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Old 28th April 2010, 18:06   #1876
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@ Kadri007, PFA a pdf which enlists the cost of all Punto Spare Parts (Service Parts, Mechanical Parts and Accident Repair Parts). You will discover that the Punto, surprisingly, has the cheapest basket of spare parts in the segment, outdoing even than the Swift !!!

I can understand your dilemma as Ive gone through the very same thing myself. I've been TD-ing all sorts of hatchbacks and had finally shortlisted

I decided they werent. Over to you.
Thanks a lot for the details. Punto prices are almost half of Fabia.

Yes car finilization is a big dilemma. A lot of battles needs to be fought between Heart and Mind.

From almost 10 models like Beat, Figo, i10, Indica Vista, Polo, Ritz, Swift, A Star, , now its a close fight between Punto and Fabia.

The Punto interiors were a bit sad and it missed airbags, front and rear impact beams,etc. A important factor for long drives in bad roads which currently Fabia is offering at 6Lakhs.
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Old 28th April 2010, 18:35   #1877
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Thanks a lot for the details. Punto prices are almost half of Fabia.

Yes car finilization is a big dilemma. A lot of battles needs to be fought between Heart and Mind.

From almost 10 models like Beat, Figo, i10, Indica Vista, Polo, Ritz, Swift, A Star, , now its a close fight between Punto and Fabia.

The Punto interiors were a bit sad and it missed airbags, front and rear impact beams,etc. A important factor for long drives in bad roads which currently Fabia is offering at 6Lakhs.
Youre welcome bud.

Say, how do you figure that the Punto does not have front and rear impact beams - I'd assume thats a standard feature in most cars. Though the Punto does not advertise the impact beams in its brochure, neither does the Polo nor the i20.
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Old 28th April 2010, 19:59   #1878
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Say, how do you figure that the Punto does not have front and rear impact beams - I'd assume thats a standard feature in most cars. Though the Punto does not advertise the impact beams in its brochure, neither does the Polo nor the i20.
I checked the car in showroom and also asked the sales guy in the showroom. Punto has a crumple zone in front.

In Fabia there is a thick beam in front of the bonnet. Its looks like a railway track beam and reduces the impact by 15 KMS, that what the sales guys at Skoda said.

Polo also misses this feature. i20 no much idea about it.
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Old 28th April 2010, 21:40   #1879
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I checked the car in showroom and also asked the sales guy in the showroom. Punto has a crumple zone in front.

In Fabia there is a thick beam in front of the bonnet. Its looks like a railway track beam and reduces the impact by 15 KMS, that what the sales guys at Skoda said.

Polo also misses this feature. i20 no much idea about it.
Punto has the same railway track beam at the front but the same is missing in other cars like Hyundai i20, Maruti even Polo as mentioned.
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Old 28th April 2010, 23:06   #1880
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I think airbag replacement costs should not be a consideration. It's something that hopefully you will never have to replace during your car ownership.

And if unfortunately you have to replace them, probably the airbags will have already saved someone who is irreplaceable.
Yes. But the only problem is, what if it malfunctions and opens up when not required? Or - For all we know, if it malfunctions and does not come on when needed?

It can possible, since it is controlled by some electronics. That too, in low Quality controlled cars. It will be a waste to have ABS-EBD and Airbags, if it is not of good quality. It can be a real pain. IMHO do not buy these facilities in cars which do not give prominence to good quality.

Only positive is that it gives peace of mind.
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Old 29th April 2010, 00:31   #1881
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Yes. But the only problem is, what if it malfunctions and opens up when not required?
It could happen. It could also happen that a tree falls on your car when it's parked somewhere. That would cost a lot to repair too. Does that thought stop you from buying a car?

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Or - For all we know, if it malfunctions and does not come on when needed?

It can possible, since it is controlled by some electronics. That too, in low Quality controlled cars. It will be a waste to have ABS-EBD and Airbags, if it is not of good quality. It can be a real pain. IMHO do not buy these facilities in cars which do not give prominence to good quality.

Only positive is that it gives peace of mind.
All I can say is that if you don't trust your car (manufacturer), then you should switch to some other car which you trust and hope that you don't end up getting that one lemon in which ABS or airbags malfunction.
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Old 29th April 2010, 08:16   #1882
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+1 to starrysky. In any product, from any manufacturer there are bound to be positive and negative things. What needs to be understood is that security ratings are not given on the fly, there is a process and logic behind those stars.
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Old 29th April 2010, 08:34   #1883
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Originally Posted by StarrySky View Post
It could happen. It could also happen that a tree falls on your car when it's parked somewhere. That would cost a lot to repair too. Does that thought stop you from buying a car?

