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Old 5th August 2010, 12:52   #2581
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Originally Posted by .anshuman View Post
The point is Swift is a faster car than Punto 90hp, 0-100 and in gear acceleration both included. The only saving grace for Punto FGT is linear power delivery with torque coming early and lesser turbo lag, but the 90hp suffers from more lag compared to FGT.

Swift 75hp 0-100:13.87secs, 20-80(3rd):11.96, 40-100(4th):14.72
Punto 75hp 0-100:17.84, 20-80(3rd):12.57, 40-100(4th):15.22
Punto 90hp 0-100:16.21, 20-80(3rd):13.97, 40-100(4th):14.72

Data:ACI

The Punto 90hp has similar power delivery as 75hp uptil 3000rpm, After 3000rpm the torque does not drop like 75hp making it deliver the 90hp power figure. Those who know the relation between Power and Torque will understand what i mean to say. The 75hp Punto has more linear power delivery with lesser turbo lag, hence its easier to drive in city.

Buy a Punto 90hp only if you intend to use the top end frequently. I have driven both 90hp Punto and Pete'd 75hp Punto, the Pete'd Punto 75 feels more peppy and is more fun to drive. Though i do not recommend fitting a tuning box, as it will lead your turbo to premature death due to excessive smoking. No matter what air-filter you use a car with tuning box smokes much more than the stock car.
Thanks for sharing the data, I haven't gotten hold of ACI's August issue (where they compare the hatch's) , I was going by BSM's Punto 90Hp review. The 0-100 time is quoted as 15.5 seconds and the 80-120 (typical highway maneuver) or 100-140 was faster (than the FGT) by a huge margin (5.9 and 7.3 seconds respectively). This consequently was interpreted as being faster than the Swift as well, since the FGT was already comparable.

You are right about the 90Hp having more power in the top end, but that works beautifully with the Punto's forte of being great on the highway (I'd say that the 80-120 is kind of mid-range).
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Old 5th August 2010, 13:00   #2582
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You are right about the 90Hp having more power in the top end, but that works beautifully with the Punto's forte of being great on the highway (I'd say that the 80-120 is kind of mid-range).
But the sad part is annoying boom and uneasiness due to shorter gearing at speeds above 100kph. My Dad is also a car lover, he drives just on highways, he always complains of the waste of chassis Fiat India has done by providing poor NVH and shorter gearing suited for just city usage.

Punto on one hand feels much slower than it is, on the other side boom makes it feel as if its being revved in 4th gear.
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Old 5th August 2010, 14:13   #2583
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Originally Posted by .anshuman View Post
I have driven both the cars on a incline, both the cars pull without accelerator in 2nd gear on a steep incline.
Although I must admit I haven't carried out the same on a Swift but I have driven it extensively in city where it require far more shift compared to the Punto.

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I did not mention Ride, Handling or door thump anywhere. I was just talking about performance.
My point of bringing the feel and solidity was not the thump. What I really want to know is where has all that metal gone in case of Swift? Or are the numbers in the spec sheet just that, numbers?

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Incorrect use of gear ratios can make hell lot of difference in Acceleration. Just like i mentioned before the first gear in Punto is tooo short, similarly second is short too, then suddenly second and third gears are so widely spaced. Do you know the Punto does a wheelspin in second, And my Elantra which is much faster and powerful does not do it even with TCS switched off.
So would you not agree that it will accelerate well with the first two gears??? Let me take a scenario where I want the least possible time for 0-100 kph sprint. The first two gear because of being being short will let me accelerate faster and then third onwards I can build up speed. I still dont think its because of the gearbox alone.


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Originally Posted by .anshuman View Post
The European Punto 75hp has performance figures matching Swift D sold in India. It comes with the same engine, same torque and same power. Just a Different Gearbox, the gearbox we have here in Punto was adapted to be used in Punto, it was not designed for a Punto.
Again do you feel its because of the "gearbox" or "gear ratios"

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Originally Posted by .anshuman View Post
Talking about gearshift quality, Everyone knows both Swift and Polo score much better than Punto.
I know but since you said the gearbox is derived from Palio's I was wondering why is it worse when it should be better because the shift action in my Palio 1.2 is as good as any gearbox around.
Frankly I dont know which gearbox Fiat is using and I dont even know from where these gearbox stories started. Can you point me to a reliable source where its mentioned?

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183kph actual speed= 200kph in Speedo.
Well yes if speedo has an error which I am sure there is however small.
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Old 5th August 2010, 14:15   #2584
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Originally Posted by .anshuman View Post
But the sad part is annoying boom and uneasiness due to shorter gearing at speeds above 100kph. My Dad is also a car lover, he drives just on highways, he always complains of the waste of chassis Fiat India has done by providing poor NVH and shorter gearing suited for just city usage.

