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Old 4th August 2009, 14:25   #856
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From the drivability and overtaking point of view, I feel it is more important to take 20-80 and 40-100 timings into consideration than 0-100.

In real life, how many times would any of us be bother about 0-100 performance?

If you agree with this, then you may agree that GP/Ritz/Fiesta are all in the same league.

Only I wish that figures for acceleration at higher speeds (say 100-140) were also available for comparison to close this debate!
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Old 4th August 2009, 14:33   #857
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Originally Posted by JVH View Post
Sid's pictures bring in a breadth of fresh air amidst the hot debate on Punto's performance

Well, seriously guys even FIAT agrees that they tuned the engine to address F.E. Enthus will always crib about this but they do have one Mr. Pete, right?

Punto's USP is clearly not performance.
I really want to know exactly what difference Pete's box can make to Punto's engine.
Anyone?
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Old 4th August 2009, 14:37   #858
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Quote:
Originally Posted by harry10 View Post
I really want to know exactly what difference Pete's box can make to Punto's engine.
Anyone?
Swift's 75 BHP will increase to 90 BHP with a Pete. Engine being the same, I'm assuming it would do the same for Punto.

Guys-please confirm on the figures.
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Old 4th August 2009, 14:59   #859
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I really want to know exactly what difference Pete's box can make to Punto's engine. Anyone?
Quote:
Swift's 75 BHP will increase to 90 BHP with a Pete. Engine being the same, I'm assuming it would do the same for Punto.
Yeah the website says power will be up from 75 to 90bhp. Also, Torque is improved from 190 to 215Nm.

Punto has 197Nm of torque so we should be looking at 90bhp and 220Nm of torque for the Punto.

Last edited by amit : 4th August 2009 at 15:01.
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Old 4th August 2009, 15:47   #860
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Originally Posted by amit View Post
Yeah the website says power will be up from 75 to 90bhp. Also, Torque is improved from 190 to 215Nm.

Punto has 197Nm of torque so we should be looking at 90bhp and 220Nm of torque for the Punto.
Yes, Punto would be tuned to 90bhp and 220Nm (round figure?) with the pete's tuning box. I chose MJD over the FIRE not because i run 1500km or more a month but just the reason that diesel a better choice over the italian petrol (thanks GTO and others who helped me)

Even tho i felt the FIRE is peppier, i chose diesel just keeping the PETE's in mind. I will be soon going with pete's box for my new diesel but i heard it would be better if i fix it after some running.

So what would be the expected 0 -100 after installing pete? (I know 0 - 100 does not matter much in city but still i want to know the change)
Attached Files
File Type: pdf swift petes box.pdf (33.4 KB, 571 views)

Last edited by ~~VinZ~~ : 4th August 2009 at 15:51.
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Old 4th August 2009, 18:07   #861
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Originally Posted by tsk1979 View Post
The real question is not whether car A is 0.5 seconds faster than car B.
The real question is that "Is half a second difference" in acc and roll on times of any consequence worthy of discussion?
Unless you are buying your car specifically for drag races(in which case non of these three are the right candidates), the questions to be asked are.
Is the car drivable, comfortable, ergonomic and reliable? What are the periodic maintenance costs? How good is the safety, whats the ride quality.
Instead of real questions, people get totally hung up on race car timings and handling.
Trust me, even in a boat like the Safari or MUV like Innova etc., you will reach the limit of your co passengers patience much before you reach the limit of the vehicle.
A better handling car will help if you are participating in a track challenge, but as I can safely say that none of us will buy a punto diesel for rallying or track events, such mundane things like 0-100 etc., are totally irrelevant.
So unless the punto had a 50BHP engine and took 30 seconds to touch 100, 1-2 seconds here there will not make a difference.
And I am pretty sure, given a car capable of 12 second 0-100 time, most of us will take 14-15 seconds for the said sprint.

So 0-100 in 14 or 16 seconds is totally irrelevant, and what is more relevant is stuff like :
I drive on highway at 90-100 continuously, will the engine boom give me headache?
I drive on hills often, will I keep burning clutch on uphill hairpins due to lack of low end torque?
Will the car lose alignment every time I hit one of the billion potholes in my neighbourhood?

So " Can a 50kgs lighter car actually be that much faster" does not matter. Even if its 1 second faster, most of you will not feel it and won't be able to meet the "expert timings"

So those who think Punto/Logan etc., are sluggish, are right in their own way. A budget diesel hatch is not for them. The verna or getz crdi is the right choice Or a 100bhp petrol car.