All I can say is that if you don't trust your car (manufacturer), then you should switch to some other car which you trust and hope that you don't end up getting that one lemon in which ABS or airbags malfunction.
I don't say not to buy a car with safety features. But when the quality of the parts that is visible is so bad, how can we trust the manufacturer on these things? Let us forget about Airbags. If one of the EBD sensors do not function properly, we will tend to feel that the car without it is better. Safety features without quality has no meaning. These things can also fail in a car which is oozing with quality. But the chances are less.

Without these things, any car that we buy will be just another car. If some quality issues are there, so be it. It will not hurt us for buying the car we like.

I am not for/against any manufacturer. This is just my opinion. I may be wrong. As you said, If the tree falls on our car, you cannot do anything. But this is natural calamity. Please think with an open mind.

Last edited by Chethan B G : 29th April 2010 at 08:35.
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Old 29th April 2010, 11:26   #1884
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Originally Posted by Chethan B G View Post
It can possible, since it is controlled by some electronics. That too, in low Quality controlled cars. It will be a waste to have ABS-EBD and Airbags, if it is not of good quality. It can be a real pain. IMHO do not buy these facilities in cars which do not give prominence to good quality.
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Originally Posted by Chethan B G View Post
I don't say not to buy a car with safety features. But when the quality of the parts that is visible is so bad, how can we trust the manufacturer on these things? Let us forget about Airbags. If one of the EBD sensors do not function properly, we will tend to feel that the car without it is better. Safety features without quality has no meaning. These things can also fail in a car which is oozing with quality. But the chances are less.

Without these things, any car that we buy will be just another car. If some quality issues are there, so be it. It will not hurt us for buying the car we like.
First of all I would like to know on what basis are you making these comments ? Are these plain assumptions or you have concrete proof about the so called low quality "Safety Components" in Punto ?

1. Have you read Sidindica's post about the massive shunt his Punto was involved in ? His entire family was saved thanks to the safety built in to the car. Read this : http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/1823784-post126.html

2. Have you come across any incident / post / report anywhere on the internet (forget TBHP alone) where the safety components have failed to their job ? (I am talking about the India spec Linea & Punto's here) (airbags not functioning, EBD failing etc as you say)

3. I am not allowed to post references of other groups here so I won't : but there are numerous reviews / experiences posted by real punto owners where Punto's braking (and I am specifically talking about braking here since you think the EBD can fail) has actually saved them from getting involved in a shunt. In one case, the person involved was a BHP'ian.

4. I am not able to find the particular thread : but a BHP'ians brand new Punto (the colour was white) hit a pole + tree on Mysore-Ooty highway. The shunt was pretty strong but no major injuries to anyone in the car. Again : all safety components of the car did their job.

5. You are conveniently ignoring the safety ratings the car has received. These ratings are not given at random. There is a methodology and process involved behind it.

6. Show me one thread / post / review on this forum : where ABS + EBD, airbags or any major electronic component on a Linea or Punto has failed causing bodily harm to the occupants.

You are arguing that since the "visible" part is bad : how can one trust the "invisible" part. Google for "airbags did not deploy" and you will find plenty of reports / complaints against major manufacturer's. And most of these manufacturers make cars that have very good looking "visible" parts. I won't name any here : you can search and find out yourself.

Last edited by amoghchaphalkar : 29th April 2010 at 11:44. Reason: typo
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Old 29th April 2010, 11:50   #1885
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+1 to Amogh.

@ Chetan: Man, how convenient of you to assume low quality safety equipment based on low quality interiors and all.

If you do not have any proofs, please stop talking all this bu****. Every other swift rattles but this does not mean the airbags wont deploy on impact. If you are not so sure about this, dont buy any vehicle and start walking to every other place. BTW which vehicle you have bought/about to buy? How did you make sure it will not fail in any case?
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Old 29th April 2010, 12:18   #1886
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Originally Posted by amoghchaphalkar View Post
First of all I would like to know on what basis are you making these comments ? Are these plain assumptions or you have concrete proof about the so called low quality "Safety Components" in Punto ?

1. Have you read Sidindica's post about the massive shunt his Punto was involved in ? His entire family was saved thanks to the safety built in to the car. Read this : http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/1823784-post126.html

2. Have you come across any incident / post / report anywhere on the internet (forget TBHP alone) where the safety components have failed to their job ? (I am talking about the India spec Linea & Punto's here) (airbags not functioning, EBD failing etc as you say)

3. I am not allowed to post references of other groups here so I won't : but there are numerous reviews / experiences posted by real punto owners where Punto's braking (and I am specifically talking about braking here since you think the EBD can fail) has actually saved them from getting involved in a shunt. In one case, the person involved was a BHP'ian.

4. I am not able to find the particular thread : but a BHP'ians brand new Punto (the colour was white) hit a pole + tree on Mysore-Ooty highway. The shunt was pretty strong but no major injuries to anyone in the car. Again : all safety components of the car did their job.

