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Old 31st May 2010, 17:51   #16
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1) Excellent Review! The TBHP reviews are now treats for TBHPians, and photographs are excellent.

2) This 5 series look too much like 7 series.

3) The front chin of bumper, though not as much as Audi, is likely to take a few hits. Its too low and protruding.

4) Rear seat space could be a bit more considering the size of the car.

5) The relatively low rear headroom is not a good thing for a car of this cost and size as the target customers might be chauffeur driven.

6) Just as TSK1979 mentioned in Cruze test drive and review thread, is it possible for someone to get in and drive off if the keyfob is near the car ?
Mainly, what is exact range of keyfob ?


Quote:
Originally Posted by GTO View Post

• Turning circle = 11.95 meters.
7) Can we add diameter in the above post ?
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Old 31st May 2010, 18:00   #17
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Feels good to see such nice quality cars in India now. Till the last 3-4 years all we had was that Merc E class (which took full advantage of being the only car in that category by being unreliable and much less classy at that price).

The new E class has really upped the game and BMW were spot on with their launch of the F10.
Tough competition between the two is really helping

Back to the Review, fantastic work by GTO once again! Great write up and pictures, and great attention to detail.

Keep it up!
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Old 31st May 2010, 18:22   #18
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Amazing review GTO!!

I still prefer the E60's styling to the F10. Also the fact that the new one has electric steering instead of the pure nirvana hydraulic unit in the E60.
Although, I think the new one is better in everything else. Better interiors, more tech, better ride and performance with good fuel efficiency. This 5-series is what most Indian buyers were waiting for. I believe it's gonna sell like hot cakes in the first few months. And the price tag is also much lower than the E-class, which makes the 5 a better buy.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sidindica View Post
I think that it is for brake energy regeneration. One odd observation: In GTO's car, the blue meter is on the right side whereas on my pic of 535i, it is on the left side..any differences perhaps?
May be the 535i you saw is an import. While GTO's 525d is the 'Made in India' one.
Will the 535i be also locally assembled?
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Old 31st May 2010, 18:43   #19
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Interiors:

- CD changer flips down from inside the glove box, Neat! The e60 has it tucked all the way back inside which makes it hard to reach.
- DVD changer! The e60 came with a single DVD slot that too only in initial batches like mine.
-Instrument cluster has way too many buttons! I defiantly didn't feel at home. It could possibly figure out how to change the blower speed while driving as I was lost in the buttons! The e60 has a much more simple layout, AC blower is a single knob in the center.
-Sun shade at the back feels flimsy and short on width
-Interior quality,touch,feel as always was top notch
-iDrive is a big step up. E60 owners would need sometime to get used to this change.
-Headroom is significantly lowered ! Thanks to the coupe like styling
-Sunroof is bigger than the E60 and the shade's sliding is automatic too, Neat!
- Drive height is lower, the e60 sits higher. Not sure if ground clearance is lowered?
- Legroom seems slightly shorter but its compensated with a bit more angled rear backrest.
-Ambient lighting, Neat !
-Transmission tunnel has gone wider
-center arm-rest is smaller. The e60 has the full size arm-rest like the 7 series

Exteriors:

- Being a bangle fan, I prefer the design of the E60 to the F10. Reasons being, the F10 isn't as aggressive or modern
looking. It might have the LED treatment, and white chrono rings that addthe "modern touch". But overall design is much more understated and
timeless...which is not what appeals to me.

- Although todays 40 lakh buyer isn't exactly my age group, hence they would prefer this timeless design over the more aggressive Bangled one.

- Loved the white chrono-rings!.

-Liked the coupe-like roofline, but on thedownside, it affects the headroom.

- I also like the LED treatment behind the door handles, and also the well-rounded feel and shape (of the door handles).

- There are a few touches that should have been avoided. The orange turn signals at the back should have been clear-lamp instead (like the E60).

