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Old 25th April 2010, 19:26   #1820
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^^ If you are only afraid of the Tata Fiat workshops, most of the workshops do not even know what a tuning box is.

For example: Recently i got a my car's key replaced under warranty. The pairing process was done using the scanner, the mechanic who did this knew how to do it but he did not know what exactly it meant, this guy did not know English and at times i read out a lot things and i explained them to him.
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Old 25th April 2010, 19:43   #1821
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Quote:
Originally Posted by better4worse View Post
Out of curiosity, the Pete's T Box adds close to 25 HP to the existing, so a Punto VGT (read 90 BHP) + Pete's should make it close to 115 BHP. How did you arrive at 102 BHP ? Am I missing something here ? Is it even safe to tune the sports Punto using Pete's ?
Considering all things remain the same as in the Linea, Pete's box figures for Linea are 102 bhp, 220 Nm. So, a safe assumption that the same will be applicable for Punto as well.

As for safety, several threads are discussing issues on turbos with Pete's, specially in Swifts and Puntos. Hence long term reliable is a bit suspect.
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Old 25th April 2010, 21:17   #1822
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@ Sukrit / .anshuman: Guys, yes.. people have raised questions on the whole on tuning boxes but for obvious reasons such as more torque puts more pressure on the components (wear and tear of the gear box, clutch et all)! I know you folks are looking at an extended ownerhip period stretching up to 8-10 yrs (150 K Kms) and are more worried over the hazards of the same, but something like turbo failure in swifts is more worrisome compared to gearbox/clutch failure. Could it be a manufacturer specific thing ? Has Pete been made to respond/explain these Turbo-failures in Swift ?

@.anshuman - Can you please share the links which discuss the Swift Turbo failure due to Pete's tuning box ?

Let me start from the beginning here..in layman terms, whats the essential difference between Re-mapping and Tuning Box ?

The way I understand it, both essentially do the same thing, alter the air & fuel flow and its timing into the engine.
- Re-mapping is one time exercise done on the company fitted OE ECU to modify the air and fuel inflow at different speed. Its like a software upgrade to the ECU.

- Tuning box concept requires a small external box which alters the air and fuel flow/timing.

Frankly, to me its still not clear why people recommend Re-map to Tuning boxes.

My personal dilemma:
Honestly, I wanted punto because of the looks, while the 75 bhp on the 1.3 MJD (when compared to the 90 BHP swift) was always a comprise. I was always counting on installing Pete's post the first 10K on my Punto, for I wanted the ride comfort and the looks of a GP coupled with a engine performance of a Swift.

If external tuning box or re-mapping has genuine issues, then in that case case one should buy a swift instead of a Punto, purely because it delivers 90 bhp as per the manufacturer. I mean, here I am on the cusp of my punto delivery which has been long overdue and I am yet to get it. Should I be re-thinking on this whole 'which diesel hatch' decision ?

- B4W

PS: Maruti A.S.S is such a lure ..all things kept aside !

Last edited by better4worse : 25th April 2010 at 21:28.
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Old 25th April 2010, 21:23   #1823
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Quote:
Originally Posted by better4worse View Post
Honestly, I wanted punto because of the looks, while the 75 bhp on the 1.3 MJD (when compared to the 90 BHP swift)

- B4W
Swift ddis is 90 bhp? Since when?
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Old 25th April 2010, 21:35   #1824
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CrAzY dRiVeR View Post
Considering all things remain the same as in the Linea, Pete's box figures for Linea are 102 bhp, 220 Nm. So, a safe assumption that the same will be applicable for Punto as well.
Fair enough, a gain of mere 12 bhp with 102 Bhp is Pete's assessment for a 'safe' Tuning box for 1.3MJD VGT engine! I also read in another one of the threads that Punto VGT re-mapping could take it upto 112 BHP. Going by the same logic, considering Punto sports will come with the same engine, wouldnt this be a far more attractive proposition (assuming the re-map is relatively safe vis-a-vis the tuning box) ?

- B4W
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Old 25th April 2010, 21:39   #1825
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Quote:
Originally Posted by arun1100 View Post
Swift ddis is 90 bhp? Since when?
Thanks Arun ! seems I had my facts wrong on the Swift, its not a 90 BHP ...just better tuned !
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Old 25th April 2010, 21:46   #1826
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Punto's acceleration is effected more due to the gearing than the weight and tuning. While the first 2 gears are too short and 3rd gear is taller making the 2nd and 3rd widely spaced. Please remember the European Punto does 0-100 in 13.XX secs similar to Swift.

Last edited by .anshuman : 25th April 2010 at 21:53.
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Old 25th April 2010, 22:00   #1827
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Quote:
Originally Posted by .anshuman View Post
@better4worse: Swift DDiS has a 75bhp engine just like the Punto MJD.
punto is tuned for 76 ps
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Old 25th April 2010, 22:10   #1828
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ms001 View Post
punto is tuned for 76 ps
Bhp and PS are different. According to Wikipedia:
Quote:
The Pferdestärke PS (German translation of horsepower) is a name for a group of similar power measurements used in Germany around the end of the 19th century, all of about one metric horsepower in size.
So 76Ps=74.96 Bhp
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Old 25th April 2010, 22:20   #1829
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Quote:
Originally Posted by .anshuman View Post
Bhp and PS are different. According to Wikipedia:


So 76Ps=74.96 Bhp
yes thats right but swift in 75ps not 75 bhp
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Old 25th April 2010, 22:27   #1830
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Quote:
Originally Posted by .anshuman View Post
Punto's acceleration is effected more due to the gearing than the weight and tuning. While the first 2 gears are too short and 3rd gear is taller making the 2nd and 3rd widely spaced. Please remember the European Punto does 0-100 in 13.XX secs similar to Swift.
Thanks for the info there, so basically what you are saying is that i can never get the Swift type engine response on my punto. Thanks for bursting my bubble... !

Any particular reason for different gearing for Indian Punto? Considering its common knowledge that the short first two gears won't be such a big hit in India !

- B4W
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