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Old 11th June 2010, 18:53   #2161
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Originally Posted by sandeepmdas View Post
@jacksons, thanks buddy.

I have booked a Punto EP and waiting for the delivery. The OTR is 6.89L in Trivandrum. If the VGT is priced over 50K. well, it's beyond my budget.

OTOH, I can go for a Pete's tuning box, and it should be a "cheaper" alternative for the VGT, esp when you consider the cumulative RT, insurance costs. On paper, the Pete's delivers slightly better performance than the VGT, according to their website. Warranty will be an issue though.

What do you people think about this scenario?
Personally I don't like to disturb company settings in any car because warranty and for other reasons as well. Pete's will also cost somewhere around 30K Rs.
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Old 11th June 2010, 19:01   #2162
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For common people to consider buying the VGT Punto (not Fiat lovers or enthusiasts), I think the price of the VGT Punto should be a few thousands less than i20 CRDI Asta and the Polo TDI Highline - simply because the Fiat brand is not as strong as VW or Hyundai in India.

I think Fiat also have recognised this. This is why we have been hearing that the 90hp Punto won't be called 'Punto Sports', but something else. I guess this means that the sunroof, bigger wheels, alloys, leather seats etc that we saw at the Auto Expo will not be included in the 90hp Punto. It's going to be just the current Emo.Pack trim + VGT. In that case, I will be surprised if Fiat demands a 50K premium over the current Emo.Pack.

The Polo TDI HL costs 6.82L ex-Delhi and the current Punto Emo.Pack costs 6.46 ex-Delhi. I guess the VGT Punto will be priced at around 6.75 to 6.8L ex-Delhi.
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Old 11th June 2010, 19:40   #2163
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Originally Posted by StarrySky View Post
For common people to consider buying the VGT Punto (not Fiat lovers or enthusiasts), I think the price of the VGT Punto should be a few thousands less than i20 CRDI Asta and the Polo TDI Highline - simply because the Fiat brand is not as strong as VW or Hyundai in India.

I think Fiat also have recognised this. This is why we have been hearing that the 90hp Punto won't be called 'Punto Sports', but something else. I guess this means that the sunroof, bigger wheels, alloys, leather seats etc that we saw at the Auto Expo will not be included in the 90hp Punto. It's going to be just the current Emo.Pack trim + VGT. In that case, I will be surprised if Fiat demands a 50K premium over the current Emo.Pack.

The Polo TDI HL costs 6.82L ex-Delhi and the current Punto Emo.Pack costs 6.46 ex-Delhi. I guess the VGT Punto will be priced at around 6.75 to 6.8L ex-Delhi.

As much as I'd too want to want that....I think its still wishful thinking (read as pure speculation).
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Old 11th June 2010, 22:24   #2164
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I have said this earlier on the Forum, if Fiat is looking for volumes they need to introduce the VGT engine on Emotion and Emotion pack variants with the same pricing and features from the current FGT version. The FGT version should be sold only in the Active and Dynamic variants.

Though the idea of a higher price Punto Sport with bigger alloys, sunroof, leather upholstery etc looks very good but it would never generate the volumes which are necessary for Fiat's long term survival in India.

How long can they sell the car with discount or freebies? Once the new car excitement for Punto, fails it won't find many takers.
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Old 11th June 2010, 22:25   #2165
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Originally Posted by StarrySky View Post
For common people to consider buying the VGT Punto (not Fiat lovers or enthusiasts), I think the price of the VGT Punto should be a few thousands less than i20 CRDI Asta and the Polo TDI Highline - simply because the Fiat brand is not as strong as VW or Hyundai in India.

I think Fiat also have recognised this. This is why we have been hearing that the 90hp Punto won't be called 'Punto Sports', but something else. I guess this means that the sunroof, bigger wheels, alloys, leather seats etc that we saw at the Auto Expo will not be included in the 90hp Punto. It's going to be just the current Emo.Pack trim + VGT. In that case, I will be surprised if Fiat demands a 50K premium over the current Emo.Pack.

The Polo TDI HL costs 6.82L ex-Delhi and the current Punto Emo.Pack costs 6.46 ex-Delhi. I guess the VGT Punto will be priced at around 6.75 to 6.8L ex-Delhi.
You are right in your way of thinking and its nothing wrong in that, I myself is whishing that but alas !
Keep guessing on.. Any they are offering lot of discount on current FGT, so it should be fair pricing.