Punto on one hand feels much slower than it is, on the other side boom makes it feel as if its being revved in 4th gear.
Swift, Punto and Figo all do 100 kph @ 2500 rpm in 5th gear. Again its not gearing you seem to blame for everything but sound deadening.
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Old 5th August 2010, 22:46   #2585
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Default Only Euro-III 2010 Punto in Chandigarh

Running here and there is useless in Chandigarh. Only Euro-III cars are available in Chandigarh.
BHPians please note that unless you check Euro-IV car's VIN personally, do not book the car.
Yesterday, I was told that Euro-IV cars have finally arrived in the stockyard and are available for ready delivery.
I was promised to be taken to the stockyard and I booked a BS-IV Bossa Nova White Fiat Grande Punto 1.4FIRE Emotion Pack.
Today, I reached the dealership with my PDI list and a dream in my eyes only to be introduced to a senior sales executive who started "educating" me that Euro-III has 5k discount so people buy Euro-III. and that there is no harm in buying a Euro-III Punto. It is infact Euro-IV compliant and officially used to be stamped as Euro-III. Now they have added "some pipe" and got Euro-IV stamp. Nothing has been changed in the Engine. Only exhaust was modified.
NO EURO IV PUNTO "EMOTION PACK" IS AVAILABLE IN CHANDIGARH.

Finally, I'm getting 14k discount on Euro-III from other dealer who is getting Euro-IV nd wants to let go of Euro-III quickly. Will do a PDI and check if the car is ok. If it's ok, i'll go ahead and buy a Euro-III Punto provided it is 2010 model.

What is the difference between Euro-IV vs Euro-III cars apart from lower emissions? Any "significant" changes with respect to FE, NVH, performance etc?

Last edited by PaddleShifter : 5th August 2010 at 22:53.
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Old 6th August 2010, 00:58   #2586
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Originally Posted by PaddleShifter View Post
What is the difference between Euro-IV vs Euro-III cars apart from lower emissions? Any "significant" changes with respect to FE, NVH, performance etc?
No differences as far as a recent test drive told me.
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Old 6th August 2010, 06:28   #2587
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Originally Posted by Stolichnaya View Post
Hang on here! Are you referring to getting a cable to create an AUX port on your music system? Please do let me know if you are able to do that!

I have an iPod which I am not able to use in the Punto, thanks to the built-in Balupunkt not having an AUX port.

I tried with an iTrip from Ebay, but it's not all that hot. Keeps making a burring sound.
Sorry for delay in replying, I hope you are reading this bcos there is good news.

Yeah I was referring to that cable. Yesterday i finally made a trip to the shop i referred in my previous posts (TMC Electronics, Jayanager East End Road) and got my baby a new gift. For 400/- bucks the Aux cable is totally Awesome. It just snaps in place on some pins behind the HU. No cable clipping, no jazz! And the outcome was much better than my expectations. The music sounds much better than Burnt MP3 CDs with the same tracks on stock Speakers. I have tried my Sony Walkman MP3 Player and Nokia N86 both worth seamlessly. The best surprise was when i left the shop listening to music, grinning from ear-to-ear and suddenly I hear the music slowly fading. My heart skipped a beat and then 'VIOLA' there was an incoming call. On pressing the call button i could hear the caller from all Speakers and with the phone in the lower-center console I could talk without shouting through the phones MIC.

Bought From:
TMC Electronics
#1594, East End Main Road,
Jayanagar 9th Block, Blore - 69.

Call Aftab on 9880440469 / 9663645692

P.S.: They modify this cable to suit the Punto and hence call ahead so that they can keep the cable ready for you.

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Originally Posted by Amartya View Post
No differences as far as a recent test drive told me.
@Amartya: I beg to differ a little. I test drove both the EIII and EIV 1.2 Punto and the EIII ones had a Sweeter Engine Note, whereas the EIV (including mine) makes that sound only around 3k rpm. This was also pointed out as one of the more Audible differences between the model by Concorde TASC Service Supervisor.
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Old 6th August 2010, 07:54   #2588
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@Amartya: I beg to differ a little. I test drove both the EIII and EIV 1.2 Punto and the EIII ones had a Sweeter Engine Note, whereas the EIV (including mine) makes that sound only around 3k rpm. This was also pointed out as one of the more Audible differences between the model by Concorde TASC Service Supervisor.
No problem, I actually test drove the 1.4 version and the 1.3 diesel (tested the 90Hp today ), and even the 1.4 had a mildly different engine note. I put it down to not being run in, but it offered very similar performance.

