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Old 11th August 2010, 02:18   #1891
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Originally Posted by Thad E Ginathom View Post
I never actually saw one, and I don't know if it has continued, but there was a trend towards giving only an "emergency" tyre as a spare. I suppose it saves costs, it certainly saves space.
You recall correctly TEG and the trend still continues.

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Originally Posted by fuel_addict View Post
I hope VW will recall all the 1.6 Polos (assuming that they all sell with the 175/R14 spare tyre) and replace the spare tyre & wheel with the 15" alloys, 185 spec tyre. Cost cutting is understood but to have different spec wheel/tyre as a spare is . What does German Engineering have to say about this?

I remember when I bought my Swift ZXi 4 years ago, the spare wheel was a steel rim with thinner rubber. Sense prevailed with MUL and they later recalled all ZXi owners and provided the alloy/wider rubber tyre as the spare.
German engineering approves of it and that is why they put it out there. It is an accepted practice in car markets around the world. My brother in law's Nissan Maxima (2006 model) has a spare tyre that looks like it belongs on a motorcycle. It actually has the multi spoke design that one sees on cycles here. My sister's Honda Van (2008 or is it 2009 model) does not have a spare at all, it is shod with run flats. This in the US, a market which would not accept it if there was something wrong with the concept.

If Maruti had prevailed with the thinner tire both you and I could have used the liberated space in our Zxis to carry that extra bag which now invariably ends up dislodging the rear parcel tray.
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Old 11th August 2010, 06:01   #1892
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Originally Posted by khoj View Post
German engineering approves of it and that is why they put it out there. It is an accepted practice in car markets around the world. My brother in law's Nissan Maxima (2006 model) has a spare tyre that looks like it belongs on a motorcycle. It actually has the multi spoke design that one sees on cycles here. My sister's Honda Van (2008 or is it 2009 model) does not have a spare at all, it is shod with run flats. This in the US, a market which would not accept it if there was something wrong with the concept.

If Maruti had prevailed with the thinner tire both you and I could have used the liberated space in our Zxis to carry that extra bag which now invariably ends up dislodging the rear parcel tray.
It isn't worth a tuppence whether German engineering approves or the American market approves of the "space savers". Conditions on Indian roads are much much different that whole prevalent in the west (include Europe).

Chances of a puncture are much higher here and with it comes the need to travel greater distances for a puncture repair. Very few people use puncture repair kits or have a pump to re-inflate or repair a tire. Somethings have to be market specific, a full spare tire is something that the Indian market requires as of now.

OT: Usually these space saver tires have a manufacturer recommended top-speed of less than 50miles/h
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Old 11th August 2010, 09:30   #1893
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Originally Posted by fuel_addict View Post
I remember when I bought my Swift ZXi 4 years ago, the spare wheel was a steel rim with thinner rubber. Sense prevailed with MUL and they later recalled all ZXi owners and provided the alloy/wider rubber tyre as the spare.
I'm curious, how many times have you _required_ to use it? Most of the times when I had a puncture, the tubeless tyre was losing air so slowly, I could have just filled in air and taken it to the tyre shop for fixing (where they don't even take the tyre off the rim to fix it). Only once in 35k km did I have a real flat, and I could have definitely used a thinner tyre until I fixed it then.
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Old 11th August 2010, 10:18   #1894
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Amartya View Post
It isn't worth a tuppence whether German engineering approves or the American market approves of the "space savers". Conditions on Indian roads are much much different that whole prevalent in the west (include Europe).

Chances of a puncture are much higher here and with it comes the need to travel greater distances for a puncture repair. Very few people use puncture repair kits or have a pump to re-inflate or repair a tire. Somethings have to be market specific, a full spare tire is something that the Indian market requires as of now.

OT: Usually these space saver tires have a manufacturer recommended top-speed of less than 50miles/h

Chances of puncture are not higher here or lower there. In-fact given the number of vehicles actually on road and the frequency of usage the probability of having a puncture are much higher in the more mature markets. chances of puncture increase only when one does not look after their tires prior to, during and after the drive.

I have been driving on highways and not just between metros but to some completely off the map places for nearly 20 years now. In these 20 years I can literally count on the tips of my fingers the times that I had a puncture. When I started intercity driving the puncture repair shops were there at every fuel pump/dhaba which were fewer in numbers and thereby further away from each other. These days with an increase in the number of fuel pumps on the highways and also the advent of stand alone road side dhabas the number of puncture repair shops has increased and thereby the distance one has to cover before finding one has actually decreased.

By the way if German Engineering's approval and the American market's acceptance were of no consequence the subject of this thread and our interlude therein themselves would not exist.

You are correct though about the speed restriction of 50 miles per hour recommended with the space saver tires. This actually turns out to be approximately 75 Kilometers per hour which is still higher than the average speed that one can maintain on the highways here.