- Wheel rims matched the car perfectly (optional) - Not too sporty, nor too bold.

- I like the fact that they've maintained the shoulder line as in the E60

Power/Engine
- I had big expectations on the power delivery improvement. Not that it was lacking in my E60 525d. Although it has 50 more NM of torque, it felt likeit had 50 less. Reason being, that the power delivery is a lot smoother. The
"explosive" feel of the E60 is missing, and with an increase in engine smoothness, the aggressive nature is toned down too. Overall, feels as "fun to drive" as the 520d.

- Engine refinement is better. But then, my E60 has also covered
nearly 50,000 kms so I don't know how well this comparison holds.

- Just like in my 525d, torque at the end of the revv range could have been better.

Transmission

-Smoother changes, quicker (not a large difference over my
525d). I definitely see it giving the biggest advantage in the fuel economy
factor. The transmission (power delivery) itself feels more or less the same, but I don't use manual mode

- Wish they gave paddle shifters as they do in the 530d.

Suspension

- Suspension is immensely improved. My E60 rides on 245/45 R17 regular Michelins tubeless versus 245/45 R18 runflats. Even with runflats, and 18 Inchers, the F10 still won hands down.

- The F10 felt a lot more planted on rough / broken roads. Swap some
tubeless tyres on the F10 and they're guaranteed to give you Mercedes-like comfort.

- The electric steering is a boon at low speeds. But you do feel the lack of "heaviness" once you are pushing above 120 kph.

- No issues with the grip levels. But the E60 gives you a lot more
confidence thanks to the heavier steering.

- Traction control blinks more often in my car, but I never saw it happen in the F10 because it doesn't deliver power in the lunatic manner

I'm confused by what direction BMW is now taking. Are they going the Mercedes way, if they are then they have done a damn good job with the F10 OR are they sticking with the 'Ultimate driving machine' approach, in that case this seems a step back.
BMW has resolved all the issues I had with the E60- suspension and interiors in particular. But they have taken away the thing I love the most in the E60 too, the aggressive torque surge!

However I see this car appeal to a lot more buyers. It gives your Mercedes like comfort and interior with a more 'fun' factor in comparison to the E.

Looking forward to driving the 530d sometime, maybe that will win my heart, this one won my mind!
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Old 31st May 2010, 19:10   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by anekho View Post
One question, when it comes down to it, would you buy one?
Yes and No. The 5 is the current pick in the segment, but I'd go for the 530d (not the 525d).

Quote:
Originally Posted by deetjohn View Post
Excellent thorough review GTO! The attention to detail is on par with the German here. I can see that you're upping the ante with each test. Keep it going.
Why thank you!

Quote:
The new 525d definitely looks great value for rupee for the sheer level of kit and technology it offers!
As they say, God bless competition. Merc & BMW are doing all they can for the No.1 spot!

Quote:
Originally Posted by aaggoswami View Post
Rear seat space could be a bit more considering the size of the car.
Sure could. The E has a shorter wheelbase, yet 10% more room at the back.

Quote:
Just as TSK1979 mentioned in Cruze test drive and review thread, is it possible for someone to get in and drive off if the keyfob is near the car ?
Mainly, what is exact range of keyfob ?
Nope. As mentioned in my review, you have to lock / unlock manually. To start the engine, the keyfob has to be inside the car.

Quote:
Can we add diameter in the above post ?
Sure. 6 meters I guess (5.975 to be precise)

Quote:
Will the 535i be also locally assembled?
I doubt. High performance petrols don't sell in India. And the 530d is just as quick as the 535i.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sahil View Post
Headroom is significantly lowered ! Thanks to the coupe like styling
True. I was surprised to find only 2 inches of room between my head and the roof.

Quote:
Drive height is lower, the e60 sits higher. Not sure if ground clearance is lowered?
Me thinks the seat hip point is lower.

Quote:
Transmission tunnel has gone wider
It was HUGE! Precisely why this car is best as a 4 seater (not 5).