I assumed that the original question was about either the 1.4 or the 1.3MJd because the Emotion pack was not available with the 1.2 version.
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Old 7th August 2010, 11:13   #2589
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GTO sure has got a massive task up his sleeve, he needs to Test Drive the 90HP and exceed the expectations.
Waiting for the most detailed and comprehensive Test Drive.
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Old 7th August 2010, 15:18   #2590
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Is it possible to reduce the booming sound using some sound deadening materials? If yes, anybody to do the job reliably around Bangalore or Chennai?

I am usually a sedate driver, I drive around 90-100 kmph range, but it would be nice to have a quieter cabin during the occasional bursts of speed.
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Old 7th August 2010, 20:37   #2591
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Originally Posted by .anshuman View Post
The point is Swift is a faster car than Punto 90hp, 0-100 and in gear acceleration both included. The only saving grace for Punto FGT is linear power delivery with torque coming early and lesser turbo lag, but the 90hp suffers from more lag compared to FGT.

Swift 75hp 0-100:13.87secs, 20-80(3rd):11.96, 40-100(4th):14.72
Punto 75hp 0-100:17.84, 20-80(3rd):12.57, 40-100(4th):15.22
Punto 90hp 0-100:16.21, 20-80(3rd):13.97, 40-100(4th):14.72

Data:ACI

The Punto 90hp has similar power delivery as 75hp uptil 3000rpm, After 3000rpm the torque does not drop like 75hp making it deliver the 90hp power figure. Those who know the relation between Power and Torque will understand what i mean to say. The 75hp Punto has more linear power delivery with lesser turbo lag, hence its easier to drive in city.

Buy a Punto 90hp only if you intend to use the top end frequently. I have driven both 90hp Punto and Pete'd 75hp Punto, the Pete'd Punto 75 feels more peppy and is more fun to drive. Though i do not recommend fitting a tuning box, as it will lead your turbo to premature death due to excessive smoking. No matter what air-filter you use a car with tuning box smokes much more than the stock car.
I have been going through all the posts for quite some time.It is indeed intriguing that discussion about performance of Punto 90 BHP is somewhat superfluous as members rely on incomplete and non-comprehensive reports of auto magazines who have not done their home work properly! I have test driven 90 BHP Punto and find it to be as peppy as swift and better than Figo and Polo; save the first gear. I have test driven all these cars and plan to buy either Punto 90 BHP or Vento around Diwali.
The in-gear acceleration reports cited above is incomplete and hence liable to be rejected.The real issue is the time expended in each gear by driver of the car to reach the optimum speed (specified by the Car Manufacturer) in that gear so that the driver reaches the speed of 100-120 in the shortest possible time.( My esteemed fellow Bhpians would surely agree that this is the optimum speed range in Indian setting.) This break up of time as adverted above is lacking in all reports cited by esteemed Bhpians.
Another important reason why Fiat or Volkswagen cars are superior to others,assuming ceteris paribus, is their ability to negotiate pot holes, bad roads,speed breakers,etc with aplomb; besides their suspension, but not in the least,it is the engine guard( Thick steel plate used beneath chamber of engine to protect it from stones,potholes,etc) which does a fantastic job.Lack of engine guard makes Korean,Japanese cars such as honda cars (Civic and lower version) useless outside City . I'd like to be enlightened by fellow members about the efficient engine guard provided by cae manufacturers in various categories.
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Old 7th August 2010, 23:54   #2592
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I have been going through all the posts for quite some time.It is indeed intriguing that discussion about performance of Punto 90 BHP is somewhat superfluous as members rely on incomplete and non-comprehensive reports of auto magazines who have not done their home work properly! I have test driven 90 BHP Punto and find it to be as peppy as swift and better than Figo and Polo; save the first gear.

I have test driven all these cars and plan to buy either Punto 90 BHP or Vento around Diwali.

The in-gear acceleration reports cited above is incomplete and hence liable to be rejected.


The real issue is the time expended in each gear by driver of the car to reach the optimum speed (specified by the Car Manufacturer) in that gear so that the driver reaches the speed of 100-120 in the shortest possible time.( My esteemed fellow Bhpians would surely agree that this is the optimum speed range in Indian setting.)
This break up of time as adverted above is lacking in all reports cited by esteemed Bhpians.

Another important reason why Fiat or Volkswagen cars are superior to others,assuming ceteris paribus, is their ability to negotiate pot holes, bad roads,speed breakers,etc with aplomb; besides their suspension, but not in the least,it is the engine guard( Thick steel plate used beneath chamber of engine to protect it from stones,potholes,etc) which does a fantastic job.[/b]Lack of engine guard makes Korean,Japanese cars such as honda cars (Civic and lower version) useless outside City . I'd like to be enlightened by fellow members about the efficient engine guard provided by cae manufacturers in various categories.
1. The Acceleration Figures compared here are just for reference purpose only. Only the figures are used from the magazines, those are my personal views acquired through my driving experience with all the cars.