To succeed in the 5L marked you need a jack of all trades
Brilliant Post!! From a typical Indian Customer's viewpoint & says it all (had to quote entire post-can't delete anything) !!

And still we keep on harping on 0-100 etc figures which are quoted different by different mags.
In fact, as an "average joe" (I hate this term used by many for typical Indian car Consumer, it sounds so demeaning), I asked a query based on some posts which got me confused.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ashwinpak View Post
__________0-100____20-80
---------------------------
Linea D____15.04s___11.86s
Punto D___ 17.84s___12.57s
Linea P____15.14s___14.04s
Punto P___ 16.58s___14.11s

Figures were taken from Autocar mag.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hiren.mistry View Post
Bought this months issue of Auto Bild yesterday and they have compared the i20 petrol (1.2), Punto (1.4) and Swift 1.3.

As per them the i20 is the fastest of the trio with a 0-100 time of 12.9 secs, followed by the Punto at 13.4 and Swift at 13.8 secs.

I will post the exact times once I reach home. Also the Punto has better in-gear acceleration times. What beats me though is the difference between Autocar India and Auto Bild. Are Auto Bild's drivers so much better than ACI or there is something that I am not able to comprehend?

Food for thought guys.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ashwinpak View Post
Auto Bild numbers make better sense. I checked Autocar again, and see that they have never done a test on the Punto 1.4, but have done on the 1.2. Interestingly in the table (in the back pages), 1.2 figures are missing while 1.4 figures are there. Now, the 1.2 figures in the test says that 0-100 takes 18 secs. Compare that with the 16.58 of the 1.4. There is something amiss here. I think 13.4 is a more realistic figure.

Coming to Overdrive, the tester also states that he did the tests in rain. He says that the rain has affected the figures (dunno how), and says that they will update the figures once they repeat the test in better conditions.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hiren.mistry View Post
I agree Auto Bilds figures are a lot more believable. Here are the accurate times for i20, Punto and Swift petrols.

Hyundai i20 1.2 Petrol Fiat Grande Punto 1.4 Petrol Suzuki Swift 1.3 petrol
0-100 kmph 12.9 secs 13.4 secs 13.8 secs
30-80 kmph in 3rd gear 11.3 secs 9.6 secs 12.6 secs
40-100 kmph in 4th gear 19.6 sec 17.0 secs 23.1 secs
Top speed 155 kmph 157 kmph 165 kmph
Hence, I asked below query:
Quote:
Originally Posted by VahanPujari View Post
Your experience raises another question - how far do we believe Auto Mags figures ?
And here is the reponse to my post :
Quote:
Originally Posted by diabloo View Post
If Punto with 17.x figures for 0-100 can have exhilarating experience, imagine those that do these figues in 13.x
Now, to me, which post makes more sense - this post or some of the other above posts? That's the beauty of this forum & I think I now know which one(s)

Last edited by VahanPujari : 4th August 2009 at 18:16.
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Old 4th August 2009, 18:10   #862
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Originally Posted by ~~VinZ~~ View Post
Yes, Punto would be tuned to 90bhp and 220Nm (round figure?) with the pete's tuning box. I chose MJD over the FIRE not because i run 1500km or more a month but just the reason that diesel a better choice over the italian petrol (thanks GTO and others who helped me)

Even tho i felt the FIRE is peppier, i chose diesel just keeping the PETE's in mind. I will be soon going with pete's box for my new diesel but i heard it would be better if i fix it after some running.

So what would be the expected 0 -100 after installing pete? (I know 0 - 100 does not matter much in city but still i want to know the change)
same here . i dont drive more than 400 kms a month but yet i went for the diesel for the torque and knowing that i can add petes in the future.!
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Old 4th August 2009, 18:22   #863
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You caught the wrong stick. The correct response to post is below.
Quote:
Originally Posted by VahanPujari View Post
Your experience raises another question - how far do we believe Auto Mags figures ?
Quote:
Originally Posted by diabloo View Post
I think the Auto Mags use some kind of timing device to measure 0-100 figures. Maybe you are not person who looks at these figures. But there is no need to mistrust the official figures.
Quote:
Originally Posted by VahanPujari View Post
And here is the reponse to my post
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Old 4th August 2009, 18:44   #864
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Quote:
Originally Posted by amit View Post
Yeah the website says power will be up from 75 to 90bhp. Also, Torque is improved from 190 to 215Nm.

Punto has 197Nm of torque so we should be looking at 90bhp and 220Nm of torque for the Punto.
As far as i understand till now by initial ownership reviews(and judging by my TD also) the prob area(if we can call it a prob initially) is the 1st and 2nd gear as from third on Punto is doing great.

