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Old 4th May 2010, 07:09   #1126
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Originally Posted by Chethan B G View Post
This Diesel is definitely not the best in the market. I have driven i20 and Punto MJD. i20 is superb, Punto MJD is also very good. With VJT being added to Punto sports, it can beat i20. But as we all know, only an Engine does not make the car! Polo as a complete car is Superb. Have no doubt about it.
Definately, the Polo as a complete car is much better. If a company makes only better engines, the best they can do is to source it to suzuki.

Secondly, Suzuki neither makes best petrol engines nor does it make best diesel, but are still the best sellers, atleast in an emerging country as big as India.

If its only the engine, I say nothing beats Fiats MJD in diesel territory and nothing beats Honda in petrol territory, atleast in this segment.

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I doubt, unless they change gear at the earliest. This is one of the worst launches I have witnessed. They have not planned it well. Add to that the inexperience of there dealers in handling numbers, it can be a mess.
As I said in my initial ownership report, the dealerships still dont know how to sell a common man's car.


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The only bad point about the Polo I found was the 3 cylinder harsh engine at that price point (TD Petrol). The engine need not have 4 cylinders but it needs to be as smooth as the rest of the car is.
The engine no doubt is a little harsh compared to the 4 cylinder but that certainly will go with a few thousand kms on the clock.

The engine of my friend's fabia became much smoother after 7-8k kms on the clock (all NVH). It was even better after the 15k service. So, I wont mind running it 7-8k kms before I get the best of this 3 pod (in terms of NVH). It will any ways take 3 months for us to do 7-8k kms, already done 1100kms.

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Old 4th May 2010, 07:21   #1127
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The only bad point about the Polo I found was the 3 cylinder harsh engine at that price point (TD Petrol). The engine need not have 4 cylinders but it needs to be as smooth as the rest of the car is.

The next itch would be the headlamp. Why can't it just have the same one from the European model. Hoping that changes with the 1.6.

It is the harshness of the engine which puts off, not to mention the diesel car like shiver when we crank the engine up. but on the plus side the car performs substantially better than it sounds and rides and handles well.

Im sure that the smoked headlamps would not have gone down well with all of us. Elantra and Baleno are examples when the company had to change in the smoked headlamps to clear ones to pick the sales up. also another reason could be that these ones are cheaper...VW surely didnt wanna give us headlamps that cost a bomb to replace.
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Old 4th May 2010, 08:32   #1128
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It is the harshness of the engine which puts off, not to mention the diesel car like shiver when we crank the engine up. but on the plus side the car performs substantially better than it sounds and rides and handles well.
What do we look for in any Engine - Well distributed Power, Drivibility, Quality which ensures longevity, FE.

NVH comes last. But some times we relate Low NVH to good Engines. So we tend to get bogged down and misinterpret. With VW, we can be sure it is a good Engine - with some extra noise and vibrations. Reputation counts!

Engine power is again very subjective. I drive a Spark with 1000CC Engine. So I will not feel any lag in VW Polo car's Drivibility. But a person driving a higher capacity Engined car (more then 1200CC) can feel a tad let down. But when we compare an Apple with an Apple - it will not make a difference.
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Old 4th May 2010, 08:49   #1129
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Originally Posted by Chethan B G View Post
What do we look for in any Engine - Well distributed Power, Drivibility, Quality which ensures longevity, FE.

NVH comes last. But some times we relate Low NVH to good Engines. So we tend to get bogged down and misinterpret. With VW, we can be sure it is a good Engine - with some extra noise and vibrations. Reputation counts!

Engine power is again very subjective. I drive a Spark with 1000CC Engine. So I will not feel any lag in VW Polo car's Drivibility. But a person driving a higher capacity Engined car (more then 1200CC) can feel a tad let down. But when we compare an Apple with an Apple - it will not make a difference.
As much as I love the Polo, I think you are being a bit biased towards it.

Harshness and a coarse engine note can be a huge letdown to an enthusiast. A car that doesn't sound rhythmic at high revs (or even at low revs) is just not fun to drive at times.