Last edited by jacksons : 11th June 2010 at 22:28.
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Old 11th June 2010, 22:35   #2166
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Originally Posted by .anshuman View Post

Though the idea of a higher price Punto Sport with bigger alloys, sunroof, leather upholstery etc looks very good but it would never generate the volumes which are necessary for Fiat's long term survival in India.
I am actually wishing and praying for a Punto VGT (whatever they call it; I don't care if the they call is Sport or something else) comes with "only" the additions of VGT and good quality leather upholstery. I somehow feel any bigger than 15" alloys may mess up with the ride of Punto, and I really like the current alloys. Moreover, I am not sure how useful sunroof is in India. So instead of all these, if they just give us the Punto VGT with nice leather upholstery and at just the minimum possible additional cost, I will consider it to be the optimal scenario.
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Old 11th June 2010, 22:38   #2167
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StarrySky View Post
For common people to consider buying the VGT Punto (not Fiat lovers or enthusiasts), I think the price of the VGT Punto should be a few thousands less than i20 CRDI Asta and the Polo TDI Highline - simply because the Fiat brand is not as strong as VW or Hyundai in India.

The Polo TDI HL costs 6.82L ex-Delhi and the current Punto Emo.Pack costs 6.46 ex-Delhi. I guess the VGT Punto will be priced at around 6.75 to 6.8L ex-Delhi.
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Originally Posted by better4worse View Post
As much as I'd too want to want that....I think its still wishful thinking (read as pure speculation).

Agree with both the quotes. Starrysky's point of Fiat not being a strong brand is absolutely right. But, it'll be hard for them to price the car below the VW. However, I do think that the VGT should come in Emotion and Emotion Pack versions (with different alloys and some other visual cues).
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Old 12th June 2010, 00:14   #2168
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Quote:
Originally Posted by .anshuman View Post
I have said this earlier on the Forum, if Fiat is looking for volumes they need to introduce the VGT engine on Emotion and Emotion pack variants with the same pricing and features from the current FGT version. The FGT version should be sold only in the Active and Dynamic variants.

Though the idea of a higher price Punto Sport with bigger alloys, sunroof, leather upholstery etc looks very good but it would never generate the volumes which are necessary for Fiat's long term survival in India.

How long can they sell the car with discount or freebies? Once the new car excitement for Punto, fails it won't find many takers.
Question: How to drive Punto volumes in immediate future ?

Anshuman, I have a slightly different take on this, I think they need to introduce the VGT across the board for all the versions. While the looks have always been a plus for Punto, now is the time to go for the kill and offer performance at nearly the same price (as an introductory offer to start with ) or at a marginal increase (25- 40K). Continue offering freebies worth 25-40 K for the feel good factor (works like crazy on the customer mindset).

Let the introductory offer run for much more than a couple of months for the word to spread and translate into volumes. Couple that with focused advertising so that every potential hatch buyer knows that there is something called VGT..which is available in a Punto and possibly not in other cars. This needs to be done for a long enough period so that buying a Punto becomes a norm. (as it is with MS Swift)

Frankly, I don't think dynamic as a version is much of a differentiator in the market and can be quite easily be thrown out and its features be introduced in 'Active' instead. It is very important to have a solid base version which is a super attractive proposition when compared against 'vanilla' version of other manufacturers.

I genuinely think if only FIAT thinks with an all Indian mindset (and not TATA's ..please for our sake!) to sell cars, it can make a killing here and Punto is just the vehicle to do that for them. Its just not the time to play catch up and be reactive to market forces, instead they need to be proactive and set the bar for premium hatch category.

Simply put... its time to roll out the VGT engine, set the plastics and A.S.S right, offer genuine value and follow it with a massive India focussed marketing blitz. (let the world know FIAT is here...and here to stay!)

- B4W


PS: While they sell under the same roof, they really need to differentiate themselves from TATA in every single way, last thing they want is that FIAT as a brand is viewed in the same light as TATA. This should start from the way FIAT folks dress up and greet you at the showroom, to the products they sell.... just no bluddy TATA 'desi-pan' !

Last edited by better4worse : 12th June 2010 at 00:19. Reason: typos
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Old 12th June 2010, 20:53   #2169
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Got a chance to take my Punto 1.2 Emotion for a 20 km spin, I had reset the trip meter before start to check the FE.