EDIT

@fordperfect Since installing my first tubeless on my '96 Zen around 8 years ago and add to that three more cars bought since then that came with tubeless tires as OE I have had a grand total of 3 punctures to date between the 4 cars. On the remaining two cars that are in daily use In fact on none of the occasions did I have a complete flat. Two were discovered to have more flex in the sidewall than usual on inspection during the periodic breaks that I take when I am out on the highway and the third one I discovered only the next morning since at parking time the sidewall did not show any visible decrease in height. This would be cumulative driving of more than 100,000 kilometers since 2002 between the 4 cars but a major share being in the Zen which surprisingly now on its second set of tubeless tires is yet to have a puncture 'touchwood'.

Last edited by khoj : 11th August 2010 at 10:36.
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Old 11th August 2010, 10:18   #1895
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Hey guys, I got my POLO finally. I was able to install after market HU with antennae coupler connected. They are available in market.

Got POLO rubber mat: Rs. 750.00
Installed Pioneer DEH4290 : Rs. 7700.00
Front 6inch. Rockford 3-way: Rs. 3000.00
Rear 6inch. Hertz 2-way: Rs. 2800.00

From Showroom: I got mud flaps Rs. 800.00 and door sills. thats all.

Sorry for the pics guys. Will shortly come up with pics, got busy these days.
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Old 11th August 2010, 10:51   #1896
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Originally Posted by fordperfect View Post
I'm curious, how many times have you _required_ to use it? Most of the times when I had a puncture, the tubeless tyre was losing air so slowly, I could have just filled in air and taken it to the tyre shop for fixing (where they don't even take the tyre off the rim to fix it). Only once in 35k km did I have a real flat, and I could have definitely used a thinner tyre until I fixed it then.
Your point is valid if you are drive within the city. If the tyre were to go flat overnight in lets say a remote place, the spare tyre would be handy. Well, as it stands today, one of my tyres developed a multiple puncture and could not be fixed (the tyre would leak air even after using 2-3 insertions of the repair gel). Had to fit a tube in that tyre and is now the spare. This happened barely after 21K km. So the original spare tyre is actually one of the tyres that I am running on.

My point is if Maruti can do it, why not VW? VW is known for its quality levels; this might be a trivial issue but again this is where the "safety" aspect is neglected for the Indian market. I'm both shocked and amazed that such things are common in the US. All I can say is that is not an example worth following. There is no comparison anyways between the roads here and the ones in the US.
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Old 11th August 2010, 10:52   #1897
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Originally Posted by Subaro123 View Post
Hey guys, I got my POLO finally. I was able to install after market HU with antennae coupler connected. They are available in market.

Got POLO rubber mat: Rs. 750.00
Installed Pioneer DEH4290 : Rs. 7700.00
Front 6inch. Rockford 3-way: Rs. 3000.00
Rear 6inch. Hertz 2-way: Rs. 2800.00

From Showroom: I got mud flaps Rs. 800.00 and door sills. thats all.

Sorry for the pics guys. Will shortly come up with pics, got busy these days.
Congrats Subaro123!

Glad it all worked out for you even after you had to cancel your initial booking.

Did you get the Pioneer installed from the dealer? Any idea about hopw it would affect warranty?

Look forward to the pics.
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Old 11th August 2010, 10:53   #1898
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fordperfect View Post
I'm curious, how many times have you _required_ to use it? Most of the times when I had a puncture, the tubeless tyre was losing air so slowly, I could have just filled in air and taken it to the tyre shop for fixing (where they don't even take the tyre off the rim to fix it). Only once in 35k km did I have a real flat, and I could have definitely used a thinner tyre until I fixed it then.
Quote:
Originally Posted by khoj View Post
Chances of puncture are not higher here or lower there. In-fact given the number of vehicles actually on road and the frequency of usage the probability of having a puncture are much higher in the more mature markets. chances of puncture increase only when one does not look after their tires prior to, during and after the drive.

I have been driving on highways and not just between metros but to some completely off the map places for nearly 20 years now. In these 20 years I can literally count on the tips of my fingers the times that I had a puncture. When I started intercity driving the puncture repair shops were there at every fuel pump/dhaba which were fewer in numbers and thereby further away from each other. These days with an increase in the number of fuel pumps on the highways and also the advent of stand alone road side dhabas the number of puncture repair shops has increased and thereby the distance one has to cover before finding one has actually decreased.

By the way if German Engineering's approval and the American market's acceptance were of no consequence the subject of this thread and our interlude therein themselves would not exist.

You are correct though about the speed restriction of 50 miles per hour recommended with the space saver tires. This actually turns out to be approximately 75 Kilometers per hour which is still higher than the average speed that one can maintain on the highways here.