The Polo's note is a mix of coarse and racy.

Please, by all means compare it with the K12M, it is an equivalent engine which is leagues ahead of the competition.
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Old 4th May 2010, 09:39   #1130
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As much as I love the Polo, I think you are being a bit biased towards it.

Harshness and a coarse engine note can be a huge letdown to an enthusiast. A car that doesn't sound rhythmic at high revs (or even at low revs) is just not fun to drive at times.

The Polo's note is a mix of coarse and racy.

Please, by all means compare it with the K12M, it is an equivalent engine which is leagues ahead of the competition.
K12M's are fitted on lighter cars. So can feel better. I did not say that a VW engine is the best. But it serves the purpose. So, we can not say it is bad either.

Enthusiast's liking is a different story. I am a common man. True - course engine note was a let down. But it does not look like a deal breaker.

I have always been a Fiat fan like most Indians. If I had money in 2003, I would have loved to buy a Uno. It was my dream to have it. But today, things have changed. Tie-up with TATA does not help. Today, expected quality standards have also increased. Fiat has a lot to catch up. If VW being a European company, can do it - Why not Fiat?
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Old 4th May 2010, 10:16   #1131
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VW Polo TV commercials - check them out!

I have mixed feelings about them.







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Old 4th May 2010, 10:43   #1132
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Today, expected quality standards have also increased. Fiat has a lot to catch up. If VW being a European company, can do it - Why not Fiat?
Blanket statements like these add absolutely NO value to the forum. And I am surprised the 1.3 MJD engine made by a manufacturer who does not care about quality is at the "heart" of so many cars in India !!

I fail to understand why are other manufacturers and engines being dragged here in this thread ? This is a thread about "Polo" so let's just stick to the topic !!

What Fiat needs to do is Fiat's business
How will K12M perform in heavier cars is Maruti's business

What have these issues got to do with a Polo test drive and review thread ?
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Old 4th May 2010, 10:45   #1133
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Originally Posted by Chethan B G View Post
K12M's are fitted on lighter cars. So can feel better. I did not say that a VW engine is the best. But it serves the purpose. So, we can not say it is bad either.

Enthusiast's liking is a different story. I am a common man. True - course engine note was a let down. But it does not look like a deal breaker.

I have always been a Fiat fan like most Indians. If I had money in 2003, I would have loved to buy a Uno. It was my dream to have it. But today, things have changed. Tie-up with TATA does not help. Today, expected quality standards have also increased. Fiat has a lot to catch up. If VW being a European company, can do it - Why not Fiat?
Its understandable that you have booked a VW Polo, but the bias is apparently visible towards your car of choice in all your posts long before you have even taken its delivery and lived with it for sometime. Fiat Punto is very much a present day car with all aspects of modern technology well covered and also the company is launching its famed 1.4 t-jet engine here in India as compared to outdated VW engines which is present at the moment along with the proposed 1.6 in future. Apart from the interior trim in Punto, there is no other quality problems reported in this forum, which again is improving constantly and that doesn't make a car bad overall. Only real area of concern for Fiat is after sales, but so is it to VW sister concern Skoda and VW is unproven in this aspect. Do note however that I mentioned Fiat only as an example to state my point that however wonderful a car Polo is, it is not perfect and engine is a big let down, more so than a mere interior trim. In the segment, the best car to me overall is Punto 1.4, which for some reason doesn't feature in any comparison reports in the magazines too where the dull 1.2 features everywhere. For the looks and interior trim, its Polo all the way, I like it better than Punto and this is about Petrol cars, not the diesel that you have booked. When VW decides to launch its turbo charged 1.2 petrol engine, then lets talk about the Polo being an all season car. Till then, its yet another car in its segment.
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Old 4th May 2010, 10:51   #1134
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Blanket statements like these add absolutely NO value to the forum. And I am surprised the 1.3 MJD engine made by a manufacturer who does not care about quality is at the "heart" of so many cars in India !!