2.Even i have driven all the Diesel hatchbacks available in our country properly, and i have had a pleasure of own some of them too.

3.I have extensively driven diesels for lakhs of kms and i know what to expect from them.

4.Punto comes with a sump guard because it has a long nose that scrapes, other cars like Swift do not need it because of short front overhang so they don't scrape every now and then.

5.While Punto is very competent when it comes to in-gear acceleration, but let's accept the fact that Swift can do any of the roll on in lower time. Yes Punto with torque coming early and linear power delivery is easier to drive in traffic but on open roads any gear, any speed the Swift is faster. Try any of the tests(100-120, 120-140, 80-100) in any gear, you will be surprised.

Last edited by .anshuman : 7th August 2010 at 23:57.
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Old 8th August 2010, 00:39   #2593
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Off topic... I know, but I thought I'd share it with you guys!

While I was at the dealership the other day, I noticed a pamphlet kept for circulation, it seemed much like a magazine cover with the heading 'The Punto', Now this one page pamphlet had the shiny red punto on it with quotes from all over. It carried a quotes about the car, one each from top car magazines (starting with Top Gear, Zig wheels, AutoCar along with couple of others) and some where in between was a quote from the Team-bhp review of Punto with followed by the Team BHP signature at the bottom . I had wicked smile on my face and my first thought was .." Way to go Team BHP...we are definitely in the big league...aren't we ?! ". I had the sales person sitting right across when I noticed the same on the pamphalet and below is the conversation I had with him right after that.

Me : Dost, Is advertisement main baakee sab to famous car magazine ke quotes hain...ye team bhp to online forum hain! < wanted to have some fun here...see if he knows a thing or two!>

Salesperson : Yes sir, kafee famous forum hain...hum log sab track karte hain! <with a wide grin on his face>

Me : Nice..good..so they (team bhp) think the car is good ?!!

Salesperson : Haan sir, Punto ka to team bhp pe bahut shorr hain..itna kahin aur nahin hain. < by that he meant that...Punto is quite popular and discussed in detail on t-bhp in comparison to the other ones>

Me : Ahaa...I see! <...with a smile on my face, I left it at that!>

All in all, it felt good on both counts, first one being the fact that I along with the rest of us have personally contributed to the ' noise ' here on Team BHP and the other one being that FIAT considers team-bhp significant enough to be placed along with other noted & very popular automotive Subject Matter Experts in print media for promotion.

Last edited by better4worse : 8th August 2010 at 00:41.
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Old 8th August 2010, 07:16   #2594
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[quote=.anshuman;2016406]1.



4.Punto comes with a sump guard because it has a long nose that scrapes, other cars like Swift do not need it because of short front overhang so they don't scrape every now and then.

Though I broadly agree with your straight line 0-100,etc. accleration of swift, my point was/is that once the turbo kicks in, Punto 90 Bhp is one of the fast cars,if not fastest cars available in its category and beyond.
Regarding engine guard, pray explain why, even a humble Palio has it.Lack of engine guard, along with its brilliant suspension, makes Fiat cars very desirable in Indian setting ( because of our road conditions ). I suspect the Japanese and Koreans cars shy away from this either due to plain oversight or as a cost cutting measure.Lack of engine guard is one of the reasons why there are traffic jams in monsoon. I have seen and experienced other car owners negotiate pot holed and uneven surfaced roads after it has rained, at zero speed,while I 've gone through that very same bad patch in my Palio at about 40-50 KMH speed.What is the reason people are so careful, because they are not confident enough to traverse such roads at higher speed since they don't want their engine chamber to be damaged. Before December 2009 I too was a fan of Honda and other Japanese cars. While I was coming from Kishangarh to Jaipur on NH-8, my 2009 model Honda city car negotiated a six inch deep and one feet wide pot hole at about 100 KMH and boom goes my Honda engine's chamber.As a result of oil loss,the engine was damged. Since then, there has been a sea change of my opinion about Japenese/Korean cars as they are not realistically meant to be driven on all kind of roads in India. I have never faced this problem with my Palio and Jetta.
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Old 8th August 2010, 09:13   #2595
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Off topic... I know, but I thought I'd share it with you guys!
It ain't OT mate. At least I don't think it is.

Quote:
a quote from the Team-bhp review of Punto with followed by the Team BHP signature at the bottom . I had wicked smile on my face and my first thought was .." Way to go Team BHP...we are definitely in the big league...aren't we ?! ". I had the sales person sitting right across when I noticed the same on the pamphlet
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