The trip meter showed 13.9 km/l overall from home to home, which includes 70% highway 30% city, with AC on position 2 and 2 persons on board maintaining max of 80 kmph under 2600-2700 rpm. I've noted the odo reading in the first tank full and will check what FE I get next time I fill her up. It would be much lower considering that I've done a lot of idling to check all the features, AC, light operations etc.

It's been 3 days and the Odo reads just 140km now, will go for a longish drive tomorrow.

Impressions so far

+ Ride is awesome, just the kind of ride quality we need for pathetic Indian roads.
+ Great handling.
+ Steering is nothing less than a non power steering as far as feedback is concerned. Good to hold too.
+ Chilling AC. Position 2 will suffice most of the time.
+ Nice MID displaying a lot of info.

- Notchy gear shift. Maybe will get better after run in period.
- Tilt steering should have come down a little more.
- Music quality isn't too good, no USB for emotion variant.

Other thoughts

Power is adequate as far as a 'commuter' is concerned. IMO, it should pose no problem for most people who stay under 120kmph at all times. For the price that it's offered, considering it as a package, the power is not a deal breaker for the 1.2 at all. It returns slightly better FE as well, which is important in India. Fiat should have had all variants in the 1.2 from the very beginning, as it's where the sales are. Hell, they still don't offer a 1.2 Emotion pack, which I think they should.

Plastic quality, well didn't find anything too bad till now. I feel the boot opener and fuel lid opener buttons are flimsy and may break if used with force. The glove box isn't too smooth to operate. Otherwise fit and finish, panel gaps etc including near the ignition key area look nothing abnormal, although I'm no expert.

Foot well isn't cramped for me, though it might be for people with wide feet. Sometimes, the dead pedal comes in the way while pressing clutch, but nothing serious and anyone can get used to it easily and adjust accordingly.

These are just the initial thoughts on the car. Will post a review once I clock enough miles.
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Old 12th June 2010, 21:38   #2170
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^^ Thanks for sharing this. it pretty much sums up the 1.2 version. This is exactly what my opinion was as well.

I would like to know a little more about what you think of the headlights (once you drive at night), my personal experience with the low beam is that the throw is too short.
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Old 14th June 2010, 15:00   #2171
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I would like to know a little more about what you think of the headlights (once you drive at night), my personal experience with the low beam is that the throw is too short.
Yesterday drove at the night, in highways and dark roads the throw at low beam is short. In decent speeds, it'll be difficult to spot any potholes well before you approach them. Will have to use high beam to be comfortable.
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Old 14th June 2010, 19:06   #2172
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Did a brief TD of Punto along with my friend last Saturday. We had been for i20 6 speed TD but it wasn’t available. So decided to visit nearby TATA-FIAT showroom. Both me and my friend returned impressed by Punto! Boy, I was mighty impressed by ride quality. One year old totally abused Punto test drive car went very well on road.

Enquired about Punto Sports, Concorde advised that it would be available mid of next month. And after a month from Punto launch, T jet Linea would be launched!
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Old 15th June 2010, 14:19   #2173
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Emo Pk users: How do I get the B&M lovely lady's voice to read out messages? I've paired my E71 and can make and take calls, but the message reading does not seem to work. Any change in settings needed?
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Old 15th June 2010, 14:56   #2174
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guys ive got a problem with the blue and me. now it dosent pair with any phone. one day it was working perfectly, then when i called from the phone it didnt come on the car speakers, since then the blue and me dosent detect any phone, and on the phone it says connection failed. ive deleted all user data from blue and me and from the phone, but still nothing.

any help will be appreciated.
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Old 15th June 2010, 15:31   #2175
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Default VGT Vs Pete's tuning Box

As far as my research goes, the VGT also helps removes any turbo lag that might be there at low RPM's, something which the Pete's tuning box will not be able to do (it will just increase the Power output accross the RPM range).

At low RPMs a normal turbo charger does not have enough exhaust gases to work with and hence it does not turn. With a VGT the turbocharger input blades actually move almost parallel to the turbine and hence increasing the velocity of the exhaust gases going into the turbine and then it can move and suck in more air.

On the Other hand, the new VGT punto will not just have the VGT but also a Retuned ECU, which will actually increase the power output. A VGT by itself will not increase the Power output by much over a normal turbo charger. Please note that a VGT behaves like a normal turbo charger at high RPMs.
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