I fail to understand why are other manufacturers and engines being dragged here in this thread ? This is a thread about "Polo" so let's just stick to the topic !!

What Fiat needs to do is Fiat's business
How will K12M perform in heavier cars is Maruti's business

What have these issues got to do with a Polo test drive and review thread ?
Absolutely agree with you, it going off-topic far too much. Also, the market will decide in the long run which is a better car, or engine in the segment but coming to Polo, the specifications and drive of Polo engine didn't impress me, though otherwise its a wonderful car. However, to me engine and drive is the most important feature of a car, everything else come next.
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Old 4th May 2010, 10:58   #1135
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Originally Posted by Zero Cool View Post
It is the harshness of the engine which puts off, not to mention the diesel car like shiver when we crank the engine up. but on the plus side the car performs substantially better than it sounds and rides and handles well.

Im sure that the smoked headlamps would not have gone down well with all of us. Elantra and Baleno are examples when the company had to change in the smoked headlamps to clear ones to pick the sales up. also another reason could be that these ones are cheaper...VW surely didnt wanna give us headlamps that cost a bomb to replace.
Some options to get them in the top end version would have helped. Just like it is with Fabia and the Projector Lamps.

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Originally Posted by Chethan B G View Post
What do we look for in any Engine - Well distributed Power, Drivibility, Quality which ensures longevity, FE.

NVH comes last. But some times we relate Low NVH to good Engines. So we tend to get bogged down and misinterpret. With VW, we can be sure it is a good Engine - with some extra noise and vibrations. Reputation counts!
You are right to a certain extent @Chetan, I drive a 1.6 Duratec and by no means the NVH on the Fusion is anywhere near desirable. But one can live with it because the rest of the car is also built like a truck.

Polo on the other hand is not built or feels like that. It's more gentle to be inside and if you look at the controls, the steering, the seats, they all exude quality, and then you turn the engine on and the dream is over. In a car like Polo, NVH has to come first.
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Old 4th May 2010, 11:16   #1136
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Its understandable that you have booked a VW Polo, but the bias is apparently visible towards your car of choice in all your posts long before you have even taken its delivery and lived with it for sometime. Fiat Punto is very much a present day car with all aspects of modern technology well covered and also the company is launching its famed 1.4 t-jet engine here in India as compared to outdated VW engines which is present at the moment along with the proposed 1.6 in future. Apart from the interior trim in Punto, there is no other quality problems reported in this forum, which again is improving constantly and that doesn't make a car bad overall. Only real area of concern for Fiat is after sales, but so is it to VW sister concern Skoda and VW is unproven in this aspect. Do note however that I mentioned Fiat only as an example to state my point that however wonderful a car Polo is, it is not perfect and engine is a big let down, more so than a mere interior trim. In the segment, the best car to me overall is Punto 1.4, which for some reason doesn't feature in any comparison reports in the magazines too where the dull 1.2 features everywhere. For the looks and interior trim, its Polo all the way, I like it better than Punto and this is about Petrol cars, not the diesel that you have booked. When VW decides to launch its turbo charged 1.2 petrol engine, then lets talk about the Polo being an all season car. Till then, its yet another car in its segment.


I have booked a polo too But please don"t take my opinions as biased. Fiat Punto is a good car too but the engine is a let down don't you think. If Fiat makes the best diesel engines, I am surprised why they did not make the engine in their car the best. The swift diesel has a more responsive engine compared to the Punto why ??

And the 1.2 diesel engine in the polo is an all new engine engine and not an outdated one. Regarding the petrol 1.2 yes its and old one but the 1.6 may also be new due Bharat IV.

I am not saying the polo engine is perfect but its not a letdown either. I haven't driven the diesel yet so no comments on that.
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Old 4th May 2010, 12:24   #1137
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But as we all know, only an Engine does not make the car! Polo as a complete car is Superb. Have no doubt about it.
I love European cars . Europeans being famous for their diesels I would expect their diesels to at least have refinement and performance neck to neck with rest of the world if not exceed. Polo being such a good car overall deserves a better spec. diesel engine.