5. You are conveniently ignoring the safety ratings the car has received. These ratings are not given at random. There is a methodology and process involved behind it.

6. Show me one thread / post / review on this forum : where ABS + EBD, airbags or any major electronic component on a Linea or Punto has failed causing bodily harm to the occupants.

You are arguing that since the "visible" part is bad : how can one trust the "invisible" part. Google for "airbags did not deploy" and you will find plenty of reports / complaints against major manufacturer's. And most of these manufacturers make cars that have very good looking "visible" parts. I won't name any here : you can search and find out yourself.
I was not referring to any particular car/manufacturer. I was only referring to the components quality (its effect WRT time). As I said, these are my personal opinions which need not be right. I am sorry if I have offended any one.

Now a days when we go shopping to buy a car, we compare all the features that the car has in the offering. We tend to weigh all features (safety or luxury) on the same scale. I am skeptical about what a manufacturer can actually deliver with in a limited budget. Any manufacturer can be hard pressed to cut costs. To me, it is better if I end up with a failed music system, rather than a failed safety feature.

My ideas on this is mostly based on hear say. My knowledge on this is very limited. Maybe if the positive incidents outweigh the negatives, it is still worth having these features. I will be glad if you can throw some light on this.
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Old 29th April 2010, 12:23   #1887
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Amogh, add another 3 to that. I first bought a Punto 6 months ago and it has been an absolute delight to drive. I have had very close calls when driving in highways mainly due to the road manners of our people and sudden surprises in the road condition. I have been saved by the Punto atleast on three occasions by the excellent braking and maneuvering capabilities of the Punto which would have definitely turned out to be a disaster in the earlier cars I had owned.

Impressed with the superb build and ride quality, my father and cousin brother also have bought Puntos recently and all of them agree on the excellent safety aspects of the car. It is very sad to see people commenting about safety based on the look of plastics.
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Old 29th April 2010, 12:40   #1888
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Amogh, add another 3 to that. I first bought a Punto 6 months ago and it has been an absolute delight to drive. I have had very close calls when driving in highways mainly due to the road manners of our people and sudden surprises in the road condition. I have been saved by the Punto atleast on three occasions by the excellent braking and maneuvering capabilities of the Punto which would have definitely turned out to be a disaster in the earlier cars I had owned.

Impressed with the superb build and ride quality, my father and cousin brother also have bought Puntos recently and all of them agree on the excellent safety aspects of the car. It is very sad to see people commenting about safety based on the look of plastics.
It is obvious that I am offending most Punto owners. My intention was definitely not that. I am once again sorry for it. I was only wondering if it was better to buy a mid variant of any car, rather than top variant with these safety feature. May be I did not communicate properly.

I agree with all of you on your decision on buying the car that you liked. I would like to stop this discussion at this point.
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Old 29th April 2010, 12:59   #1889
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While every Punto owners can defend the safety of the car, I still am a bit suspect on how well these safety features are fitted to the car. People say the plastics are of not good quality, but actually, more than the poor quality of the plastics it is the fit and finish of these plastics that have played the spoil sport.

I don't mind a poor quality plastic in my car but it really bothers me when I see some plastic bits falling, even recently I have heard of a Punto owner(Silver Fire) complaining that his bonnet lever fell when he fiddled with it.

Building a car is a process, the level of quality control could be the same in each and every stage, though the type may vary among manufacturers. I don't think a manufacturer would take special care while fitting the airbags and EBD and take less care while fitting the dash boards and the seats.

The thing that most bothers me is that I still keep hearing of Plastic bits falling. While most manufacturers are being proactive, Fiat is not even being reactive. Fiat must become more vocal of what they are doing, it is almost like an iron curtain sheilding Fiat. I definitely like to know the positive developments in Fiat, right from the way it manufactures its cars to the way it strategizes to sell its cars.

Last edited by CliffHanger : 29th April 2010 at 13:03.
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Old 29th April 2010, 13:24   #1890
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Originally Posted by Chethan B G View Post
Now a days when we go shopping to buy a car, we compare all the features that the car has in the offering. We tend to weigh all features (safety or luxury) on the same scale. I am skeptical about what a manufacturer can actually deliver with in a limited budget. Any manufacturer can be hard pressed to cut costs. To me, it is better if I end up with a failed music system, rather than a failed safety feature.
Chethan, I totally agree to your point of view and with the reviews we have from Punto (FIAT) owners over internet; I am pretty sure FIAT has done cost cutting on the plastics but not on the safety aspect. On a whole the ABS, EBD & Airbags is something very new for the mass-market cars(read:hatchback) segment cars in India and its really. Frankly, I have not heard/read of any incidence where the safety feature on any of the cars have failed when needed. And I really don't think that with the price war going on for the mass-market, any manufacturer can provide a complete package at the price band (6-7 Lakh). Its upto the individual buyer on what they want to compromise at.
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