So my Q is can Pete's box solve this issue as well?
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Old 4th August 2009, 21:33   #865
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Originally Posted by harry10 View Post
As far as i understand till now by initial ownership reviews(and judging by my TD also) the prob area(if we can call it a prob initially) is the 1st and 2nd gear as from third on Punto is doing great.

So my Q is can Pete's box solve this issue as well?
Hi Harry !!

How much would you pay for Pete's box ? Compare the price paid for Pete + Punto MJD Emotion Pack vis a vis price of i20 CRDi

If you are looking for power, I suggest you go for the i20. By adding Pete on a new car, you might also risk its warranty.

Needless to say, in the premium you pay for the i20, you also get disc brakes on all four wheels, 6 airbags and superior interiors.

Just my two pennies worth of advice.

btw : my Punto is now giving a mileage of close to 19 km/lit. So we can clearly see that Fiat has achieved what it had built the Punto for : Fuel Efficiency !!

Amogh
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Old 4th August 2009, 22:03   #866
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Originally Posted by amoghchaphalkar View Post
Hi Harry !!

How much would you pay for Pete's box ? Compare the price paid for Pete + Punto MJD Emotion Pack vis a vis price of i20 CRDi

If you are looking for power, I suggest you go for the i20. By adding Pete on a new car, you might also risk its warranty.

Needless to say, in the premium you pay for the i20, you also get disc brakes on all four wheels, 6 airbags and superior interiors.

Just my two pennies worth of advice.

btw : my Punto is now giving a mileage of close to 19 km/lit. So we can clearly see that Fiat has achieved what it had built the Punto for : Fuel Efficiency !!

Amogh
OT, but since the i20 was brought into the discussion, couldn't help commenting. i20 has a very light steering which needs fixing. Sadly this cannot be done off the factory. My quest for an automatic had me waiting for the i20 auto, but the light steering killed my enthusiasm.
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Old 4th August 2009, 22:28   #867
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Quote:
Originally Posted by amoghchaphalkar View Post
Hi Harry !!

How much would you pay for Pete's box ? Compare the price paid for Pete + Punto MJD Emotion Pack vis a vis price of i20 CRDi

If you are looking for power, I suggest you go for the i20. By adding Pete on a new car, you might also risk its warranty.

Needless to say, in the premium you pay for the i20, you also get disc brakes on all four wheels, 6 airbags and superior interiors.

Just my two pennies worth of advice.

btw : my Punto is now giving a mileage of close to 19 km/lit. So we can clearly see that Fiat has achieved what it had built the Punto for : Fuel Efficiency !!

Amogh
HI,
Pete's box is - 28k.
After doing Pete's i still save a good amount of money.
Roughly around 50-60k.

You do have a point though.
However points why i will still prefer punto-
1.- I LOVE the looks(i20 is good looking as well but it doesn't makes my heart jump up everytime i see it), i see a Blue Punto(color i will be buying) parked right in front of my gym everyday and its beautiful!
2.- I am not so sure of i20's mileage(i honestly feel it wont beat Punto).
3.- I loved the ride and handling of Punto in my td. Also the steering gave me a very good feel.
4.- We got a tata product with us so we know how to deal with them.

Just for info - Pete's box may void the warranty but all the people who install it take it out before servicing as it is a DIY job so..

P.S- I had not driven i20 crdi till date. Will do the TD though shortly.
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Old 4th August 2009, 23:00   #868
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Originally Posted by harry10 View Post
However points why i will still prefer punto-

Just for info - Pete's box may void the warranty but all the people who install it take it out before servicing as it is a DIY job so..

P.S- I had not driven i20 crdi till date. Will do the TD though shortly.
I guess your decision is almost done. I just did not want you to be disappointed after getting a Punto

Yeah .. and do test drive the i20 crdi.

Just a word of caution about Pete though : even if you Pete a new car, I guess it would be wise to not share that information publicly or on any of the TBHP forums. (for that matter any internet forum) You never know someone from Fiat might be reading it, and god forbid, if there is any problem with your new car, they might cancel the warranty (even if the problem has got nothing to with Pete)

Look forward to seeing your Electric Blue Punto MJD E+
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Old 4th August 2009, 23:16   #869
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Originally Posted by harry10 View Post
I really want to know exactly what difference Pete's box can make to Punto's engine.
Anyone?
It will definitely make the engine even noisier.
Hopefully, it should revive the dead 1st and 2nd gear.
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Old 5th August 2009, 00:22   #870
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the swift petes box on the punto will do harm. even speaking raw truth, the petes boxes which do rail pressure modulation will do harm on any vehicle.
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