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K12M's are fitted on lighter cars. So can feel better. I did not say that a VW engine is the best. But it serves the purpose. So, we can not say it is bad either.
Swift Petrol ZXi Kerb Weight = 1,010 Kg
Polo Petrol TL Kerb Weight = 1,020 Kg

Drive Swift ZXi with a co-passenger/luggage = 60 Kg. Then drive Polo with a co-passenger/luggage = 50Kg to make it weight exactly same. Let us know what you have to say.
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Old 4th May 2010, 14:10   #1138
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I have booked a polo too But please don"t take my opinions as biased. Fiat Punto is a good car too but the engine is a let down don't you think. If Fiat makes the best diesel engines, I am surprised why they did not make the engine in their car the best. The swift diesel has a more responsive engine compared to the Punto why ??

And the 1.2 diesel engine in the polo is an all new engine engine and not an outdated one. Regarding the petrol 1.2 yes its and old one but the 1.6 may also be new due Bharat IV.

I am not saying the polo engine is perfect but its not a letdown either. I haven't driven the diesel yet so no comments on that.
@liner4u, let me re-iterate, Punto is by no means the best car available. Its the sum of parts based on user requirement which makes a car desirable to their target customers, during which time, emotions are best set aside. I stated Punto as an example only due to constant low quality rantings. Each have their strengths and weaknesses, only point I stressed on was its better to have a relaxed, comparatively refined 1.4 petrol and a lot more goodies and features over a diesel sounding 1.2 3 pot petrol with good looking interiors but not much kit at the same price-point. Definitely, to me Punto engine is a disappointment when compared to my existing car, Palio 1.6.

Agreed 1.2 diesel is a current engine, but like you, none have driven it yet. Hopefully it turns out to be good, but specification wise, its still a 3 pot engine, hence refinement may not be its forte, which could be merely speculation from my side, hence didn't mention it in my previous post.

Coming to the proposed 1.6 engine, I too would love it to perform well, but the reason for current trend with small capacity petrol engines with turbo-charger is to offer performance with fuel efficiency along with compliance to emission norms. Having owned a so called performance based 1.6, I do know how fuel efficiency takes a big hit when driven enthusiastically due to which it may face the same fate as Palio 1.6 which is low sales due to being fuel guzzler. Its also not any new engine, its the same as in Jetta with certain improvements to meet Bharat IV norms like you mentioned.

What I would like to see in Polo is the 1.2 TSI engine, which ticks most boxes for the car even if offered with the same equipment list as of now.
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Old 4th May 2010, 14:14   #1139
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I have booked a polo too But please don"t take my opinions as biased. Fiat Punto is a good car too but the engine is a let down don't you think. If Fiat makes the best diesel engines, I am surprised why they did not make the engine in their car the best. The swift diesel has a more responsive engine compared to the Punto why ??
You clearly need to do a lot of reading about the 1.3 MJD !!

Have you searched the forums ?

Have you read about the weight difference between the Punto & the Swift ? (Power to weight ratio ?)

Have you read about how the ECU's are tuned differently in the Punto & the Swift ?

It's easier to say : Oh !! Car A & Car B have same engines therefore their performance should be exactly the same.

You say the Swift Diesel is more "responsive" than the Punto Diesel : I agree. But you would be surprised to know : the Swift Petrol is also more "responsive" than the Ritz Petrol. And guess what do they have in common : the Engine !!
And who makes it ? Maruti Suzuki themselves !!

Again : such topics / issues / debates are endless and highly subjective. So let's not go off topic here and start comparing manufacturers.

This is a Volkswagen Polo test drive & review thread !!
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Old 4th May 2010, 14:21   #1140
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Sorry for the re-post again, couldn't edit due to newbie status.

It actually doesn't matter if the engine is entirely new or not as long as it performs well. There is a very interesting thread by @smartcat here which clearly shows where Polo 1.2 petrol engine stands among its competitors. Hope that clarifies my stand about its performance and efficiency. Make no mistake, Polo is a terrific package let down only in the engine department at present.
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