Quote:
But overall design is much more understated and
timeless...which is not what appeals to me.

- Although todays 40 lakh buyer isn't exactly my age group, hence they would prefer this timeless design over the more aggressive Bangled one.
Definitely a more mature design. As Flyingspur mentioned in the other thread, its like the brat who's grown up.

Quote:
There are a few touches that should have been avoided. The orange turn signals at the back should have been clear-lamp instead (like the E60).
The kind of stuff that only a BMW owner could point out. Thanks for coming by that night!

Quote:
Reason being, that the power delivery is a lot smoother. The
"explosive" feel of the E60 is missing, and with an increase in engine smoothness, the aggressive nature is toned down too.
Even my C feels peakier. Us enthusiasts love that "push in the seat" feeling...passengers dont Linear is better for driveability.

Quote:
- Engine refinement is better. But then, my E60 has also covered
nearly 50,000 kms so I don't know how well this comparison holds.
You MUST change your oil at 7,500 kms! 15K is too long IMO.

Quote:
Wish they gave paddle shifters as they do in the 530d.
I found the steering too "plain-jane" for 40 lakhs.

Quote:
I'm confused by what direction BMW is now taking. Are they going the Mercedes way, if they are then they have done a damn good job with the F10 OR are they sticking with the 'Ultimate driving machine' approach, in that case this seems a step back.
Think of it this way : The E60 5 sold so well, despite it giving a hard ride + heavy steering in the city. And that's for 90% of its owners who are chauffeur-driven at the end of the day. This car is much better suited to the kind of usage and is a superior balance between ride & handling.

Last edited by GTO : 31st May 2010 at 19:11.
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Old 31st May 2010, 19:58   #21
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Excellent review GTO with wonderful pictures ! Thank you !

The F10 is so much more understated & a timeless design that will age better than the old 5. IMHO the old 5 was more striking & still turns my head when i see one pass by. Would be interesting to see the sales figures post July between the E & the 5. Looks like BMW have pulled out all stops to ensure they overtake Mercedes !

A few observations on the pics :

- What does the diamond shaped button on the remote do ? Guess the remote batteries need to be replaced & arent the chargeable type. Does the information about the car sync wirelessly & get stored in the flash memory of the remote ?

- At least a damped cover with a basic hot/cool temp control should have been provided to the rear AC controls ! That open type looks pretty downmarket :(

- That hidden storage in the boot has some pretty weird shape !

Btw the lack of a spare doesn't bother me very much. Have learnt to live with it after having put together a basic repair kit for our 320D consisting of a portable compressor & tools like a spanner/jack/tubeless repair kit etc. No worries & no stress for outstation trips !
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BMW 525d : Test Drive & Review-137971.jpg  

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Old 31st May 2010, 19:58   #22
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Excellent review GTO! Personally, I love the F10 but E60 has got better eyes

Also, isnt the HUD on the windscreen standard in the 5 series? I didnt see it being referred.
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Old 31st May 2010, 20:16   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sidindica View Post
I think that it is for brake energy regeneration. One odd observation: In GTO's car, the blue meter is on the right side whereas on my pic of 535i, it is on the left side..any differences perhaps?
GTO has reviewed the 525d your photos show the 535i and in both cases the regenerative braking gauge is actually on the bottom of the tachometer. It is the battery indicator along with the terms'ED' which on the right side for diesels and on the left for petrols.

I think it is to maintain symmetry of the dial since the diesel tachometer reads off at 5K+ but the ED meter goes from 0 to 30 and the petrol runs up to 7K+ but the ED meter reads only from 0 to 20.

A good second look and yes it is aesthetics at work.

EDIT What intrigues me is that in one of the snaps by GTO the RPM needle is hovering just below 1 while the display reads 'no engine start'. The ED guage is also not showing here. What gives?