EDIT

@fordperfect Since installing my first tubeless on my '96 Zen around 8 years ago and add to that three more cars bought since then that came with tubeless tires as OE I have had a grand total of 3 punctures to date between the 4 cars. On the remaining two cars that are in daily use In fact on none of the occasions did I have a complete flat. Two were discovered to have more flex in the sidewall than usual on inspection during the periodic breaks that I take when I am out on the highway and the third one I discovered only the next morning since at parking time the sidewall did not show any visible decrease in height. This would be cumulative driving of more than 100,000 kilometers since 2002 between the 4 cars but a major share being in the Zen which surprisingly now on its second set of tubeless tires is yet to have a puncture 'touchwood'.
Absolutely right on all points, except we are used to having all tyres of the same size, as far as punctures go between my 3 vehicles till date (scooter, hatch and SUV) I have had 2 punctures in the last 12 yrs or so.
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Old 11th August 2010, 11:38   #1899
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Quote:
Originally Posted by khoj View Post
Chances of puncture are not higher here or lower there. In-fact given the number of vehicles actually on road and the frequency of usage the probability of having a puncture are much higher in the more mature markets. chances of puncture increase only when one does not look after their tires prior to, during and after the drive.
Appreciate your sharing this point of view. On the face of it, it seems quite logical, however I am still not convinced (maybe I am the reason why this hasn't taken off in India as yet).

It seems to me that road conditions have to have a bearing on tire wear and tear. In that respect, the worse the roads, the greater the chance of a puncture (not talking about a nail only, even sharp pebbles/rocks can cause a tear). So, in terms of total number of punctures, the west would have a larger number, but somehow, puncture per vehicle (over a certain number of kms) shouldn't follow such logic, and should be higher here.

Looking after the tires is something I have done, but not this religiously (I think you meant removing pebbles stuck between the treads, keeping track of tire wear etc.).

Anyway, apologies for taking the thread off-topic.

Last edited by Amartya : 11th August 2010 at 11:39.
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Old 11th August 2010, 19:45   #1900
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Originally Posted by Subaro123 View Post
Hey guys, I got my POLO finally. I was able to install after market HU with antennae coupler connected. They are available in market.

Got POLO rubber mat: Rs. 750.00
Installed Pioneer DEH4290 : Rs. 7700.00
Front 6inch. Rockford 3-way: Rs. 3000.00
Rear 6inch. Hertz 2-way: Rs. 2800.00
days.
Congrats Subaro123. I'm curious: was the ICE install entirely splice-free? I understand the Polo requires a specific type of connector for the antenna. VW seems to be a bit anal about warranty, so I wanted to know if the average install bloke will be able to fix things cleanly.

Tushar
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Old 11th August 2010, 22:28   #1901
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Amartya View Post
Looking after the tires is something I have done, but not this religiously (I think you meant removing pebbles stuck between the treads, keeping track of tire wear etc.).
You got me there.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Amartya View Post
Anyway, apologies for taking the thread off-topic.
Since we are all in it together, allow me to add my apologies too and leave it to the mods but then I am sure they appreciate that going OT is like 'tadka' in the 'dal'. That is where the actual taste (fun) is and lots of times OTs are an invaluable source of information.

@ Subaro 123
Congratulations on the new acquisition Subaro, we look forward to viewing the snaps as and when you post them.

Last edited by khoj : 11th August 2010 at 22:32.
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Old 12th August 2010, 00:56   #1902
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Thanks Tushar, The connector for antennae are available in the market and I was able to get it connected from them. So, coupler connectivity remains intact. Infact the guy from accessories shop said he only has these couplers and he has already install around 10-12 POLOs in Delhi. I was there during installation and coupler wiring was not cut.

@now what : Thanks, I got most of the accessories from outside including HU.

@Khoj, Thanks man.
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Old 12th August 2010, 16:12   #1903
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Originally Posted by Subaro123 View Post
Thanks Tushar, The connector for antennae are available in the market and I was able to get it connected from them. So, coupler connectivity remains intact. Infact the guy from accessories shop said he only has these couplers and he has already install around 10-12 POLOs in Delhi. I was there during installation and coupler wiring was not cut.
Could you please give the address of this lone accessory shop? I might need to visit him some time.
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Old 12th August 2010, 17:02   #1904
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I also got my music system installed outside the dealership. Connectors are available in Chennai. I got this done almost 2 months ago.
Transferred by Blaupunkt system with Bluetooth from my old car to the Polo. Works perfectly and the installer assured me that no cutting of wires was requried.
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Old 12th August 2010, 20:45   #1905
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Does the entire door need to be disassembled from the inside for speaker installation? Are there couplers on the speaker-side of the wiring harness as well? I'm paranoid about installation boys descending on the car like a pack of wolves to tear things apart.

Also: has anyone noticed that the "night mode" of the RVM requires you to re-adjust the angle of view? This is not how it's supposed to be. You switch to anti-glare mode and the view should remain the same. Apparently, all new Polos are like this (I checked one other car in the workshop). This effectively makes the RVM useless at night.

Tushar
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