Last edited by khoj : 31st May 2010 at 20:36.
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Old 31st May 2010, 20:18   #24
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GTO and Sahil:
You guys have written a beautiful review!
I am really happy with some points such as the better ride quality, and performance.
Given that I haven't seen the car still as I have been travelling, the review has come at a perfect time.

Some things that I was really impressed by:
- A couple of days ago, I got an email from a BMW salesperson informing me that the new 5 is on display at the showroom, along with an invitation to come and check her out. No annoying phone calls, but a great way to build a relationship with existing owners.
- I love the tan interiors. Was our first choice on the E60, as we saw one on an M5. However it wasn't available at that time.
- Improved Ride Quality. Last time I took the 525d out for a drive with my mom at the back seat, she was tossed around a bit on Marine Drive, at 70kmph!

One thing I am not at all impressed by:
- The headroom at the back. If in the next few years we earn enough of money to buy this beauty, there is a very high probability that my dad will be the user and will use the back seat as and when required. Given that we are over 6'2", I see this to be a problem. This might be the low point that might keep us away from her.

A few questions:
- Do you know how much the service packages will cost? Also, is the BMW Insurance with the 0% depreciation on offer?
- 2-3 year old 7 Series, or a new 5 series? Say this is 2 years in the future and we are looking at the current 7 series (not the bangled one), and this 5 series, for a 7 year buy.
- GTO, when are you picking up your sparingly used 5 series?

Last edited by lamborghini : 31st May 2010 at 20:20.
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Old 31st May 2010, 20:29   #25
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GTO, as always a fantastic detail oriented report!! Look forward to read your reviews every single time.

Found something awkward so thought I should point out. What is wrong with the back side of the divers seat?
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Old 31st May 2010, 20:42   #26
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Nice review GTO. Except in the looks department Beemer almost beats the Merc. Most people describe the new 5 series as a small 7 series but to me it looks like a big 3 series!
@GTO: Now, which car would you suggest for someone who's considering either the E250 cdi or 525d if the car would be both self & chauffeur driven (50:50)?
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Old 31st May 2010, 20:51   #27
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fab fab fab review! loved reading it.

I am still not convinced on styling but the interiors are to die for and at 39 lakhs ex-showroom I would even called it value for money. Overall a much better 5 series but I wish it was slightly more aggressive.

P.S. Saw one approaching me the other day and almost thought it was a 3 series. Goes without saying, rated 5 stars!
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Old 31st May 2010, 20:52   #28
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I actually like this interior combination.

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And I am a big fan of its looks.Can't wait for this though.
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Old 31st May 2010, 21:01   #29
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Thumbs up Brilliant car !! Brilliant write up !!!!

For some reason I like this better than the outgoing model !! The review is as always comprehensive. Anybody who wants to buy need not buy an Auto Mag. Just read this review or (many others that GTO wrote) & decide !!!!!

I was busy on my own German beauty hence the late response to this thread, no let us make that "brilliant review thread"


cheers
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Old 31st May 2010, 21:55   #30
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The E now drives better but is still no E60, looks worse than its predecessor but built way better, has comparatively less kit, but strangely when considered alone, lacks nothing that you cannot live without, is more more spacious & comfortable, period.

The 5 now rides better but its still no merc, lost its tankish charm, looks more charming and less dramatic than its predecessor, has the bells & whistles, hasn't changed much at the rear seat.

Basically you cannot go wrong in this segment with whichever model you choose as they tied neck & neck for the key reason they are bought.... LUXO BARGES

The line that divides them is the age group buying them. Slightly elder generation/bent of mind wont be floored by the extra gizmos which they will not use as they merely stretch out in the back seat and waft along ( E CLASS BUYERS) while on the other hand, the younger market/more tech savvy/ steve jobs worshipping mac book toting kind will definitely prefer the more futuristic 5.


Miss the simpler times

Love to drive: BMW

Love to be driven: Mercedes
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